N9OGL wrote:
The general term for noncommercial is a station that can't make a
profit, but can make money to substain the station. Then you have the
amateur rules which state an amateur station can make money direct or
indirect period. K1MAN is a primary example of this no money direct or
indirect period which the FCC is enforcing and the ARRL supports. that
was last week, now you have the ARRL this week getting a grant to give
to amateur operators to basically compensate them for doing radio
communication down south. I REALLY hope the FCC is watching this crap
as a matter of fact I'm going to copy and paste this and sent it to the
FCC and a few other people I know. I posted it on QRZ but those asshole
knocked it off their site. Because Like I said what applies for one
should apply for all.

You are right of course it should, but alas it doesn't, such is life in
the USA these days under either party since the 'Crats control things

Todd N9OGL

"N9OGL" wrote in message
oups.com...
Food, caps, tee-shirts, food, and bottle water is one thing, but money
is another. My point in all of this is K1MAN was fined by the FCC for
Pecuniary Interest and now the ASSHOLE RADIO RELAY LEAGUE is going to
do the samething. What go for one person should apply for all. The MAIN
problem I see here is the definition of the term noncommercial, and
seems that there is two tems on what noncommercial means.

Todd N9OGL
.................................................. ...

Learn to write (and spell), Todd.
Most third graders can do better than you.

"KØHB" wrote in message
ink.net...

"N9OGL" wrote

now the ASSHOLE RADIO RELAY LEAGUE

Todd,

Up until this point, the conversation on this topic was reasoned and
balanced.

(according to who? You?)


But you've chosen to resort to your habitual trash mouth mode, so you can
find
any further comments from me posted at http://www.amishrakefight.org/gfy .

Don't go away mad, Hans. Just go away. Thank you very much.

With warmest kind wishes,
de Hans, K0HB


(in closing, Hans takes his dishes and goes home...)

"Cmdr Buzz Corey" wrote in message
...
Dee Flint wrote:


Not at all. I read the ARRL statement and the FCC rules. I happen to
agree
that there is enough flexibility to allow meeting the travel expenses,
food
expenses for those who are going down. There is no intent to "make a
buck".

My point was that there is no reason to automatically assume that there is
an intent to do wrong.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE


Years ago I participated in ham radio communications after a tornado
cleaned out about half of the southern part of Witchta Fall, Tx. The
kind folks of WF housed us in a church, provided sleeping facilities and
fed us. Anyone think that was violating the rule of "pecuniary interest"?
.................

Of course not. Besides, who but the most idiotic of Hams would accuse you of
same?
You were performing a public service.
I am assuming, of course, that your question was posted with a
tongue-in-cheek smile and with hopes to "bait" someone.

And by the way. Hotel/motel rooms, meals etc. aside, I wonder if some
nit-picker may not come along and posit that you should not have accepted
the free electricity to run your radios, either.

"an old friend" wrote in message
oups.com...

Dee Flint wrote:
"an_old_friend" wrote in message
ups.com...
cut

It only looks like that to people who look at the worst possible
interpretation rather than the best. Most of us DON'T look at it that
way.

Those notes are from the ARRL who have boasted they take a more liberal
view than the FCC

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE


It seems like a simple statement rather than a boast.

you are of course entitled to your opinion. By what right to seek to
deny MINE?

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE


I have not denied yours. Simply made my point to counterbalance yours.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

"Cmdr Buzz Corey" wrote in message
...
Dee Flint wrote:


Not at all. I read the ARRL statement and the FCC rules. I happen to
agree that there is enough flexibility to allow meeting the travel
expenses, food expenses for those who are going down. There is no intent
to "make a buck".

My point was that there is no reason to automatically assume that there
is an intent to do wrong.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE
Years ago I participated in ham radio communications after a tornado
cleaned out about half of the southern part of Witchta Fall, Tx. The kind
folks of WF housed us in a church, provided sleeping facilities and fed
us. Anyone think that was violating the rule of "pecuniary interest"?

Not me. I'm quite sure you returned home with less money than you started.

I've generally seen the term "pecuniary interest" used in the sense of
"attempting to make a profit". Neither the ARRL nor the individual hams
will make a profit from this.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

"Digital" wrote in message ...

"Cmdr Buzz Corey" wrote in message
...
Dee Flint wrote:


Not at all. I read the ARRL statement and the FCC rules. I happen to
agree
that there is enough flexibility to allow meeting the travel expenses,
food
expenses for those who are going down. There is no intent to "make a
buck".

My point was that there is no reason to automatically assume that there
is
an intent to do wrong.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE


Years ago I participated in ham radio communications after a tornado
cleaned out about half of the southern part of Witchta Fall, Tx. The
kind folks of WF housed us in a church, provided sleeping facilities and
fed us. Anyone think that was violating the rule of "pecuniary interest"?
................

Of course not. Besides, who but the most idiotic of Hams would accuse you
of
same?
You were performing a public service.
I am assuming, of course, that your question was posted with a
tongue-in-cheek smile and with hopes to "bait" someone.

And by the way. Hotel/motel rooms, meals etc. aside, I wonder if some
nit-picker may not come along and posit that you should not have accepted
the free electricity to run your radios, either.

Excellent example of "illustrating absurdity by reducing it to the absurd."

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

Mike Coslo wrote:
wrote:
K=D8HB wrote:

"N9OGL" wrote


"You must never accept any money or other consideration for operating
your station [97.113(a)(2)]. this is consistent with one of the prime
directives of our serice:

I understand your concern, but the grant does not provide payment for o=
perating;
it provides reimbursement for expenses.


My radios are expenses.


You might be able to make a case for that if you purchased them for
emergency use, and only used them for Emergency use.

Expect a challenge, tho'
=20
- Mike KB3EIA -

As if I'd use them any other time.

"KØHB" ) writes:
Cmdr Buzz Corey wrote:

Years ago I participated in ham radio communications after a tornado
cleaned out about half of the southern part of Witchta Fall, Tx. The
kind folks of WF housed us in a church, provided sleeping facilities and
fed us. Anyone think that was violating the rule of "pecuniary interest"?


"an old friend" replied:

Yes

OK, folks, every one of you who accepted food or lodging in the course of
participating in an emergency communications incident is guilty of violating FCC
rules.

If the Red Cross or Salvation Army (btw, why is there no Salvation Navy)
provided you with some identification garment like a hat or t-shirt, you must
return the garment to the issuing agency. If you have lost or damaged the
garment you must reimburse the RC/SA for the fair market value of the garment.

You should file amended state and federal tax returns accounting for the value
of the freebie meals/lodging/refreshments/transportation which was provided to
you in the course of your volunteer assignment, with copies to all FCC
Commissioners who will review your fitness to continue to hold your Amateur
Radio license.

Or not.

73, de Hans, K0HB

Of course, if you reverse the wording, it makes the thing all make more
sense.

You volunteer for something, but they insist you wear a tshirt and hat,
and you MUST pay for it.

They won't provide food, so you've got to pay for it, even though you will
be in a situation where you can't easily bring lunch from home, and don't
have a wide selection of choices.

Then they will bill you for lodging.

Michael VE2BVW

Randy wrote:
"K=D8HB" wrote in message
ink.net...

"N9OGL" wrote

now the ASSHOLE RADIO RELAY LEAGUE

Todd,

Up until this point, the conversation on this topic was reasoned and
balanced.

(according to who? You?)


But you've chosen to resort to your habitual trash mouth mode, so you can
find
any further comments from me posted at http://www.amishrakefight.org/gfy =
=2E

Don't go away mad, Hans. Just go away. Thank you very much.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^^^

Plagiarist Lardass!


With warmest kind wishes,
de Hans, K0HB
=20
=20
(in closing, Hans takes his dishes and goes home...)

"Michael Black" wrote in message
...

"KØHB" ) writes:
Cmdr Buzz Corey wrote:

Years ago I participated in ham radio communications after a tornado
cleaned out about half of the southern part of Witchta Fall, Tx. The
kind folks of WF housed us in a church, provided sleeping facilities
and
fed us. Anyone think that was violating the rule of "pecuniary
interest"?


"an old friend" replied:

Yes

OK, folks, every one of you who accepted food or lodging in the course of
participating in an emergency communications incident is guilty of
violating FCC
rules.

If the Red Cross or Salvation Army (btw, why is there no Salvation Navy)
provided you with some identification garment like a hat or t-shirt, you
must
return the garment to the issuing agency. If you have lost or damaged
the
garment you must reimburse the RC/SA for the fair market value of the
garment.

You should file amended state and federal tax returns accounting for the
value
of the freebie meals/lodging/refreshments/transportation which was
provided to
you in the course of your volunteer assignment, with copies to all FCC
Commissioners who will review your fitness to continue to hold your
Amateur
Radio license.

Or not.

73, de Hans, K0HB

Of course, if you reverse the wording, it makes the thing all make more
sense.

You volunteer for something, but they insist you wear a tshirt and hat,
and you MUST pay for it.

They won't provide food, so you've got to pay for it, even though you will
be in a situation where you can't easily bring lunch from home, and don't
have a wide selection of choices.

Then they will bill you for lodging.

Michael VE2BVW


Either way, you end up with less than when you started even accounting for
being able to deduct them on your income taxes.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

"Michael Black" wrote


They won't provide food, so you've got to pay for it, even though you will
be in a situation where you can't easily bring lunch from home, and don't
have a wide selection of choices.


Is that written in Canookian? All the words seem to be English, but .........

73, de Hans, K0HB

K=D8HB wrote:
"Michael Black" wrote


They won't provide food, so you've got to pay for it, even though you w=
ill
be in a situation where you can't easily bring lunch from home, and don=
't
have a wide selection of choices.


Is that written in Canookian? All the words seem to be English, but ....=
..=2E...

73, de Hans, K0HB

ah the open mindedness of hams

one boasts of killing gooks another address canaadian pagoritively

"an Old friend" wrote

KØHB wrote:
"Michael Black" wrote


They won't provide food, so you've got to pay for it, even though you will
be in a situation where you can't easily bring lunch from home, and don't
have a wide selection of choices.


Is that written in Canookian? All the words seem to be English, but
.........

73, de Hans, K0HB

canaadian pagoritively

Well, at least the esteemed ham from Canookia used English words. The esteemed
old_friend from Michigan used words from an unknown language.

Beep beep!
de Hans, K0HB

learn to quote people correctly

"an Old friend" wrote

learn to quote people correctly

Those two words are a precise copy of the words you used. (Ain't Google
wonderful!)

Beep beep
de Hans, K0HB

K=D8HB wrote:
"an Old friend" wrote

learn to quote people correctly

Those two words are a precise copy of the words you used. (Ain't Google
wonderful!)
with out the rest of them
=20
Beep beep
de Hans, K0HB

K0HB:

Maybe, perhaps, and non-pecuniary of course, you can find someone who
would fund you to go away--I mean, hell!, just maybe the arrl is on to
something here and we can all make a buck while doing something which
would be done anyway! Ethics are such a bother anyway--and besides, they
are only for the "other guy" (read K1MAN here), certainly they don't
pertain to us "special people!"

John

On Mon, 05 Sep 2005 04:22:56 +0000, KØHB wrote:


"N9OGL" wrote

now the ASSHOLE RADIO RELAY LEAGUE

Todd,

Up until this point, the conversation on this topic was reasoned and balanced.
But you've chosen to resort to your habitual trash mouth mode, so you can find
any further comments from me posted at http://www.amishrakefight.org/gfy .

With warmest kind wishes,
de Hans, K0HB

John Smith wrote:
K0HB:

Maybe, perhaps, and non-pecuniary of course, you can find someone who
would fund you to go away--I mean, hell!, just maybe the arrl is on to
something here and we can all make a buck while doing something which
would be done anyway! Ethics are such a bother anyway--and besides, they
are only for the "other guy" (read K1MAN here), certainly they don't
pertain to us "special people!"

John

On Mon, 05 Sep 2005 04:22:56 +0000, K=D8HB wrote:
=20

Indeed this is a large problem in the ARS

CB:

Funny, but when the gov't asked for billions for "homeland defense" and
made fema and it united, I thought they would have bought some
communications equip., trained people and they would be set in place in
such a disaster--from planes, tops of tall buildings, in communication
vehicles and such--then begin communicating with hams in their local
communities to handle communications for family and other services into
that area. I never thought for a moment they would then plan, in a real
disaster, to start hiring hams--that simply sucks and demonstrates we have
been screwed.

Now we find out, they didn't even use the money to get supplies of food,
water, bedding, blankets, clothing, etc. WHICH YOU WOULD NEED IN ANY
EMERGENCY! together, how surprising, the gov't has given us a royal
screwing--ONCE AGAIN...

John

On Sun, 04 Sep 2005 21:35:01 -0700, Cmdr Buzz Corey wrote:

Dee Flint wrote:


Not at all. I read the ARRL statement and the FCC rules. I happen to agree
that there is enough flexibility to allow meeting the travel expenses, food
expenses for those who are going down. There is no intent to "make a buck".

My point was that there is no reason to automatically assume that there is
an intent to do wrong.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE


Years ago I participated in ham radio communications after a tornado
cleaned out about half of the southern part of Witchta Fall, Tx. The
kind folks of WF housed us in a church, provided sleeping facilities and
fed us. Anyone think that was violating the rule of "pecuniary interest"?

Digital wrote:
"Cmdr Buzz Corey" wrote in message

Years ago I participated in ham radio communications after a tornado
cleaned out about half of the southern part of Witchta Fall, Tx. The
kind folks of WF housed us in a church, provided sleeping facilities and
fed us. Anyone think that was violating the rule of "pecuniary interest"?
................

Of course not. Besides, who but the most idiotic of Hams would accuse you of
same?

Bingo!

John Smith wrote:
CB:

Funny, but when the gov't asked for billions for "homeland defense" and
made fema and it united, I thought they would have bought some
communications equip., trained people and they would be set in place in
such a disaster--from planes, tops of tall buildings, in communication
vehicles and such--then begin communicating with hams in their local
communities to handle communications for family and other services into
that area. I never thought for a moment they would then plan, in a real
disaster, to start hiring hams--that simply sucks and demonstrates we have
been screwed.

So just were are they "hiring" hams?

All that money to the ARRL which everyone knows to be the only legit
representative of ALL of the nations hams and not one single penny to
the looser up in Maine who is usually bellowing how important he is.
The Corporation for National and Community know which groups are real
and which are phony and they know that the ARRL and ONLY the ARRL
deserves the support because the ARRL is REAL and is saving lives. The
K1MAN group is nothing more than a guy in an old packing crate in
Maine.


Service
N9OGL wrote:
NEWINGTON, CT, Sep 2, 2005--The Corporation for National and Community
Service (CNCS) will provide a $100,000 grant supplement to ARRL to
support Amateur Radio's emergency communication operators in states
affected by Hurricane Katrina. The grant will help to fund "Ham Aid," a
new League program to support Amateur Radio volunteers deployed in the
field in disaster-stricken areas. ARRL Chief Development Officer Mary
Hobart, K1MMH, expressed gratitude to CNCS for its generous response.
Ham Aid, she said, offers a unique opportunity to support individual
radio amateurs helping to bridge the communication gap Hurricane
Katrina has caused.

"For the first time in ARRL history, we will be able to reimburse some
of the expenses that hams incur in response to a disaster," she said.
"We only wish that we could justify an expense reimbursement program
like this every time Amateur Radio Emergency Service volunteers are
called upon to help in a disaster or emergency, sometimes placing
themselves in harm's way."

In addition to providing emergency communication within and outside the
affected areas, Amateur Radio Emergency Service (ARES) members and
individual radio amateurs are supplementing the communication needs of
emergency management and relief agencies, including the American Red
Cross and The Salvation Army. Hobart said it's only due to the scope of
the unprecedented and tragic Katrina disaster that CNCS agreed to help
support dedicated Amateur Radio volunteers.

"But," she added, "we'd like to think of this grant as a token of
appreciation and a recognition of Amateur Radio's value in past
emergencies and disasters, such as 9/11."

Hobart says ARRL's Ham Aid program already has received some
substantial private donations. Those and the CNCS grant, she said,
provide a way for the League to "support our Field Organization as
never before."

The CNCS Ham Aid grant is effective for operations established and
documented as of September 1, 2005, and the aid is earmarked for
Hurricane Katrina deployments only at this point. Guidelines are being
established that will permit volunteers who have been involved in bona
fide field support operations on or after September 1 to provide
communication support to apply for a reimbursement voucher on a per
diem basis.

Trained Amateur Radio operators will be on site for the duration of
this disaster response, which could run into several weeks or months.
"Many will leave their jobs and families and travel on their own
expense, using their own equipment," Hobart points out.

Corporation funds may also sustain the Ham Aid program and help to
rebuild the emergency communications capabilities in Louisiana,
Mississippi and Alabama to ensure that the Gulf Coast is prepared,
should disaster strike again.

The CNCS grant is an extension of ARRL's three year Homeland Security
training grant, which has provided certification in emergency
communication protocols to nearly 5500 Amateur Radio volunteer over the
past three years.

"CNCS grants helped make it possible for the ARRL to train America's
hams and make them the best all-volunteer emergency radio service ever
seen," Hobart said. "Now they are making it possible for the hams to
use that training."

Randy wrote:
"N9OGL" wrote in message
oups.com...
Food, caps, tee-shirts, food, and bottle water is one thing, but money
is another. My point in all of this is K1MAN was fined by the FCC for
Pecuniary Interest and now the ASSHOLE RADIO RELAY LEAGUE is going to
do the samething. What go for one person should apply for all. The MAIN
problem I see here is the definition of the term noncommercial, and
seems that there is two tems on what noncommercial means.

Todd N9OGL
.................................................. ..

Learn to write (and spell), Todd.
Most third graders can do better than you.

Make the ARRL stop, make them all stop. Who listens to W1AW anyway,
except for field day points.