Nutty Antenna Idea -- Complete with Rhetorical Questions
 

I have two multiband trap verticals They are not exactly the same, but
close. Obviously they're intended to be mounted vertically above a ground.

What happens if I mount them horizontally, base-to base? If I feed one with
coax as designed, would it see the other one as a counterpoise? Could I
remove any base matching components and feed them both with a 1:1 balun, in
effect duplicating the function of a horizontal wire trap dipole?

I'm really impressed with the lower noise of a horizontal antenna. Screw
the directionality drawbacks of a horizontal! I can hear more stations.

I am having great fun with HF. My 10 meter copper pipe dipole is laying on
the roof with one element extended using a short clip lead and some RG-6 TV
coax. Tonight, my Kenwood TS-120 reached out from San Diego for a QSO with
New Zealand on 20 meters, my first contact outside this hemisphere. Neat.

"Sal"
(really KD6VKW)

Nutty Antenna Idea -- Complete with Rhetorical Questions
 

"Sal M. Onella" wrote in message
...
I have two multiband trap verticals They are not exactly the same, but
close. Obviously they're intended to be mounted vertically above a
ground.

What happens if I mount them horizontally, base-to base? If I feed one
with
coax as designed, would it see the other one as a counterpoise? Could I
remove any base matching components and feed them both with a 1:1 balun,
in
effect duplicating the function of a horizontal wire trap dipole?

I'm really impressed with the lower noise of a horizontal antenna. Screw
the directionality drawbacks of a horizontal! I can hear more stations.

I am having great fun with HF. My 10 meter copper pipe dipole is laying
on
the roof with one element extended using a short clip lead and some RG-6
TV
coax. Tonight, my Kenwood TS-120 reached out from San Diego for a QSO with
New Zealand on 20 meters, my first contact outside this hemisphere. Neat.

"Sal"
(really KD6VKW)



What you would have is a trap dipole, a fairly common antenna. With out
seeing the antennas I am not sure how the twoo different types would
intereact but its worth a try. You will probably need a tuner.

Nutty Antenna Idea -- Complete with Rhetorical Questions
 

On Sat, 24 Mar 2007 06:11:45 -0400, "Jimmie D"
wrote:


"Sal M. Onella" wrote in message
...
I have two multiband trap verticals They are not exactly the same, but
close. Obviously they're intended to be mounted vertically above a
ground.

What happens if I mount them horizontally, base-to base? If I feed one
with
coax as designed, would it see the other one as a counterpoise? Could I
remove any base matching components and feed them both with a 1:1 balun,
in
effect duplicating the function of a horizontal wire trap dipole?

I'm really impressed with the lower noise of a horizontal antenna. Screw
the directionality drawbacks of a horizontal! I can hear more stations.

I am having great fun with HF. My 10 meter copper pipe dipole is laying
on
the roof with one element extended using a short clip lead and some RG-6
TV
coax. Tonight, my Kenwood TS-120 reached out from San Diego for a QSO with
New Zealand on 20 meters, my first contact outside this hemisphere. Neat.

"Sal"
(really KD6VKW)



What you would have is a trap dipole, a fairly common antenna. With out
seeing the antennas I am not sure how the twoo different types would
intereact but its worth a try. You will probably need a tuner.


If both were the same, I think he would be better off, but it should
turn into a rotatable dipole similar to a multiband beam, but without
the directors and reflectors. I see there is no reason it shouldn't
work once he gets them tuned.

Buck

--
73 for now
Buck, N4PGW
www.lumpuckeroo.com

Nutty Antenna Idea -- Complete with Rhetorical Questions
 

Buck wrote:
If both were the same, I think he would be better off, but it should
turn into a rotatable dipole similar to a multiband beam, but without
the directors and reflectors. I see there is no reason it shouldn't
work once he gets them tuned.

How much would it weigh?
--
73, Cecil http://www.w5dxp.com

Nutty Antenna Idea -- Complete with Rhetorical Questions
 

"Cecil Moore" wrote in message
...
Buck wrote:
If both were the same, I think he would be better off, but it should
turn into a rotatable dipole similar to a multiband beam, but without
the directors and reflectors. I see there is no reason it shouldn't
work once he gets them tuned.

How much would it weigh?
--
73, Cecil http://www.w5dxp.com

Yeah I thought about that too after my inital post. It would be a bear to
make a rotateable dipole using this if its anything like my old trap
vertical.

Nutty Antenna Idea -- Complete with Rhetorical Questions
 

I have two multiband trap verticals They are not exactly the same, but
close. Obviously they're intended to be mounted vertically above a ground.
What happens if I mount them horizontally, base-to base? If I feed one with
....[snip]....

I've done it with pairs of identical "hamsticks" (not multiband, but
quick-disconnects made it relatively easy to change bands), coax fed,
and mounted (horizontally, pointed fore and aft, of course!-) about
two feet above the cab of my pickup. It made a GREAT NVIS HF antenna!

--
--Myron A. Calhoun; W0PBV; 2001 Dunbar Road; Manhattan, KS 66502-3907
Five boxes preserve our freedoms: soap, ballot, witness, jury, and cartridge
NRA Life Member & Certified Instructor for Rifle, Pistol, & Home Firearm Safety
Also Certified Instructor for the Kansas Concealed-Carry Handgun (CCH) license

Nutty Antenna Idea -- Complete with Rhetorical Questions
 

"Jimmie D" wrote in message
...

"Cecil Moore" wrote in message
...
Buck wrote:
If both were the same, I think he would be better off, but it should
turn into a rotatable dipole similar to a multiband beam, but without
the directors and reflectors. I see there is no reason it shouldn't
work once he gets them tuned.

How much would it weigh?
--
73, Cecil http://www.w5dxp.com

Yeah I thought about that too after my inital post. It would be a bear to
make a rotateable dipole using this if its anything like my old trap
vertical.



I hadn't bargained on rotating it, although that's not out of the question.
I think those verticals are about 20 pounds each, so it would be a project.
I will weigh them tomorrow. I do have a rotator thrust bearing that I once
used with a monster VHF TV antenna.

The Hustler four band (10, 15, 20 , 40) is 35 feet tall. The other antenna
is a five-band, but I don't have the specs here at hand. It's presumably
the same, unless they got 80 with some folding tricks, in which case I don't
know how tall it would be.

Depending on where I would put a rotating 70-foot horizontal antenna, I'm
sure I could either prune my neighbor's tree or make contact with the power
company, via their overhead lines. Did I mention I am on a city street with
a 100 x 100 lot? Hm-m-m -- better not rotate.

Nutty Antenna Idea -- Complete with Rhetorical Questions
 

wrote in message ...

I have two multiband trap verticals They are not exactly the same, but
close. Obviously they're intended to be mounted vertically above a
ground.
What happens if I mount them horizontally, base-to base? If I feed one
with
....[snip]....

I've done it with pairs of identical "hamsticks" (not multiband, but
quick-disconnects made it relatively easy to change bands), coax fed,
and mounted (horizontally, pointed fore and aft, of course!-) about
two feet above the cab of my pickup. It made a GREAT NVIS HF antenna!

--
--Myron A. Calhoun; W0PBV;

Thanks. I don't own any of them, yet, but it sounds like a possibility.
I'm probably going to want DX, though, so NVIS isn't something that I'm
seeking. If I'm horizontal, I'll want some elevation.

"Sal"

Nutty Antenna Idea -- Complete with Rhetorical Questions
 

"Sal M. Onella" wrote in message
...

"Jimmie D" wrote in message
...

"Cecil Moore" wrote in message
...
Buck wrote:
If both were the same, I think he would be better off, but it should
turn into a rotatable dipole similar to a multiband beam, but without
the directors and reflectors. I see there is no reason it shouldn't
work once he gets them tuned.

How much would it weigh?
--
73, Cecil http://www.w5dxp.com

Yeah I thought about that too after my inital post. It would be a bear to
make a rotateable dipole using this if its anything like my old trap
vertical.



I hadn't bargained on rotating it, although that's not out of the
question.
I think those verticals are about 20 pounds each, so it would be a
project.
I will weigh them tomorrow. I do have a rotator thrust bearing that I
once
used with a monster VHF TV antenna.

The Hustler four band (10, 15, 20 , 40) is 35 feet tall. The other
antenna
is a five-band, but I don't have the specs here at hand. It's presumably
the same, unless they got 80 with some folding tricks, in which case I
don't
know how tall it would be.

Depending on where I would put a rotating 70-foot horizontal antenna, I'm
sure I could either prune my neighbor's tree or make contact with the
power
company, via their overhead lines. Did I mention I am on a city street
with
a 100 x 100 lot? Hm-m-m -- better not rotate.



Make sure your antenna is OK before you try this a lot of those old Hustlers
are good for scrap.

Nutty Antenna Idea -- Complete with Rhetorical Questions
 

"Sal M. Onella" wrote in
:

I have two multiband trap verticals They are not exactly the same,
but close. Obviously they're intended to be mounted vertically above
a ground.

What happens if I mount them horizontally, base-to base? If I feed
one with coax as designed, would it see the other one as a
counterpoise? Could I remove any base matching components and feed
them both with a 1:1 balun, in effect duplicating the function of a
horizontal wire trap dipole?

Will water drain from the traps in their new configuration?

Owen

Nutty Antenna Idea -- Complete with Rhetorical Questions
 

On Sat, 24 Mar 2007 14:05:28 GMT, Cecil Moore
wrote:

Buck wrote:
If both were the same, I think he would be better off, but it should
turn into a rotatable dipole similar to a multiband beam, but without
the directors and reflectors. I see there is no reason it shouldn't
work once he gets them tuned.

How much would it weigh?

That part hadn't occurred to me. Come to think of it, I don't think
they were designed to withstand horizontal positioning, but then I
don't know the antennas. Anyway, good luck in the antenna.

Maybe a vertical dipole?


--
73 for now
Buck, N4PGW
www.lumpuckeroo.com

Nutty Antenna Idea -- Complete with Rhetorical Questions
 

I've done it with pairs of identical "hamsticks" ....
two feet above the cab of my pickup. It made a GREAT NVIS HF antenna!

Thanks. I don't own any of them, yet, but it sounds like a possibility.
I'm probably going to want DX, though, so NVIS isn't something that I'm
seeking. If I'm horizontal, I'll want some elevation.

The NVIS was not caused by the hamsticks, themselves,
but by their being VERY LOW!
(2 feet above my pickup cab is only 8-9 feet high)

I'm not in any way claiming hamsticks are the "best" antenna,
but if you elevated a dipole made of them, I'm sure they
would not act like cloud-burners anymore.

--
--Myron A. Calhoun; W0PBV; 2001 Dunbar Road; Manhattan, KS 66502-3907
Five boxes preserve our freedoms: soap, ballot, witness, jury, and cartridge
NRA Life Member & Certified Instructor for Rifle, Pistol, & Home Firearm Safety
Also Certified Instructor for the Kansas Concealed-Carry Handgun (CCH) license

Nutty Antenna Idea -- Complete with Rhetorical Questions
 

"Owen Duffy" wrote in message
...
"Sal M. Onella" wrote in
:

I have two multiband trap verticals They are not exactly the same,
but close. Obviously they're intended to be mounted vertically above
a ground.

What happens if I mount them horizontally, base-to base? If I feed
one with coax as designed, would it see the other one as a
counterpoise? Could I remove any base matching components and feed
them both with a 1:1 balun, in effect duplicating the function of a
horizontal wire trap dipole?

Will water drain from the traps in their new configuration?

Owen

Probably not, unless I do something special, like custom drain holes. Being
in Southern California, we have a six-month virtually rain-free summer
coming up, so I suppose it cold be a fair-weather project. (What do you bet
I forget to take it down in October?)

Nutty Antenna Idea -- Complete with Rhetorical Questions
 

"Jimmie D" wrote in message news:46060d00$0$1379



Make sure your antenna is OK before you try this a lot of those old
Hustlers
are good for scrap.



Good idea.

Nutty Antenna Idea -- Complete with Rhetorical Questions
 

"Buck" wrote in message
...



That part hadn't occurred to me. Come to think of it, I don't think
they were designed to withstand horizontal positioning, but then I
don't know the antennas. Anyway, good luck in the antenna.

Maybe a vertical dipole?

withstand horizontal positioning If I do this, I will have the thing
laying on the roof, at or near the peak, so support won't be a
consideration. (The far end of each unit could stick out and be
self-supporting.) Having it slide down the roof is a bigger worry.

vertical dipole Ahah! I started out with a 10m vertical dipole as my
first-ever HF antenna, last month. (It has since morphed into an OCF
horizontal dipole that I've stretched all the way to 40m with a homebrew
pi-network tuner I acquired at the swap meet.). To the point, two opposing
trap verticals as a single dipole would be a 70 foot vertical structure and
is not within my capabilities. (I would love to try it, though.)

"Sal"
(KD6VKW)