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-   -   A Newbies View On Things (https://www.radiobanter.com/policy/27219-newbies-view-things.html)

Len Over 21 January 19th 04 11:24 PM

In article ,
(Stebe Robeson, in his period and needing attention) writes:

(Len Over 21) wrote in message
...
In article , "Scott"
writes:

A heart felt thank you to all that replied.

I guess my opinion that "Amateur Radio Service is not an essential element
in our society" was incorrect. I appreciate all that took the time to show
me where I was wrong. I stand corrected.


Only in THIS venue, Scott.

In THIS venue, all the pro-code newsgroupies require all to think,
act, do, behave, and moralize as they do.


A blatant lie from someone who finds it easy to lie.

I've been trying to get a word in on the SUBJECT of morse code
testing and have been a constant target of character assassination
by these pro-code newsgroupies. No "civil debate" possible in that
cacophony of code.


Another lie. The subject has been "debated", discussed and
dissected until all are nauseous of the topic anymore.


Tsk, tsk, tsk, still the unoriginal non-debate non-technique. Such
is beyond trite and worn-out.

Stebe once more indicates intense hatred and rage against one
person. He needs Anger Management Therapy. Immediately.

Opinions not in line with Stebe's Beliefs in his fantasyland are,
in his mind, "lies." Strange stuff.

Unfortunately, there are no dictionaries published on definitions
of Stebe's unreality.

That Lennie has nothing else to discuss as it pertains to Amateur
Radio should be a clue to those new to this forum that would be swayed
by his "debating style".


Tsk, tsk, tsk, still trying that old ploy, senior gunnery nurse?

A reminder: In THIS reality, this newsgroup is open, unmoderated
and there are no raddio kopps at the doorway to check for
proper credentials of amateurism. Stebe is a mighty amateur in
radio...as well as in human society.

You've taken grand liberty with the term "literary license" and
have grossly abused any sense of social propriety so many times that
your name is synonomous with "liar" and "antagonist".


Tsk, tsk, tsk...there you go again, confusing your unreality with the
rest of the world.

No "literary license" is required in here, amateur or professional.
Acknowledging the existance of true reality (as opposed to your
fantasyland) is a requirement for rational discourse. You do not
exhibit rational discourse, therefore you've lost your "license."

Ergo, Stebe is just (vainly) trying to sugar-coat very ordinary
personal insults of the hatred kind. That doesn't work...except
that Stebe is too wrapped up in his personal fantasyland to
acknowledge that others think differently.

AMATEUR Radio, Lennie...You have exactly zero-point-zero minutes
of experience in AMATEUR Radio. No one, repeat NO one in this forum
denies that the technology and propagation of radio waves is any
different in any other radio service.


Tsk, tsk, tsk...in Stebe's fantasyland, those who want to get into
amateur radio must also "have experience in amateur radio?" That
would make their experience illegal. The FCC would not grant
amateur licenses to those who have done illegal radio operation.

Perhaps's Stebe thinks the amateur radio "service" is like the USMC.
One does not need to know anything as a "recruit." The Dill Sergeant
will explain all to them, spit insults in their faces, give them extra
punishment for misbehavior (such as sassing the Dill Instructor).
All to break them down first, then "rebuild" them into patriotic robots
"for the corps, God, and country."

Amateur radio is a technical hobby, a recreational pursuit (for fun)
that requires licensing due to the nature of transmission of RF
energy. It is not a military service. It is not a government service.

Reminder reprise: This newsgroup is open, unmoderated. No
authoritiy is automatically granted to the enraged, hysterical, or
upset fantasylanders attempting something like squatter's rights.
All they end up doing is squatting.

It's the PRACTICE and the APPLICATION of the technology that
makes the difference.


Of course it does, senior amateur gunnery nurse. Simply making
a number of legal regulations and calling it something else changes
the technology into a glorious wonderland of physics that needs
long, arduous study and much time in grade to comprehend. No.

You are exhibiting an erroneous false Belief System again. The
nature of RF transmission energy requires (by law) regulation. In
the USA this is done (by a law of Congress) through the FCC for
civil radio. The FCC grants amateur radio licenses (not the
"amateur community"). An FCC-granted amateur radio license is
not an academic accreditation, not a diploma, not a certificate of
some excellence in radio. A license is just a regulatory tool.

You are wrapping yourself in imaginary glory by winding that
license around your personna, falsely puffing up patriotism of
a federal license as somehow enobling yourself. You are not
"better than non-licensees" for having an amateur license, you are
simply authorized by the federal government to transmit certain
RF energy at certain frequencies using certain modes and
modulations all given in federal regulations.

You WANT (desperately) to be "better than others" for having that
federal authorization and become enraged when others do not
respect your glorious and noble achievement...forgetting that your
other actions as a human being are deplorable, even despicable.

Anyone venturing into this newsgroup is as open and vulnerable to
opinion attack as any other. There is no Special Dispensation for
the supposed magics of a high license. You cannot negate
opposite opinions by using a lot of false insults, acting the outraged
bigoted bully, all in insulting the person rather than the subject.

Opposite opinions exist. They do not go away. Physical force
and coercion will not stop them. They are not "lies" no matter how
many times you call opposite opinions for "lies." In order to remove
the self-applied-through-response despicability, you must try to
concentrate on the subject, not the person making the opinion
statements.

My opinion is that none of the above will have any effect on Stebe.
He will continue to vent rage and fury on certain individuals because
that is the only tactic available to bullies. But, it needs to be said
once in a while... :-)

LHA / WMD



William January 20th 04 01:08 AM

(Steve Robeson, K4CAP) wrote in message . com...
(Steve Robeson, K4CAP) wrote in message om...

those who praticipate in it.


Ooooops. Made a new word!

Steve


Looks like you've been attending "Anger Management."

Len Over 21 January 20th 04 03:57 AM

In article ,
(William) writes:

(Steve Robeson, K4CAP) wrote in message
.com...
(Steve Robeson, K4CAP) wrote in message
. com...

those who praticipate in it.


Ooooops. Made a new word!

Steve


Looks like you've been attending "Anger Management."


Only one class. After a few minutes the therapist gave up in
disgust.

:-)

LHA / WMD

Steve Robeson, K4CAP January 20th 04 12:02 PM

(Len Over 21) wrote in message ...
In article ,

(Steve Robeson, K4CAP) writes:


Your "exploration" has been as a paid employee, never being
allowed to use the "radio" as AMATEURS use thiers.


That's the way it is done in professional work.


Yet you still seem to ahve a problem understanding the difference
between AMATEUR Radio and all otehr forms of radio...You continue to
think Amateur Radio should be like them, when Part 97 specifically
lays out what it wants Amateur Radio to be.

However, for casual "ragchews," I've used CB...perfectly legal to
do so without any morse knowledge or needing a ham license.


And considering the character and content of most "ragchews" I
ahve heard on 11 meters, I'd say that you were right in your element,
Lennie.

That you never used Morse Code is not germane. Millions of other
radio users never use it either. So what?


Test element 1 is still present in the U.S. amateur radio license
examination regulations. That requires demonstration of morse code
proficiency.


Again...so what? You are still not a licensee in the Amateur
Radio Service, therefore it is absolutely of no consequence to you.

Hang in there, Scott. Pander to the would-be "authority wanna-bes"
if you have to...but GO YOUR OWN WAY. Be your own man, not
a puppet of those who dictate what you can do, what you shall
enjoy, what you must do to please them.

Independent thought is GOOD!


Independent thought IS good, as long as it is LENNIE'S
independent thought.


Incorrect. When I said "independent," I meant it in the complete
sense, not some inappropriate, semantically-incorrect, emotionally-
loaded form by Stebe the wonder marine.


Or in other words, YOUR "independent" thought, ie your OPINIONS
are more valuable since they are contrary to someone elses...uh huh...

Leonard H. Anderson, retired from regular hours engineer, is a
known pathological liar and newsgroup antagonist.


Tsk, tsk, tsk...Stebe froths at the mouth and does the personal-
insult bit again.


It's not an insult if it's true, Lennie.

You've been caught lying over and over.

You are knee deep in a newsgroup for which you have expressed NO
interest in being a proactive participate except to rant in this
forum...THAT makes you an antagonist.

Here in the present reality, there are differing OPINIONS, not "lies."


When you make an assertion that is determined to not be true,
THAT is a lie.

YOU have been caught lying on MORE than one occassion.

Strange to associate "concept of amateur radio" as being all about
morse code testing.


No, Lennie, YOU are the one with the "morse code testing"
fixation.

You are the one who cannot discuss ANY Amateur Radio topic
without interjecting it.

Still sucks to be you, Lennie. You're still a putz.

Steve, K4YZ

Steve Robeson, K4CAP January 20th 04 12:20 PM

(Len Over 21) wrote in message ...
In article ,

(Stebe Robeson, still in the throes of PMS (Powerful Marine Syndrome) writes:


(Lennie exhibits yet again his "accuse OTHERS of "character
assassination, then deny, deny, deny...)

And I do not spit on "professionalism" Lennie.


Of course you do. Everyone has seen it in this free, open,
unmoderated forum.


What YOU represent is not what anyone that I know calls
"professionalism".

You have the tools to make a difference in Amateur Radio, yet
your only action is to antagonize, humiliate and insult in this forum.

Hardly "professional" in ANYone's definition.

You "knew everything about electronics engineering" after working
less than a year as a purchasing agent in a company making
set-top boxes and modems.


You will, of course, provide the reference for the "quote" you
just cited?

You've consistantly tried to equate college night courses with some
kind of alliterative low-grade "night school."


No, Lennie, YOU have demonstrated that it's some kind of
allitaritive low-grade "night school" by your assertion of
"professionalism" and subsequent conduct herein.

You've consistantly said I was a mere "bench technician" rather
than a design engineer...yet you've never tried to check with any of
the past employers I've listed nor contacted any of the U.S. radio
amateurs I've listed as references.


I have yet to find any product in my home or in MY profession
that has your hand in it, Lennie.

And discussions with people who knew you placed your
"contributions" at teh bench technician level...I just picked up on
it.

That assertion is yet ANOTHER lie from somone whio finds it EASY
to lie. I have nothing but the highest regard for professionals in ANY
field...It's just that I have absolutely ZERO respect for YOU since
you've made such a mockery of the title.


"Mockery?" From the expert Dill Instructor with hardly any work
experience in ANY engineering?


This forum is NOT about "engineering", Your Scumminess. It's
about Amateur Radio.

Tsk, tsk, tsk...all you do is vent hatred and bile against another
because that is your nature in here...always insulting the person
who has opinions rather than tackling the subject matter...and,
when there is no possibility of a valid response to the subject, just
more heaping of insults against a person.


The "opinions" you express are as received as equally injurous as
YOU receive against you.

The only problem is that you seem to think you are the only one
with a valid opinion. THAT makes you arrogant.

As for "going on 84", I will gladly jog around the block a few
times with you or see how well you do carrying a full field pack on
the rescue team. NOW who is involved in another "ploy of pervase
character assassination"...?!?!


Tsk, tsk, tsk...Stebe reacting as if He were the only one mentioned.


Well, Lennie...YOU said "48 going on 84"...

To WHOM were you refering?

And I will STILL mount up taht pack and take a jog around the
block with you...You also accused me of being "pudgy", yet evidence to
the contrary ahs been presented.

More of that Andersonian "character assassination" going on, I
see...

Unless Stebe moved (again?), He does not live in Pennsylvania
nor is he a renowned amateur historian.


I need to live in Pennsylvania or be a historian to make a fool
out of you...?!?!

I don't THINK so!

Since YOU seem to be the only one who deems it important to
interject arguments about Morse Code into threads that don't even
adress it, I'd say the fixation is yours, Oh Putzy One.


Absolutely. I interject comments about the beloved smartness of
the morse code test at any opportunity.


And when the thread is NOT about Morse Code, that makes you a
troll.

Contrary to your personal (weird) beliefs, just getting into U.S.
amateur radio on HF allocations requires a morse test. [see subject
title "A Newbies View On Things"]


Sorry, Scummy One...

FEDERAL LAW requires that one know Morse Code to have access to
the Amateur HF allocations. This was based upon international
convention which has since been changed. The United States Government
is presently in the public comment phase of chainging that
requirement.

My only "belief" is that one should comply with the law as it
exists while it exisits.

You seem to think selective law compliance is OK.

Some of us desire to change the amateur regulations and eliminate
the morse code test. Being a "member of the amateur community"
through licensing is not required to change federal laws [see the
U.S. Constitution in regard to who may communicate with their
government].


Then communicate with them. Your presence and practice here is
antagonistic and argumentitive. You long ago lost any initiative on
your "opinions" when you started in on individuals.

All amateur learning STOPS after achieving Extra in Stebe's World.


If that's what you think, Lennie, and that's what you NEED to
believe in order to sleep at night, well, who am I to deny you a good
night's sleep. That it's not true is inconsequential to YOUR needs....

Steve, K4YZ

Steve Robeson, K4CAP January 20th 04 12:34 PM

(Len Over 21) wrote in message ...
In article ,

(Stebe, suffering yet another Powerful Marine Syndrome attack) writes:


It wasn't YOUR station, Lennie...It was a facility of the United
States Army.


Tsk, tsk, tsk...still sore and pished because I had the opportunity
while in my military service yet you did not?


But I did, Lennie. Had fun, too, but it still wasn't MY station
(save for being NCOIC of the facility)...It was the Marine Corps', and
they provided more than adequate instruction on how it was to be set
up and what they expected from it.

Therein lies the difference between you and I...

ADA was...(SNIPPED)


Yadayadayada...same old drivvel.

They could have just as easily made you a diesel
mechanic...Perhaps then you would have been harrassing the
professional truck drivers.


No, the Army could NOT "do that as easily." I was sent to the
Fort Monmouth Signal School for several months of microwave
radio relay training after Basic. Diesel mechanics were trained
in several other school locations.


And the Army COULD have sent you to diesel mechanic school, jst as
easily as the USMC could have sent me to it...It's thier game.

ADA did have several...(SNIPPED)


Yadayadayada...

More ranting on about a 1950's era event that has NO relevence to
MODERN Amateur Radio.

Yes, "senior NCOs taught us" and said "do this." This is normal in
a work environment were supervisors also teach and say "do that."
Somehow you find that deplorable?


Absolutely not.

YOU do, however, since you have, on several occasions, tried to
insinusate that YOU set up a "KW trans-Pacific" radio station on the
Army's behalf.

I learned all that was required (and more) on-the-job and later
became an "NCO" who said "do this (or that)."


Congratuations.

That was all before Stebe was born. It must make him very angry
and furious that anyone actually did those things before his life
experience began.


Nope. Not at all.

What I find FUNNY is that you repeatedly try to insinuate that
YOU were somehow singlehandedly responsible for all of the
accomplishments at ADA.

Shall we revist YOUR assertion of how you passed "1.2 million
messages"...?!?!

I still honor the men and women of my Battalion, knowing the history
from first unit formation to changes through today. I am proud of
what I did, of my fellow signalmen for "getting the messages
through." We did it. It's on record, including two Presidential Unit
Citations. Callsign ADA still exists, now that of U.S. Army Pacific
Headquarters at Fort Shafter, Hawaii.


People do not Honor their comrades-in-arms by trying to make it
appear as though THEY were the sole reason the US Army Signal Corps
was able to pass HF radio traffic in the 1950's.

And people do not Honor thier comrades-in-arms by trying to
garner newsgroup message points by trying to associate THIER Army
"career" with the blood shed by soldiers KIA three years before they
were in-theater.

Lennie...The only person you try to "honor" is yourself, and
you've already proven that THAT is a waste of energy.

Steve, K4YZ

Steve Robeson, K4CAP January 20th 04 12:42 PM

(Len Over 21) wrote in message ...
In article ,

(Stebe Robeson, in his period and needing attention) writes:


Opinions not in line with Stebe's Beliefs in his fantasyland are,
in his mind, "lies." Strange stuff.


Assertions made without validation of proof are lies.

You have been caught lying...over and over.

A reminder: In THIS reality, this newsgroup is open, unmoderated
and there are no raddio kopps at the doorway to check for
proper credentials of amateurism. Stebe is a mighty amateur in
radio...as well as in human society.


You're right about one thing...there is no validation of
credentials...save to cross reference federal databases.

As of this moment, you do not hold a station license in ANY radio
service, nor are you a licensed Amateur Radio operator.

AMATEUR Radio, Lennie...You have exactly zero-point-zero minutes
of experience in AMATEUR Radio. No one, repeat NO one in this forum
denies that the technology and propagation of radio waves is any
different in any other radio service.


Tsk, tsk, tsk...in Stebe's fantasyland, those who want to get into
amateur radio must also "have experience in amateur radio?"


Nice try.

Perhaps's Stebe thinks the amateur radio "service" is like the USMC.


Nope. That's YOUR scthick, Lennie.

You WANT (desperately) to be "better than others" for having that
federal authorization and become enraged when others do not
respect your glorious and noble achievement...forgetting that your
other actions as a human being are deplorable, even despicable.


In this case I AM better than YOU for having done it,
Lennie...That includes over 30+ years of experience in the topic that
we are addressing...AMATEUR Radio.

My opinion is that none of the above will have any effect on Stebe.
He will continue to vent rage and fury on certain individuals because
that is the only tactic available to bullies. But, it needs to be said
once in a while.


There is no "affect" to be had, Lennie.

I am not the one in a newsgroup of which I have no practical
experience...Nor do I pretend that some experience in another related
field somehow means I DO know more than those who ARE involved.

You are the bully here, Lennie.

A lying, antagonistic one. Sucks to be you...again.

Steve, K4YZ

Dwight Stewart January 20th 04 07:19 PM


"William" wrote:

Looks like you've been attending
"Anger Management."



I went to an anger management class once - the class just made me angry.


Dwight Stewart (W5NET)

http://www.qsl.net/w5net/

Daniel J. Morlan January 20th 04 08:17 PM

"Scott" wrote in message ...
Hi folks.

Please allow me to give a "newbies" view on the current state of amateur
radio, and also ask a few questions.

I recently took my Technicians License exam and passed with a perfect score.
(I bring up the score just to indicate that I studied hard, and took the
exam seriously). I am now studying to take the 5wpm mores code test. I have
not yet purchased a radio, or even been "on the air". More on this is a
moment.

I have also joined a local radio club, whose first meeting I attended last
night. This club owns and maintains the local 2m repeater, and even though
it is an open repeater, if nothing else, I feel as though by joining, I am
helping to support a service which I plan on eventually using.

But what disappoints me is the fact that I left this meeting knowing
absolutely no more than I did when I walked into the door. I had been led to
believe that one of the best ways for a new guy just becoming involved in
this hobby to get practical advice on things like your first purchase of
equipment, which bands are best for what, and the different applications of
amateur radio, was to join a club. Well, unfortunately, the majority of the
meeting I attended was, in my opinion, controlled by a group of 7 or 8 ham
"veterans" trying to impress one another with their technical knowledge.

So, I guess what I would like to do here is give my views on what I have
seen so far, and invite anyone who is more informed on these matters to
correct me.

1) The Amateur Radio Service is not an essential element in our society.
Even in times of emergency, there is nothing you can do with a ham radio
that you can't do with an internet connection, fax machine, land line
telephone, or cell phone in similar circumstances. Ham Radio is a hobby, and
like golf, gardening, bird watching, or any other hobby, it could cease to
exist tomorrow, and nothing would really change.

2) To me, the most appealing aspect to Ham Radio is the gaining of
knowledge. Learning the "in's and out's" of all that encompasses Ham Radio o
peration is the true fun, whether it is dx'ing, satellite, CW or whatever.
But, like building a boat in a bottle, or even doing a crossword puzzle, the
satisfaction comes in the steps taken to accomplish the task, not the end
result itself.

3) From all accounts that I have heard, the number of new Amateur licenses
issued has been declining for years. This would tell me that the best way to
save the hobby was to open new Hams with open arms, instead of clinging
white-knuckled to the past (packet radio, morse code etc.) look to the
future, and make it fun.

Thanks for letting me rant folks. Now for some questions.

1) Can anyone point me towards any resources to assist someone brand new to
the hobby? (Stuff like recommendations on the type of equipment to get for
the first time buyer)?

2) Also, any sources to purchase used equipment. I think I would rather buy
more functional used stuff, than new equipment that has less "bells and
whistles".

3) One more thing...I am looking for information on antennas that is geared
to the novice.

Thanks folks.



I am newer than you, but I do have a rig set up, and ready to go when
my callsign is granted. What I've learned so far:


1.) Make sure you have what you'll need. If you don't operate from a
car, and you want a mobile rig, make sure you've bought your 13.8V DC
Power supply. I used up every penny getting this bugger ready to go,
and I found I needed the following:

2M Mobile Radio (I got an Icom v8000)
Diamond X-50 2M Antenna
50' 52-Guage Coax
A pair of "banana plugs"
A pair of 50 ohm Coax plugs
A soldering Iron
Solder
A mono-stereo 8 Ohm converter (for earphones) I am very hearing
impaired. I have only 20% hearing in my left ear, 25% in my right
Both ears is good. (As far as listening goes)
Coax crimper
Wire cutter/stripper


Make sure you'll know EVERYTHING you'll need. I spent $150.00 more
than I thought I'd have to getting started. Total price tag for me
was $400.00. YMMV.

2.) You'll pretty much have to get on the air and ask, but ask
PREPARED TO UNDERSTAND! KNOW what it is you want to know, and go from
there. Nothing irritates ANYONE more than someone randomly asking
unrelated questions, and not grasping what's being told to them. If
you're transmitting with hum or static, they'll let you know. I don't
speak from personal experience, but by listening to the 2M repeater.

3.) Have fun, be polite, and follow the rules of transmission and
you'll learn sooner rather than later whether or not you want to move
forward in this hobby.

My ultra-newbie two cents worth.

With all respects,

73

DJM

KØHB January 20th 04 09:45 PM


"Daniel J. Morlan" wrote


I am newer than you, but I do have a rig set up, and ready to go when
my callsign is granted. What I've learned so far:


I absolutely LOVE it!!!! Dan is still waiting on his callsign, but he's
already being an Elmer!

Welcome aboard Dan. You are a breath of fresh air around here.

73, de Hans, K0HB








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