FWIW, I store batteries in my basement over the winter. About every two
weeks I place a small "half-way intelligent" charger on each, in turn, and
bring each up to "full". I think your parallel charging is not a good idea
and may have partly destroyed one of the batteries. Diode protection (for
charging in parallel) might work, but it will probably change the voltages
involved and may confuse an intelligent charger. I suggest individual
charging.

Bill
W2WO

Hi
Thanks for the tips,

I was worried about storing in the basement because of the fumes that come
from them. I figured when charging and their bubbling that adds a lot of
chemical fumes into the home. Is that a concern?

Going to unplug that system I have in the garage now, I hope I haven't done
any damage and was wondering why each battery came to green light
individually but when put in parellel it hasn't came to greenlight for over
a week. I hope I haven't destroyed them. And even though those chaps at
Canadian Tire recommend this, I understand they haven't an engineering
degree in marine batteries, but thankful I get opinions from this group,
thanks for the tips,

73s





"Bill Ogden" wrote in message
...
FWIW, I store batteries in my basement over the winter. About every two
weeks I place a small "half-way intelligent" charger on each, in turn, and
bring each up to "full". I think your parallel charging is not a good
idea and may have partly destroyed one of the batteries. Diode protection
(for charging in parallel) might work, but it will probably change the
voltages involved and may confuse an intelligent charger. I suggest
individual charging.

Bill
W2WO

Battery charging???

Group: rec.radio.amateur.antenna Date: Tue, Jan 1, 2013, 11:52am From:
(Tom)
Hi
Thanks for the tips,
I was worried about storing in the basement because of the fumes that
come from them. I figured when charging and their bubbling that adds a
lot of chemical fumes into the home. Is that a concern?
Going to unplug that system I have in the garage now, I hope I haven't
done any damage and was wondering why each battery came to green light
individually but when put in parellel it hasn't came to greenlight for
over a week. I hope I haven't destroyed them. And even though those
chaps at Canadian Tire recommend this, I understand they haven't an
engineering degree in marine batteries, but thankful I get opinions from
this group, thanks for the tips,
73s
"Bill Ogden" wrote in message
...
FWIW, I store batteries in my basement over the winter. About every two
weeks I place a small "half-way intelligent" charger on each, in turn,
and bring each up to "full". I think your parallel charging is not a
good idea and may have partly destroyed one of the batteries. Diode
protection (for charging in parallel) might work, but it will probably
change the voltages involved and may confuse an intelligent charger. I
suggest individual charging.
Bill
W2WO

=================

That bubling is probably hydrogen gas, which is basicaly nontoxic but
explosive. If you have ANY source of ignition in your basement, I would
be VERY concerned!
You need ventiliation to get the hydrogen out.

--
"A man who can own a gun is a citizen. A man who cannot own a gun is a
subject."--

Unknown

On Tue, 1 Jan 2013 11:52:00 -0500, "Tom" wrote:

I was worried about storing in the basement because of the fumes that come
from them. I figured when charging and their bubbling that adds a lot of
chemical fumes into the home. Is that a concern?

Yes, it's a concern. I've done it the wrong way a few times. The
result was a battery box with severely corroded hardware. That's why
battery boxes are usually plastic or wood. No explosions because the
box is vented to the outside air. Hydrogen is lighter than air and
will rise easily out of a vented box.

Our radio club's battery "pile":
http://www.LearnByDestroying.com/k6bj/K6BJ%20Repeater/slides/Batteries.html

This might give you some ideas:
https://www.google.com/search?tbm=isch&q=battery+box

You might also get some hints from the alternative energy groups that
often store their batteries in the basement.
https://homepower.com
There are various schemes involving filtered battery vent plugs,
manifolds, dryers, and absorbers.

Wooden battery box with vent:
http://www.oynot.com/battery-box.html
I'm not thrilled with this method but it probably works:
http://www.oynot.com/battery-box-venting.html

Also, I missed the part where you were trying to charge two batteries
in parallel. Don't do that, at least not with your simple charger.
However, if you must do it, there are numerous articles on the
internet on charging batteries in parallel.

--
Jeff Liebermann
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

Well,
I read a lot of intelligent information on this post and some not intelligent information.
I think that what your problem is - is that instead of using your noggin, you want to buy something that will do your thinking for you.

If you have 4 batteries, and you connect it to a 10 amp charger, you will still place a 10 amp charge upon the batteries, but to the batteries, it will look more like a 2.5 amp charger - since it is dividing the current between them.

I have seen some cheap people in my life, but I will guess the OP takes the cake. If you think that a 10 amp charger is going to make your electric bill go up or down by regulating the power being applied to the battery at day vs night - you are only fooling yourself.

Until you understand a charge vs. a surface charge, you will never understand what events are taking place within the batteries.
I liked the analogy of someone using diodes to isolate each battery.
But a even better solution is to use those batteries as a battery bank, say on a transistor radio - police scanner would be a good example.

If you charge the batteries nearly full charge and you use those batteries for a couple of days or even a week at a time, you will create a cycle, which will keep the batteries at optimum power - slow down the calcification on the battery plates and keep the one good battery from being killed by the one junk battery that doesn't store as much power.

The other thing is - if you are stupid enough to use a trolling motor with a deep cycle battery until you run it down to nothing, then you ought to be willing to replace those batteries every 4 years, because even though they say deep cycle - you are squeezing the life out of them when you discharge them beyond 10.5 volts DC.

Your battery charger is not a power generating station - it doesn't work like 3 mile island. It will create a charge sufficient enough to recharge a battery to the point of where it is useable again and then it will reduce the amount of current, so it does not over heat the plates in the battery.
The fold back on the charger is sufficient enough to protect the batteries, but once the VOM - and this is the missing link in your hardware - once the VOM shows 13.7 volts - the battery holds as much power as it can possibly hold... Like a cup of water, what happens when you over fill it? The excess product spills out.

Batteries by nature are dirty.
The dirt, acid etc on the battery creates a discharge because the current flows out of the battery through the dielectric to ground.
The other thing I didn't read is what you placed the batterys on?
Wood is prefered, but some rubber mats might not be bad either, as long as they are thick enough and kept clean.
A heavy truck mud flap would probably work well.

The missing link in this post is to advise you not to connect the batteries either in series or in parrellel, but to PURCHASE a BATTERY TENDER...
This takes all the guess work out of keeping your batteries charged.

Even if you watch a couple of episodes of American Chopper, eventually you will see someone go to the battery rack and pull out a fresh battery from the rack. How do you think they keep those batteries charged?
Do you think that they use a mindless battery charger? Or do you think that they use a Battery Tender or some other commercial battery charger?

Do the math - if they build a dozen motorcycles a week, how many batteries does that add up to at the end of the year?

Hi Channel Jumper

Sorry for such a late reply, once again you had no understanding of my
question.

Your answer, while long and interesting was either a duplication of answers
already given or had nothing to do with my question.

But thanks anyway, nice try again, I will take the other's advice again this
time.

My batteries are fine, I can charge them in parrellel if I like, but
remember they must be equals.
Do the math you say Channel?? lol,,, And another reason why your answer
lacks logic is that you don't understand I live in an area that has a 50%
discount on electrical consumption for 12 hours during the evening and early
morning. So that is why I talked about night time charging. i know, I know,,
nickles and dimes, but after a few weeks of 10 or 15 amp charging, or 1000
or 2000 watts at .08c per kwh it sure adds up at the end of the month. Its
all a state of mind. Do you turn your light out when you leave a room?

Your estimate Channel Jumper of 4 years for deep cycle batteries I can
correct for you, my last deep cycle batteries lasted 8 or 9 years and I ran
them down every fishing time by the downrigger balls up and down 30 tims a
trip along with all the electronics and radio, lights, phones, 2m rig, vhf
marine radio, etc etc. And I kept them stored somtimes in basement,
sometimes left in boat, most times stored in garage for winter season
without charge. So where did you get your "4 year life" from? Your own
experience? Maybe I should give you some advice.


Thanks for all the advice everyone,,,,I appreciate every word of it.

73s





"Channel Jumper" wrote in message
...

Well,
I read a lot of intelligent information on this post and some not
intelligent information.
I think that what your problem is - is that instead of using your
noggin, you want to buy something that will do your thinking for you.

If you have 4 batteries, and you connect it to a 10 amp charger, you
will still place a 10 amp charge upon the batteries, but to the
batteries, it will look more like a 2.5 amp charger - since it is
dividing the current between them.

I have seen some cheap people in my life, but I will guess the OP takes
the cake. If you think that a 10 amp charger is going to make your
electric bill go up or down by regulating the power being applied to the
battery at day vs night - you are only fooling yourself.

Until you understand a charge vs. a surface charge, you will never
understand what events are taking place within the batteries.
I liked the analogy of someone using diodes to isolate each battery.
But a even better solution is to use those batteries as a battery bank,
say on a transistor radio - police scanner would be a good example.

If you charge the batteries nearly full charge and you use those
batteries for a couple of days or even a week at a time, you will create
a cycle, which will keep the batteries at optimum power - slow down the
calcification on the battery plates and keep the one good battery from
being killed by the one junk battery that doesn't store as much power.

The other thing is - if you are stupid enough to use a trolling motor
with a deep cycle battery until you run it down to nothing, then you
ought to be willing to replace those batteries every 4 years, because
even though they say deep cycle - you are squeezing the life out of them
when you discharge them beyond 10.5 volts DC.

Your battery charger is not a power generating station - it doesn't work
like 3 mile island. It will create a charge sufficient enough to
recharge a battery to the point of where it is useable again and then it
will reduce the amount of current, so it does not over heat the plates
in the battery.
The fold back on the charger is sufficient enough to protect the
batteries, but once the VOM - and this is the missing link in your
hardware - once the VOM shows 13.7 volts - the battery holds as much
power as it can possibly hold... Like a cup of water, what happens when
you over fill it? The excess product spills out.

Batteries by nature are dirty.
The dirt, acid etc on the battery creates a discharge because the
current flows out of the battery through the dielectric to ground.
The other thing I didn't read is what you placed the batterys on?
Wood is prefered, but some rubber mats might not be bad either, as long
as they are thick enough and kept clean.
A heavy truck mud flap would probably work well.

The missing link in this post is to advise you not to connect the
batteries either in series or in parrellel, but to PURCHASE a BATTERY
TENDER...
This takes all the guess work out of keeping your batteries charged.

Even if you watch a couple of episodes of American Chopper, eventually
you will see someone go to the battery rack and pull out a fresh battery
from the rack. How do you think they keep those batteries charged?
Do you think that they use a mindless battery charger? Or do you think
that they use a Battery Tender or some other commercial battery
charger?

Do the math - if they build a dozen motorcycles a week, how many
batteries does that add up to at the end of the year?




--
Channel Jumper

You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make em drink!

I had a neighbor once that didn't want to wear out his light bulbs, so he used a flashlight when he went from room to room.

Light bulbs were 4/$1.00

Flashlight batteries were $.50 each.

The amount of power a battery charger uses is insignificant - anyone so anal to think you will save money on your electric bill by not using a couple of watts of power during peak times is crazy.

No I do not shut off the lights when I go from room to room.
Most of my lights are florescent - a gift of working for a company that did retail remodeling of Lowes stores.

The difference between leaving the light on vs turning it on and off and ruining the bulbs - if the period of time is less then 15 minutes - you do not save anything by turning the lights on and off.

Wow, that is an odd neighborhood.

Costs of each kwh decreases by 50% (half) in my neck of the woods at evening
time till morning light. 12 hours. So we do save money using high electrical
consumers at night. It is not minimual, not to me anyway.

I was wondering why you only get 4 years out of your deep cycle batteries,
when I get at least 8 and you are giving me advice? I think you are just
jumping at the chance to fling some mud at someone who is less knowledgable
as yourself in electrical situations.

Light bulbs, flashlights, horses to water, neighbors, again, you skirted
right around the question.

Thanks anyway,,,

73s







"Channel Jumper" wrote in message
...

You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make em drink!

I had a neighbor once that didn't want to wear out his light bulbs, so
he used a flashlight when he went from room to room.

Light bulbs were 4/$1.00

Flashlight batteries were $.50 each.

The amount of power a battery charger uses is insignificant - anyone so
anal to think you will save money on your electric bill by not using a
couple of watts of power during peak times is crazy.

No I do not shut off the lights when I go from room to room.
Most of my lights are florescent - a gift of working for a company that
did retail remodeling of Lowes stores.

The difference between leaving the light on vs turning it on and off and
ruining the bulbs - if the period of time is less then 15 minutes - you
do not save anything by turning the lights on and off.




--
Channel Jumper