Best Alternative to eBay for banned 10 meter gear
 

I am not a regular user of eBay, so needless to say, I was quite
surprised when my HR2600 was banned. I emailed eBay and they
basically said the HR2600 has been deemed by the FCC to be an illegal
radio since it's used frequently for out-of-band pirate operation.
Since I am a licensed ham, bought the radio legally from another ham,
and have always operated it legally, I can't see how they can ban
these radios (other than the fact that they can because it's their
auction site and I know this trumps fairness).

So my question, is what is the best alternative auction site for those
10 meter ham refugees who have been banished from eBay? I've heard
Yahoo's site is pretty good, are there others I should consider? I'm
not a dealer, just an ordinary ham wanting to get a fair price for my
prized HR2600.

Thanks in advance for your advice and suggestions.

Darren
W5DKE

QTH.com is good.
Thats Ebay for ya, can't sell legal items but there are literally
hundreds of low drive 10m amps listed there, and they are ALL illegal.
Relist it but don't use HR2600 in the title, just put 10m transceiver.
Ebay reminds me of the Bush/Cheney/Ashcroft cartel. They do anything
they want, legal or not, and they don't care what anyone thinks of their
actions. Bunch of arrogant *******s.
Once I saw an item manufactured in 1999, "autographed" by a person
who has been dead since 1990. It was being sold as authentic with a
COA. I notified ebay of this obvious scam. They told me to mind my own
business.

Darren418 wrote:
I am not a regular user of eBay, so needless to say, I was quite
surprised when my HR2600 was banned. I emailed eBay and they
basically said the HR2600 has been deemed by the FCC to be an illegal
radio since it's used frequently for out-of-band pirate operation.
Since I am a licensed ham, bought the radio legally from another ham,
and have always operated it legally, I can't see how they can ban
these radios (other than the fact that they can because it's their
auction site and I know this trumps fairness).

So my question, is what is the best alternative auction site for those
10 meter ham refugees who have been banished from eBay? I've heard
Yahoo's site is pretty good, are there others I should consider? I'm
not a dealer, just an ordinary ham wanting to get a fair price for my
prized HR2600.

Thanks in advance for your advice and suggestions.

Darren
W5DKE

try eHam, QTH.com or QRZ.com, all have very widely used classified for sale
boards, with good pricing

In article ,
(Richard Cranium) writes:

If you "want a fair price", post it For Sale in any of these groups.
The fact that you want to auction it suggests that you want more than
a fair price.

Rubbish. An auction is the best way to get a fair price because the free
market is allowed to deterimine the value. What could be fairer than that?

Richard Cranium wrote:

The fact that you want to auction it suggests that you want more than
a fair price.

That is a stupid thing to say. On ebay you could have hundreds
of people looking at your item. Here you are limited to a
couple of dozen at best. You should use your cranium some time.

Darren418 wrote:
I am not a regular user of eBay, so needless to say, I was quite
surprised when my HR2600 was banned. I emailed eBay and they
basically said the HR2600 has been deemed by the FCC to be an illegal
radio since it's used frequently for out-of-band pirate operation.
Since I am a licensed ham, bought the radio legally from another ham,
and have always operated it legally, I can't see how they can ban
these radios (other than the fact that they can because it's their
auction site and I know this trumps fairness).

I know about the HR2600 ban and it does not make sense to
include it with the Lincoln and the HR2510. Those radios
are easily modified but the 2600 requires major surgery
in order for it to operate out of band. Common sense doesn't
seem to be all that common.

I did not see your auction so I don't know if this applies.
I put up a very nice HR2600 on ebay this year. It had the
Chipswitch so it was capable of 10 thru 12 meter operation.
I mentioned in my auction that it would operate on 11 meters
and ebay pulled it. I listed it again and only mentioned 10
and 12 meter operation and they left it alone. You could also
list it without mentioning the model of the radio. Bidders
could email you about specifics.

Yes at time I have some equipment kicked off also. I have no Idea what
the problem is as most HF rigs today is easily changed to work on 11 meters,
with 100 watts of power to boot.


"Harry" wrote in message
...


Darren418 wrote:
I am not a regular user of eBay, so needless to say, I was quite
surprised when my HR2600 was banned. I emailed eBay and they
basically said the HR2600 has been deemed by the FCC to be an illegal
radio since it's used frequently for out-of-band pirate operation.
Since I am a licensed ham, bought the radio legally from another ham,
and have always operated it legally, I can't see how they can ban
these radios (other than the fact that they can because it's their
auction site and I know this trumps fairness).

I know about the HR2600 ban and it does not make sense to
include it with the Lincoln and the HR2510. Those radios
are easily modified but the 2600 requires major surgery
in order for it to operate out of band. Common sense doesn't
seem to be all that common.

I did not see your auction so I don't know if this applies.
I put up a very nice HR2600 on ebay this year. It had the
Chipswitch so it was capable of 10 thru 12 meter operation.
I mentioned in my auction that it would operate on 11 meters
and ebay pulled it. I listed it again and only mentioned 10
and 12 meter operation and they left it alone. You could also
list it without mentioning the model of the radio. Bidders
could email you about specifics.

Yahoo's site is pretty good, are there others I should consider? I'm
not a dealer, just an ordinary ham wanting to get a fair price for my
prized HR2600.


If you prize it so much, why are you selling it?

Harry wrote in message ...
Darren418 wrote:
I am not a regular user of eBay, so needless to say, I was quite
surprised when my HR2600 was banned. I emailed eBay and they
basically said the HR2600 has been deemed by the FCC to be an illegal
radio since it's used frequently for out-of-band pirate operation.
Since I am a licensed ham, bought the radio legally from another ham,
and have always operated it legally, I can't see how they can ban
these radios (other than the fact that they can because it's their
auction site and I know this trumps fairness).

I know about the HR2600 ban and it does not make sense to
include it with the Lincoln and the HR2510. Those radios
are easily modified but the 2600 requires major surgery
in order for it to operate out of band. Common sense doesn't
seem to be all that common.

I did not see your auction so I don't know if this applies.
I put up a very nice HR2600 on ebay this year. It had the
Chipswitch so it was capable of 10 thru 12 meter operation.
I mentioned in my auction that it would operate on 11 meters
and ebay pulled it. I listed it again and only mentioned 10
and 12 meter operation and they left it alone. You could also
list it without mentioning the model of the radio. Bidders
could email you about specifics.

Yep, you guessed it. Same deal with mine. The wording I used was
operates "10 *through* 12 meters." I emailed them and proposed that
if I change the wording to "10 *and* 12 meters would it be ok. The
answer was that the wording didn't matter.

Below is the exchange I had this morning with eBay. It seems eBay is
guilty of merely blind obedience to the FCC and that the problem lies
with the FCC's determination that all HR2600's are "problematic" and
are of a "prohibited nature." When I bought the radio years ago from
its original owner (also a licensed ham) I liked that the radio had a
Chipswitch so I could operate it on 12 meters where I have operated it
extensively. An added side benefit is that I can monitor CB during
long roadtrips (I don't own a regular CB but can see their usefulness
out on the highway). I have never transmitted out of band nor have I
ever wished to. I guess my biggest problem with all of this is that I
feel like I've been falsely accused and assumed to be a criminal. I
must say I was somewhat offended by the whole episode. Here's the
exchenge with eBay:



Hello Darren,

Thank you for taking the time to write eBay with your concerns. I'm
happy to help you further.

We absolutely understand that you did not intentionally violate our
policies. However, the Uniden HR2600 model is simply not permitted on
eBay. Regardless of how the item is described, it just isn't allowed.
I
apologize for the inconvenience.

Your item was ended because it was identified by the FCC as
potentially
problematic. At eBay, we are not experts on transceivers and the
specifications of each model and how it may be modified. Therefore, we
rely on the FCC for guidance. eBay was contacted by representatives
from
the FCC and asked to remove certain models of radios that, while
legal,
may be problematic. Therefore, you may contact the FCC if you have any
further questions about the prohibited nature of your particular
model.

For further information concerning why your model was ended, contact
Ray
LaForge at the FCC Laboratory, 7435 Oakland Mills Road, Columbia, MD
21046, (301) 362-3041, or E-mail:

We appreciate your patience and understanding regarding this matter,
and
wish you continued success on eBay.

Regards,

Lara
eBay Community Watch
__________________________________________________ _________________________
Message: Item #: 3058207918

Dear Sir or Ma'am,

I believe you may have misunderstood the nature of my item that was
removed today. The radio is a fully FCC type accepted and approved HF
tranceiver. It is designed and advertised by the manufacturer (Uniden)
as a 10 meter HF tranceiver with 12 meter capability after minor
modification. As a consequence of the modification it is, admitedly,
capable of operating between the 12 meter and 10 meter amateur bands.
However, it is NOT a so-called "export," "CB," or other non-type
accepted radio. It's fully FCC approved. Many, many, hams have
modified
the Uniden HR2600 in this particular fashion to enable them to operate
legally on 12 meters as well as 10, and is not at all inconsistent
with
perfectly legal operation on these bands.

There are also many other FCC type accepted HF radios capable of
operation outside the amateur bands that are listed on eBay right now,
so I'm not sure why my radio is different. In reviewing my item's
listing, perhaps if I had said "operates on 10 and 12 meters" rather
than "10 'through' 12 meters" or included a disclaimer that the
operator
of the radio must hold an FCC genral class or higher ham license,
would
my listing be ok?

Also, I would like to point out that I am a law-abiding ham radio
operator who holds a General class amateur radio license, call sign
W5DKE, and that I legally operate this radio on both 10 and 12 meter
amateur bands. If a purchaser "might" operate the radio outside the
legal amateur bands, that should not preclude my being allowed to sell
the item. Otherwise you would have to end the majority of transceiver
auctions I see in the Ham Radio Tranceiver section of your website.

Lastly, you can see from my selling history that I am not a regular
user
of eBay. Please understand that I in no way intended to circumvent or
disregard your site's policies and if I have, please accept my
apology.

Respectfully,

Darren Ream

Below is the exchange I had this morning with eBay.

This is definitely not right.
Hell, by that grounds, a pencil is "problematic" because it might be used to
plot a terrorist attack..

I'd forward the exchange back to riley and the arrl.

Radioman wrote in message ...
Yahoo's site is pretty good, are there others I should consider? I'm
not a dealer, just an ordinary ham wanting to get a fair price for my
prized HR2600.


If you prize it so much, why are you selling it?

I bought an Icom 706 MKIIG and when the wife found out she, well,
insisted I sell the HR2600.

eBay practices what is known as "selective enforcement" on their site.

Basically, if someone complains, they cancel your auction. The onus is then on
YOU to prove the item is NOT prohibited under eBay rules. Guilty until proven
innocent, in other words. This is difficult if not downright impossible to do,
since you're dealing with an entry-level drone on the other end who doesn't
have a clue as to the specifics of radio equipment. You're likely to receive
only form letters in response. Most of their customers simply give up in
frustration. This is their intention. eBay has become just another oversized
corporate conglomerate. They don't want to bother with some guy selling a ham
radio. Realizing they're the only real game in town with regards to online
auctions, their stance seems to be "We'll do what we want. We don't care."

I've seen this happen time and time again: legal, unmodified 10m radios,
advertised in the ham radio section, being removed from the site. Meanwhile,
modified radios are allowed to continue being auctioned in the CB section.
Radios clearly marked as "modified", "extra channels", "full 26-28Mhz
coverage", etc., in the Item Description. Also linear amplifiers, which are
clearly illegal in all cases.

Ditto for pre-ban scanners with 800Mhz coverage. Units made prior to April,
1994, with no mention of modification are pulled while others described as
"full 800Mhz coverage", "cellular unlocked", "modified for cell", etc., are
allowed to continue.

I believe a competent attorney could, after sufficient documentation, make a
strong case against eBay on these grounds. Given the millions of users, it
wouldn't be too hard to then have class action status awarded to the pending
case. I'm not a lawyer, nor do I play one on TV, but I sure would love to see
one take them on. This game has been going on way too long now, as any regular
buyer of radio gear via eBay can attest to.

"Darren418" wrote in message
om...
Radioman wrote in message
...
Yahoo's site is pretty good, are there others I should consider? I'm
not a dealer, just an ordinary ham wanting to get a fair price for my
prized HR2600.


If you prize it so much, why are you selling it?

I bought an Icom 706 MKIIG and when the wife found out she, well,
insisted I sell the HR2600.

Since the HR2600 is only 10 through 12 meters, tell her you won't get very
much for it and it isn't worth selling.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

Yahoo's site is pretty good, are there others I should consider? I'm
not a dealer, just an ordinary ham wanting to get a fair price for my
prized HR2600.

From the current Hamprice document:
HR2600 10M ALL MODE 153, 142, 135, 103

More info on Hamprice at:


If you prize it so much, why are you selling it?

I bought an Icom 706 MKIIG and when the wife found out she, well,
insisted I sell the HR2600.

Those things don't like to be around radio towers. 2 meters is useless
when the tower is a half mile away.

Talking to Ebay is like talking to M$. They really don't care as long
as they make $. The are very "reactive" to issues, not "proactive". I
see nothing wrong with the 2600 but lets talk about the 200 watt "Ham
Amps" for $1xx.00 that cover 12 and 10 meters? They are still around.
Also the "Amateur amps, 250 watts for $2xx.00 that only cover 24 to 30
mhz. Funny, they still get listed?

What do I know and its for sure Ebay does not care at all.

Just my 3 cents, John W5CGU



Darren418 wrote:

I am not a regular user of eBay, so needless to say, I was quite
surprised when my HR2600 was banned. I emailed eBay and they
basically said the HR2600 has been deemed by the FCC to be an illegal
radio since it's used frequently for out-of-band pirate operation.
Since I am a licensed ham, bought the radio legally from another ham,
and have always operated it legally, I can't see how they can ban
these radios (other than the fact that they can because it's their
auction site and I know this trumps fairness).

So my question, is what is the best alternative auction site for those
10 meter ham refugees who have been banished from eBay? I've heard
Yahoo's site is pretty good, are there others I should consider? I'm
not a dealer, just an ordinary ham wanting to get a fair price for my
prized HR2600.

Thanks in advance for your advice and suggestions.

Darren
W5DKE

Harry wrote in message ...
Richard Cranium wrote:

The fact that you want to auction it suggests that you want more than
a fair price.

That is a stupid thing to say. On ebay you could have hundreds
of people looking at your item. Here you are limited to a
couple of dozen at best. You should use your cranium some time.

"A couple of dozen at best"? How do you figure that? Do you have any
clue? If that's true, why did you ask your question here?

BTW, I merely made an observation. But you proved it for me: The "fair
price" you could get here wouldn't be enough.

In article , Citizens For A
Keyclown-Free Newsgroup says...

(Darren418) wrote in message
.com...
I emailed eBay and they
basically said the HR2600 has been deemed by
the FCC to be an illegal
radio since it's used frequently for out-of-band pirate operation.

It's pirates, freebanders and keyclowns who are responsible for the
"ban" in the first place, yet they are the ones who bitch the loudest
about the "unfair" eBay and FCC.

I only jammed a few repeaters and people got their panties all in a bunch.
What's so bad about freebanding anyway?

Best alternative to ebay? The Dayton Hamvention.

Dave Head
K8DH


On 10 Nov 2003 23:01:48 -0800, (Darren418) wrote:

I am not a regular user of eBay, so needless to say, I was quite
surprised when my HR2600 was banned. I emailed eBay and they
basically said the HR2600 has been deemed by the FCC to be an illegal
radio since it's used frequently for out-of-band pirate operation.
Since I am a licensed ham, bought the radio legally from another ham,
and have always operated it legally, I can't see how they can ban
these radios (other than the fact that they can because it's their
auction site and I know this trumps fairness).

So my question, is what is the best alternative auction site for those
10 meter ham refugees who have been banished from eBay? I've heard
Yahoo's site is pretty good, are there others I should consider? I'm
not a dealer, just an ordinary ham wanting to get a fair price for my
prized HR2600.

Thanks in advance for your advice and suggestions.

Darren
W5DKE

Radioman wrote in message ...
Yahoo's site is pretty good, are there others I should consider? I'm
not a dealer, just an ordinary ham wanting to get a fair price for my
prized HR2600.


If you prize it so much, why are you selling it?

By the way, thanks everyone for their responses. I think I'll go
ahead and post it on eham and qrz and skip this whole auction thing
altogether. When I post it for sale, I'll post a link here so
everyone can look it up.

Thanks again.

Darren
W5DKE

Idiots just can't get that point through their heads. Damned, if an open
auction
doesn't define fairness... nothing else does.

"SouthDakotaRadio" wrote in message
...
In article ,
(Richard Cranium) writes:

If you "want a fair price", post it For Sale in any of these groups.
The fact that you want to auction it suggests that you want more than
a fair price.

Rubbish. An auction is the best way to get a fair price because the free
market is allowed to deterimine the value. What could be fairer than
that?

Richard Cranium wrote:

"A couple of dozen at best"? How do you figure that? Do you have any
clue? If that's true, why did you ask your question here?

What a pinhead

Ebay is a wonderful thing most of the time.
Yes, you get the most cash from whatever you sell (most of the time).
Ebay is watched all over the world and if someone really wants to
spend more than you might think is a fair price, well, it's up to
them. It's called free enterprise. I look at some of the high
prices and shake my head, but If an item is wanted bad enough,
make it so. Who is to say what an item is worth to somebody looking
for it.
ALSO, these newsgroups are nice to find stuff too, BUT, You have no
recourse if something goes wrong. Like what happens if you pay for
something and you never get it? Or if is not working as described?
Or it's beat up and not mint like the posting says? You're screwed.
True, most hams are honest but there are some chumps also.
At least on Ebay there are actions that can be done. Also, using
paypal to pay for something is great. Yes it cost a very small amount
but if you don't get your item and the seller does not have any proof
that he sent it Paypal can and does get your money back from the
sellers account.
73



If you "want a fair price", post it For Sale in any of these groups.
The fact that you want to auction it suggests that you want more than
a fair price.

BTW, Ebay is so large that they usually do not go out of their way to
look for items to ban. What usually happens is some dirtbags out
there look for these radios and amps and e-mail ebay. Then "poof"
your auction is ended. Even though there is nothing illegal with the
item. Ebay is making way to much money to let a legal radio (or
whatever) that someone "might" modify" to be sold on their system.
They seem to be afraid of repercussions down the road.
-------------
With all ebays money how come they are afraid to have a telephone??
----------------

On 10 Nov 2003 23:01:48 -0800, (Darren418)
wrote:

I am not a regular user of eBay, so needless to say, I was quite
surprised when my HR2600 was banned. I emailed eBay and they
basically said the HR2600 has been deemed by the FCC to be an illegal
radio since it's used frequently for out-of-band pirate operation.
Since I am a licensed ham, bought the radio legally from another ham,
and have always operated it legally, I can't see how they can ban
these radios (other than the fact that they can because it's their
auction site and I know this trumps fairness).

So my question, is what is the best alternative auction site for those
10 meter ham refugees who have been banished from eBay? I've heard
Yahoo's site is pretty good, are there others I should consider? I'm
not a dealer, just an ordinary ham wanting to get a fair price for my
prized HR2600.

Thanks in advance for your advice and suggestions.

Darren
W5DKE

Harry wrote in message ...
Richard Cranium wrote:

"A couple of dozen at best"? How do you figure that? Do you have any
clue? If that's true, why did you ask your question here?

What a pinhead

Pinhead? I guess you are.

Prove me wrong: Post it For Sale here. You'll get a "fair price".

But you didn't answer the question: How can you claim that you'll only
get "a couple of dozen at best"? A "couple of dozen" would only be the
flamers and trolls!

In article ,
(Steve Robeson, K4CAP) writes:

Rubbish. An auction is the best way to get a fair price because the free
market is allowed to deterimine the value. What could be fairer than that?

"Fair price"...??? For whom?

eBay prices are typically HIGHER than what can be had through
other resources simply because people get caught up in the bidding
process. Great for the seller, I guess.


But how is this not a "fair price?" Nobody is twisting the bidders' arms,
forcing them to pay. Is the system responsible because they make a poor
decision and overbid?

I suppose, in this junk society where nobody's responsible for their own
actions, it fits right in. Just as McDonalds is responsible for people getting
fat and RJ Reynolds is responsible for people getting lung cancer. *sigh*

OK, everyone, as promised, I finally posted my radio on QRZ.com and
www.eham.com. Price is $225 or best offer. Go to either of those
sites and check out the description and photo.

Thanks again to everyone who helped me with advice. Much appreciated.

Darren
W5DKE


(Mark Russo) wrote in message ...
BTW, Ebay is so large that they usually do not go out of their way to
look for items to ban. What usually happens is some dirtbags out
there look for these radios and amps and e-mail ebay. Then "poof"
your auction is ended. Even though there is nothing illegal with the
item. Ebay is making way to much money to let a legal radio (or
whatever) that someone "might" modify" to be sold on their system.
They seem to be afraid of repercussions down the road.
-------------
With all ebays money how come they are afraid to have a telephone??
----------------

On 10 Nov 2003 23:01:48 -0800, (Darren418)
wrote:

I am not a regular user of eBay, so needless to say, I was quite
surprised when my HR2600 was banned. I emailed eBay and they
basically said the HR2600 has been deemed by the FCC to be an illegal
radio since it's used frequently for out-of-band pirate operation.
Since I am a licensed ham, bought the radio legally from another ham,
and have always operated it legally, I can't see how they can ban
these radios (other than the fact that they can because it's their
auction site and I know this trumps fairness).

So my question, is what is the best alternative auction site for those
10 meter ham refugees who have been banished from eBay? I've heard
Yahoo's site is pretty good, are there others I should consider? I'm
not a dealer, just an ordinary ham wanting to get a fair price for my
prized HR2600.

Thanks in advance for your advice and suggestions.

Darren
W5DKE

The Hamprice info is really neat. I saved the document for future
reference. I figure then that my radio is priced just about right
considering it comes with a pretty much new $50 aftermarket amplified
mike, and the Chipswitch enhanced microprocessor which is about $100
installed. Throw in a 2510 service manual and two mounting brackets,
and I figure all these extras have to be worth at least $75 over the
Hamprice price (which is presumably for just the basic radio).

It's been years since I've sold any equipment, so one variable I don't
know about is what the overall market conditions are like right now,
but since Hamprice says all their #'s are since March 2003, it's
obviously not too bad.

And yes, I've heard the 706 tends to get clobbered by intermod on 2
meters, but since I use it for a base radio and I live in an extremely
quiet location, that's not a concern for me. In fact the main
intended use for my new 706 is to monitor 2 meter SSB for band
openings.


Radioman wrote in message ...
Yahoo's site is pretty good, are there others I should consider? I'm
not a dealer, just an ordinary ham wanting to get a fair price for my
prized HR2600.

From the current Hamprice document:
HR2600 10M ALL MODE 153, 142, 135, 103

More info on Hamprice at:


If you prize it so much, why are you selling it?

I bought an Icom 706 MKIIG and when the wife found out she, well,
insisted I sell the HR2600.

Those things don't like to be around radio towers. 2 meters is useless
when the tower is a half mile away.

BTW, Ebay is so large that they usually do not go out of their way to
look for items to ban. What usually happens is some dirtbags out
there look for these radios and amps and e-mail ebay. Then "poof"
your auction is ended. Even though there is nothing illegal with the
item. Ebay is making way to much money to let a legal radio (or
whatever) that someone "might" modify" to be sold on their system.
They seem to be afraid of repercussions down the road.
-------------
With all ebays money how come they are afraid to have a telephone??
----------------


Funny thing is that I've spotted quite a few HR2600's on eBay both
before and since I tried posting my radio. And no, I didn't email
eBay about them nor am I going to post the links to the items (if the
radio police want to, they can just search eBay to find them). One
that has been up for several days even proudly advertises its
Chipswitch mod that covers CB. Ummm, can you say "selective
enforcement?"