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Part three of many
Part two I finished up talking about eddy currents that form a
magnetic field in opposition to the primrary magnetic field. It is this eddy current that is considered a loss in the building of transformers and forms as a circulating current which can penetrate quite deeply in a transformer. To cut down this loss a transformer is made of laminated steel parts bound together so the depth of the eddy current is confined to a single laminate to control its penetration or skin depth. Eddy currents formed on an antenna are also circulartory such that the current flow is at right angles to the applied current flow. So the conception of skin depth of a radiator as being some sort of high resistance or corrosion skin is not quite correct. What we actually have is a force or current running into the side of another current flow so that the summation of such is deflected sideways and upwards in three dimensional terms. As I mentioned earlier this eddy field or magnetic field comes into contact with the magnetic field of the particle and where the particle is ejected together with a spin applied to it so it can maintain a straight trajectory. Remember, the particle is extremely small so it takes only a small amount of energy to send it on its way. For those who are aware of the magnetic elevation experiments the elevation force is a fraction more than the gravity force in the opposite direction and as many know to keep an article stable while elevated it is difficult to preventing the elevated article from turning over which is particle spin. So when the particle is ejected from the antenna surface it has spin so that it can maintain a straight line trajectory as well as the ability to negotiate thru areas affected by gravitational pull which is nullified by the upthrust of the elevation force created by the magnetic field of the eddy currents. However these ejected particles passing from one antenna to another does not explain the transmission of intelligence so something else has to occur otherwise we are stymied. Well remember that Newtons laws of action and reaction means there is a reactionary force on the radiator from the ejection of the particles is similar to what you see at the swimming pool with a spring board. A diver jumps on the spring board which is a downward force and the reactionary force is that applied by the spring board to the diver so in the case of an antenna it must move in a reaction to the downwards motion and you then see a repartition of what you saw with the spring board where after the diver has left it continues to oscillate for a short time. But in the case of antenna another particle quickly takes the place of the ejected particle for a place to rest such that the antenna oscillation continually takes place over a short length of time. To fully understand this repartition of ejection and replacement with respect to the natural frequency and time factors we must now investigate further the electrical circuit that simulates such action .This is called a Tank circuit where the energy supplied sloshes back and forth between a capacitor and a inductor and where the capacitor itself cannot radiate and the inductor can cause radiation in two different ways ie. when the field is being generated and when it is dissapating for each full cycle or period of the tank circuit operation. This represents the full sinosoidal of the applied alternating current when applied not to a fractional WL antenna but a full WL antenna because a period represents the repetitive function of BOTH phases of the applied current. More on the Tank circuit operation in the next Part four. If you can get ahead of the game and study the operation of a tanks circuit you will see it is not as simple as it appears because it involves time constants, voltage multiplication as well as phase change each of which is important in terms of sequence to provide for the ejection of particles . I may have to Google to get the sequence correct ie copy the description or refer to a URL for simplicity Art Unwin unwinantennas.com/ |
Part three of many
"Art Unwin" wrote in message ... [text deleted] Art Unwin unwinantennas.com/ I went to your website but I didn't see any specific antenna information, like a ham might want to build a new type of antenna, to try it out. I saw a write-up of an H-F antenna with elements wound into a spiral and wondered if that might be yours, as you speak of physically small antennas (fraction of an expected resonant size). Pls advise in group. TNX. |
Part three of many
On Jul 9, 12:55 am, "Clark Kent" wrote:
"Art Unwin" wrote in message ... [text deleted] Art Unwin unwinantennas.com/ I went to your website but I didn't see any specific antenna information, like a ham might want to build a new type of antenna, to try it out. I saw a write-up of an H-F antenna with elements wound into a spiral and wondered if that might be yours, as you speak of physically small antennas (fraction of an expected resonant size). Pls advise in group. TNX. A helix is an excellent example to talk about to arrive at small full wave antennas. When you follow the reasoning of the extension to Gaussian law of statics which makes it dynamic it brings to the surface that a radiator can be any size or shape as long as it is in equilibrium. So to meet the intent of both laws which are now the same, we must not impose any lumped circuits while making our antenna. Now a helix is a fractional wave antenna with added capacitive and inductive lumped loads, thus to follow the intent of Maxwell's law we must first extend the antenna to a full wave form while at the same time cancelling the added lumped loads. So if we start with a half wave helix in standard form we have to continue the element in a down ward direction where we then reach the starting point. Doing this first completes the circuit to a full wave and secondly it cancels the pre imposed capacitive and inductive lumped load that are inherrent with a standard helix antenna PLUS we have removed the need for a ground plane as the completed antenna is now a full instead of fractional circuit. Now instead of winding with a helix angle of some ten degrees plus we can now push the windings close together and then tip the new antenna to a 10 degree plus angle to put the whole thing in equilibrium by replacing the angular force represented by the form pitch that we removed by losing the pitch of the winding. Actually this works out quite well as you can now laquer the assembly where it has no voids and is quite strong. By the way my antennas are always of a full wavelength which by virtue of its reduced volume then becomes a small FULL wave antennas to retain the inherrent efficiencies of full wave antennas in equilibrium as well as resonant. Allow me to continu on this line of thinking. It should now be seen that an array is also shrunken not only by the shortened elements but also by the fact that element spacings conform to the equilibrium of the array as a whole! We then have an array that does not have to have elements at certain distance from each other ad infirnitum but just two elements much closer together where all radiation is accounted for! Hope the above helps you out but I do expect howls of resistance from others as they wish to protect the notion that "all is known about antennas" thus this posting is sacrelidge and must be negated at all costs. And some others ofcourse will vehemently reject the notion of the WEAK force being revealed by a ham where Einstein could no so for me the end of the World is aproaching or at the least the magnetic pole of our Earth has started a full rotation! Cheers and beers Art Unwin KB9MZ....xg unwinantennas.com/ |
Part three of many
Art wrote:
"---thus to follow the intent of Maxwell`s law we must first extend the antenna to a full wave form." False. All we need is resonance to eliminate reactance which otherwise would limit current in the antenna . First resonance in the thin straight 1/2-wave dipole ia about 5% less than a physical 1/2 wavelength. A full wavelength straight antenna has characteristics completely different from its first-resonance cousin. A small diameter coil radiates perpendicularly to its axis. As a radiator its effect is related to the coil`s length not the length of wire on the form. Wire length is related to resistance to r-f current and therefore to loss in an antenna containing coils. That is the source of skepticism of the Unwin antenna. Resistance-loaded antennas have proven useful in situations demanding great frequency bandwidth so Art may have something of value after all. My ARRL Antenna Book (20th ed.) says on page 16-13: "The general approach has been to use a coil nade from very heavy wire (#14 or larger), with length-to-diameter ratios as high as 21. British experimenters have reported good results with 8-foot overall lengths on the 1.8 and 3.5 MHz bands." Bill Orr wrote on page 78 of "All About Vertical Antennas": "In general, a half-wavelength of no,14 Formvar-coated wire is spirally wrapped on the form, with turn spacing approximately eqial to the wire diameter. This amount of wire will approximate a quarter-wave resonance. Orr`s book was first printed in 1986. Unwin has a problem with novelty. Best regards, Richard harrison, KB5WZI |
Part three of many
"Art Unwin" wrote in message ... On Jul 9, 12:55 am, "Clark Kent" wrote: "Art Unwin" wrote in message ... [text deleted] Art Unwin unwinantennas.com/ I went to your website but I didn't see any specific antenna information, like a ham might want to build a new type of antenna, to try it out. [text deleted A helix is an excellent example to talk about to arrive at small full wave antennas. When you follow the reasoning of the extension to Gaussian law of statics which makes it dynamic it brings to the surface that a radiator can be any size or shape as long as it is in equilibrium. [ text deleted] By the way my antennas are always of a full wavelength which by virtue of its reduced volume then becomes a small FULL wave antennas to retain the inherrent efficiencies of full wave antennas in equilibrium as well as resonant. Allow me to continu on this line of thinking. It should now be seen that an array is also shrunken not only by the shortened elements but also by the fact that element spacings conform to the equilibrium of the array as a whole! We then have an array that does not have to have elements at certain distance from each other ad infirnitum but just two elements much closer together where all radiation is accounted for! Hope the above helps you out. [text deleted] Cheers and beers Art Unwin KB9MZ Well, I'm good with the cheers and beers, but no way am I close to clipping and snipping (wire) to make an Unwin Antenna. What do they look like? Photos? Diagrams? Crayola drawings? Don't get me wrong, OM, theory is important but there's no textbook that loads up at 7220 KHz. Show me some metal parts. |
Part three of many
On Jul 9, 8:10 pm, "Clark Kent" wrote:
"Art Unwin" wrote in message ... On Jul 9, 12:55 am, "Clark Kent" wrote: "Art Unwin" wrote in message ... [text deleted] Art Unwin unwinantennas.com/ I went to your website but I didn't see any specific antenna information, like a ham might want to build a new type of antenna, to try it out. [text deleted A helix is an excellent example to talk about to arrive at small full wave antennas. When you follow the reasoning of the extension to Gaussian law of statics which makes it dynamic it brings to the surface that a radiator can be any size or shape as long as it is in equilibrium. [ text deleted] By the way my antennas are always of a full wavelength which by virtue of its reduced volume then becomes a small FULL wave antennas to retain the inherrent efficiencies of full wave antennas in equilibrium as well as resonant. Allow me to continu on this line of thinking. It should now be seen that an array is also shrunken not only by the shortened elements but also by the fact that element spacings conform to the equilibrium of the array as a whole! We then have an array that does not have to have elements at certain distance from each other ad infirnitum but just two elements much closer together where all radiation is accounted for! Hope the above helps you out. [text deleted] Cheers and beers Art Unwin KB9MZ Well, I'm good with the cheers and beers, but no way am I close to clipping and snipping (wire) to make an Unwin Antenna. What do they look like? Photos? Diagrams? Crayola drawings? Don't get me wrong, OM, theory is important but there's no textbook that loads up at 7220 KHz. Show me some metal parts. I am sharing information with all so there is nothing to stop you making one for your own use. I really want the Britts to use it on their small gardens at the back and get on the top bands. They are still into experimenting oiver there where America still is in the throw away society preferring the Lazy Boy and a six pack instead of a hobby. All they want to be is LOUD and talk over the other cb ers which is why their interest in antennas evolve solely around gain and a amplifier. Read some of the postings and eventually you will find where it tells you how to make one as I am not giving them away for trial runs on the air. Just follow what is evident, a radiator can be any shape size or elevation as long as it is in equilibrium. Put another way if during construction you add lumped loads in any form then they must be cancelled. Now let your imagination run wild. I have made one in sheet form so there are plenty of options |
Part three of many
On Jul 9, 8:10 pm, "Clark Kent" wrote:
"Art Unwin" wrote in message ... On Jul 9, 12:55 am, "Clark Kent" wrote: "Art Unwin" wrote in message ... [text deleted] Art Unwin unwinantennas.com/ I went to your website but I didn't see any specific antenna information, like a ham might want to build a new type of antenna, to try it out. [text deleted A helix is an excellent example to talk about to arrive at small full wave antennas. When you follow the reasoning of the extension to Gaussian law of statics which makes it dynamic it brings to the surface that a radiator can be any size or shape as long as it is in equilibrium. [ text deleted] By the way my antennas are always of a full wavelength which by virtue of its reduced volume then becomes a small FULL wave antennas to retain the inherrent efficiencies of full wave antennas in equilibrium as well as resonant. Allow me to continu on this line of thinking. It should now be seen that an array is also shrunken not only by the shortened elements but also by the fact that element spacings conform to the equilibrium of the array as a whole! We then have an array that does not have to have elements at certain distance from each other ad infirnitum but just two elements much closer together where all radiation is accounted for! Hope the above helps you out. [text deleted] Cheers and beers Art Unwin KB9MZ Well, I'm good with the cheers and beers, but no way am I close to clipping and snipping (wire) to make an Unwin Antenna. What do they look like? Photos? Diagrams? Crayola drawings? Don't get me wrong, OM, theory is important but there's no textbook that loads up at 7220 KHz. Show me some metal parts. Tell you what, get some wire twice the WL of the frequency you are interested in. Wind a close coil any diameter with it until half the wire is used then change direction and come back without changing wire winding direction and wind the wire on top of the first coil where you finish with two wires to feed. Put a variometer in series with it and then get on the air. Now this is not exactly in equilibrium because one coil is a larger diameter than the other. Nor is the wire pre twisted pair which nullifies near field noise to my thinking. Now you have a helix style antenna but without the helix. Coat the antenna with an alkyd type solution before you slide it off the tube since the inside coil must be exposed the same way the outside coil is exposed 'So it is easy to build a common standard form as stated on my page. I really do not know what the beef is. Alternatively make a zig zag with your wire two times and connect the wires at the top so you have two laminations,. Be inventive and don't throw your other antenna away. Hams in the past have tested their new antennas only to get insulted over the manner of testing so a ham should never make claims regarding gain |
Part three of many
A helix wound antenna with a double winding? Really?
- 'Doc |
Part three of many
wrote in message ... A helix wound antenna with a double winding? Really? - 'Doc Double winding - in which direction and spaced how far apart in each direction? |
Part three of many
W3CQH wrote:
wrote in message ... A helix wound antenna with a double winding? Really? - 'Doc Double winding - in which direction and spaced how far apart in each direction? This URL, of a patent of an antenna which is growing in commercial use, describes just such a winding and how it is constructed for real world use. I am almost positive this is the "double helix winding method" which Art is making reference to: http://www.patentstorm.us/patents/7187335/fulltext.html In particular, this reference in the patent: "It has been found that interlacing a false winding into a current enhancing unit (such as the top unit winding shown in FIG. 6) or a radiation resistance unit (such as a helix as shown in FIG. 7) enhances the bandwidth of the top unit as well as improves the current profile along the antenna. The interlaced false winding has little effect on the resonant frequency of the antenna system." Regards, JS |
Part three of many
On Jul 10, 11:17 am, John Smith wrote:
W3CQH wrote: wrote in message ... A helix wound antenna with a double winding? Really? - 'Doc Double winding - in which direction and spaced how far apart in each direction? This URL, of a patent of an antenna which is growing in commercial use, describes just such a winding and how it is constructed for real world use. I am almost positive this is the "double helix winding method" which Art is making reference to: http://www.patentstorm.us/patents/7187335/fulltext.html In particular, this reference in the patent: "It has been found that interlacing a false winding into a current enhancing unit (such as the top unit winding shown in FIG. 6) or a radiation resistance unit (such as a helix as shown in FIG. 7) enhances the bandwidth of the top unit as well as improves the current profile along the antenna. The interlaced false winding has little effect on the resonant frequency of the antenna system." Regards, JS What you are refering to i believe is the Rhode Island antenna that has been attacked by all of ham radio but again it could be another follow up new antenna tho it seems a bit soon since they had to resubmit the first patent to get it accepted. John, imagine the following 1 a rcp and a lcp helix driven in parallel with counterpoise. What would the ensueing gain consist of? 2 a rcp and a lcp helix driven antenna connected at the top and fed with out a counterpoise ( assumption is that windings do not come in contact with each other) What would the ensuing gain, if any, consist of ? Would either 1 or 2 produce a negative total gain? I am really having a difficult time understanding why hams THINK so bad of this type of antenna, with close windings or in pitched form You just can't stop wire radiating so where are they coming from? Regards Art Regards Art Nobody has supplied any reasoning of what radiation a ham could expect from such an arrangement. Yet anybody can check it out forthemselves without unsubstantiated off the cuff comments meant to inflict pain |
Part three of many
Art Unwin wrote:
... What you are refering to i believe is the Rhode Island antenna that has been attacked .... Art Regards Art Nobody has supplied any reasoning of what radiation a ham could expect from such an arrangement. Yet anybody can check it out forthemselves without unsubstantiated off the cuff comments meant to inflict pain It is the "Distributed Load Monopole" (DLM) antenna by Robert Vincent ... I have a 50 ft. one in my front yard and disquised as a flagpole, for 80m. At the back of the house, and hidden from view, is a 1/2 version for 10m. For me, it is a perfect design ... I have not incorporated the "interlaced winding(s)", yet ... Regards, JS |
Part three of many
"Art Unwin" wrote in message ... Tell you what, get some wire twice the WL of the frequency you are interested in. Wind a close coil any diameter with it until half the wire is used then change direction and come back without changing wire winding direction and wind the wire on top of the first coil where you finish with two wires to feed. Put a variometer in series with it and then get on the air. Now this is not exactly in equilibrium because one coil is a larger diameter than the other. Nor is the wire pre twisted pair which nullifies near field noise to my thinking. Now you have a helix style antenna but without the helix. Coat the antenna with an alkyd type solution before you slide it off the tube since the inside coil must be exposed the same way the outside coil is exposed OK, I can do most of that. However, I went to your page for some variometer details, as I don't have one. No luck. From other reading it appears to be a loosely couple balun or un-un. But near there on your page, I discovered some verbiage about building an antenna and saw the reference to a 12-inch diameter. Good find, as I was going to go smaller. If I wound the thing on cardboard (like a big empty ice cream tub from the ice cream store), could I avoid having to take the coil(s) off the form? What about a paint bucket or an empty pool chlorine tub? I'd sorta like to skip that alkyd step. Messy. Need more variometer data, but I'll dig for that |
Part three of many
"Clark Kent" wrote in message
... ( Big snip) Need more variometer data, but I'll dig for that Variometer design he http://www.qsl.net/in3otd/variodes.html Cheers, John |
Part three of many
"Clark Kent" wrote in message ... "Art Unwin" wrote in message ... Tell you what, get some wire twice the WL of the frequency you are interested in. Wind a close coil any diameter with it until half the wire is used then change direction and come back without changing wire winding direction and wind the wire on top of the first coil where you finish with two wires to feed. Put a variometer in series with it and then get on the air. Now this is not exactly in equilibrium because one coil is a larger diameter than the other. Nor is the wire pre twisted pair which nullifies near field noise to my thinking. Now you have a helix style antenna but without the helix. Coat the antenna with an alkyd type solution before you slide it off the tube since the inside coil must be exposed the same way the outside coil is exposed OK, I can do most of that. However, I went to your page for some variometer details, as I don't have one. No luck. From other reading it appears to be a loosely couple balun or un-un. But near there on your page, I discovered some verbiage about building an antenna and saw the reference to a 12-inch diameter. Good find, as I was going to go smaller. If I wound the thing on cardboard (like a big empty ice cream tub from the ice cream store), could I avoid having to take the coil(s) off the form? What about a paint bucket or an empty pool chlorine tub? I'd sorta like to skip that alkyd step. Messy. Need more variometer data, but I'll dig for that I thought I might try and experiment with building one, since it seems simple. The variometer is a deal killer however. Is there any reason a transmatch/balun couldn't be used? |
Part three of many
On Jul 11, 2:32 pm, "Wayne" wrote:
"Clark Kent" wrote in message ... "Art Unwin" wrote in message ... Tell you what, get some wire twice the WL of the frequency you are interested in. Wind a close coil any diameter with it until half the wire is used then change direction and come back without changing wire winding direction and wind the wire on top of the first coil where you finish with two wires to feed. Put a variometer in series with it and then get on the air. Now this is not exactly in equilibrium because one coil is a larger diameter than the other. Nor is the wire pre twisted pair which nullifies near field noise to my thinking. Now you have a helix style antenna but without the helix. Coat the antenna with an alkyd type solution before you slide it off the tube since the inside coil must be exposed the same way the outside coil is exposed OK, I can do most of that. However, I went to your page for some variometer details, as I don't have one. No luck. From other reading it appears to be a loosely couple balun or un-un. But near there on your page, I discovered some verbiage about building an antenna and saw the reference to a 12-inch diameter. Good find, as I was going to go smaller. If I wound the thing on cardboard (like a big empty ice cream tub from the ice cream store), could I avoid having to take the coil(s) off the form? What about a paint bucket or an empty pool chlorine tub? I'd sorta like to skip that alkyd step. Messy. Need more variometer data, but I'll dig for that I thought I might try and experiment with building one, since it seems simple. The variometer is a deal killer however. Is there any reason a transmatch/balun couldn't be used? The variometer allows the frequency to be moved as a multiple of a wavelength. Thus allows your antenna to vary as you turn the knob on the radio. If you do not use a variometer then you just have to hope that one of the many suitable swr points rest upon your frequency of choice. This can also be simulated by a series of jumpers or a slider method over the surface of the windings. For me I prefer a variometer since the motor drive can be that which is dismantled from the radio's tuner such that you have an automatic set up the same as the new variable antenna that hit the market a few years ago except this design is less than $100.....big difference.......and much much smaller....... and yes the variometer is placed on the top of the tower with your 160M rotatable antenna. Don't know where I will go next! Sweaty...need a shower Unwinantennas.com/ |
Part three of many
"Art Unwin" wrote in message ... On Jul 11, 2:32 pm, "Wayne" wrote: "Clark Kent" wrote in message ... "Art Unwin" wrote in message ... Tell you what, get some wire twice the WL of the frequency you are interested in. Wind a close coil any diameter with it until half the wire is used then change direction and come back without changing wire winding direction and wind the wire on top of the first coil where you finish with two wires to feed. Put a variometer in series with it and then get on the air. Now this is not exactly in equilibrium because one coil is a larger diameter than the other. Nor is the wire pre twisted pair which nullifies near field noise to my thinking. Now you have a helix style antenna but without the helix. Coat the antenna with an alkyd type solution before you slide it off the tube since the inside coil must be exposed the same way the outside coil is exposed OK, I can do most of that. However, I went to your page for some variometer details, as I don't have one. No luck. From other reading it appears to be a loosely couple balun or un-un. But near there on your page, I discovered some verbiage about building an antenna and saw the reference to a 12-inch diameter. Good find, as I was going to go smaller. If I wound the thing on cardboard (like a big empty ice cream tub from the ice cream store), could I avoid having to take the coil(s) off the form? What about a paint bucket or an empty pool chlorine tub? I'd sorta like to skip that alkyd step. Messy. Need more variometer data, but I'll dig for that I thought I might try and experiment with building one, since it seems simple. The variometer is a deal killer however. Is there any reason a transmatch/balun couldn't be used? The variometer allows the frequency to be moved as a multiple of a wavelength. Thus allows your antenna to vary as you turn the knob on the radio. If you do not use a variometer then you just have to hope that one of the many suitable swr points rest upon your frequency of choice. This can also be simulated by a series of jumpers or a slider method over the surface of the windings. For me I prefer a variometer since the motor drive can be that which is dismantled from the radio's tuner such that you have an automatic set up the same as the new variable antenna that hit the market a few years ago except this design is less than $100.....big difference.......and much much smaller....... and yes the variometer is placed on the top of the tower with your 160M rotatable antenna. Don't know where I will go next! Sweaty...need a shower Unwinantennas.com/ Suddenly, here's just a TON of stuff that needs some good sense sprinkled on it. Just a few highlights: I just took another look at the website and further examined the graphs at the bottom. Per your instructions, using approximately 2000 ft of wire means the antenna is wound for a wl of 1000 ft, 305 meters or around 1 MHz. How is it you're getting a decent SWR nearly everywhere from 1.0 to 100 MHz? Look, the WORST number for SWR is about 4:1, well within the range of any decent tuner. BTW, it looks like the response of a comb filter, except that the cancellation frequencies between the reinforcements don't look as lossy as they should look. The variometer will do variable transformer coupling. OK fine, but I think you should have provided a description for one. The link to http://www.qsl.net/in3otd/variodes.html was instructive but ... I have no idea what coil inductances to shoot for. Groping in the dark is not fun. What does it mean to move the frequency as a multiple of wavelength? What does it mean for the antenna to vary as I turn the knob on the radio? I've got decades of experience with this hobby and that does not compute. You shouldn't throw this stuff out and figure we're mind readers. 160m rotatable antenna? I don't travel in those circles. If that was a joke, I guess I need my sense of humor recalibrated. Here's my own "tell you what": I'll wind one of these things for 20m, which isn't a lot of wire. I have an antenna analyzer that will tell me a few nice things about what I have. Then if the SWR is anything like reasonable, it's Kenwood Time! I'll check for who I can hear and try working him. ... and I'll check for WWV on 15. I can usually hear him any day, often on a cheap portable radio with a whip antenna. Using a local ham (eliminating the bulk of QSB) I can compare antennas for equal S-meter readings with a switchable attenuator in line with the better antenna. That will settle it for me. |
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