[gareth]

50 years ago the world was buzzing with AR88s (both D and LF), HROs,
CR100s and the like.

What has happened to them all?

Surely no self-respecting radio amateur would ever think of putting
them in the garbage?

[Scott Dorsey]

gareth wrote:
50 years ago the world was buzzing with AR88s (both D and LF), HROs,
CR100s and the like.

What has happened to them all?

They are sitting in glass cases in Japan.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[Michael Black[_2_]]

On Fri, 31 Oct 2014, gareth wrote:

50 years ago the world was buzzing with AR88s (both D and LF), HROs,
CR100s and the like.

What has happened to them all?

Surely no self-respecting radio amateur would ever think of putting
them in the garbage?

But that's exactly what happened to them.

People bought them to be used. Thus all those modifications, they wanted
better receivers, not resale value. They weren't tossed away immediately,
they were tossed over time, well after the receivers were replaced.

IN the early seventies, it was easy to get "boatanchors". People didn't
want the stuff, it wasn't solid state and it wasn't SSB, so it was common
to find at the ham fleamarkets and auctions, and cheap. I went through a
lot of junk in that period, buying it for a few dollars, then trading it
for something or stripping it for some reason. Nobody was thinking about
history.

So a lot of it wsa cleared out. Probably lots of hams died, and the stuff
trashed, too.

It was only decades later that "boatanchors" became collectable.
Originally "boatanchor" was a slur, something big and heavy and fairly
useless (like some WWII surplus, which seems to be what the term wsa
originally applied to), but as SSB and transistors came in, it came to
apply to ham equipment too. People grew up, they had money, and they
either regretted getting rid of that junk back then, or wanted that stuff
they lusted after as kids, but could never afford. So the price of what
remained went up, because there was demand, and supply was low (because
the period of trashing had occurred).

Let's not forget that a lot of WWII surplus was so common that it held a
low price for a long time. I could get a Command Set transmitter here in
Canada for 9.95 Canadian in the fall of 1972, almost 30 years after the
war ended. It was still in a box. That takes a long time to clear out,
but it also means not a high value was placed on the equipment in the
first place. If you have to pay hundreds of dollars, you will be careful,
if it's ten bucks, you can always buy another one.

The scenario is no different from "antique" radios They were old and big
and didn't do anything that newer radios didn't, so for most people they
were junk. There were some collectors in the sixties and seventies, but I
didn't know about the concept until about 1974 when there was an antique
radio column in Elementary Electronics. But in 1972, a school teacher
offered me an A****er Kent chassis, because he'd gotten the radio cheap,
and wanted to use the cabinet as a liquor cabinet. I kept the chassis for
a few years, then it wsa just getting in the way. Around the same time,
the shop teacher at school was taking old AA5 radios, removing them from
their cabinets, painting them with dayglo paint, and then putting them in
homemade plexiglass cabients. The time hadn't yet come where they were
generally valued for what they had been.

So now supplies are limited. And demand is higher, though I get the
impression it's peaked. You can get that Clegg VHF receiver you lusted
after seeing the ads as a kid, but it will cost you. YOu can find
the manual for that Tapetone (I think it was) VHF receiver) that
you once saw in an ad and never heard about again, though it's
still not clear how many of those were made (or if any were
actually made).

However, you may still have a better chance of finding one since you don't
have to hope someone locally bought one back then, and now is selling it
off. There's ebay, that makes everything "local".


It will be rare to find stuff cheap. I was increadibly lucky 2 years ago
to get that TMC GPR-90 for $20 at a garage sale, a case of someone
clearing out a home and not wanting to find the right place to sell it. I
suspect that if I'd not come along that day, nobody would have passed by
that recognized it, and it would have been put in the garbage after the
sale.

Michael

[Stan Barr[_3_]]

On Fri, 31 Oct 2014 14:23:42 -0400, Michael Black wrote:
On Fri, 31 Oct 2014, gareth wrote:

50 years ago the world was buzzing with AR88s (both D and LF), HROs,
CR100s and the like.

What has happened to them all?

Surely no self-respecting radio amateur would ever think of putting
them in the garbage?

But that's exactly what happened to them.

Indeed. A lot of them were dismantled for parts, I can recall HRO
tuning mechanisms etc. being used in homebrew projects. You have to
remember back in the '60s these were just "old radios" not antiques.

There have been a few HROs and AR88s on UK eBay recently, so they're
still out there. Prices aren't too bad either.

--
Stan Barr

[Michael Black[_2_]]

On Sat, 1 Nov 2014, Stan Barr wrote:

On Fri, 31 Oct 2014 14:23:42 -0400, Michael Black wrote:
On Fri, 31 Oct 2014, gareth wrote:

50 years ago the world was buzzing with AR88s (both D and LF), HROs,
CR100s and the like.

What has happened to them all?

Surely no self-respecting radio amateur would ever think of putting
them in the garbage?

But that's exactly what happened to them.

Indeed. A lot of them were dismantled for parts, I can recall HRO
tuning mechanisms etc. being used in homebrew projects. You have to
remember back in the '60s these were just "old radios" not antiques.

I'm sure that did happen, but in the case of parts, they were also
available. So you could get HRO dials and tuning capacitors off the shelf,
though I'm not sure if from National or Millen. I gather there were spare
variable capacitors for the Command Sets, though since the transmitters
were so cheap, it was often easier to strip one down for the tuning gear
and capacitor. I have a tuning capacitor that's never been soldered to,
and it certainly looks like the one used in a BC-221 frequency meter.

You could certainly get Eddystone dials without ripping one apart.

But yes, the equipment lived its life, then was reused as best it could
be. There was also that period where older equipment was updated. Fred
Brown had an article in CQ in early 1970 about updating his HRO, which was
mainly about replacing the octal tubes with miniature tubes, complete with
lower power consumption. Or Hank Cross took a BC-348 and transistorized
it, in effect using the relatively cheap surplus receiver as a chassis to
build a solid state receiver on. That sort of thing happened too, to
extend the life of something that was getting old and not as appropriate
in the days of lower power consumption and SSB.

There have been a few HROs and AR88s on UK eBay recently, so they're
still out there. Prices aren't too bad either.

Some are saying it will all flatten out. That there was a peak, in
interest and price, as people got to a certain age, and lusted after old
equipment, or regretted getting rid of old equipment, but there aren't
that many coming into boatanchors to keep the prices high. It does make
sense. I can look at the ads in the old magazines, and wish for this or
that, but it's mostly nostalgia, I would have very little practical use
for a Clegg 66er, though a Swan 250 six metre SSB rig could still find
use. But if you didn't grow up with the stuff, or at least read about it
when younger, there may not be the same incentive to pursue it now. Once
everyone is satisfied, there won't be new people wanting the same stuff.
For that matter, like that TMC GPR-90, the owners will fade away and fewer
people interested in what remains.

Michael

[Scott Dorsey]

Michael Black wrote:
I'm sure that did happen, but in the case of parts, they were also
available. So you could get HRO dials and tuning capacitors off the shelf,
though I'm not sure if from National or Millen. I gather there were spare
variable capacitors for the Command Sets, though since the transmitters
were so cheap, it was often easier to strip one down for the tuning gear
and capacitor. I have a tuning capacitor that's never been soldered to,
and it certainly looks like the one used in a BC-221 frequency meter.

You could get HRO dials and tuning caps off the shelf, and the main brand
of tuning caps that my local shop carried was Hammarlund.

But... the surplus gear was so cheap, so much ham gear was built around it.
I remember going to New York with my parents and seeing a shop on Canal St.
that was packed to the ceiling with command sets, and they were all ten
dollars, receivers or transmitters. Pick your band. So many homebrew SSB
sets were built on ARC-5 chassis using the oscillator and final and little
else.

I would have built one myself if my father would have loaned me ten dollars.

You could certainly get Eddystone dials without ripping one apart.

But that cost money! And an old Eddystone was probably a giveaway item.

But yes, the equipment lived its life, then was reused as best it could
be. There was also that period where older equipment was updated. Fred
Brown had an article in CQ in early 1970 about updating his HRO, which was
mainly about replacing the octal tubes with miniature tubes, complete with
lower power consumption. Or Hank Cross took a BC-348 and transistorized
it, in effect using the relatively cheap surplus receiver as a chassis to
build a solid state receiver on. That sort of thing happened too, to
extend the life of something that was getting old and not as appropriate
in the days of lower power consumption and SSB.

Yes, I bought an SX-28 at a hamfest for $2 and followed the directions in
a QST article to add a product detector and a Collins mechanical filter,
and I used that for years until I got an R-388 for $100 at the 1981 Virginia
Beach Hamfest.

I think in 1987 I bought an R-390A from the same vendor for $250, but at
that time prices on that gear were starting to rise.

There have been a few HROs and AR88s on UK eBay recently, so they're
still out there. Prices aren't too bad either.

Some are saying it will all flatten out. That there was a peak, in
interest and price, as people got to a certain age, and lusted after old
equipment, or regretted getting rid of old equipment, but there aren't
that many coming into boatanchors to keep the prices high. It does make
sense.

This is definitely the case, and you see this with all kinds of gear. The
kids who lusted after $10 ARC-5 sets have grown up and they have money now,
and they are snapping up the few units left.

The peak was also helped by a huge demand in Japan for old American boatanchor
gear, although the Japanese only want stuff in excellent cosmetic condition
and they don't want the ARC-5 transmitter with the Compactron sheet beam
modulator stage added in the seventies.

I can look at the ads in the old magazines, and wish for this or
that, but it's mostly nostalgia, I would have very little practical use
for a Clegg 66er, though a Swan 250 six metre SSB rig could still find
use. But if you didn't grow up with the stuff, or at least read about it
when younger, there may not be the same incentive to pursue it now. Once
everyone is satisfied, there won't be new people wanting the same stuff.
For that matter, like that TMC GPR-90, the owners will fade away and fewer
people interested in what remains.

I think there is no sense in collecting equipment if you don't use it. I
am on the OMISS net at least once a week with my R-390A and a homebrew
compactron-based transmitter. (I built it from scratch because these days
that is much cheaper than starting with an ARC-5). Just got my 5-watt WAS,
now I'm working for a DXCC with all the sheer power of the 6AQ5 final.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[Wymsey[_2_]]

On Fri, 31 Oct 2014 11:57:23 +0000, gareth wrote:

What has happened to them all?

There were two AR88s for sale at Kempton and a CR100 went for pea nuts at
our recent club sale.

I often see both at rallies.

--
M0WYM
Sales @ radiowymsey
http://stores.ebay.co.uk/Sales-At-Radio-Wymsey/

[Irv Finkleman VE6BP]

Wymsey wrote:
On Fri, 31 Oct 2014 11:57:23 +0000, gareth wrote:

What has happened to them all?

There were two AR88s for sale at Kempton and a CR100 went for pea nuts at
our recent club sale.

I often see both at rallies.

Probably the same ones! They tend to recirculate!

VE6BP

[gareth]

"Wymsey" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 31 Oct 2014 11:57:23 +0000, gareth wrote:

What has happened to them all?

There were two AR88s for sale at Kempton and a CR100 went for pea nuts at
our recent club sale.

green eyes of envy

[Michael Black[_2_]]

On Thu, 13 Nov 2014, Irv Finkleman VE6BP wrote:

Wymsey wrote:
On Fri, 31 Oct 2014 11:57:23 +0000, gareth wrote:

What has happened to them all?

There were two AR88s for sale at Kempton and a CR100 went for pea nuts at
our recent club sale.

I often see both at rallies.

Probably the same ones! They tend to recirculate!

VE6BP

When I was 12, it had to be towards the end of the school year, near when
I went for my license, we went to the science museum in Ottawa, I forget
the official title. And they had an AR-88 on display, we could even tune
it, though I can't remember if I heard anything. Maybe it wasn't plugged
in. That's the only one I've ever seen. I doubt it's still there.

Michael