Art:

[snip]
Reg, no need for help as it is all completed with success.
I may add. I used AO PRO to do the final wrap up as well as making the
antennas which in uncompromising fashion proved what you are stating but
what other people have been unable to understand .
[snip]

Art, you can't blame others for not understanding! What?

It is your responsibility and your's alone to help others to understand
your ideas, concepts, inventions.

Any failure of others to understand is your responsibility alone!

There are three important things in science:

Communications, communications and communications. Clearly *you* have
failed to communicate.

If you communicate clearly and succinctly without whining and do so clearly
and unequivocally and stop complaining that no one understands you, why...
then you may succeed! I for one certainly wish you well in that regard.

[snip]
I am sure glad however, to see a dissertation such as yours that was
unsolicitated even tho it may finish up as a 'Plonk" on this side of the
Pond as many times the obvious is ignored until it apears in a book
[snip]

Not true at all. Reg is quite capable of explaining himself and no one
that I know of feels that Reg's contributions to the NG are "plonk".
Apparently you might!

[snip]
Hopefully you will able to withstand the junk that will now be thrown at
you for stating such an outrageous thing.
Cheers
Art
[snip]

Reg has proven that he can withstand criticism, questioning, and
examination,
he has demonstrated that many times over on this NG... he needs no help or
appeals to the lack of ability of readers and listeners. Art, wake up and
smell
the roses and practice: Communicatons, communications, communications...

:-)

You are doing better, but... you have come very close to whining again
here...

If no one understands you, it is your fault!

"Perception is Reality" -Tom Peters

Best regards for the New Year,

--
Peter K1PO
Indialantic By-the-Sea, FL.

Reg:

[snip]
Vary line length until it is exactly 1/4 wavelengths.

The input impedance of the 1/4-wave length of open-circuited line is also
calculated and displayed.

It will be found that at exact resonance (vary length or frequency very
finely) the input impedance of the line will be a pure resistance ( jXin =
0) equal to half of the of the line end-to-end wire resistance.
[snip]

This is *exactly* what my [and other's as well] line analysis computer
programs do for the analysis of so-called "bridged taps".

"Bridged taps", which are sections of open circuited transmission line
bridged across an operational transmission line, are quite common
in telephony practice. They are often placed deliberately to allow
for extra extension/party lines, or are inadvertently left in place once
a line is taken out of service. There are often several bridged taps
on a given line. These bridged taps don't affect telephony [audio] but
wreak havoc at higher frequencies for broadband signals. For
frequencies where the bridged taps represent a 1/4 wavelength, they
act as traps or notches and "suck out" the desired energy on the main
line. As such bridged taps can ruin the performance of digital subscriber
loops aka "DSL" such as ADSL/VDSL, etc. because they punch holes
in the transmission band. Several companies, and consultants
such as myself, have transmission line programs to evaluate broadband
transmission over lines with cascades of multiple guages/dielectrics and
several bridged taps. In fact several such "standard" line makeups
for evaluating the performance of DSL systems are published
in the Standards literature [ANSI T1E1.4]. My Fortran computer codes
must perforce analyze such 1/4 wave, or any wavelength for that
matter, stubs quite accurately to predict multi-megabit transmission
performance over several thousand feet of such impaired lines. :-)

But until your posting I had never thought to use them to analyze
the driving point impedances of antennas. Neat application!

[snip]
If your own programs significantly disagree then consign them to the junk
box.
[snip]

Can't do that now, since literally millions of DSL modems are now running
around the world over lines that have been accurately analyzed using those
programs, hence they must be "right". I still use the programs in my
consulting
practice for client companies designing DSL modems who use my services.

I have never used these programs to simulate antennas yet, gotta do that
just for fun... I can set any arbitrary distribution of radiation
resistance
along the line in series with the primary parameter R(f) [of R(f), L(f),
C(f)
and G(f)] and so uniform distribution should be easy.

[snip]
. There are no references
except my tattered note books. I came across various useful relationship
around 1960 when researching into methods of locating faults on oceanic
phone cables.
[snip]

Well you certainly predate me, I only started developing my transmission
line
analysis programs around 1971 or so and have kept *improving* them over the
years, mostly to make contributions to my employers, clients and various
transmission standards committees [ANSI, ITU, ETSI, IEEE].

[snip]
But I daresay Heaviside preceded me. I dug up much information
and designed fault locating and other test equipment but very little was
published beyond contract manufacturing information. There were two
articles
in the house engineering journal. I worked alone with a small group of
assistants, a lab and a workshop. I did present a series of lectures
afterwards, twice in Europe. But it was all just in a day's work with
occasional trips aboard cable laying ships and at manufacturers. The
nearest
I got to the States was Newfoundland and Nova Scotia. I then shifted in
succession to several entirely different fields of operations. But no
experience is ever lost.
[snip]

Same here, as you know... I am a "fan" of Oliver's myself... and most of
my work in this area was done "in house" for various clients and never
published. Many times I felt that such work was "all done" and I was ready
to retire it all only to have it called back into service with each round of
higher
bandwidth systems... for various reasons detailed cable/transmission line
analysis seems to come back into favor every decade or so... these days it
is a sadly neglected subject in "skul" curricula and are few "young turks"
who can handle such problems, and so we "old farts" can't retire just yet.
:-)

Newfie and Nova Scotia, eh? Wonderful place in the summer. My wife
and I have a condominium overlooking Halifax harbour and we spend
part of the summers there. My Mom was/is a Newfie and I was
born in Halifax, Nova Scotia myself, although we are both now all
fully certified "Americans".

Did you work for Cable and Wireless at one time?

I suppose you might even have sailed on the "Cyrus Field", no?

Long live the "Telegraphist's Equations"!

--
Peter K1PO
Indialantic By-the-Sea, FL.

Peter,

Soon after WW2 the Cable & Wireless company was 'nationalised' and became a
part of the British General Post Office. The GPO, in effect, was a giant
government department with 250,000 employees world wide. At its head was the
Postmaster General, a politician, a minister of government next in authority
to the prime minister (Clement Attley who had usurped Churchill). All other
employees, including the usually distinguished Engineer-in-Chief, down to
postmen, telegram boys on motor bikes and pretty female telephone operators
were civil servants.


C&W was the GPO's overseas arm distributed around the far-flung Empire on
which the sun never set. As the whole of my 40 years telecoms career was
with the GPO (later British Telecom and The Royal Mail to be asset-stripped
by Mrs Thatcher) you might say that for a period I was a C&W employee. At
any rate we were all contributing to the same pension scheme.


One of the Engineer-in-Chief's domains was his Research Department based at
Dollis Hill, N.London. It was the British renowned equivalent of Bell labs.
Formally I was a member of the E-in-Chief's Cable Test Section, a
non-descript name which covered a multitude of sins. I once met Josephson of
Junction fame with some of his equipment in a broom cupboard under the
stairs at DH. But at that time research was being concentrated on submerged
deep-sea repeaters, reliablity of thermionic tubes, and on a new,
light-weight oceanic cable with its strength member being the coaxial inner
conductor itself. It consisted of a bundle of high-tensile steel wires
covered with a seamed copper tape. I designed the mobile transmission test
equipment used at the cable factory in Southampton docks. To determine
temperature coefficients of line loss and other properties the last decade
of the home-brewed comparison attenuator was in steps of 0.001 decibels. I
also recall the all-tube equipment incorporated what must have been one of
the first of the phase-locked loops. RF signal switching circuits used
high-speed, mercury-wetted relays. To get everything to work properly in
the lab all at the same time I had to haggle my boss (who hadn't any idea
what it was all about) to specially import a Tektronics double-beam scope
from the States.


It will be appreciated cable loss across the Atlantic can amount to 4000
decibels. A prediction error of 0.5 percent involving temperature
coefficients can cause HF signal levels to disappear in thermal agitation
noise or LF signals to overload the last repeater into a state of
intermodulation paralysis. Aaah! - the romance of it all.


Never met up with the famous "Cyrus Field" cable layer. But I've had spells
at sea on HMTS (Her Majesty's Telegraph Ship) "Monarch" and "Iris" and even
privately shared most of a bottle of Scotch with Captain Evans of "HMTS
Arial" in his cabin while proceding in darkness up the English Channel back
to the ship's home port, Dover, just in time for Xmas.


There were once so many thousands of miles of disused Teed-pairs,
bridged-taps, coax, buried in GPO telephone exchanges (offices) and trunk
switching centres a national drive was organised to recover them for the
value of the metal involved. It was called "Copper Mining".


I lived for 4 years in the other Halifax, in the hills and deep valleys of
the West Riding of Yorkshire, but didn't spend much time at home to be amid
the smoking chimney stacks attached to the many woolen mills. They've now
all gone. We have other things in common besides transmission lines.


To have confidence in an analysis of an antenna as a transmission line it is
first necessary to pray and believe in the existance of single-wire
transmission lines. But Heaviside asked "Shall I refuse to eat my dinner
because I do not fully understand the processes of digestion."
----
Yours, Reg.

============================================


[snip]
Vary line length until it is exactly 1/4 wavelengths.

The input impedance of the 1/4-wave length of open-circuited line is
also
calculated and displayed.

It will be found that at exact resonance (vary length or frequency very
finely) the input impedance of the line will be a pure resistance ( jXin
=
0) equal to half of the of the line end-to-end wire resistance.
[snip]

This is *exactly* what my [and other's as well] line analysis computer
programs do for the analysis of so-called "bridged taps".

"Bridged taps", which are sections of open circuited transmission line
bridged across an operational transmission line, are quite common
in telephony practice. They are often placed deliberately to allow
for extra extension/party lines, or are inadvertently left in place once
a line is taken out of service. There are often several bridged taps
on a given line. These bridged taps don't affect telephony [audio] but
wreak havoc at higher frequencies for broadband signals. For
frequencies where the bridged taps represent a 1/4 wavelength, they
act as traps or notches and "suck out" the desired energy on the main
line. As such bridged taps can ruin the performance of digital subscriber
loops aka "DSL" such as ADSL/VDSL, etc. because they punch holes
in the transmission band. Several companies, and consultants
such as myself, have transmission line programs to evaluate broadband
transmission over lines with cascades of multiple guages/dielectrics and
several bridged taps. In fact several such "standard" line makeups
for evaluating the performance of DSL systems are published
in the Standards literature [ANSI T1E1.4]. My Fortran computer codes
must perforce analyze such 1/4 wave, or any wavelength for that
matter, stubs quite accurately to predict multi-megabit transmission
performance over several thousand feet of such impaired lines. :-)

But until your posting I had never thought to use them to analyze
the driving point impedances of antennas. Neat application!

[snip]
If your own programs significantly disagree then consign them to the
junk
box.
[snip]

Can't do that now, since literally millions of DSL modems are now running
around the world over lines that have been accurately analyzed using those
programs, hence they must be "right". I still use the programs in my
consulting
practice for client companies designing DSL modems who use my services.

I have never used these programs to simulate antennas yet, gotta do that
just for fun... I can set any arbitrary distribution of radiation
resistance
along the line in series with the primary parameter R(f) [of R(f), L(f),
C(f)
and G(f)] and so uniform distribution should be easy.

[snip]
. There are no references
except my tattered note books. I came across various useful
relationship
around 1960 when researching into methods of locating faults on oceanic
phone cables.
[snip]

Well you certainly predate me, I only started developing my transmission
line
analysis programs around 1971 or so and have kept *improving* them over
the
years, mostly to make contributions to my employers, clients and various
transmission standards committees [ANSI, ITU, ETSI, IEEE].

[snip]
But I daresay Heaviside preceded me. I dug up much information
and designed fault locating and other test equipment but very little was
published beyond contract manufacturing information. There were two
articles
in the house engineering journal. I worked alone with a small group of
assistants, a lab and a workshop. I did present a series of lectures
afterwards, twice in Europe. But it was all just in a day's work with
occasional trips aboard cable laying ships and at manufacturers. The
nearest
I got to the States was Newfoundland and Nova Scotia. I then shifted in
succession to several entirely different fields of operations. But no
experience is ever lost.
[snip]

Same here, as you know... I am a "fan" of Oliver's myself... and most of
my work in this area was done "in house" for various clients and never
published. Many times I felt that such work was "all done" and I was
ready
to retire it all only to have it called back into service with each round
of
higher
bandwidth systems... for various reasons detailed cable/transmission line
analysis seems to come back into favor every decade or so... these days it
is a sadly neglected subject in "skul" curricula and are few "young turks"
who can handle such problems, and so we "old farts" can't retire just yet.
:-)

Newfie and Nova Scotia, eh? Wonderful place in the summer. My wife
and I have a condominium overlooking Halifax harbour and we spend
part of the summers there. My Mom was/is a Newfie and I was
born in Halifax, Nova Scotia myself, although we are both now all
fully certified "Americans".

Did you work for Cable and Wireless at one time?

I suppose you might even have sailed on the "Cyrus Field", no?

Long live the "Telegraphist's Equations"!

--
Peter K1PO
Indialantic By-the-Sea, FL.

Reg:

Thanks for that interesting personal history below... I enjoyed reading it.

Another thing that [my] transmission line analysis routines [based upon 150
year old but
"augmented" "Telegraphist's Equations"] allow for besides arbitrary
resistive
loading is arbitrary inductive loading along the length to accomodate the
effects of
loading coils [Thanks Prof. Puppin, Oliver Heaviside!].

Of course the "Telegraphists Equations" [first developed by Oliver Heaviside
I believe] are
based upon circuit theory and not field theory per se, and so they only
accurately model the
TEM mode of transmission.

Single conductor transmission lines. It seems to me that there may be
several, even
many, modes simultaneously supported on such single conductor lines. I
don't know about
your programs/algorithms capabilities, but my own programs analyze lines
only for the TEM
mode [Sufficient for telephony, and broadband DSL and cable modem
applications] and so
one has to be careful with interpertations of the outputs of such modelling
programs when
other [non-TEM] modes might be present.

The mathematical models for various modes will be different won't they?

I don't see [forsee] any problems with the pure TEM analysis of single
conductor lines
using augmented "Telegraphists Equations". Other than the radiation losses
and their
distribution, which we have been discussing. such single conductor lines are
modeled, for
TEM mode, the same way as two [or more] conductor transmission lines are
they not?

--
Peter K1PO
Indialantic By-the-Sea, FL.


"Reg Edwards" wrote in message
...
Peter,

Soon after WW2 the Cable & Wireless company was 'nationalised' and became
a
part of the British General Post Office. The GPO, in effect, was a giant
government department with 250,000 employees world wide. At its head was
the
Postmaster General, a politician, a minister of government next in
authority
to the prime minister (Clement Attley who had usurped Churchill). All
other
employees, including the usually distinguished Engineer-in-Chief, down to
postmen, telegram boys on motor bikes and pretty female telephone
operators
were civil servants.


C&W was the GPO's overseas arm distributed around the far-flung E[ny]mpire
on
which the sun never set. As the whole of my 40 years telecoms career was
with the GPO (later British Telecom and The Royal Mail to be
asset-stripped
by Mrs Thatcher) you might say that for a period I was a C&W employee. At
any rate we were all contributing to the same pension scheme.


One of the Engineer-in-Chief's domains was his Research Department based
at
Dollis Hill, N.London. It was the British renowned equivalent of Bell
labs.
Formally I was a member of the E-in-Chief's Cable Test Section, a
non-descript name which covered a multitude of sins. I once met Josephson
of
Junction fame with some of his equipment in a broom cupboard under the
stairs at DH. But at that time research was being concentrated on
submerged
deep-sea repeaters, reliablity of thermionic tubes, and on a new,
light-weight oceanic cable with its strength member being the coaxial
inner
conductor itself. It consisted of a bundle of high-tensile steel wires
covered with a seamed copper tape. I designed the mobile transmission
test
equipment used at the cable factory in Southampton docks. To determine
temperature coefficients of line loss and other properties the last decade
of the home-brewed comparison attenuator was in steps of 0.001 decibels. I
also recall the all-tube equipment incorporated what must have been one of
the first of the phase-locked loops. RF signal switching circuits used
high-speed, mercury-wetted relays. To get everything to work properly in
the lab all at the same time I had to haggle my boss (who hadn't any idea
what it was all about) to specially import a Tektronics double-beam scope
from the States.


It will be appreciated cable loss across the Atlantic can amount to 4000
decibels. A prediction error of 0.5 percent involving temperature
coefficients can cause HF signal levels to disappear in thermal agitation
noise or LF signals to overload the last repeater into a state of
intermodulation paralysis. Aaah! - the romance of it all.


Never met up with the famous "Cyrus Field" cable layer. But I've had
spells
at sea on HMTS (Her Majesty's Telegraph Ship) "Monarch" and "Iris" and
even
privately shared most of a bottle of Scotch with Captain Evans of "HMTS
Arial" in his cabin while proceding in darkness up the English Channel
back
to the ship's home port, Dover, just in time for Xmas.


There were once so many thousands of miles of disused Teed-pairs,
bridged-taps, coax, buried in GPO telephone exchanges (offices) and trunk
switching centres a national drive was organised to recover them for the
value of the metal involved. It was called "Copper Mining".


I lived for 4 years in the other Halifax, in the hills and deep valleys of
the West Riding of Yorkshire, but didn't spend much time at home to be
amid
the smoking chimney stacks attached to the many woolen mills. They've now
all gone. We have other things in common besides transmission lines.


To have confidence in an analysis of an antenna as a transmission line it
is
first necessary to pray and believe in the existance of single-wire
transmission lines. But Heaviside asked "Shall I refuse to eat my dinner
because I do not fully understand the processes of digestion."
----
Yours, Reg.

============================================


[snip]
Vary line length until it is exactly 1/4 wavelengths.

The input impedance of the 1/4-wave length of open-circuited line is
also
calculated and displayed.

It will be found that at exact resonance (vary length or frequency
very
finely) the input impedance of the line will be a pure resistance (
jXin
=
0) equal to half of the of the line end-to-end wire resistance.
[snip]

This is *exactly* what my [and other's as well] line analysis computer
programs do for the analysis of so-called "bridged taps".

"Bridged taps", which are sections of open circuited transmission line
bridged across an operational transmission line, are quite common
in telephony practice. They are often placed deliberately to allow
for extra extension/party lines, or are inadvertently left in place once
a line is taken out of service. There are often several bridged taps
on a given line. These bridged taps don't affect telephony [audio] but
wreak havoc at higher frequencies for broadband signals. For
frequencies where the bridged taps represent a 1/4 wavelength, they
act as traps or notches and "suck out" the desired energy on the main
line. As such bridged taps can ruin the performance of digital
subscriber
loops aka "DSL" such as ADSL/VDSL, etc. because they punch holes
in the transmission band. Several companies, and consultants
such as myself, have transmission line programs to evaluate broadband
transmission over lines with cascades of multiple guages/dielectrics and
several bridged taps. In fact several such "standard" line makeups
for evaluating the performance of DSL systems are published
in the Standards literature [ANSI T1E1.4]. My Fortran computer codes
must perforce analyze such 1/4 wave, or any wavelength for that
matter, stubs quite accurately to predict multi-megabit transmission
performance over several thousand feet of such impaired lines. :-)

But until your posting I had never thought to use them to analyze
the driving point impedances of antennas. Neat application!

[snip]
If your own programs significantly disagree then consign them to the
junk
box.
[snip]

Can't do that now, since literally millions of DSL modems are now
running
around the world over lines that have been accurately analyzed using
those
programs, hence they must be "right". I still use the programs in my
consulting
practice for client companies designing DSL modems who use my services.

I have never used these programs to simulate antennas yet, gotta do that
just for fun... I can set any arbitrary distribution of radiation
resistance
along the line in series with the primary parameter R(f) [of R(f), L(f),
C(f)
and G(f)] and so uniform distribution should be easy.

[snip]
. There are no references
except my tattered note books. I came across various useful
relationship
around 1960 when researching into methods of locating faults on
oceanic
phone cables.
[snip]

Well you certainly predate me, I only started developing my transmission
line
analysis programs around 1971 or so and have kept *improving* them over
the
years, mostly to make contributions to my employers, clients and various
transmission standards committees [ANSI, ITU, ETSI, IEEE].

[snip]
But I daresay Heaviside preceded me. I dug up much information
and designed fault locating and other test equipment but very little
was
published beyond contract manufacturing information. There were two
articles
in the house engineering journal. I worked alone with a small group of
assistants, a lab and a workshop. I did present a series of lectures
afterwards, twice in Europe. But it was all just in a day's work with
occasional trips aboard cable laying ships and at manufacturers. The
nearest
I got to the States was Newfoundland and Nova Scotia. I then shifted
in
succession to several entirely different fields of operations. But no
experience is ever lost.
[snip]

Same here, as you know... I am a "fan" of Oliver's myself... and most of
my work in this area was done "in house" for various clients and never
published. Many times I felt that such work was "all done" and I was
ready
to retire it all only to have it called back into service with each
round
of
higher
bandwidth systems... for various reasons detailed cable/transmission
line
analysis seems to come back into favor every decade or so... these days
it
is a sadly neglected subject in "skul" curricula and are few "young
turks"
who can handle such problems, and so we "old farts" can't retire just
yet.
:-)

Newfie and Nova Scotia, eh? Wonderful place in the summer. My wife
and I have a condominium overlooking Halifax harbour and we spend
part of the summers there. My Mom was/is a Newfie and I was
born in Halifax, Nova Scotia myself, although we are both now all
fully certified "Americans".

Did you work for Cable and Wireless at one time?

I suppose you might even have sailed on the "Cyrus Field", no?

Long live the "Telegraphist's Equations"!

--
Peter K1PO
Indialantic By-the-Sea, FL.

Cec and others, what's the point in dragging in opinions of people nobody
has ever head of and whose publications are highly unlikely ever to become
available before all interest in the subject has faded from everybody's
imagination.

If anything needs to be said, would it not be better to say it just on one's
own authority and be done with it. Otherwise it falls into the category of
"name dropping".
---
Reg

On Tue, 6 Jan 2004 03:58:18 +0000 (UTC), "Reg Edwards"
wrote:

I never support my stuff by citing

On Mon, 5 Jan 2004 04:41:03 +0000 (UTC), "Reg Edwards"
wrote:

to keep Roy happy

On Tue, 6 Jan 2004 03:58:18 +0000 (UTC), "Reg Edwards"
wrote:

But I daresay Heaviside preceded me.

On Tue, 6 Jan 2004 18:28:33 +0000 (UTC), "Reg Edwards"
wrote:

Clement Attley who had usurped Churchill

On Tue, 6 Jan 2004 18:28:33 +0000 (UTC), "Reg Edwards"
wrote:

I once met Josephson

On Tue, 6 Jan 2004 18:28:33 +0000 (UTC), "Reg Edwards"
wrote:

Captain Evans

On Wed, 7 Jan 2004 16:18:52 +0000 (UTC), "Reg Edwards"
wrote:

If anything needs to be said, would it not be better to say it just on one's
own authority and be done with it. Otherwise it falls into the category of
"name dropping".
---
Reg

I don't agree (and apparently neither do you).
If names were snowflakes, this would be an avalanche. :-)

73's
Richard Clark, KB7QHC

Reg Edwards wrote:
Cec and others, what's the point in dragging in opinions of people nobody
has ever head of and whose publications are highly unlikely ever to become
available before all interest in the subject has faded from everybody's
imagination.

Reg, everyone except you has heard of John D. Kraus, W8JK. My personal
library would be extremely incomplete without his book(s).

If anything needs to be said, would it not be better to say it just on one's
own authority and be done with it. Otherwise it falls into the category of
"name dropping".

In physics and engineering circles, it's called providing a reference.
Without a reference, it is just a personal opinion, unless one can
prove otherwise. With a proper reference, it is generally accepted as
fact, unless one can prove otherwise. Check out all the references
at the end of any technical article.
--
73, Cecil http://www.qsl.net/w5dxp



-----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----
http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
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Reg Edwards wrote:
Cec and others, what's the point in dragging in opinions of people
nobody has ever head of and whose publications are highly unlikely ever
to become available before all interest in the subject has faded from
everybody's imagination.

If anything needs to be said, would it not be better to say it just on
one's own authority and be done with it.

We already noticed. But if anyone else tried that, guess who'd call it
"plagiarism"?

Otherwise it falls into the category of
"name dropping".

Cecil has it right: it's called "a reference".


--
73 from Ian G3SEK 'In Practice' columnist for RadCom (RSGB)
Editor, 'The VHF/UHF DX Book'
http://www.ifwtech.co.uk/g3sek

Peter, wot's a 'mode'. Don't bother to answer. ;o)

All I know is that there are a great number of them. I became aware of their
existence when in 1944 I first twiddled the 3 slugs in the matching section
of rectangular waveguide (the tuner) between Randall and Boot's 50 KW
magnetron and a renewed radar dish. This was a tedious, aggravating process
because when tightening the locking nuts the slugs never failed rotate with
the nuts so returning the process to square one.

I have always been under the impression Modes were invented by academics
just to explain by using pictures in their published papers the
peculiarities of waves when confined to waveguides. As I have never come
across another waveguide since 1946, and my favourite band has always been
160 meters, what microscopic amount of knowledge of modes I may have gleaned
from tightening nuts while lying on my belly inside an aircraft fuselage has
long ago evaporated.

On the other hand, 1875 telegraphists' equations have always provided good
enough answers when used to analyse behaviour of single wire lines including
antennas. If it looks by eye like a line it will behave like one. After all,
the very first telegraph lines were just single wires strung up on poles.
All have uniformly distributed R,L,C & G except at their ends. And end
effects, which are related to wire diameter, are calculable and can (if
necessary for precision) be accounted for.

The only problem, and it's not a serious one in practice, using classical
transmission line analysis is due to uncertainty in the antenna's
environment such as height above ground, ground conductivity, or dogs' hind
legs. or trees. Attempts to use some sort of mode analysis to relieve
environmental uncertainty would be just as likely to fail.

The modelling and number-crunching methods of EZNEC-type programs, which are
neither classical nor modal, will eventually remove the guesswork by fully
including the environment in the model. But the time and effort taken to
enter the data and to ensure absence of errors may prove overwhelming to
professionals and amateurs alike.

I would think trying to find a use for modes would be as fruitless as
considering what happens to the so-called power which is supposed to be
reflected back into transmitters.
----
Reg.

Reg Edwards, G4FGQ wrote:
"I have always been under the impression Modes were invented by
academics just to explain by using pictures in their published papers
the pecularities of waves when confined to wave guides."

Could well be. If anyone would like to see some of these pictures, King,
Mimno, and Wing have a well illustrated section beginning on page 243 of
"Transmission Lines, Antennas, and Wave Guides". They even include a
single-wire line, near or far from the earth, in the text.

It isn`t only telegraph which used single-wire transmission lines. In
Tierra del Fuego, there was a single galvanized steel wire running along
the 40-miile long road between Rio Grande and San Sebastian used for
telephone service to the sheep raising "estancias" (stations) along the
route. It was hardly insulated at all. It must have worked, but we never
imitated nor tried to gain access. We interfered with the estancias as
little as possible. Drilling for oil was imposition enough. In return we
were the finders, producers, refiners, and marketers of petroleum
products and natural gas on the Argentine side of the island.

Best regards, Richard Harrison, KB5WZI