On Fri, 14 Oct 2005 00:51:02 GMT, Cecil Moore wrote:

Sorry, I am just quoting Owen's results.
There is nothing in his entire scope of postings that presents:
There was 4.1667 watts of reflected energy flowing back through the Bird.
Which is absurd.

This is simply more of the same attempt of your trying to cram a
trade-unionist pamphlet into the frame built by Owen. It is not only
the wrong topic, it doesn't even fit.

Owen has demonstrated quite clearly that your assertion
It takes a certain length of feedline to establish a Z0 environment
is blarney from one end of your feedline to the other. Another way of
saying mythbusted, or if you have grandkids, they would say
you've been served!

On Fri, 14 Oct 2005 00:53:03 GMT, Cecil Moore wrote:
I feel sorry for you.
You and Mother Theresa - did the Cardinals miss electing you too?
Don't fret, maybe there's work available as Vatican Bat Boy.

"Owen Duffy" wrote
Entirely OT:

Reg, you are way to impatient. There are very few Australian Shiraz
that should be taken in less than three years.
======================================
I'm 80 next month.
======================================

I can't recall the "instructions" on the back of the bottle that
tell
one what to drink it with and when to drink it, but Banrock Station
produce "everday drinking" quality reds that should stand a few
years
cellaring,

==========================================
The bottle was chosen at random by my daughter from the supermarket
shelf. Following your message I retrieved it from the trash bin.

The label did not mention a 'drink by' date. But it does mention eat
with a mature blue cheese which is a firm favorite of mine. I've long
given up worrying about cholesterol.
====================================

IIRC, the labels carry a bit of a story on their wildlife refuge, do
they get to tell you what to eat with it?

====================================
Yes. I looked up Banrock Station's website about their contributions,
internationally, towards preservation of wetlands, nature reserves,
and the many forms of wildlife therein. There's even a photograph of
a water snail. Very interesting.

I guess you are far more knowledgeable about wines than I am. Thanks
for drawing my attention to the bottle.
----
Reg, G4FGQ

On Fri, 14 Oct 2005 01:44:02 +0000 (UTC), "Reg Edwards"
wrote:


I guess you are far more knowledgeable about wines than I am. Thanks
for drawing my attention to the bottle.

Not at all to both.

But, I do enjoy a glass of red... unfortunately my feet are getting
less happy about that.

Owen
--

"Cecil Moore" wrote
The insertion of the Bird does not appreciably change the V/I ratio.

====================================
Cec,

I have tried to avoid entering this argument.

But it appears to me that ALL SWR meters work on the principle of a
common, identical, take off point for both voltage and current
samples.

Therefore, anything inside the meter which could constitute a
transmission line, no matter how long or short, if it separates the
two effective take-off points, it is a small source of error and its
actual length otherwise plays no part in the measuring process.

( I mean its actual length is not included in the basic design
calculations, except perhaps in rare instances to minimise the error.)

( The error arises from a phase-shift error in tapping off the current
sample. There may be no problem with defining the location of the
voltage sample. All depends on meter construction and the tapping
methods which vary but do not affect the basic design principle of a
common tapping point.)

I am not trolling. Please read very carefully. Try to limit yourself
to HF and VHF. Do you agree? Yes or No?
----
Reg, G4FGQ.

On Fri, 14 Oct 2005 01:55:28 GMT, Owen Duffy wrote:

But, I do enjoy a glass of red... unfortunately my feet are getting
less happy about that.

Hi Owen,

Gout?

73's
Richard Clark, KB7QHC

On Thu, 13 Oct 2005 22:37:43 -0700, Richard Clark
wrote:


Gout?

Of course.

Owen
--

Gee! I was born with gout! My parents were not drinkers. My doctor says
it is genetic.

I did not know that red wine caused gout! :-)

Actually, it spikes uric acid. Gout is the inability of my kidneys to
eliminate the uric acid as waste.

Richard Clark wrote:
On Fri, 14 Oct 2005 01:55:28 GMT, Owen Duffy wrote:


But, I do enjoy a glass of red... unfortunately my feet are getting
less happy about that.


Hi Owen,

Gout?

73's
Richard Clark, KB7QHC

"Cecil Moore" wrote in message
om...
Dave wrote:
i'm not agreeing with how you assume the 50 ohm impedance of the meter
out of the circuit.

I don't think you understand what I was saying. It takes a
certain length of feedline to establish a Z0 environment
for the forward and reverse traveling TEM waves, i.e. to
force Vfor/Ifor = Vref/Iref = Z0.

and what the experiment pointed out was that the length of feedline attached
is immaterial, the 50ohm environment is established within the meter itself
and it doesn't care what the length of feedline attached is.

"Cecil Moore" wrote in message
. com...
Tam/WB2TT wrote:

"Cecil Moore" wrote:
The actual SWR on a lossless line doesn't change. Yet, in another
posting, I showed that moving the Bird 1/4WL closer to the load
caused a reported SWR change by the Bird from 1:1 to 2.25:1. How
could both results possibly be right?

The Bird does not know squat about transmission lines, foreward, or
reflected. It only cares about impedance. If you connect a 50 Ohm load to
it through 1/4 wave of 75 Ohm coax, the impedance the Bird sees will be
transformed to 112.5 Ohms; hence the 2.25 SWR. (Actually, a 2.25:1
impedance ratio)

Yes, that's exactly what I said in the other posting. But some
people seem to believe that inserting a Bird into a transmission
line with a Z0 other than 50 ohms magically changes it to a 50
ohm environment. The 40mm of transmission line inside the Bird
is supposed to accomplish that miracle.

yep, that is true, and that is what the experiment shows. the 50 ohm load,
even though it is caused by a 75 ohm line, is far enough away from the
sensor that it sees it as 50 ohms. so the 'miracle' length is obviously
less than 40mm.