Design Flaw in iPhone 4, Testers Say
 

John Smith wrote:
On 8/3/2010 1:25 PM, Michael Coslo wrote:
John Smith wrote:

No it isn't. I don't want to take calls on my television. The XYL will
talk for hours with friends. Seems like a bad thing to tie the TV up for
that time. I don't want my telephone to be my computer either, or listen
to my music on my telephone.


Only a damn fool would make a phone call on their TV, or even think
about it. But, if the case is you and the wife can't afford seperate
hand-helds/netbooks, well, get a better job!

So how does your Television/radio/phone/stereo work exactly? If a person
using the phone at the same time as another person trying to watch TV
and another wanting to listen to music isn't going to conflict, I'm not
sure what will. You be the one that suggested we should be buying
singular devices and plug dongles into them.



It's for the same reason that I don't want to keep my frozen meat in my
car. A whole lot of us prefer our devices to be purpose built instead of
the myriad of compromises in having all in one instruments. History has
shown that all in one devices tend to perform poorly or mediocre at best
in all their functions.


Again, only a damn fool would think about keeping food in their
palm-top/ereader/netbook, or even think about it.

Hmm, I have to imagine you're deliberately missing that analogy.


Hmmm, my computer is
not a printer, but an external printer hooked up workes just fine. My
computer is not a netcard, but a USB dongle netcard works just
fine--plugged in, my computer is not a TV, but an USB dongle HD TV works
fine--plugged in, etc. In fact, I have never noticed any problems with
them running all at once. Perhaps you need new hardware.

As you will. My purpose built hardware has one huge advantage. A lot of
people have a whole lot of trouble keeping their computers running. I
spend a lot of time as my friends and family's Tech support guy.

Explain how having a PC, with all it's security issues and other
problems, like updates that knock it out of commission, is going to be a
superior alternative to a television that you turn on, or a phone you
pick up and use. When your computer is zombified or halted due to all
the spyware on it, it will take down everything that is attached to it.
After that, we have to worry about turning our Televisions, which at
this time have a 15 year lifespan, into the 3 or 4 year lifespan of
PC's. I can just see children waiting patiently while Dad reformats and
reinstalls the system software because the computer got hosed and no one
is getting anything on the television.

So people are going to have to become IT weenies so they can watch TV?
Good luck with that one.


They kind of remind me of the Escalade SUV/Pickup trucks. Horrible
pickup truck, poor SUV, and ugly as sin.


Never seen wheels, steering wheel, gearshift, headlights, etc. on a
palm-top/ereader/netbook/laptop/computer. This sounds more of mental
condition and/or drugs.

Whoosh. Another analogy about devices that try to be more than one
thing. A television is not a telephone is not a cell phone is not a
stereo system. One could be pressed into service as all of the above,
and at the same time - but it takes a pretty good argument to say it
will perform as well as the separate devices.


It is time to end the stone age of electronics!

I want faster, better looking, and higher performance. I don't want
all-in wonders, which are always compromises.


Must be boring never using any USB or ported peripherals, as your post
indicates! Try it, you will find that "all-in-one-wonders" are great!

Have got no idea how you got the idea that I don't use USB devices.

- Mike -

Design Flaw in iPhone 4, Testers Say
 

Registered User wrote:
On Tue, 03 Aug 2010 14:21:08 -0700, John Smith
wrote:

On 8/3/2010 1:25 PM, Michael Coslo wrote:
John Smith wrote:
No it isn't. I don't want to take calls on my television. The XYL will
talk for hours with friends. Seems like a bad thing to tie the TV up for
that time. I don't want my telephone to be my computer either, or listen
to my music on my telephone.

Only a damn fool would make a phone call on their TV, or even think
about it.

But if as was suggested the computer is the TV and is the telephone
and is the ... abstractly they are all one device.

- quote -
Isn't it about time we stopped buy a seperate TV, radio, phone,
stereo, etc. A computer with the proper software and attachment(s)
are all of these and more (all these, except for phone, are available
on ebay.)
- end quote -

Literally by both connection and dependency they all become one
device. No USB device is especially useful without a computer's USB
port.

But, if the case is you and the wife can't afford seperate
hand-helds/netbooks, well, get a better job!


It's a functionality question not a financial question. Should a
second computer with all the USB peripherals be required just so
Mike's Mrs. can use the telephone while he watches television? Being
able to do something doesn't validate its worth. Using USB devices for
the sake of using USB devices gains no efficiencies.

It's for the same reason that I don't want to keep my frozen meat in my
car. A whole lot of us prefer our devices to be purpose built instead of
the myriad of compromises in having all in one instruments. History has
shown that all in one devices tend to perform poorly or mediocre at best
in all their functions.

Again, only a damn fool would think about keeping food in their
palm-top/ereader/netbook, or even think about it.
Hmmm, my computer is

Is this discussion about appliances with limited functionality such as
"palm-top/ereader/netbook" or a fully functional computer? How well do
the USB devices mentioned below work within the
"palm-top/ereader/netbook" trifeca?

not a printer, but an external printer hooked up workes just fine. My
computer is not a netcard, but a USB dongle netcard works just
fine--plugged in, my computer is not a TV, but an USB dongle HD TV works
fine--plugged in, etc. In fact, I have never noticed any problems with
them running all at once. Perhaps you need new hardware.


Yourself as well, your USB spell-checker doesn't appear working
properly ;)

Your initial post alluded to convergence but all you're doing is daisy
chaining peripheral devices. The only visible difference between now
and ten years ago is the number and types of available USB devices.

All those peripherals may work well together until disk, bus and/or
processor activity becomes intensive. Regardless of optimism there are
always limitations.

They kind of remind me of the Escalade SUV/Pickup trucks. Horrible
pickup truck, poor SUV, and ugly as sin.

Never seen wheels, steering wheel, gearshift, headlights, etc. on a
palm-top/ereader/netbook/laptop/computer. This sounds more of mental
condition and/or drugs.

You missed the point and taking a second cheap shot won't help you
find it. The Escalade is an analogy about multi-purpose devices in
general, not about using a computer as a multi-purpose device.

If you've never seen wheels, steering wheel, gearshift, headlights,
etc. on a computer you haven't looked at today's passenger vehicles.
There's more processor power there than on/under your desk.

palm-top/ereader/netbook/laptop/computer
It is time to end the stone age of electronics!
I want faster, better looking, and higher performance. I don't want
all-in wonders, which are always compromises.

Must be boring never using any USB or ported peripherals, as your post
indicates! Try it, you will find that "all-in-one-wonders" are great!

Pure conjecture. Mike's post provides no insights concerning his use
or non-use of USB devices. For all you know his computer might be
surrounded by cluster of USB devices.

I use 'em by the ton. My computer controls my radio via Ham Radio
Deluxe. I use DM-780 for my digital modes. The computer control of the
radio takes place over a USB to serial Dongle. I also have a TinyTracker
interface via another USB to Serial dongle. It works pretty well. But
I'd never dream of plugging a MagicJack or watching Hulu on it. I have
other computers for that stuff.

Not only would performance drop off, but there would be useage conflicts
also. Right now, I can watch Television on my TV, while reading email on
one of my computers, while carrying on a PPSK31 QSO with the rig
control computer. Heck I could carry on a simultaneous conversation via
phone too, I guess.

Much more difficult to do all the above if I was using all in one operation.

- 73 de Mike N3LI -

Design Flaw in iPhone 4, Testers Say
 

On 8/3/2010 7:07 PM, Registered User wrote:
On Tue, 03 Aug 2010 14:21:08 -0700, John Smith
wrote:

On 8/3/2010 1:25 PM, Michael Coslo wrote:
John Smith wrote:

No it isn't. I don't want to take calls on my television. The XYL will
talk for hours with friends. Seems like a bad thing to tie the TV up for
that time. I don't want my telephone to be my computer either, or listen
to my music on my telephone.


Only a damn fool would make a phone call on their TV, or even think
about it.

But if as was suggested the computer is the TV and is the telephone
and is the ... abstractly they are all one device.

- quote -
Isn't it about time we stopped buy a seperate TV, radio, phone,
stereo, etc. A computer with the proper software and attachment(s)
are all of these and more (all these, except for phone, are available
on ebay.)
- end quote -

Literally by both connection and dependency they all become one
device. No USB device is especially useful without a computer's USB
port.

But, if the case is you and the wife can't afford seperate
hand-helds/netbooks, well, get a better job!


It's a functionality question not a financial question. Should a
second computer with all the USB peripherals be required just so
Mike's Mrs. can use the telephone while he watches television? Being
able to do something doesn't validate its worth. Using USB devices for
the sake of using USB devices gains no efficiencies.

It's for the same reason that I don't want to keep my frozen meat in my
car. A whole lot of us prefer our devices to be purpose built instead of
the myriad of compromises in having all in one instruments. History has
shown that all in one devices tend to perform poorly or mediocre at best
in all their functions.


Again, only a damn fool would think about keeping food in their
palm-top/ereader/netbook, or even think about it.
Hmmm, my computer is

Is this discussion about appliances with limited functionality such as
"palm-top/ereader/netbook" or a fully functional computer? How well do
the USB devices mentioned below work within the
"palm-top/ereader/netbook" trifeca?

not a printer, but an external printer hooked up workes just fine. My
computer is not a netcard, but a USB dongle netcard works just
fine--plugged in, my computer is not a TV, but an USB dongle HD TV works
fine--plugged in, etc. In fact, I have never noticed any problems with
them running all at once. Perhaps you need new hardware.


Yourself as well, your USB spell-checker doesn't appear working
properly ;)

Your initial post alluded to convergence but all you're doing is daisy
chaining peripheral devices. The only visible difference between now
and ten years ago is the number and types of available USB devices.

All those peripherals may work well together until disk, bus and/or
processor activity becomes intensive. Regardless of optimism there are
always limitations.

They kind of remind me of the Escalade SUV/Pickup trucks. Horrible
pickup truck, poor SUV, and ugly as sin.


Never seen wheels, steering wheel, gearshift, headlights, etc. on a
palm-top/ereader/netbook/laptop/computer. This sounds more of mental
condition and/or drugs.

You missed the point and taking a second cheap shot won't help you
find it. The Escalade is an analogy about multi-purpose devices in
general, not about using a computer as a multi-purpose device.

If you've never seen wheels, steering wheel, gearshift, headlights,
etc. on a computer you haven't looked at today's passenger vehicles.
There's more processor power there than on/under your desk.

palm-top/ereader/netbook/laptop/computer

It is time to end the stone age of electronics!

I want faster, better looking, and higher performance. I don't want
all-in wonders, which are always compromises.


Must be boring never using any USB or ported peripherals, as your post
indicates! Try it, you will find that "all-in-one-wonders" are great!

Pure conjecture. Mike's post provides no insights concerning his use
or non-use of USB devices. For all you know his computer might be
surrounded by cluster of USB devices.


Pure tripe, and too obvious to respond to. The cry of desperation in
all the verbiage is deafening.

If you missed it, read my first post over, a few times ...

Regards,
JS

Design Flaw in iPhone 4, Testers Say
 

On 8/4/2010 6:28 AM, Michael Coslo wrote:

...
I use 'em by the ton. My computer controls my radio via Ham Radio
Deluxe. I use DM-780 for my digital modes. The computer control of the
radio takes place over a USB to serial Dongle. I also have a TinyTracker
interface via another USB to Serial dongle. It works pretty well. But
I'd never dream of plugging a MagicJack or watching Hulu on it. I have
other computers for that stuff.

Not only would performance drop off, but there would be useage conflicts
also. Right now, I can watch Television on my TV, while reading email on
one of my computers, while carrying on a PPSK31 QSO with the rig control
computer. Heck I could carry on a simultaneous conversation via phone
too, I guess.

Much more difficult to do all the above if I was using all in one
operation.

- 73 de Mike N3LI -

Well then, sounds like you are on the right track, headed in the right
direction. It just takes some a bit longer than others. I am sure you
will get it right ... eventually. Anyway, will give you something to do
while we are waiting for a software controlled cell phone to be
developed. But like I say, it probably won't happen until enough people
become "electronic literate" enough to demand them.

Regards,
JS

Design Flaw in iPhone 4, Testers Say
 

On 8/4/2010 6:17 AM, Michael Coslo wrote:


So how does your Television/radio/phone/stereo work exactly? If a person
using the phone at the same time as another person trying to watch TV
and another wanting to listen to music isn't going to conflict, I'm not
sure what will. You be the one that suggested we should be buying
singular devices and plug dongles into them.


Yeah, I can see how you would have a lot of time figuring that out. It
is done with multiple computers. Home entertainment systems is run off
a desktop. Portable stuff done around the home is done on a laptop.
Stuff in a hotel room is done on one of the travel netbook/laptops.
However, I frequently have the tv in a corner of my screen, muted, an
MP3 playing though USB wireless headphones, a call going over skype or
another such application, and the software defined (SDR) radio
monitoring, etc. So the conflicts you keep coming up with are just
unknown here. Perhaps you are just one of those people who can only do
one thing at a time?



It's for the same reason that I don't want to keep my frozen meat in my
car. A whole lot of us prefer our devices to be purpose built instead of
the myriad of compromises in having all in one instruments. History has
shown that all in one devices tend to perform poorly or mediocre at best
in all their functions.


Again, only a damn fool would think about keeping food in their
palm-top/ereader/netbook, or even think about it.

Hmm, I have to imagine you're deliberately missing that analogy.


I imagine you must be missing refrigerated food!


Hmmm, my computer is not a printer, but an external printer hooked up
workes just fine. My computer is not a netcard, but a USB dongle
netcard works just fine--plugged in, my computer is not a TV, but an
USB dongle HD TV works fine--plugged in, etc. In fact, I have never
noticed any problems with them running all at once. Perhaps you need
new hardware.

As you will. My purpose built hardware has one huge advantage. A lot of
people have a whole lot of trouble keeping their computers running. I
spend a lot of time as my friends and family's Tech support guy.


Yeah, that is a real pain. You do have to learn to properly
use/maintain a computer. I am always amazed at the amount of people
standing around calling a tech for some simple "plug it in" answer to
fix it. Usually, these are the first to tell you about all the
technically complex stuff they are doing on their computer, like your
text here starts off, then you find out it usually set non-functional in
a corner with them afraid to touch it, in fear of messing it up, ROFLOL.

Explain how having a PC, with all it's security issues and other
problems, like updates that knock it out of commission, is going to be a
superior alternative to a television that you turn on, or a phone you
pick up and use. When your computer is zombified or halted due to all
the spyware on it, it will take down everything that is attached to it.
After that, we have to worry about turning our Televisions, which at
this time have a 15 year lifespan, into the 3 or 4 year lifespan of
PC's. I can just see children waiting patiently while Dad reformats and
reinstalls the system software because the computer got hosed and no one
is getting anything on the television.

So people are going to have to become IT weenies so they can watch TV?
Good luck with that one.


The above just proposes a lot of problems which don't exist in my world.
My computers run rock solid. If a kid messes with a control, or
causes a problem in the software, I just fix it. Obviously, you need a
computer course, or two, or three, ... and knowledge in the correct
operation of computers. I use Avast free anti-virus. McAfee, Norton,
etc. are just too buggy--there is a problem with these products.
Microsoft defender is an excellent addition to this.


They kind of remind me of the Escalade SUV/Pickup trucks. Horrible
pickup truck, poor SUV, and ugly as sin.


Never seen wheels, steering wheel, gearshift, headlights, etc. on a
palm-top/ereader/netbook/laptop/computer. This sounds more of mental
condition and/or drugs.

Whoosh. Another analogy about devices that try to be more than one
thing. A television is not a telephone is not a cell phone is not a
stereo system. One could be pressed into service as all of the above,
and at the same time - but it takes a pretty good argument to say it
will perform as well as the separate devices.


That is just a blatantly stupid remark. The computer was meant to do
all this and much, much more. It is that single-device-single-function
mentality which manufacturers have hired madison avenue ad men to sell
you at work.


It is time to end the stone age of electronics!

I want faster, better looking, and higher performance. I don't want
all-in wonders, which are always compromises.


Must be boring never using any USB or ported peripherals, as your post
indicates! Try it, you will find that "all-in-one-wonders" are great!

Have got no idea how you got the idea that I don't use USB devices.

Well, you whole texts are confusing. They are written around a logic
which defies translation!


- Mike -

Regards,
JS

Design Flaw in iPhone 4, Testers Say
 

On 8/4/2010 5:52 AM, Registered User wrote:

Why would that be when you are the one purchasing multiple USB
accessories to fulfill your supposed all-in-one vision.


Simply go back and read the original post, that was never my vision.
That was someone elses' interpretation of my text, and that error became
translated into your interpretation.

My TV, radio, stereo, MP3 player, DVD recorder/player, etc. all travel
in my briefcase as USB Dongles or software. That size fits me well! ROFLOL

It sounds like you're describing my 3 y.o. laptop that has all that
hardware built-in. To use the box and all the devices it is simply a
matter of booting up. There is no need to unpack and connect a bunch
of peripherals. When done I can close the lid and go w/o the need to
disconnect and re-pack a bunch of peripherals. It's much closer to
being an all-in-one device than your box with all its external
accessories.

No, you are simply trapped by your own world. You need to look beyond
to what other people are actually saying and using.


You might want to refrain from using the term 'USB dongle' to describe
anything that plugs into a USB port.

That is exactly what they were, have always been, and still are. The
term was coined back in the early 70's and used to be applied to
differing externals plugged in to differing ports of a computer. I
guess you learn something new everyday.


To each his/her own,
regards,
JS

Regards,
JS

Design Flaw in iPhone 4, Testers Say
 

On Wed, 04 Aug 2010 09:11:04 -0700, John Smith
wrote:



You might want to refrain from using the term 'USB dongle' to describe
anything that plugs into a USB port.

That is exactly what they were, have always been, and still are.
Nope, try an external hardware device which acts as a security key for
a specific piece of software.

The term was coined back in the early 70's
Nope, wrong decade.

and used to be applied to differing externals plugged in to differing ports of a computer.
I guess you learn something new everyday.

Apparently not you as you profess to have all the answers already.

Design Flaw in iPhone 4, Testers Say
 

John Smith wrote:


Well, you whole texts are confusing. They are written around a logic
which defies translation!

Well, JS. Why don't you design and implement this system. You don't like
my logic, and I am "wrong". I say it won't work, and gave my reasons.
Prove me wrong. Along the way, you'll become the richest man in the world.

I say people have enough trouble with their computers already to have
everything they own running on one. Because it won't be running. There
is no reason to believe that this setup you propose will be any more
reliable than what is already out there, and not being reliable now.

It isn't vision, it isn't being a Luddite, it's just that it isn't
practical. My Television is already accessing the internet. It's doing
it via software that isn't Microsoft Windows based, and avoids all the
vulnerabilities that platform has. My Telephone is IP based, and the
same for that. It works, it's not Windows. The weak point of my entire
home communication system is the computer internet access. And if you
don't have any trouble, you're one of the few. My Linux machine doesn't
have any particular problems, my Mac runs bareback. My Windows PC has to
be locked down like Fort knox. It's hard to imagine giving up my
presently operating systems to migrate to the weakest link of the chain.

But by all means, have at it. Remember us little folk.


My favorite part about Windows users is when I note a problem, they say
"Gee, I've never had a problem with my machine - it works flawlessly.
THen they start to tell me about the time a virus got into their
machine, and they ended up reformatting the drive and reinstalling
Windows, and the time they got their DLL's messed up and ended up
reformatting the drive and reinstalling Windows, and the time their
machine was zombified and they ended up reformatting the drive but it
was rootkitted and they have to reformat again, and then figured out
they had a problem in the BIOS. But they've never had a problem.

Even those who have a running computer don't know exactly what's on it.

I deal with repairing this stuff every day, and I have to tell ya, there
are a lot of intelligent people that for whatever reason, can't keep
their computers running.

Anyhow, have fun, no use of you arguing with the great unwashed like myself.

- 73 de Mike N3LI -

Design Flaw in iPhone 4, Testers Say
 

On 8/4/2010 11:00 AM, Registered User wrote:

Nope, try an external hardware device which acts as a security key for
a specific piece of software.


A major CAD (computer assisted drafting) software company made that a
popular term for its' copy protection. Anyone coming though an industry
heavily dependent on such, and working is such a department, would
certainly share your view. This is much the same as the term "Computer
Hacker"--used to denote one who is tops in their field; This term was
usurped by the news and now in joe-blow-six-packs minds is associated
with computer criminal. Their error.

The term was coined back in the early 70's
Nope, wrong decade.


It was coined before CAD existed.

and used to be applied to differing externals plugged in to differing ports of a computer.
I guess you learn something new everyday.

Apparently not you as you profess to have all the answers already.

I don't profess any such thing, you do.

Regards,
JS

Design Flaw in iPhone 4, Testers Say
 

On 8/4/2010 12:10 PM, Michael Coslo wrote:
John Smith wrote:


Well, you whole texts are confusing. They are written around a logic
which defies translation!

Well, JS. Why don't you design and implement this system. You don't like
my logic, and I am "wrong". I say it won't work, and gave my reasons.
Prove me wrong. Along the way, you'll become the richest man in the world.

I say people have enough trouble with their computers already to have
everything they own running on one. Because it won't be running. There
is no reason to believe that this setup you propose will be any more
reliable than what is already out there, and not being reliable now.

It isn't vision, it isn't being a Luddite, it's just that it isn't
practical. My Television is already accessing the internet. It's doing
it via software that isn't Microsoft Windows based, and avoids all the
vulnerabilities that platform has. My Telephone is IP based, and the
same for that. It works, it's not Windows. The weak point of my entire
home communication system is the computer internet access. And if you
don't have any trouble, you're one of the few. My Linux machine doesn't
have any particular problems, my Mac runs bareback. My Windows PC has to
be locked down like Fort knox. It's hard to imagine giving up my
presently operating systems to migrate to the weakest link of the chain.

But by all means, have at it. Remember us little folk.


My favorite part about Windows users is when I note a problem, they say
"Gee, I've never had a problem with my machine - it works flawlessly.
THen they start to tell me about the time a virus got into their
machine, and they ended up reformatting the drive and reinstalling
Windows, and the time they got their DLL's messed up and ended up
reformatting the drive and reinstalling Windows, and the time their
machine was zombified and they ended up reformatting the drive but it
was rootkitted and they have to reformat again, and then figured out
they had a problem in the BIOS. But they've never had a problem.

Even those who have a running computer don't know exactly what's on it.

I deal with repairing this stuff every day, and I have to tell ya, there
are a lot of intelligent people that for whatever reason, can't keep
their computers running.

Anyhow, have fun, no use of you arguing with the great unwashed like
myself.

- 73 de Mike N3LI -

You can cure most of your problems with a college course, or two.

Regards,
JS