Ban wrote:

Watson A.Name - Watt Sun wrote:

Hey, I agree with you. But instead, I would have used higher voltage

lamps, two in parallel. Decent LEDs were hard to get back in the
'70s. Another solution might be to use neon lamps.


You mean flourescent lights. neon lamps need a high voltage transformer. :-(

Neon lamps need a current limiting resistor, something like 47k or so,
but not a transformer. Some of the screw base neons have the resistor
built into the base. Some of the ones I've seen have a standard sized
'edison' lamp base with a glass envelope that's about twice the size of
the base. They last something like tens of thousands of hours. They
would solve the problem of burned out filaments.

you will not want them for emergency lights, as they are often the cause of
the emergency themselves.
BTW also fluorescent lights have many shortcomings, in a cold
environment(Alaska?) they extinguish and won't start at even moderately cold
temperatures. They need some electronics inside the socket and finally last
not longer than special longlife bulbs, that is 6000h, which is not even 1
year. Of course the efficiency is much higher even if you add the loss of
the electronics (which is usually not accounted for).

Here in my building we have flourescent lights in the emergency lights, but
they are always off and only light up at power loss. They have a 12Ah 12V
gel-battery inside and will power the 5W lamp for not even 24h, not enough
if we have a blackout like in NY. But fortunaterly that has never happened
so far.

ciao Ban
Bordighera,Italy

In article , Lizard Blizzard wrote:
Neon lamps need a current limiting resistor, something like 47k or so,
but not a transformer. Some of the screw base neons have the resistor

That's the case with the teenytiny neon night-lights that are commonly
built into clock radios and things. They sell those at Radio Shack.
Bought a two-pack there last year.

The large neon tube signs need a ballast in order to kick start the
tube...similar to fluorecent lights.

--
Sven Weil
New York City, U.S.A.

Sven Franklyn Weil wrote:
In article , Lizard Blizzard wrote:

Neon lamps need a current limiting resistor, something like 47k or so,
but not a transformer. Some of the screw base neons have the resistor


That's the case with the teenytiny neon night-lights that are commonly
built into clock radios and things. They sell those at Radio Shack.
Bought a two-pack there last year.

The large neon tube signs need a ballast in order to kick start the
tube...similar to fluorecent lights.

What is it? full moon? (no, that's a week away). I guess some young'uns
just enjoy arguing what they don't know about... ;-)

Look up the following:

NE-30, NE-34, NE-40 and NE-56.

At three watts on an edison base - the NE-40 is an impressive Neon bulb.
(and yes it runs fine on 120VAC - in fact it'll fire at about 85V)

best regards...
--
randy guttery

A Tender Tale - a page dedicated to those Ships and Crews
so vital to the United States Silent Service:
http://tendertale.com

In article , Randy and/or Sherry wrote:
At three watts on an edison base - the NE-40 is an impressive Neon bulb.
(and yes it runs fine on 120VAC - in fact it'll fire at about 85V)

I keep forgetting about those decorative neon flicker bulbs - the ones
with two closely positioned plates cut out in the shapes of crosses,
stars of David, fish, women, flames, etc.

Those are so delicate that one little tap can send one of those lamps into
convulsions and possibly premature failure.

I had a set of the flames in a menorah and every year there's one or two
that just ... go out...maybe they're all too close together (about inch or
two apart).

Isn't there an issue with capacitance between those bulbs if they're close
together that causes them to go nuts?

--
Sven Weil
New York City, U.S.A.

"Sven Franklyn Weil" wrote in message
...
In article , Randy and/or Sherry wrote:
At three watts on an edison base - the NE-40 is an impressive Neon bulb.
(and yes it runs fine on 120VAC - in fact it'll fire at about 85V)

I keep forgetting about those decorative neon flicker bulbs - the ones
with two closely positioned plates cut out in the shapes of crosses,
stars of David, fish, women, flames, etc.

I've got one of those (somewhere) with R. Crumb's "Keep on Truckin'" guy as
the filament...bought in the 70's, still worked the last time I plugged
(screwed) it in.

jak


Those are so delicate that one little tap can send one of those lamps into
convulsions and possibly premature failure.

I had a set of the flames in a menorah and every year there's one or two
that just ... go out...maybe they're all too close together (about inch or
two apart).

Isn't there an issue with capacitance between those bulbs if they're close
together that causes them to go nuts?

--
Sven Weil
New York City, U.S.A.

"Sven Franklyn Weil" wrote in message
...
In article , Randy and/or Sherry wrote:
At three watts on an edison base - the NE-40 is an impressive Neon bulb.
(and yes it runs fine on 120VAC - in fact it'll fire at about 85V)

I keep forgetting about those decorative neon flicker bulbs - the ones
with two closely positioned plates cut out in the shapes of crosses,
stars of David, fish, women, flames, etc.

I've got one of those (somewhere) with R. Crumb's "Keep on Truckin'" guy as
the filament...bought in the 70's, still worked the last time I plugged
(screwed) it in.

jak


Those are so delicate that one little tap can send one of those lamps into
convulsions and possibly premature failure.

I had a set of the flames in a menorah and every year there's one or two
that just ... go out...maybe they're all too close together (about inch or
two apart).

Isn't there an issue with capacitance between those bulbs if they're close
together that causes them to go nuts?

--
Sven Weil
New York City, U.S.A.

In article , Randy and/or Sherry wrote:
At three watts on an edison base - the NE-40 is an impressive Neon bulb.
(and yes it runs fine on 120VAC - in fact it'll fire at about 85V)

I keep forgetting about those decorative neon flicker bulbs - the ones
with two closely positioned plates cut out in the shapes of crosses,
stars of David, fish, women, flames, etc.

Those are so delicate that one little tap can send one of those lamps into
convulsions and possibly premature failure.

I had a set of the flames in a menorah and every year there's one or two
that just ... go out...maybe they're all too close together (about inch or
two apart).

Isn't there an issue with capacitance between those bulbs if they're close
together that causes them to go nuts?

--
Sven Weil
New York City, U.S.A.

Sven Franklyn Weil wrote:
In article , Lizard Blizzard wrote:

Neon lamps need a current limiting resistor, something like 47k or so,
but not a transformer. Some of the screw base neons have the resistor


That's the case with the teenytiny neon night-lights that are commonly
built into clock radios and things. They sell those at Radio Shack.
Bought a two-pack there last year.

The large neon tube signs need a ballast in order to kick start the
tube...similar to fluorecent lights.

What is it? full moon? (no, that's a week away). I guess some young'uns
just enjoy arguing what they don't know about... ;-)

Look up the following:

NE-30, NE-34, NE-40 and NE-56.

At three watts on an edison base - the NE-40 is an impressive Neon bulb.
(and yes it runs fine on 120VAC - in fact it'll fire at about 85V)

best regards...
--
randy guttery

A Tender Tale - a page dedicated to those Ships and Crews
so vital to the United States Silent Service:
http://tendertale.com

On Wed, 03 Sep 2003 10:15:14 -0700, Lizard Blizzard
wrote:

Ban wrote:

Watson A.Name - Watt Sun wrote:

Hey, I agree with you. But instead, I would have used higher voltage

lamps, two in parallel. Decent LEDs were hard to get back in the
'70s. Another solution might be to use neon lamps.


You mean flourescent lights. neon lamps need a high voltage transformer. :-(

Neon lamps need a current limiting resistor, something like 47k or so,
but not a transformer. Some of the screw base neons have the resistor
built into the base. Some of the ones I've seen have a standard sized
'edison' lamp base with a glass envelope that's about twice the size of
the base. They last something like tens of thousands of hours. They
would solve the problem of burned out filaments.


The only problem is the (described) Neon lamp does not provide a high
enough light output for emergency egress signs. They tend to be a very
weak, flickering orange. Make a good pilot light, but not much more.

In article , clare @
snyder.on .ca mentioned...
On Wed, 03 Sep 2003 10:15:14 -0700, Lizard Blizzard
wrote:

Ban wrote:

Watson A.Name - Watt Sun wrote:

Hey, I agree with you. But instead, I would have used higher voltage

lamps, two in parallel. Decent LEDs were hard to get back in the
'70s. Another solution might be to use neon lamps.


You mean flourescent lights. neon lamps need a high voltage
transformer. :-(

Neon lamps need a current limiting resistor, something like 47k or so,
but not a transformer. Some of the screw base neons have the resistor
built into the base. Some of the ones I've seen have a standard sized
'edison' lamp base with a glass envelope that's about twice the size of
the base. They last something like tens of thousands of hours. They
would solve the problem of burned out filaments.


The only problem is the (described) Neon lamp does not provide a high
enough light output for emergency egress signs. They tend to be a very
weak, flickering orange. Make a good pilot light, but not much more.

No, these are much brighter than a pilot light. Much bigger, too,
Since they're red, they put out the proper color light without
filtering.

But this whole neon lamp for exit sign thread is moot. The new ones
I've seen use LEDs and run off a SLA gel cell battery. Today I was
working in a hallway with an exit sign that was about a foot (.3 m)
off the floor. During the recent remodeling someone had knocked the
cover loose so I took the cover off. I found that the sandwich behind
the cover was unusual. The front layer was a clear diffuser made of
plastic, sort of like the glass they use in bathroom windows, with
bumps on one side. Underneath the glass was a thick tray with grooves
cut (or cast) into it in the shape of the letters EXIT. Each groove
had a pale yellowish rod laying in it, a bit thicker than a pencil
lead. My guess is that this is some kind of phosphorescent material
that glows when light from flames from a fire are hitting it. There
is _no_ power to the sign.

This kind of exit sign seems to be standard on all newer built
buildings. And positioning them close to the floor is standard
procedure, because exit signs above the doors become useless as the
smoke rises and fills the room.

--
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