On Thu, 23 Oct 2003 16:22:18 -0400, wrote:


Actually it's 62"..........If you can wait a second I'll give you the
entire dimensions. Maybe Mmana wants to know?

Tnom;

I plugged in the values that you posted. By simulation, the
Stainless whip has just about a 1 dB edge. The S/S whip has its main
lobe at 27.9 degrees, the X-terminator at 31.2 degrees. I posted a
current plot for it in:

alt.binaries.pictures.radio

I played with the parameters for the coils, and one coil works just as
well as the 2. Guess it just doesn't look as cool?

On Thu, 23 Oct 2003 17:23:26 -0500, Neil Down
wrote:

"(Scott Unit 69)" wrote in
:


I wish someone who knew what they were talking about would tell the
truth about this antenna.There is enough BS on this group as it is
without more myths being spread.



The funniest part this antenna is made by workman it is junk, the coils are
low Q. No way on gods green earth it beats a full 1/4 wave.

No, the coils aren't low Q

Stop pretending to be me.

"(Scott Unit 69)" wrote:

Steveo wrote:
wrote:
On 24 Oct 2003 02:52:14 GMT, Steveo
wrote:

wrote:
Ok Tnom, You've peaked my interest. URL?

I think bills two way sells them?

Who makes it?

Workman?

Is this one ok ?

$36.95 SP-5000 X-Terminator V, 1000 Watt Single Open air coil, 1/8"
square Copper wire, 70 inch overall length.

That's not the same one as Tnom is pushing.

On Fri, 24 Oct 2003 08:48:53 -0700, Frank Gilliland
wrote:

In , "(Scott Unit 69)"
wrote:

snip

But what about what Frank said? You know Tnom's test was a sham. I just don't
like to see people get cheated.

The X-terminator's coils work out to 1.27 uH for the 9 turn coil and 0.60 for
the 5 turn coil. The values of the coils and their positions on the shaft are
consistent with the design of a center-loaded vertical.

For those that don't already know, a loading coil is used to shorten an antenna
while still keeping it's electrical length at 1/4 wavelength. But the antenna is
necessarily less efficient because the coil radiates part of the power, and that
power is lost. Why is it lost? Using the X-terminator picture as an example, you
will see that the wire in the coil is oriented perpendicular to the antenna, so
any radiation from the coil is going to be horizontally polarized, while the
radiation from the antenna is vertically polarized. Some people might think
that's a plus because some people have horizontal antennas, but it's really
useless because it is radiated from 14 different wires (9 turns + 5 turns), and
none of them are in phase with each other. Since there is no receiver publically
available that can receive all those signals, put them back in phase with each
other and add them to the horizontal signal, the power radiated by the coil is
wasted. Nor can a receiver pick out just one signal from the fourteen. Even
worse, the coil concentrates the magnetic flux (just like any other coil) and
directs it right at the roof of the vehicle, which results in more lost power
due to eddy currents induced into the sheet metal. Any loaded antenna is a
trade-off between antenna height and efficiency.

The only difference between the X-terminator and any other center-loaded
vertical is that the former is built for kilowatts (and not very well at that,
as the conductors are chrome plated, so it's RF resistance due to skin effect is
higher than stainless steel, and much higher than bare copper or silver). There
is no way that this antenna will outperform the unloaded 102" stainless-steel
whip.

Tnom's test may or may not have been a sham -- he may have actually gotten those
numbers, but for reasons other than what he presented. Personally, I think the
only thing he tested was his imagination.



The X-terminator has its main lobe at bit higher angle than the whip
does. That may account for some of the differences.

Chrome has about the same conductivity that Stainless does, or at
least from the info I found. 3-15% for Stainless, 19% for chrome,
relative to copper.

"scott" wrote:

Stop pretending to be me.

Another nic to be killfiled, George.


"(Scott Unit 69)" wrote:

Steveo wrote:
wrote:
On 24 Oct 2003 02:52:14 GMT, Steveo
wrote:

wrote:
Ok Tnom, You've peaked my interest. URL?

I think bills two way sells them?

Who makes it?

Workman?

Is this one ok ?

$36.95 SP-5000 X-Terminator V, 1000 Watt Single Open air coil, 1/8"
square Copper wire, 70 inch overall length.

That's not the same one as Tnom is pushing.

(Twistedhed) wrote:
wrote:
But what about what Frank said?

Irrelevant.
_
You know Tnom's test was a sham.
_
Countered by.....Frank's claims? THAT is your claim that Tnom's
presentation is a sham?

I just

don't like to see people get cheated.

_
It's way beyond that on this group,,,,this is about one who prefers
Chevy, one prefers Ford, and yet another prefers Dodge. The margin of
difference when applied to the average cber will not be noticeable
between the the antennas. The actual "cheating" taking place, if indeed
such a thing is to be found among a discussion forum, are the posts of
malicious and angry origin, unprovokingly attacking one's character by
name, contacting their work, and intentional libelous content of posts.
Of course, we can always add the scumbags that post under different nics
and play both sides of the fence......


I am not trying to play both sides of the fence Twist, you know me and my
CB background. But when it comes to the truth about a product there should
be no "fence" that divides us, only the truth.

Tnom's test may or may not have been a sham -- he may have actually gotten those
numbers, but for reasons other than what he presented. Personally, I think the
only thing he tested was his imagination.

I guess picture that I posted of all the antennas I used must also be
my imagination.

On Fri, 24 Oct 2003 17:48:23 GMT, lancer wrote:

On Thu, 23 Oct 2003 16:22:18 -0400, wrote:


Actually it's 62"..........If you can wait a second I'll give you the
entire dimensions. Maybe Mmana wants to know?

Tnom;

I plugged in the values that you posted. By simulation, the
Stainless whip has just about a 1 dB edge. The S/S whip has its main
lobe at 27.9 degrees, the X-terminator at 31.2 degrees. I posted a
current plot for it in:

alt.binaries.pictures.radio

I played with the parameters for the coils, and one coil works just as
well as the 2. Guess it just doesn't look as cool?

I don't disagree with what Mmana says but, there is no antenna
simulation program that can give the definitive answer for how a
antenna will actually perform in a real installation.

In other words when a engineer plugs in his values when designing a
new product he can never just rely on the computer or that design as
the final product. If he is to give performance numbers on the product
he can never use the computed values. He must use the measured
values. The measured value is always the most direct and accurate way
to evaluate a product.

snip
The X-terminator has its main lobe at bit higher angle than the whip
does. That may account for some of the differences.

Chrome has about the same conductivity that Stainless does, or at
least from the info I found. 3-15% for Stainless, 19% for chrome,
relative to copper.

I'll have to go through the archives to find the numbers but chrome is
a better conductor than Stainless

The only difference between the X-terminator and any other center-loaded
vertical is that the former is built for kilowatts (and not very well at that,
as the conductors are chrome plated, so it's RF resistance due to skin effect is
higher than stainless steel, and much higher than bare copper or silver). There
is no way that this antenna will outperform the unloaded 102" stainless-steel
whip.

The coils are copper with a chrome plating.................The chrome
does not cause any additional skin effect.