Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #71   Report Post  
Old May 9th 10, 08:13 PM posted to rec.radio.amateur.antenna
external usenet poster
 
First recorded activity by RadioBanter: Oct 2009
Posts: 707
Default What exactly is radio


"K1TTT" wrote
...
On May 9, 10:30 am, "Szczepan Bialek" wrote:
"tom"
se.net...



On 5/8/2010 2:04 PM, Szczepan Bialek wrote:


Yes. But one end of the dipole may have the better conditions to
propagate.


if it only moves in one direction as it would have
to in a monopole there is no wave only a simple field.


I am writing about a dipole with one end visible and the second
shielded.


In nature is always as you wrote. The both ands are always "visible".


Light is always directional. Radio waves can be omnidirectional.
Of course light is emitted by many dipoles. Radio waves by halve, one,
two
(circular polarity) or many (phase radar).
S*


Astonishing understanding of the subject.


Light is not coherent. So dipole radiate for very short time.

Radio waves are coherent and can be from one source. It is easy to analyse
them.
Are they transversal?
S*


light can be coherent, what do you think lasers are?


"The most monochromatic sources are usually lasers; such high
monochromaticity implies long coherence lengths (up to hundreds of meters).
For example, a stabilized helium-neon laser can produce light with coherence
lengths in excess of 5 m. Not all lasers are monochromatic, however (e.g.
for a mode-locked Ti-sapphire laser, ?? ? 2 nm - 70 nm). LEDs are
characterized by ?? ? 50 nm, and tungsten filament lights exhibit ?? ? 600
nm, so these sources have shorter coherence times than the most
monochromatic lasers". From:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coherence_(physics)

Up to now light is not coherent. But in future who knows.
S*


  #72   Report Post  
Old May 9th 10, 08:37 PM posted to rec.radio.amateur.antenna
external usenet poster
 
First recorded activity by RadioBanter: May 2009
Posts: 197
Default What exactly is radio


Użytkownik napisał w wiadomo¶ci
...
Szczepan Bialek wrote:


Light is not coherent. So dipole radiate for very short time.
Radio waves are coherent and can be from one source. It is easy to
analyse
them.
Are they transversal?
S*


Babble.

Any electromagnetic radiation, from radio to gamma rays, can be coherent
or
not; it depends on how it is generated.

Did you get tired of being called a babbling, drooling, idiot on the
sci.physics.* groups with your rambling nonsense and now you are trying
your
luck in the amateur radio groups?

You were an idiot when you were posting to sci.physics.* and you are still
an idiot now that you are posting to rec.radio.amateur.*.


The term EM waves is traditional.
Light, sound and radio waves are simmilar. It is stated in all textbooks.
Are they wrote by idiots?
Look what wrote another idiot:
"This article is about general theory and electromagnetic phased array. For
the ultrasonic and medical imaging application, see phased array
ultrasonics. For the optical application, see phased-array optics." From:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phased_array

Do you know even one example where Acoustic analogy do not work?
S*


  #73   Report Post  
Old May 9th 10, 09:36 PM posted to rec.radio.amateur.antenna
external usenet poster
 
First recorded activity by RadioBanter: Jun 2006
Posts: 1,898
Default What exactly is radio

"Szczepan Bia?ek" wrote:

U?ytkownik napisa? w wiadomo?ci
...
Szczepan Bialek wrote:


Light is not coherent. So dipole radiate for very short time.
Radio waves are coherent and can be from one source. It is easy to
analyse
them.
Are they transversal?
S*


Babble.

Any electromagnetic radiation, from radio to gamma rays, can be coherent
or
not; it depends on how it is generated.

Did you get tired of being called a babbling, drooling, idiot on the
sci.physics.* groups with your rambling nonsense and now you are trying
your
luck in the amateur radio groups?

You were an idiot when you were posting to sci.physics.* and you are still
an idiot now that you are posting to rec.radio.amateur.*.


The term EM waves is traditional.
Light, sound and radio waves are simmilar. It is stated in all textbooks.


Having some similar charactristics does not mean EM and sound are the
same thing.

You are still a babbing idiot.

snip
Do you know even one example where Acoustic analogy do not work?
S*


All of them once you get past the grade school stage.


--
Jim Pennino

Remove .spam.sux to reply.
  #74   Report Post  
Old May 9th 10, 09:52 PM posted to rec.radio.amateur.antenna
external usenet poster
 
First recorded activity by RadioBanter: Apr 2010
Posts: 484
Default What exactly is radio

On May 9, 7:00*pm, "Szczepan Bialek" wrote:
Uzytkownik "K1TTT" napisal w ...
On May 9, 10:14 am, "Szczepan Bialek" wrote:





In textbooks must be all theories.

In one chapter light (and radio waves) is like photons, in the next
chapter
like EM waves and in next like acoustics.


EM is the only example of transversal waves. So it must be in teaching

program.


But we try to help Peter. He wrote: "I begin to appreciate a comment made
by

a fellow radio amateur and
technician that antenna theory was 15% science and 85% black magic! "


It seems that you are sure that radio waves are transversal. It is

impossible to help you (Maxwell was full of doubts).
May be that somebody consider the Acoustic analogy and the black magic
disappear for him.
S*
maxwell may have been full of doubts, and Einstein wasn't able to see


the experiments that have proven his theories,

Maxwell did EM, Einstein did the photons and somebody else the acoustic
analogy.

but we have seen them


well tested and accepted over the years.

All of that three ( all three are in textbooks) are well tested and accepted
but only in some extend. May be that after some time only one will be fully
accepted. Which one do you designate?

if you think that 85% is


black magic then you have lots of learning to do to fill in that 85% gap in
your knowledge.

I designate the acoustic analogy and do not see any gaps.
They who designate EM or the photons are in constant trouble for more than
100 years.
S*


you may designate away, that doesn't make it any more correct. the
only things that the acoustic, water, and em radiation has in common
is the sinusoidal characteristics and that superposition works.
because of those two you can get similar interference patterns from
all 3 types of waves. that doesn't mean the underlying physics are
the same.
  #75   Report Post  
Old May 9th 10, 09:59 PM posted to rec.radio.amateur.antenna
external usenet poster
 
First recorded activity by RadioBanter: Apr 2010
Posts: 484
Default What exactly is radio

On May 9, 7:13*pm, "Szczepan Bialek" wrote:
*"K1TTT" ...
On May 9, 10:30 am, "Szczepan Bialek" wrote:



"tom"
se.net...


On 5/8/2010 2:04 PM, Szczepan Bialek wrote:


Yes. But one end of the dipole may have the better conditions to
propagate.


if it only moves in one direction as it would have
to in a monopole there is no wave only a simple field.


I am writing about a dipole with one end visible and the second
shielded.


In nature is always as you wrote. The both ands are always "visible"..


Light is always directional. Radio waves can be omnidirectional.
Of course light is emitted by many dipoles. Radio waves by halve, one,
two
(circular polarity) or many (phase radar).
S*


Astonishing understanding of the subject.


Light is not coherent. So dipole radiate for very short time.

Radio waves are coherent and can be from one source. It is easy to analyse
them.
Are they transversal?
S*
light can be coherent, what do you think lasers are?


"The most monochromatic sources are usually lasers; such high
monochromaticity implies long coherence lengths (up to hundreds of meters).
For example, a stabilized helium-neon laser can produce light with coherence
lengths in excess of 5 m. Not all lasers are monochromatic, however (e.g.
for a mode-locked Ti-sapphire laser, ?? ? 2 nm - 70 nm). LEDs are
characterized by ?? ? 50 nm, and tungsten filament lights exhibit ?? ? 600
nm, so these sources have shorter coherence times than the most
monochromatic lasers". From:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coherence_(physics)

Up to now light is not coherent. But in future who knows.
S*


if you are going to be that critical then its hard to call radio waves
coherent either. every transmitter has some drift, phase noise, or
harmonic content that distorts the pure sine waveform one way or
another making them incoherent in longer periods, the same way there
is noise and incoherence in lasers... nothing is perfect.


  #76   Report Post  
Old May 10th 10, 01:42 AM posted to rec.radio.amateur.antenna
joe joe is offline
external usenet poster
 
First recorded activity by RadioBanter: Feb 2010
Posts: 55
Default What exactly is radio

Szczepan Białek wrote:


Do you know even one example where Acoustic analogy do not work?
S*



A high school experiment using a bell jar, alarm clock and a vacuum pump.
  #77   Report Post  
Old May 10th 10, 08:41 AM posted to rec.radio.amateur.antenna
external usenet poster
 
First recorded activity by RadioBanter: Oct 2009
Posts: 707
Default What exactly is radio


"joe" wrote ...
Szczepan Białek wrote:


Do you know even one example where Acoustic analogy do not work?
S*


A high school experiment using a bell jar, alarm clock and a vacuum pump.


Jim wrote: " Having some similar charactristics does not mean EM and sound
are the
same thing."

They are not the same. Sound propagate in gases, liquids and solids
Electric waves in the "aether".

But the source of sound is an increase of the pressure.
The source of electric waves is an increase of the voltage.

The voltage increases at the ends of a dipole.

The electric waves and sound propagate in metal wires, but with different
speeds.
Are electric waves in a wire also transversal?
S*




  #78   Report Post  
Old May 10th 10, 09:03 AM posted to rec.radio.amateur.antenna
external usenet poster
 
First recorded activity by RadioBanter: Oct 2009
Posts: 707
Default What exactly is radio


"K1TTT" wrote
...
On May 9, 7:00 pm, "Szczepan Bialek" wrote:

In textbooks must be all theories.

In one chapter light (and radio waves) is like photons, in the next
chapter
like EM waves and in next like acoustics.


EM is the only example of transversal waves. So it must be in teaching

program.


But we try to help Peter. He wrote: "I begin to appreciate a comment
made
by

a fellow radio amateur and
technician that antenna theory was 15% science and 85% black magic! "


It seems that you are sure that radio waves are transversal. It is

impossible to help you (Maxwell was full of doubts).
May be that somebody consider the Acoustic analogy and the black magic
disappear for him.
S*
maxwell may have been full of doubts, and Einstein wasn't able to see


the experiments that have proven his theories,

Maxwell did EM, Einstein did the photons and somebody else the acoustic
analogy.

but we have seen them


well tested and accepted over the years.

All of that three ( all three are in textbooks) are well tested and
accepted
but only in some extend. May be that after some time only one will be
fully
accepted. Which one do you designate?

if you think that 85% is


black magic then you have lots of learning to do to fill in that 85% gap
in

your knowledge.

I designate the acoustic analogy and do not see any gaps.

They who designate EM or the photons are in constant trouble for more than
100 years.
S*


you may designate away, that doesn't make it any more correct. the

only things that the acoustic, water, and em radiation has in common
is the sinusoidal characteristics and that superposition works.
because of those two you can get similar interference patterns from
all 3 types of waves. that doesn't mean the underlying physics are
the same.

Oscillating compressible gas create .the standing waves in the tube with the
closed end.
The oscillating compressible electron gas create the standing waves in open
circuit (antenna).
Is not the same physics?
S*


  #79   Report Post  
Old May 10th 10, 03:29 PM posted to rec.radio.amateur.antenna
external usenet poster
 
First recorded activity by RadioBanter: Jun 2006
Posts: 1,898
Default What exactly is radio

Szczepan Bialek wrote:


They are not the same. Sound propagate in gases, liquids and solids
Electric waves in the "aether".


There is no "aether".

snip babbling nonsense


--
Jim Pennino

Remove .spam.sux to reply.
Reply
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules

Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 09:33 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004-2024 RadioBanter.
The comments are property of their posters.
 

About Us

"It's about Radio"

 

Copyright © 2017