Airy R. Bean wrote:
No, the question is not pointless. Ham Radio is a technical pursuit.

If it's not technical for you, then you may be an
unwitting CBer-Masquerading-As-A-Radio-Ham

In addition to being a technical pursuit, Ham Radio also provides
some self-delusional people the opportunity to make precious
distinctions between themselves and others in order to provide
those self delusionists with a sense of smug superiority. It's just
another of the psychological benefits of participating in the hobby.
73,
Tom Donaly, KA6RUH

I think that you are confusing my wish to preserve Ham
Radio as a technical pursuit with your own mental processes
which you project so well below.

Perhaps it is that you are an unwitting CBer-Masquerading-
As-A-Radio-Ham who is annoyed at being "outed" and which
annoyance results in you revealing the innermost workings
of your psyche as below?

It is a very exciting and inspiring thing to continue to
educate yourself in all matters of technology - try it and
you'll find that there is more to Ham Radio than your
own CBisation of it!

"Tom Donaly" wrote in message
. com...
Airy R. Bean wrote:
No, the question is not pointless. Ham Radio is a technical pursuit.
If it's not technical for you, then you may be an
unwitting CBer-Masquerading-As-A-Radio-Ham
In addition to being a technical pursuit, Ham Radio also provides
some self-delusional people the opportunity to make precious
distinctions between themselves and others in order to provide
those self delusionists with a sense of smug superiority. It's just
another of the psychological benefits of participating in the hobby.

Airy R. Bean wrote:
I think that you are confusing my wish to preserve Ham
Radio as a technical pursuit with your own mental processes
which you project so well below.

Perhaps it is that you are an unwitting CBer-Masquerading-
As-A-Radio-Ham who is annoyed at being "outed" and which
annoyance results in you revealing the innermost workings
of your psyche as below?

It is a very exciting and inspiring thing to continue to
educate yourself in all matters of technology - try it and
you'll find that there is more to Ham Radio than your
own CBisation of it!

"Tom Donaly" wrote in message
. com...

Airy R. Bean wrote:

No, the question is not pointless. Ham Radio is a technical pursuit.
If it's not technical for you, then you may be an
unwitting CBer-Masquerading-As-A-Radio-Ham

In addition to being a technical pursuit, Ham Radio also provides
some self-delusional people the opportunity to make precious
distinctions between themselves and others in order to provide
those self delusionists with a sense of smug superiority. It's just
another of the psychological benefits of participating in the hobby.




If you're trying to "preserve Ham Radio as a technical pursuit,"
you won't do it by belittling other's contributions to the hobby.
You will however reinforce other's belief that you're just another
grouchy, old, British crackpot who is constantly getting exercised
over what other people consider trivial matters. On the antenna
newsgroup, there's another Briton like yourself who thinks it's of
the utmost importance that hams change the name of their SWR meters
to "transmitter loading indicators." I expect some day to hear of
some Englishman who wants to change the name "spoon" to "pie-hole
insertion device."
73,
Tom Donaly, KA6RUH

I haven't belittled anybody's contribution to anything.

Ham Radio is a technical pursuit.

CB Radio is a hobby.

CBers and CBers-Masquerading-As-Radio-Hams contribute
to the hobby of CB and not to the technical pursuit that is Ham Radio.

Those who are not technically motivated nor technically qualified
are unsuitable as Ham Radio licensees.

"Tom Donaly" wrote in message
om...
Airy R. Bean wrote:
I think that you are confusing my wish to preserve Ham
Radio as a technical pursuit with your own mental processes
which you project so well below.
Perhaps it is that you are an unwitting CBer-Masquerading-
As-A-Radio-Ham who is annoyed at being "outed" and which
annoyance results in you revealing the innermost workings
of your psyche as below?
It is a very exciting and inspiring thing to continue to
educate yourself in all matters of technology - try it and
you'll find that there is more to Ham Radio than your
own CBisation of it!

"Tom Donaly" wrote in message
. com...
If you're trying to "preserve Ham Radio as a technical pursuit,"
you won't do it by belittling other's contributions to the hobby.

quoting:
CBers and CBers-Masquerading-As-Radio-Hams contribute
to the hobby of CB and not to the technical pursuit that is Ham Radio.

Those who are not technically motivated nor technically qualified
are unsuitable as Ham Radio licensees.
unquote:

you may be right - in Germany (per your path)?

But here in the USA, the justification for amateur radio spectrum and
existence is called PICON - public interest, convenience, or necessity.
The goal is communications at the most basic level. Technical pursuits or
qualifications are not a core concern of the licensing body (FCC).

You also have to be careful about such issues as "technically qualified",
since it requires someone to define who is qualified, what they need to be
qualified in, and why ;-)

The USA's licensing body (FCC) has defined a rather basic set of core
technical competencies for the entry level licenses, and most advanced
countries seem to have similar modest technical standards (the old Soviet
system may be an exception etc. where you had to build your own radio
station?).

Now flip thru an RSGB or ARRL handbook, and ask yourself how many of the
various modes and bands and projects have _you_ done? ;-) I am still doing
new stuff (VLF beacons, modulated lasers for field day's 3 modes credit
etc.), which means I am certainly not technically qualified in all the
areas of ham radio yet ;-) Plus they keep inventing new ones all the time.

in short, if you feel you are "technically competent" in (all of) ham
radio, you may not be paying enough attention to all that's going on. ;-)

Finally, when the chips are down and ham radio has to prove its value thru
emergency communications or whatever, there are lots of very technically
competent folks who aren't setup or interested or trained in providing
such communications. So the laurels often go to those who some might
deride as "appliance operators" who are able to provide such
communications. Many of those folks are just as elite and capable in
their own areas of ham radio as those with a more technical bent might be
in ours...

grins bobm

--
************************************************** *********************
* Robert Monaghan POB 752182 Southern Methodist Univ. Dallas Tx 75275 *
********************Standard Disclaimers Apply*************************

On 9 Sep 2004 21:46:11 -0500, (Bob Monaghan)
wrote:

Finally, when the chips are down and ham radio has to prove its value thru
emergency communications or whatever, there are lots of very technically
competent folks who aren't setup or interested or trained in providing
such communications. So the laurels often go to those who some might
deride as "appliance operators" who are able to provide such
communications. Many of those folks are just as elite and capable in
their own areas of ham radio as those with a more technical bent might be
in ours...

I don't see what's so elite about buying a black box off a shelf,
connecting it up and shouting into it, as most of them do, when the
other station is distant - regardless of quality of reception. Sure,
black box operators may save the day in the event of an emergency, but
the degree of study, experimentation and practice they have to undergo
to pull it off is minimal at best and demands zero respect, IMV.
--

"What is now proved was once only imagin'd." - William Blake, 1793.

Ham Radio is what Hams do, and not what the regulatory
powers seek to restrict.

Radio Hams are technical people. Those who buy radios
off-the-shelf, notwithstanding that they may have qualified
as Hams are behaving as CBers and are viewed as such.

"Bob Monaghan" wrote in message
...
quoting:
CBers and CBers-Masquerading-As-Radio-Hams contribute
to the hobby of CB and not to the technical pursuit that is Ham Radio.

Those who are not technically motivated nor technically qualified
are unsuitable as Ham Radio licensees.
unquote:

you may be right - in Germany (per your path)?

But here in the USA, the justification for amateur radio spectrum and
existence is called PICON - public interest, convenience, or necessity.
The goal is communications at the most basic level. Technical pursuits or
qualifications are not a core concern of the licensing body (FCC).

You also have to be careful about such issues as "technically qualified",
since it requires someone to define who is qualified, what they need to be
qualified in, and why ;-)

The USA's licensing body (FCC) has defined a rather basic set of core
technical competencies for the entry level licenses, and most advanced
countries seem to have similar modest technical standards (the old Soviet
system may be an exception etc. where you had to build your own radio
station?).

Now flip thru an RSGB or ARRL handbook, and ask yourself how many of the
various modes and bands and projects have _you_ done? ;-) I am still doing
new stuff (VLF beacons, modulated lasers for field day's 3 modes credit
etc.), which means I am certainly not technically qualified in all the
areas of ham radio yet ;-) Plus they keep inventing new ones all the time.

in short, if you feel you are "technically competent" in (all of) ham
radio, you may not be paying enough attention to all that's going on. ;-)

Finally, when the chips are down and ham radio has to prove its value thru
emergency communications or whatever, there are lots of very technically
competent folks who aren't setup or interested or trained in providing
such communications. So the laurels often go to those who some might
deride as "appliance operators" who are able to provide such
communications. Many of those folks are just as elite and capable in
their own areas of ham radio as those with a more technical bent might be
in ours...

grins bobm

--
************************************************** *********************
* Robert Monaghan POB 752182 Southern Methodist Univ. Dallas Tx 75275 *
********************Standard Disclaimers Apply*************************

"Airy R. Bean" wrote in message
...
Ham Radio is what Hams do, and not what the regulatory
powers seek to restrict.

Radio Hams are technical people. Those who buy radios
off-the-shelf, notwithstanding that they may have qualified
as Hams are behaving as CBers and are viewed as such.


And how technical does one need to be? Enough practical experience to screw
up a PL259 correctly? (Note I said correctly and by screw up do not mean
fettle.)
Enough to know the nature of EM radiation (no heat bands). Enough to
understand DSP?

Do tell Gareth. Do tell.

Your resorting to rather silly and childish broadcasting (CB)
in your infantile outbursts below would seem to confirm that
you are a CBer.

Ham Radio has traditions of international gentlemanly conduct
which seem to be lost on you.

Sic transit gloria Mundi.

This is a "homebrew" NG for _REAL_ Radio Hams. I fear that
you and your rants are somewhat out of place herein.

"Tom Donaly" wrote in message
om...
You will however reinforce other's belief that you're just another
grouchy, old, British crackpot who is constantly getting exercised
over what other people consider trivial matters.

Airy R. Bean wrote:
Your resorting to rather silly and childish broadcasting (CB)
in your infantile outbursts below would seem to confirm that
you are a CBer.

Ham Radio has traditions of international gentlemanly conduct
which seem to be lost on you

Sic transit gloria Mundi.

This is a "homebrew" NG for _REAL_ Radio Hams. I fear that
you and your rants are somewhat out of place herein.

"Tom Donaly" wrote in message
om...

You will however reinforce other's belief that you're just another
grouchy, old, British crackpot who is constantly getting exercised
over what other people consider trivial matters.




Well, I'm glad to hear that you're a real Smithfield, Airy, and can
look down on those of us non-technicians who don't share your narrow
view of Ham Radio. Every hobby needs its share of tin-pot deities to
provide comic relief to its other practitioners. Carry on, m'boy.
73,
Tom Donaly, KA6RUH