Beating planning permission (Brit) or zonal regulation (Yank)?
 

Looking at the way that antennae on spacecraft unwrap into
elaborate structures from a near-perfect spheroid, (not unlike the
Japanese / Chinese tissue paper flowers when dropped into water),
I wonder if there is scope for we amateurs (Brit) / Hams (Yank) to
produce similar structures, but with the added capacity to fold back
into a tight ball?

That way, we could all have extensive antennae farms, but then being
of a temporary nature, would not fall foul of the bureaucrato******s
that plague local government (especially here in Brit).

Beating planning permission (Brit) or zonal regulation (Yank)?
 

"gareth" wrote in message
...
Looking at the way that antennae on spacecraft unwrap into
elaborate structures from a near-perfect spheroid, (not unlike the
Japanese / Chinese tissue paper flowers when dropped into water),
I wonder if there is scope for we amateurs (Brit) / Hams (Yank) to
produce similar structures, but with the added capacity to fold back
into a tight ball?

That way, we could all have extensive antennae farms, but then being
of a temporary nature, would not fall foul of the bureaucrato******s
that plague local government (especially here in Brit).

Spheroids, Beanie? Is this another balls-up on your part?
--
;-)
..
73 de Frank Turner-Smith G3VKI - mine's a pint.
..
http://turner-smith.co.uk

Beating planning permission (Brit) or zonal regulation (Yank)?
 

"Rambo" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 6 Oct 2013 17:56:28 +0100, "gareth"
wrote:

Looking at the way that antennae on spacecraft unwrap into
elaborate structures from a near-perfect spheroid, (not unlike the
Japanese / Chinese tissue paper flowers when dropped into water),
I wonder if there is scope for we amateurs (Brit) / Hams (Yank) to
produce similar structures, but with the added capacity to fold back
into a tight ball?

That way, we could all have extensive antennae farms, but then being
of a temporary nature, would not fall foul of the bureaucrato******s
that plague local government (especially here in Brit).


I think Sir Issac Newton may have thought about reasons why a
spacecraft antenna is lighter and can adopt perfect spheroids easily.

The gravity of the situation is certainly a consideration, so making
elements
open downwards onto a stop could use that attribute.

Beating planning permission (Brit) or zonal regulation (Yank)?
 

"gareth" wrote in message
...
"Rambo" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 6 Oct 2013 17:56:28 +0100, "gareth"
wrote:

Looking at the way that antennae on spacecraft unwrap into
elaborate structures from a near-perfect spheroid, (not unlike the
Japanese / Chinese tissue paper flowers when dropped into water),
I wonder if there is scope for we amateurs (Brit) / Hams (Yank) to
produce similar structures, but with the added capacity to fold back
into a tight ball?

That way, we could all have extensive antennae farms, but then being
of a temporary nature, would not fall foul of the bureaucrato******s
that plague local government (especially here in Brit).


I think Sir Issac Newton may have thought about reasons why a
spacecraft antenna is lighter and can adopt perfect spheroids easily.

The gravity of the situation is certainly a consideration, so making
elements
open downwards onto a stop could use that attribute.

What about retracting upwards?

Beating planning permission (Brit) or zonal regulation (Yank)?
 

In the US, the FCC rules trump any planning commission or homeowners'
association, etc., allowing the licensed operator to erect an antenna
that isn't subject to any restrictions on height, length, etc., as
long as it doesn't extend beyond the land the owner controls, of
course.

Same for antennas for television reception, unless cable TV is
supplied at no charge to the occupant.

That doesn't mean that we wouldn't have to spend some time and trouble
fighting to assert our rights, though, even though we are protected by
law here in the US.

The reasoning behind the law is that amateur radio is very useful in
times of disaster or local emergencies and that anything impeding the
use of such is counter to the public's general interests.

Many amateur radio operators here skirt the issue and just erect
"stealth antennas" that either can't be easily seen or aren't ugly
(like a flagpole vertical). In doing so, rather than ask for
permission, they just put it up and wait to see if the homeowner's
association or local code enforcer decides to press the issue. If the
amateur asks for permission, they increase the probability that
everything they do from then on will be scrutinized carefully.

Don



On Sun, 6 Oct 2013 17:56:28 +0100, "gareth"
wrote:

Looking at the way that antennae on spacecraft unwrap into
elaborate structures from a near-perfect spheroid, (not unlike the
Japanese / Chinese tissue paper flowers when dropped into water),
I wonder if there is scope for we amateurs (Brit) / Hams (Yank) to
produce similar structures, but with the added capacity to fold back
into a tight ball?

That way, we could all have extensive antennae farms, but then being
of a temporary nature, would not fall foul of the bureaucrato******s
that plague local government (especially here in Brit).

Beating planning permission (Brit) or zonal regulation (Yank)?
 

On 10/12/2013 7:18 PM, Donald wrote:
In the US, the FCC rules trump any planning commission or homeowners'
association, etc., allowing the licensed operator to erect an antenna
that isn't subject to any restrictions on height, length, etc., as
long as it doesn't extend beyond the land the owner controls, of
course.


Incorrect. FCC regulations say nothing about homeowner associations or
other covenants; only laws and zoning regulations. Even then, there can
be further restrictions, i.e. for safety reasons. About all PRB-1 says
is the city/county/other AHJ cannot have restrictions due to scenic reasons.

Even this is subject to interpretation. A recent court case in
California (I forgot which one - you can look it up if you are
interested) a judge ruled that a ham's 2M antenna was sufficient for him
to enjoy the hobby, and the city could restrict him from any other antennas.

Same for antennas for television reception, unless cable TV is
supplied at no charge to the occupant.


A completely different law, and also partially true. It allows
satellite antennas anywhere - whether cable tv is supplied or not. It
says nothing about outdoor broadcast antennas.

That doesn't mean that we wouldn't have to spend some time and trouble
fighting to assert our rights, though, even though we are protected by
law here in the US.


As I said - only partially true. And yes, it can cost several thousand
dollars to fight - and you may or may not "win".

The reasoning behind the law is that amateur radio is very useful in
times of disaster or local emergencies and that anything impeding the
use of such is counter to the public's general interests.

Many amateur radio operators here skirt the issue and just erect
"stealth antennas" that either can't be easily seen or aren't ugly
(like a flagpole vertical). In doing so, rather than ask for
permission, they just put it up and wait to see if the homeowner's
association or local code enforcer decides to press the issue. If the
amateur asks for permission, they increase the probability that
everything they do from then on will be scrutinized carefully.

Don




--
==================
Remove the "x" from my email address
Jerry, AI0K

==================

Beating planning permission (Brit) or zonal regulation (Yank)?
 

In article ,
Donald wrote:

In the US, the FCC rules trump any planning commission or homeowners'
association, etc., allowing the licensed operator to erect an antenna
that isn't subject to any restrictions on height, length, etc., as
long as it doesn't extend beyond the land the owner controls, of
course.

Alas, that is not entirely true.

The FCC rules do trump local zoning laws and regulations, to the
extent that the FCC has declared... specifically, that such local
government restrictions must make reasonable accommodation for the
needs of amateur radio operators. Local government bodies can still
have some rules and restrictions, but they can't have a blanket "no
antennas" law or a policy which amounts to one.

Unfortunately, the FCC's override does *NOT* apply to restrictive
property covenants (the sorts of restrictions that homeowners'
associations enforce). The FCC has specifically, and repeatedly
refused to override such covenants, saying that it lacks the authority
to do so. Such HOA rules aren't laws... rather, they are terms
included in the contract under which a house or other property was
purchased. The FCC says that they don't have the legal right to
override such private contractual terms, unless Congress specifically
authorizes them to do so.

Congress *has* enacted such an override of HOA rules, but it applies
only to television and satellite receiving antennas (and, I believe,
to Internet-access antenna systems). It does not apply to amateur
radio antennas.

Hams have lobbied Congress, repeatedly, to try to get Congress to
extend the override to include ham antennas, but every such attempt
has failed... and until one succeeds, the FCC won't act.