Citizens make inappropriate comments?
 

The FCC has given all citizens a great tool, in the form of the ECFS,
for commenting on matters under its purview, including matters related
to the Amateur Radio Service.

I thank the Commission for providing that forum for commentary by all
citizens.

Unfortunately, at least one citizen seems to have set himself up as the
judge of what is appropriate and inappropriate for other citizens to say
to the Commission.

This citizen has singled out to the FCC the comments of several other
citizens as innapropriate and/or misdirected,

Here is a small sample of his attempts to choose for the FCC which
citizen comments are not appropriate.

"I consider Mr. Sanford's Comment inappropriate as well as misdirected"

"I consider Mr.Brakob's Comment inappropriate as well as misdirected."

"Mr. Desany's Comments were found inappropriate..."

"Mr. Oring's Comments are once again found inappropriate..."

Sorry, Mr. Citizen, but the FCC doesn't need you to determine which
comments are appropriate. ALL CITIZENS may comment.

Sunuvagun, where have I heard that before?

With all kind wishes,

de Hans, K0HB

Hans,

They used to do something like that some decades ago. Free elections. You
elect whomever you want. Of course, there was only one person to vote for.
They also decided what was appropriate to say.

The U.S.S.R. fell apart a few decades ago, but that was one place that tried
that - and failed. ;)


73 from Rochester, NY
Jim AA2QA


"KØHB" wrote in message
ink.net...
The FCC has given all citizens a great tool, in the form of the ECFS,
for commenting on matters under its purview, including matters related
to the Amateur Radio Service.

I thank the Commission for providing that forum for commentary by all
citizens.

Unfortunately, at least one citizen seems to have set himself up as the
judge of what is appropriate and inappropriate for other citizens to say
to the Commission.

This citizen has singled out to the FCC the comments of several other
citizens as innapropriate and/or misdirected,

Here is a small sample of his attempts to choose for the FCC which
citizen comments are not appropriate.

"I consider Mr. Sanford's Comment inappropriate as well as misdirected"

"I consider Mr.Brakob's Comment inappropriate as well as misdirected."

"Mr. Desany's Comments were found inappropriate..."

"Mr. Oring's Comments are once again found inappropriate..."

Sorry, Mr. Citizen, but the FCC doesn't need you to determine which
comments are appropriate. ALL CITIZENS may comment.

Sunuvagun, where have I heard that before?

With all kind wishes,

de Hans, K0HB



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"KØHB" wrote in message link.net...
The FCC has given all citizens a great tool, in the form of the ECFS,
for commenting on matters under its purview, including matters related
to the Amateur Radio Service.

I thank the Commission for providing that forum for commentary by all
citizens.

Unfortunately, at least one citizen seems to have set himself up as the
judge of what is appropriate and inappropriate for other citizens to say
to the Commission.

Who is this individual? Does he have a name? An amateur radio
callsign?

This citizen has singled out to the FCC the comments of several other
citizens as innapropriate and/or misdirected,

Here is a small sample of his attempts to choose for the FCC which
citizen comments are not appropriate.

"I consider Mr. Sanford's Comment inappropriate as well as misdirected"

"I consider Mr.Brakob's Comment inappropriate as well as misdirected."

That's just his opinion.

"Mr. Desany's Comments were found inappropriate..."

"Mr. Oring's Comments are once again found inappropriate..."

Found by whom?

Sorry, Mr. Citizen, but the FCC doesn't need you to determine which
comments are appropriate. ALL CITIZENS may comment.

Of course. In fact, noncitizens may comment, I think. Not only that,
but organizations and business concerns may comment as well as
individuals.

The problem is that any system which is as free and open as ECFS is
bound to attract at least a few folks who are not serious about the
subjects being discussed. And it will also attract all sorts of folks
who have an "agenda" that isn't immediately apparent.

Hopefully those at FCC who read the comments will recognize the nature
and spirit of such remarks.

Sunuvagun, where have I heard that before?



But who is it that you refer to, Hans?

73 de Jim, N2EY

"N2EY" wrote in message
om...
"KØHB" wrote in message
link.net...
The FCC has given all citizens a great tool, in the form of the ECFS,
for commenting on matters under its purview, including matters related
to the Amateur Radio Service.

I thank the Commission for providing that forum for commentary by all
citizens.

Unfortunately, at least one citizen seems to have set himself up as the
judge of what is appropriate and inappropriate for other citizens to say
to the Commission.

Who is this individual? Does he have a name? An amateur radio
callsign?

This citizen has singled out to the FCC the comments of several other
citizens as innapropriate and/or misdirected,

Here is a small sample of his attempts to choose for the FCC which
citizen comments are not appropriate.

"I consider Mr. Sanford's Comment inappropriate as well as misdirected"

"I consider Mr.Brakob's Comment inappropriate as well as misdirected."

That's just his opinion.

"Mr. Desany's Comments were found inappropriate..."

"Mr. Oring's Comments are once again found inappropriate..."

Found by whom?

Sorry, Mr. Citizen, but the FCC doesn't need you to determine which
comments are appropriate. ALL CITIZENS may comment.

Of course. In fact, noncitizens may comment, I think. Not only that,
but organizations and business concerns may comment as well as
individuals.

The problem is that any system which is as free and open as ECFS is
bound to attract at least a few folks who are not serious about the
subjects being discussed. And it will also attract all sorts of folks
who have an "agenda" that isn't immediately apparent.

Hopefully those at FCC who read the comments will recognize the nature
and spirit of such remarks.

Sunuvagun, where have I heard that before?



But who is it that you refer to, Hans?

73 de Jim, N2EY

I noticed the same practice on some of the other petitiions. The FCC marks
them as duplicates, not sure if they're given equal (or any) consideration.

73 de Bert
WA2SI

"N2EY" wrote


Who is this individual? Does he have a name? An amateur radio
callsign?


The name of the citizen is not important (and I didn't say it was a
"he"). No amateur radio callsign was evident in any of the persons
comments (dozens of different submissions on several recent RM's)
although the person did claim learning Morse code to the speed of 8WPM.

"I consider Mr. Sanford's Comment inappropriate as well as
misdirected"

"I consider Mr.Brakob's Comment inappropriate as well as misdirected."

"Mr. Desany's Comments were found inappropriate..."

"Mr. Oring's Comments are once again found inappropriate..."

I just thought it presumptous for that to tell the FCC that other
citizens comments were innapropriate.

73, de Hans, K0HB

"KØHB" wrote in message
ink.net...

"N2EY" wrote


Who is this individual? Does he have a name? An amateur radio
callsign?


The name of the citizen is not important (and I didn't say it was a
"he"). No amateur radio callsign was evident in any of the persons
comments (dozens of different submissions on several recent RM's)
although the person did claim learning Morse code to the speed of 8WPM.

"I consider Mr. Sanford's Comment inappropriate as well as
misdirected"

"I consider Mr.Brakob's Comment inappropriate as well as misdirected."

"Mr. Desany's Comments were found inappropriate..."

"Mr. Oring's Comments are once again found inappropriate..."

I just thought it presumptous for that to tell the FCC that other
citizens comments were innapropriate.

73, de Hans, K0HB

isn't it just as bad that you come in here and throw dirt at an unnamed
citizen for the wording of their comments? and not even knowing if they
read here to defend themselves?? or do you know that they read this forum?

"Dave" wrote

isn't it just as bad that you come in here and throw dirt at
an unnamed citizen for the wording of their comments?

I specifically avoided naming the individual so as not to disparge
anyones good name in a public forum.

And unlike you, I have the balls to identify myself, not take anonymous
potshots from behind noone@nowhere.

(Or perhaps you really ARE noone worth paying attention to.) PLONK

With all kind wishes,

de Hans, K0HB

"KØHB" wrote in message link.net...
"N2EY" wrote


Who is this individual? Does he have a name? An amateur radio
callsign?


The name of the citizen is not important (and I didn't say it was a
"he").

I think you indicated that the citizen is a male, Hans. From your post
that originated this thread:

"at least one citizen seems to have set himself up as the
judge"

and

"sample of his attempts to choose"

That's why I thought the citizen was a he.

No amateur radio callsign was evident in any of the persons
comments (dozens of different submissions on several recent RM's)
although the person did claim learning Morse code to the speed of 8WPM.

It should be a simple matter to correlate the citizen's name with the
FCC callsign database. Have you done so?

"I consider Mr. Sanford's Comment inappropriate as well as
misdirected"

"I consider Mr.Brakob's Comment inappropriate as well as misdirected."

"Mr. Desany's Comments were found inappropriate..."

"Mr. Oring's Comments are once again found inappropriate..."

I wonder if my comments were commented on. I wonder if I was referred
to as "Mr."....

I just thought it presumptous for that to tell the FCC that other
citizens comments were innapropriate.

Of course - but that won't stop some people.

In fact, a large volume of such commentary says more about the
commenter than about those commented on.

In any event, I say let the comments speak for themselves.

73 de Jim, N2EY

It is the little green man in his head.

N2EY wrote:
"KØHB" wrote in message link.net...

The FCC has given all citizens a great tool, in the form of the ECFS,
for commenting on matters under its purview, including matters related
to the Amateur Radio Service.

I thank the Commission for providing that forum for commentary by all
citizens.

Unfortunately, at least one citizen seems to have set himself up as the
judge of what is appropriate and inappropriate for other citizens to say
to the Commission.


Who is this individual? Does he have a name? An amateur radio
callsign?

This citizen has singled out to the FCC the comments of several other
citizens as innapropriate and/or misdirected,

Here is a small sample of his attempts to choose for the FCC which
citizen comments are not appropriate.

"I consider Mr. Sanford's Comment inappropriate as well as misdirected"

"I consider Mr.Brakob's Comment inappropriate as well as misdirected."


That's just his opinion.

"Mr. Desany's Comments were found inappropriate..."

"Mr. Oring's Comments are once again found inappropriate..."


Found by whom?

Sorry, Mr. Citizen, but the FCC doesn't need you to determine which
comments are appropriate. ALL CITIZENS may comment.


Of course. In fact, noncitizens may comment, I think. Not only that,
but organizations and business concerns may comment as well as
individuals.

The problem is that any system which is as free and open as ECFS is
bound to attract at least a few folks who are not serious about the
subjects being discussed. And it will also attract all sorts of folks
who have an "agenda" that isn't immediately apparent.

Hopefully those at FCC who read the comments will recognize the nature
and spirit of such remarks.

Sunuvagun, where have I heard that before?




But who is it that you refer to, Hans?

73 de Jim, N2EY

Their name is paranoia.

Dave wrote:

"KØHB" wrote in message
ink.net...

"N2EY" wrote


Who is this individual? Does he have a name? An amateur radio
callsign?


The name of the citizen is not important (and I didn't say it was a
"he"). No amateur radio callsign was evident in any of the persons
comments (dozens of different submissions on several recent RM's)
although the person did claim learning Morse code to the speed of 8WPM.


"I consider Mr. Sanford's Comment inappropriate as well as

misdirected"

"I consider Mr.Brakob's Comment inappropriate as well as misdirected."

"Mr. Desany's Comments were found inappropriate..."

"Mr. Oring's Comments are once again found inappropriate..."

I just thought it presumptous for that to tell the FCC that other
citizens comments were innapropriate.

73, de Hans, K0HB


isn't it just as bad that you come in here and throw dirt at an unnamed
citizen for the wording of their comments? and not even knowing if they
read here to defend themselves?? or do you know that they read this forum?

"N2EY" wrote


I wonder if my comments were commented on. I wonder if I was referred
to as "Mr."....

Yes, your comments were commented on.

You were simply called "Miccolis", without the appellation (or is that
Appalachian?) "Mr."

The citizen commented that "There is a decided ignorance of the tasks of
other radio service operators displayed by Miccolis." and "Miccolis'
remarks must be taken as due to his ignorance of the radio world outside
amateurism."

And your FCC submittal "has a number of errors and disconnections which
require correction." Please see to that at your earliest convenience.

Further, your comments were "a decided insult to the broadcasting
industry, civil aviation, maritime world, and all of those services
which enable constant communications by means of radio." Would you
please make it a point to apologize to those good folks as soon as
practicable?

73, de Hans, K0HB

KØHB wrote:

This citizen has singled out to the FCC the comments of several other
citizens as innapropriate and/or misdirected,



Hey Hans.

I went through and read the comments from the good poster, and I am
amazed that the perp would treat the public comments as he would the
newsgroup - that is to attack those he disagrees with.

In the comments even more than in the newsgroup, it is imperitive that
the attacking comments be given the respect they deserve, and utterly no
reply from those attacked.

To do otherwise is to invite the inclusion of your comments with his,
and having what may be a reasoned assessment look like one of the
strange little brawls that is the embarrassment of the ARS.


The public comment forums are just that. He is welcome to make all the
personal attacks he sees fit, and the F.C.C. will just eventually
consider the source.

- Mike KB3EIA -

N2EY wrote:

"KØHB" wrote in message link.net...

"N2EY" wrote


Who is this individual? Does he have a name? An amateur radio
callsign?


The name of the citizen is not important (and I didn't say it was a
"he").


I think you indicated that the citizen is a male, Hans. From your post
that originated this thread:

"at least one citizen seems to have set himself up as the
judge"

and

"sample of his attempts to choose"

That's why I thought the citizen was a he.

It only takes about 3-4 minutes to find out who the citizen *is*!

Snip

In any event, I say let the comments speak for themselves.

Which they do indeed.

- Mike KB3EIA -

"KØHB" wrote:

"N2EY" wrote

I wonder if my comments were commented on. I wonder if I was referred
to as "Mr."....

Yes, your comments were commented on.

You were simply called "Miccolis", without the appellation (or is that
Appalachian?) "Mr."

The citizen commented that "There is a decided ignorance of the tasks of
other radio service operators displayed by Miccolis." and "Miccolis'
remarks must be taken as due to his ignorance of the radio world outside
amateurism."

And your FCC submittal "has a number of errors and disconnections which
require correction." Please see to that at your earliest convenience.

Further, your comments were "a decided insult to the broadcasting
industry, civil aviation, maritime world, and all of those services
which enable constant communications by means of radio." Would you
please make it a point to apologize to those good folks as soon as
practicable?

73, de Hans, K0HB

I didn't need to go play along this far to find the answer. I went to
the comments page, typed in one name in the search field and had the
answer in four or five minutes. The comments were what I expected.

Dave K8MN

On Mon, 03 May 2004 13:21:52 GMT, KØHB wrote:

I just thought it presumptous for that to tell the FCC that other
citizens comments were innapropriate.

"Other citizens comments were innapropriate and unfounded and etc.
etc." is a typical attack by litigators who don't have any ammunition
in their gun or any skill in gently demolishing the opposition. I've
been the "honoree" of such attacks in several proceedings, but I
refuse to reply in kind. I know better.

--
73 de K2ASP - Phil Kane

Dave Heil wrote in message ...
"KØHB" wrote:

"N2EY" wrote

I wonder if my comments were commented on. I wonder if I was referred
to as "Mr."....

Yes, your comments were commented on.

That's hardly surprising.

You were simply called "Miccolis", without the appellation (or is that
Appalachian?) "Mr."

Indeed.

The citizen commented that "There is a decided ignorance of the tasks of
other radio service operators displayed by Miccolis." and "Miccolis'
remarks must be taken as due to his ignorance of the radio world outside
amateurism."

And your FCC submittal "has a number of errors and disconnections which
require correction." Please see to that at your earliest convenience.

How can I, if the "errors and disconnections" are not explained?

Further, your comments were "a decided insult to the broadcasting
industry, civil aviation, maritime world, and all of those services
which enable constant communications by means of radio." Would you
please make it a point to apologize to those good folks as soon as
practicable?

Dear me, I managed to do all that in a few paragraphs of comments? All
I did was say that I'm against some parts of the various proposals and
in favor of other parts.

73, de Hans, K0HB

I didn't need to go play along this far to find the answer. I went to
the comments page, typed in one name in the search field and had the
answer in four or five minutes. The comments were what I expected.

Well, it was never my intention to insult anyone or any industry with
my comments on the requirements for an amateur radio license.

So let me ask those who have read my comments to the FCC on the
various restructuring proposals (most recently RM-10867, -10868 and
10870):

Are *you* insulted by anything in my comments? I'm not asking that you
agree with them, just if you find yourself insulted by my comments to
FCC.



73 de Jim, N2EY

N2EY wrote:

Dave Heil wrote in message ...
"KØHB" wrote:

"N2EY" wrote

I wonder if my comments were commented on. I wonder if I was referred
to as "Mr."....

Yes, your comments were commented on.

That's hardly surprising.

You were simply called "Miccolis", without the appellation (or is that
Appalachian?) "Mr."

Indeed.

The citizen commented that "There is a decided ignorance of the tasks of
other radio service operators displayed by Miccolis." and "Miccolis'
remarks must be taken as due to his ignorance of the radio world outside
amateurism."

And your FCC submittal "has a number of errors and disconnections which
require correction." Please see to that at your earliest convenience.

How can I, if the "errors and disconnections" are not explained?

Further, your comments were "a decided insult to the broadcasting
industry, civil aviation, maritime world, and all of those services
which enable constant communications by means of radio." Would you
please make it a point to apologize to those good folks as soon as
practicable?

Dear me, I managed to do all that in a few paragraphs of comments? All
I did was say that I'm against some parts of the various proposals and
in favor of other parts.

73, de Hans, K0HB

I didn't need to go play along this far to find the answer. I went to
the comments page, typed in one name in the search field and had the
answer in four or five minutes. The comments were what I expected.

Well, it was never my intention to insult anyone or any industry with
my comments on the requirements for an amateur radio license.

So let me ask those who have read my comments to the FCC on the
various restructuring proposals (most recently RM-10867, -10868 and
10870):

Are *you* insulted by anything in my comments? I'm not asking that you
agree with them, just if you find yourself insulted by my comments to
FCC.

I wasn't insulted by anything in your comments but I'm a radio amateur.
If I was a total outsider, the type who might be miffed because mere
radio amateurs didn't show me the deference I thought I was owed, given
my PROFESSIONAL standing, I might have taken umbrage to your comments.

Dave K8MN

Dave Heil wrote in message ...

I wasn't insulted by anything in your comments but I'm a radio amateur.
If I was a total outsider, the type who might be miffed because mere
radio amateurs didn't show me the deference I thought I was owed, given
my PROFESSIONAL standing, I might have taken umbrage to your comments.

Aren't/weren't you also a "professional in radio", Dave?

73 de Jim, N2EY

N2EY wrote:

Dave Heil wrote in message ...

I wasn't insulted by anything in your comments but I'm a radio amateur.
If I was a total outsider, the type who might be miffed because mere
radio amateurs didn't show me the deference I thought I was owed, given
my PROFESSIONAL standing, I might have taken umbrage to your comments.

Aren't/weren't you also a "professional in radio", Dave?

I certainly was but I left all the *PROFESSIONAL* baggage behind several
years ago. Now I'm simply a radio amateur. I do feel quite qualified
to comment on matters relating to amateur radio regulation. Like you,
I'm an active participant in amateur radio.

Dave K8MN

N2EY wrote:
Dave Heil wrote in message ...

"KØHB" wrote:

"N2EY" wrote


I wonder if my comments were commented on. I wonder if I was referred
to as "Mr."....

Yes, your comments were commented on.


That's hardly surprising.

You were simply called "Miccolis", without the appellation (or is that
Appalachian?) "Mr."


Indeed.

The citizen commented that "There is a decided ignorance of the tasks of
other radio service operators displayed by Miccolis." and "Miccolis'
remarks must be taken as due to his ignorance of the radio world outside
amateurism."

And your FCC submittal "has a number of errors and disconnections which
require correction." Please see to that at your earliest convenience.


How can I, if the "errors and disconnections" are not explained?

Further, your comments were "a decided insult to the broadcasting
industry, civil aviation, maritime world, and all of those services
which enable constant communications by means of radio." Would you
please make it a point to apologize to those good folks as soon as
practicable?


Dear me, I managed to do all that in a few paragraphs of comments? All
I did was say that I'm against some parts of the various proposals and
in favor of other parts.

73, de Hans, K0HB

I didn't need to go play along this far to find the answer. I went to
the comments page, typed in one name in the search field and had the
answer in four or five minutes. The comments were what I expected.


Well, it was never my intention to insult anyone or any industry with
my comments on the requirements for an amateur radio license.

So let me ask those who have read my comments to the FCC on the
various restructuring proposals (most recently RM-10867, -10868 and
10870):

Are *you* insulted by anything in my comments? I'm not asking that you
agree with them, just if you find yourself insulted by my comments to
FCC.

For cryin' out loud, Jim!
The short answer is no.

The liddle bit longer answer is - to my knowledge, you have never
stooped to insulting anyone here.

The longer answer is that we are talking about a person that calls you
"The Reverend Jim", calls me a hockey puck, calls Dave various
disparaging names dealing with German heritage, suggests that people
that disagree with him get mental counseling or that they appear to have
a drinking problem - and those are the ones I can think of offhand.

My point is that he knows full well what insulting is, and insulting is
what you isn't.

Shame on ya for even asking the question, and giving the accusation
even a bit of credence! 8^)

- Mike KB3EIA -

Mike Coslo wrote in message ...
N2EY wrote:
Dave Heil wrote in message ...

"KØHB" wrote:

"N2EY" wrote

I wonder if my comments were commented on. I wonder if I was referred
to as "Mr."....

Yes, your comments were commented on.

That's hardly surprising.

You were simply called "Miccolis", without the appellation (or is that
Appalachian?) "Mr."

Indeed.

The citizen commented that "There is a decided ignorance of the tasks of
other radio service operators displayed by Miccolis." and "Miccolis'
remarks must be taken as due to his ignorance of the radio world outside
amateurism."

And your FCC submittal "has a number of errors and disconnections which
require correction." Please see to that at your earliest convenience.

How can I, if the "errors and disconnections" are not explained?

Further, your comments were "a decided insult to the broadcasting
industry, civil aviation, maritime world, and all of those services
which enable constant communications by means of radio." Would you
please make it a point to apologize to those good folks as soon as
practicable?

Dear me, I managed to do all that in a few paragraphs of comments? All
I did was say that I'm against some parts of the various proposals and
in favor of other parts.

73, de Hans, K0HB

I didn't need to go play along this far to find the answer. I went to
the comments page, typed in one name in the search field and had the
answer in four or five minutes. The comments were what I expected.

Well, it was never my intention to insult anyone or any industry with
my comments on the requirements for an amateur radio license.

So let me ask those who have read my comments to the FCC on the
various restructuring proposals (most recently RM-10867, -10868 and
10870):

Are *you* insulted by anything in my comments? I'm not asking that you
agree with them, just if you find yourself insulted by my comments to
FCC.

For cryin' out loud, Jim!
The short answer is no.

That's reassuring, Mike.

The liddle bit longer answer is - to my knowledge, you have never
stooped to insulting anyone here.

Thank you.

The longer answer is that we are talking about a person that calls you
"The Reverend Jim", calls me a hockey puck, calls Dave various
disparaging names dealing with German heritage, suggests that people
that disagree with him get mental counseling or that they appear to have
a drinking problem - and those are the ones I can think of offhand.

I've lost track of how many different unflattering nicknames and
descriptions have been applied to me here. I think that sort of
behavior says a lot about the person writing the stuff.

My point is that he knows full well what insulting is, and insulting is
what you isn't.

I know what *my* idea of insulting is. I'm just checking what others
think, including those who disagree with me on license issues (such as
Hans, K0HB). Did you read my comments?

Shame on ya for even asking the question, and giving the accusation
even a bit of credence! 8^)

I hope I did not insult you by my question...

I don't know whether such reply comments make any difference to FCC. I
do know that I will take K2ASP's excellent advice and example and not
reply in kind.

73 de Jim, N2EY

N2EY wrote:


I hope I did not insult you by my question...

Oh, I'm just mortified! ;^)


- Mike KB3EIA -