Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #1   Report Post  
Old July 5th 03, 01:23 PM
N2EY
 
Posts: n/a
Default Tech+ to General upgrade question

In article ,
(bro) writes:

(5) An unexpired (or expired) FCC-granted Novice Class operator license

grant:
Element 1.

(6) A CSCE: Each element the CSCE indicates the examinee passed within the
previous 365 days.

(7) An unexpired (or expired less than 5 years) FCC-issued commercial
radiotelegraph operator license or permit: Element 1.

(8) An expired FCC-issued Technician Class operator license document

granted
before March 21, 1987: Element 3.

(9) An expired or unexpired FCC-issued Technician Class operator license
document granted before February 14, 1991: Element 1.

(b) No examination credit, except as herein provided, shall be allowed on

the
basis of holding or having held any other license grant or document.

(End of Part 97 quote)

Note that an old expired Tech can be good for Element 3, and an old expired
Novice or Tech can be good for Element 1. But a CSCE more than 365 days old
gives no credit. Only a license can carry element credit beyond 365 days.

It is good "forever" for the purpose of granting the Novice HF
privileges to a Technician.


Yup.

How's that for Uncle Sam logic?


Makes no sense at all.

It gets worse - consider these scenarios:

Expired Novice or Tech-with-code licenses are good for Element 1, but other
expired-beyond-the-grace-period licenses are not. So someone who held a

Novice
50 years ago and let it expire gets Element 1 credit, but someone who held

an
Extra and let it expire 732 days ago gets no credit.

In similar fashion, an expired Tech from before March 21, 1987 is worth

Element
3, but not Element 2! Also, no other expired-beyond-the-grace-period

license is
worth written element credit.

Huh?

73 de Jim, N2EY



Ok now how about this?

My license is now expired, but....

I have sitting on my desk:
an origional 01/14/86 issued "Technician License" and
an origional 07/11/89 issued "Technician License (address change)

If i gave to a VE the earlier issued lic. do I get credit for elements
1 and 3, giving me a general class now? With no retesting?
I think at that time gen and tech written were the same, only
needing faster
code for the gen.

Or
If i gave the VE the latter issued lic. do I get credit only for the
code, meaning i must retake the written tech and general?


Brian,

The earlier license carries credit for Element 1 (5 wpm code) and Element 3
(General written). See paragraphs (9) and (8). But it does not carry credit for
Element 2 (Technician written!). Even though the Tech and General written were
the same in 1986, they're not the same now.

So the thing to do is to brush up on Element 2. It's 35 questions, multiple
choice, and the Q&A pools are available for free download at several websites.
You can also do online practice exams for any written element to see how well
the studying is going.

When you're ready to try the Element 2 exam, go to a VE session, present your
1986 license and take Element 2. Once Element 2 is passed, you'll have a
General.

In fact, while you're there, try Element 4 (Extra). Costs nothing but your
time, and you might wind up an Extra.

73 es GL de Jim, N2EY.


  #2   Report Post  
Old July 5th 03, 04:53 PM
Kim W5TIT
 
Posts: n/a
Default

"N2EY" wrote in message
...
In article ,


(bro) writes:

(5) An unexpired (or expired) FCC-granted Novice Class operator license

grant:
Element 1.

(6) A CSCE: Each element the CSCE indicates the examinee passed within

the
previous 365 days.

(7) An unexpired (or expired less than 5 years) FCC-issued commercial
radiotelegraph operator license or permit: Element 1.

(8) An expired FCC-issued Technician Class operator license document

granted
before March 21, 1987: Element 3.

(9) An expired or unexpired FCC-issued Technician Class operator

license
document granted before February 14, 1991: Element 1.

(b) No examination credit, except as herein provided, shall be allowed

on
the
basis of holding or having held any other license grant or document.

(End of Part 97 quote)

Note that an old expired Tech can be good for Element 3, and an old

expired
Novice or Tech can be good for Element 1. But a CSCE more than 365 days

old
gives no credit. Only a license can carry element credit beyond 365

days.

It is good "forever" for the purpose of granting the Novice HF
privileges to a Technician.

Yup.

How's that for Uncle Sam logic?

Makes no sense at all.

It gets worse - consider these scenarios:

Expired Novice or Tech-with-code licenses are good for Element 1, but

other
expired-beyond-the-grace-period licenses are not. So someone who held a

Novice
50 years ago and let it expire gets Element 1 credit, but someone who

held
an
Extra and let it expire 732 days ago gets no credit.

In similar fashion, an expired Tech from before March 21, 1987 is worth

Element
3, but not Element 2! Also, no other expired-beyond-the-grace-period

license is
worth written element credit.

Huh?

73 de Jim, N2EY



Ok now how about this?

My license is now expired, but....

I have sitting on my desk:
an origional 01/14/86 issued "Technician License" and
an origional 07/11/89 issued "Technician License (address change)

If i gave to a VE the earlier issued lic. do I get credit for elements
1 and 3, giving me a general class now? With no retesting?
I think at that time gen and tech written were the same, only
needing faster
code for the gen.

Or
If i gave the VE the latter issued lic. do I get credit only for the
code, meaning i must retake the written tech and general?


Brian,

The earlier license carries credit for Element 1 (5 wpm code) and Element

3
(General written). See paragraphs (9) and (8). But it does not carry

credit for
Element 2 (Technician written!). Even though the Tech and General written

were
the same in 1986, they're not the same now.

So the thing to do is to brush up on Element 2. It's 35 questions,

multiple
choice, and the Q&A pools are available for free download at several

websites.
You can also do online practice exams for any written element to see how

well
the studying is going.

When you're ready to try the Element 2 exam, go to a VE session, present

your
1986 license and take Element 2. Once Element 2 is passed, you'll have a
General.

In fact, while you're there, try Element 4 (Extra). Costs nothing but your
time, and you might wind up an Extra.

73 es GL de Jim, N2EY.



Whoops, I came into this thread late, Jim, so please forgive (I had to find
another thread with a semblance of logic to it...whew). OK, I notice that
the poster said his license is now expired (but I'm not sure if how long
it's been expired).

I am "coaching" a former ham. His license expired well over 2 years ago and
he was a pre-1987 Technician. I told him he needs to re-enter the hobby
fresh, as if he'd never been there.

Was I right?

Kim W5TIT


  #3   Report Post  
Old July 5th 03, 09:23 PM
N2EY
 
Posts: n/a
Default

In article , "Kim"
writes:

Whoops, I came into this thread late, Jim, so please forgive (I had to find
another thread with a semblance of logic to it...whew).


That's a BIG job, Kim!

OK, I notice that
the poster said his license is now expired (but I'm not sure if how long
it's been expired).


He's beyond the grace period.

I am "coaching" a former ham. His license expired well over 2 years ago and
he was a pre-1987 Technician. I told him he needs to re-enter the hobby
fresh, as if he'd never been there.

Was I right?


To put it delicately - it depends.

If he can find his old license, and the dates on it prove he was a pre-1987
Tech, then he only needs to pass Element 2 (Tech written, 35 Q) to get a
General. That old expired license carries credit for 5 wpm code and General
written, as I read Part 97.

If he goes for Extra he only needs Element 2 and Element 4

If he can't find his old license, things get a bit more involved.

73 de Jim, N2EY



  #4   Report Post  
Old July 5th 03, 09:23 PM
N2EY
 
Posts: n/a
Default

In article , bro writes:

In fact, while you're there, try Element 4 (Extra). Costs nothing but your
time, and you might wind up an Extra.

73 es GL de Jim, N2EY.


Awesome! Thanks for advice!

You're welcome.

As of yesterday, I was thinking I'd have to retest for everything , so I
downloaded the new tech pool from ARRL. Taking that test is going to be no
problem. I think i could get a 80 or 90 percent if i had to answer the whole

500 or so question pool now now.

See? Nothing to it.

So like you say, mabe start studying for the Extra also. Why not.

'zactly. Go for it.

Just to be sure, do you know of any web sites that throw 35 questions at you
and grade you?


Not offhand, but I know they exist. Try a Google search. I will do so and post
the results when I have a chance (this is being written offline and will be
AutoAol'ed to post).

Oh yes, and if I give the VE the 1986 licence will he know my most currently
expired one is from 1989? (from some data base or something), giving me only
Element one.


Doesn't matter. Your 1986 license documentation overrides the 1989 license
documentation. The reason for the difference is that the Tech test changed on
March 21, 1987. The '86 license proves you took the "old" test, and that's all
that matters.

If it were me, I'd bring the original licenses and a copy or two.

Again, Thank you kindly


Weclome back and good luck!

73 de Jim, N2EY
  #5   Report Post  
Old July 6th 03, 01:06 AM
D. Stussy
 
Posts: n/a
Default

...
I am "coaching" a former ham. His license expired well over 2 years ago and
he was a pre-1987 Technician. I told him he needs to re-enter the hobby
fresh, as if he'd never been there.

Was I right?


No.

He does have to take element 2, but upon presentation of his pre-87 expired
technician license, that element 2 test will give him a GENERAL class license,
not technician (as it would for someone who was starting "fresh").


  #6   Report Post  
Old July 6th 03, 04:43 AM
Jim Hampton
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Kim,

The problem with the questions and answers is that as they change, unless
someone actually learned the theory behind it, one may have to restudy. I
let all of my licenses go in the early 80s (commercial telegraph, 1st phone,
radar, amateur extra). When I decided to get back into amateur radio, I
simply appeared for the exam and spent dang near 3 hours for all of the
tests (back in 1993 - I'm up for renewal in a few months). I doubt any of
the former licenses carried any weight, but I didn't worry about it and it
didn't matter. (the 20 word per minute cw exam did have me a bit nervous as
I hadn't copied any cw since 1969 LOL).

73 from Rochester, NY
Jim AA2QA


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.497 / Virus Database: 296 - Release Date: 7/4/03


Reply
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules

Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Upgrading to from Tech Plus to General, help on a FCC Form 605 question please Jerry Bransford General 6 December 1st 03 03:37 AM
No Code General Twistedhed Homebrew 40 November 16th 03 04:02 PM
No Code General Twistedhed Homebrew 0 November 2nd 03 12:31 AM
Ready to upgrade... what HF xcvr features do you like? Jim Kalafut Equipment 4 October 26th 03 12:38 AM
Ready to upgrade... what HF xcvr features do you like? Jim Kalafut Equipment 0 October 22nd 03 02:47 AM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 06:36 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004-2024 RadioBanter.
The comments are property of their posters.
 

About Us

"It's about Radio"

 

Copyright © 2017