Because, in the United States


Is Kim going to tell ---me--- about America???

Please allow me to assume the position.

"Thank you sir, may I have another?!"

In article .com, "K4YZ"
writes:

Lenof21 wrote:
In article .com,
"bb"
writes:

Mike said: """Everyone is entitled to an opinion, Brian."""

Reeaally???

"""We wouldn't have anywhere near as much fun if we could only give
opinions on what we have personal experience in! 8^)"""

Then lotsa people on RRAP owe Len Anderson an apology.

Amateur morsemen are far superior to professionals in radio.
They have nice Titles and federal call signs and all kinds of
good stuff washed into their brains like a henna rinse. They
apologize to NO one.

"Amateur morsemen" are far superior to professionals in AMATEUR
radio.

This forum is about AMATEUR radio...Not "professional", military,
Public Service, PLMRS, etc etc etc.

Really? :-)

Then cite your "credentials" as a political pundit.

Cite your "credentials" as a national economist.

Cite your "credentials" as a "space business worker."

Don't have any of the above, do you? Yet you've discussed all
those things in HERE, in this forum...which you blabber that it
is "all about amateur radio." :-)

Tsk. Starting off the new year with the usual hypocrisy.

Oh, I understand...as a "healthcare professional" you took an
oath of Hipocrisy! :-)


I am sure he can cut-and-paste as well as you do, Lennie, however
I bet Jim's far more competent and knowledgeable in "space business"
than you without the URL's to click on.

Tsk. Rocketdyne, formerly a Division of Rockwell International
(now purchased by Boeing), and EOS (Electro-Optical Systems),
a Division of Xerox were both engaged in the space business and
both presented me with salary checks for many years...all for
doing things IN the space business. The IRS and California
Franchise Tax Board verified that the forms they received
(separately, forwarded by employers) did indeed indicate I was
IN the space business...as did the FBI, DCASS, and some other
alphabet soup agencies.

No "cut and paste" in any of that, sonny. I've laid hands on an
SSME on a test stand and been through a Shuttle being
assembled...held many an unmanned spacecraft electronics
package being assembled and tested in a clean room...not to
mention meeting the first shuttle astronauts John Young and
Bob Crippen.

So, what does "Jim" do? He won't say anything more than he
"works in vehicular transportation" according to an ECFS
comment on the FCC website.

So, what does the Avenging Angle do? NOTHING in the "space
business," never has. At best he exaggerates his "engineering"
job as a Purchasing Agent for a set-top box maker! Lasted less
than a half year. Tsk.

He knew all about USSR military aircraft too, even though he
didn't shoot any Bears for naval intelligence (another non-
serviceman did that).

He sure does...And funny you should mention that since it was YOU
that brought up being threatened by Mr Tupolev's turboprop wonder
despite the fact it wasn't in servce until YOU were out of theater!

Tsk. My military service obligation ended in 1960...with receipt
of my Honorable Discharge. But, having actually worked IN the
aerospace industry for a long time before that year and for years
afterwards, it might be easy to slip up on who flies what where
when making casual mentions of things among these aerospace
gurus of self-defined "experience."

He has a BSEE and an MSEE, double-degreed, supposedly in
an electronics industry but won't say which one, but he can do
morse code at high rate...which makes him far superior as a
2004 radio person.

When matched against an UNlicensed ex-radio technician
wannabe...Sure!

Tsk. There you go talking trash again. You can't stop, can you?

You are one sick little puppy, always always mean-mouthing the
person (and relations) of anyone disagreeing with you.

Whoopee. If an NCTA mentions degrees, yet another "superior"
calls night college classes something derogatory, implying they
are for some kind of civics for citizenship candidates or are
classes for remedial English. If I mention that my wife has TWO
Masters Degrees, that "superior" person calls the University of
Illinois at Urbana a "correspondence school."

She obviously doesn't have the requisite skills to get you into
therapy or counselling, ergo I doubt she has the credentials you cite.

Poor baby...mentally deranged and still crawling the newsgroup,
are you? It's a given that the insane are the last ones to admit
they are nuts.

Tsk. The Avenging Angle has claimed all he has to do is pick up
a telephone and "have authorities commit another" just because
you have an LPN whatsis. So far you haven't done that, not with
me, not with Brian Burke. Because you DON'T have any such
authoritiy as a nurse. You CANNOT do it, yet you keep on saying
so. That's nuts.

And my wife gets
a personal insult because she is married to me, all courtesy of
that medically-discharged veteran of "seven hostile actions."
Late in the year this "healthcare professional" told me to go have
a stroke.

No..I said PLEASE go have a stroke.

Oh, my, that makes it "all right," does it? :-)

PLEASE cite the where and when of your "seven hostile actions,"
mighty warrior (of fantasyland).

PLEASE cite the government regulation that establishes "MARS
IS amateur radio!"

You can't do any of those things, can you?

That's because they are NOT related to this newsgroup general
subject matter. You think that the whole of this newsgroup is to
give you some open forum to insult and demean anyone who
doesn't agree with your fantastic opinions. You are the sicko.


Lessee...Dave Heil spent a life career in the State Department and
YOU didn't...Dave was actually AT those places we only read about or
watched on TV.

We are all still waiting for the cite of the Avenging Angle's mighty
"seven hostile actions" he claims he had.

We are all still waiting for the cite of "MARS IS amateur radio"
from the mighty warrior and regulator of everything in his fantasies.

And Lennie was...In Japan at a rear-area radio relay
station for a couple of years in the 50's...

Three years, sicko. Three.

Before your existance on earth, grasshopper. Powerful HF
transmitters...3 1/2 dozen of them...13 microwave radio relay
terminals, each carrying 24 voice channels. [just to name a
few things] Nothing carrying any on-off morse mode traffic.

You haven't done a thing in military radio comparable to that.

Poor baby. Feel left out, do you? Can't blame you for getting
angry...someone comes along who has done MORE than you
beginning BEFORE your time and it spoils the heck out of your
bragging and fantasy claims.

Never mind that national issues on economics
or politics don't have much effect on radio regulations or ham
radio.

Absolutely, without contradiction, one of the most assinine
assertions you've ever made, Lennie.

Economics has been one of the MAJOR driving factors behind
numerous impacts on the Amateur Service!

Someone has "impacted" you and it sounds like damage to your
thinking apparatus. Poor sicko.

More tsk. "MAJOR impact?" :-)

Amateur radio is a radio activity engaged in WITHOUT pecuniary
interest! [that's an old FCC definition of "amateur radio" and
explains the use of the word "amateur" in the service title]

Sunnuvagun!

Another avowed PCTA and super morseman claims he can
make a "Type 7" radio for just $100 and "recycled parts."
Doesn't sound like some kind of "MAJOR impact" to the nation,
more like a personal decision on his part.

Does Alan Greenspan get your input? :-)

On the otherhand, we have you, an ex-Army radio meachanic claiming
to have handled over "2.1 million" bits of traffic until the
mathematics of your silly claim were laid bare.

Then you tried to dance around it.

Tsk. Was NOT a "radio meachanic" nor even a "mechanic." :-)

E-5, Microwave Radio Relay Operations and Maintenance
Supervisor, MOS 281.6 under the old MOS numbering system.
Also doing Fixed Station Transmitters Operations and
Maintenance Supervision prior to arrival of the microwave radio
relay systems.

Army station ADA was only the third largest radio station in the
Army Command and Administrative Network (ACAN) yet it
handled 220,000 messages a month average in 1955, something
printed in the Stars and Stripes military newspaper of that year.
Since ADA was in operation 24/7 and there were so many radio
circuits active at any one time, all I did was estimate how many
messages were transmitted per operating team shift (there were
four teams on a rotating shift basis). Since the swing and mid-
night shifts didn't have resident Officers In Charge, the "trick
chief" (team supervisor) bore the direct responsibility to see that
communications were maintained. They were.

NO ONE "laid bare" any of my numbers (which were never
claimed as anything more than an estimate since they were
not logged as such but the operational radio circuits were
definitely logged to the minute over the TTY order-wire.

I say ESTIMATE solely because some of the radio circuits
carried several multiplexed channels. The SSB transmitters
each had two voice channels plus 6 to 12 TTY channels. Some
transmitters had four time-multiplexed TTY channels done with
frequency-shift keying for the lot. ADA kept increasing its
capacity in three years, from only 36 transmitters in 1953 to 43
at the beginning of 1956. It grew more up to 1963 when the
USAF was given operational control of the Central Honshu HF
communicaitons. That ceased in 1978 when the facility was
closed and all given to the Japanese government; USAF had
other communications means to keep worldwide comms going.

And let's not forget how glorious YOUR Army career was simply by
having been in a unit that had suffered KIA's three years before you
were ever there.

Tsk. You are still one SICK puppy.

The 8235th Army Unit, a Signal Battalion, lost 23 total, 19 at the
beginning of July, 1950, the other four in years following. Hardy
Barracks (the billet for most of the 8235th) was named for
Corporal Elmer Hardy, one of the Signalmen killed in that July
transport crash in Korea. Camp Tomlinson was the new name
for the Kashiwa transmitters site, given during a dedication in
1956, honoring one of the officers killed in that July crash.

I still honor those Signalmen who lost their lives...they were
members of MY Signal unit that I served in. I've stood Retreat
more than once to honor those Signalmen and other Army
soldiers during the Korean War and for the on-going continual
Truce period from July 1953 to the present.

You don't like that I honor the men of my Army unit. Tsk. Go
and report me to Hal and Ted Barker of the Korean War Project.
Go and report me to the Secretary of the Army...or even the
Secretary of Homeland Security (whoever that might be now).
Go and report me to "authorities" and "have me committed" as
you claim you can do with your nursing title, all in a single
telephone call.

Better yet, have yourself committed and save all that insulting
personal trash tossing you seem to do constantly with anyone
who disagrees with you.

You be one Class A Sicko with oak leaf clusters. Get help.

Don't have a cow.

Lenof21 wrote:

In article .com, "bb"
writes:

Amateur morsemen are far superior to professionals in radio.

They might be or they might not be. So far, you're the only fellow
making such a claim. Radio amateurs who use morse may or may not be
superior to professionals in radio who use morse. They are certainly
superior in the use of morse code to professionals in radio who don't
know morse code.

They have nice Titles and federal call signs and all kinds of
good stuff washed into their brains like a henna rinse. They
apologize to NO one. :-)

Titles? I know of no titles. I do have a federally issued call sign.
Don't you?

When I see those apologies, I'll stop pointing out that "true blue" Jim
has never served his country in any capacity, yet has availed himself
to the finest education and standard of living in a system where the
freedom to do so were paid for with the blood of other people's sons.

He "served in 'other' ways." :-(

You don't believe that to be possible?

He knew all about the space business without having worked
in it. Good trick, even if he wasn't rated in soldering to NPC-200.

Do you have information that he didn't work in it?

He knew all about USSR military aircraft too, even though he
didn't shoot any Bears for naval intelligence (another non-
serviceman did that).

He knew that the ones you wrote about didn't exist at the time of your
service.

He has a BSEE and an MSEE, double-degreed, supposedly in
an electronics industry but won't say which one...

What's that to you?

...but he can do
morse code at high rate...which makes him far superior as a
2004 radio person.

Being able to handle morse certainly gives him more tools at his
disposal than a radio amateur who is unable to send or receive morse.


Yet another "superior" (perhaps the radio god of all) claims actual
Department of State employment...

Yeah! Remember how, according to you, I didn't appear on any list of
key employees until I offered proof in the form of several archived
urls?
After that, the "Key Officers of Foreign Service Posts" list became
telephone contact lists to you. Nobody disputes that at the time of my
"claimed" Foreign Service assignments, I actually appeared on the ham
bands from those various places. Do you know anyone who travels to
various countries, staying for two or three years and operating on the
ham bands during that time just so he can fake a claim to Department of
State employment? Gosh, but you're a loon, Len.

...yet doesn't get into the socio-
political "cures and remedies" spouted by all those other PCTA
"superiors" who've never had any diplomatic experience or politics
or of economics (beyond their personal account stuff) but regularly
spout All About it.

I was never told that there was a requirement set out by you which had
to be met. :-)

Never mind that national issues on economics
or politics don't have much effect on radio regulations or ham radio.


That most-superior person claims he was "in" Vietnam but can't
or won't describe any duties "in" Vietnam or that they involved
radio of any kind.

I claim that I was in Vietnam because I was in Vietnam. My duties, as
previously stated here, did have to do with radio of some kind. Those
duties could be found on the web by anyone with any ability at using a
search engine.

All he do is diss and cuss at the person he
doesn't personally like. He IS the superior one. He say so.

As a radio amateur, I'm much superior to you. I've had an amateur radio
license for 41 years. You have none. You have never had one. Even the
guy who received his ticket in last week's mail is superior to you in
amateur radio. If you find that to be a problem, you'd better get used
to it.
All discussion is pointless. It's all a trash can
of insults on the persons holding no-code-test advocacy.

That's a sweeping generalization, Leonard. Most of that stuff is
reserved for you alone. You grate on folks.

Dave K8MN

"bb" wrote in message
oups.com...

Kim wrote:
"bb" wrote in message
oups.com...


Mike said: """Everyone is entitled to an opinion, Brian."""

Reeaally???

"""We wouldn't have anywhere near as much fun if we could only give
opinions on what we have personal experience in! 8^)"""

Then lotsa people on RRAP owe Len Anderson an apology.

When I see those apologies, I'll stop pointing out that "true blue"
Jim
has never served his country in any capacity, yet has availed himself
to the finest education and standard of living in a system where the
freedom to do so were paid for with the blood of other people's sons.
Happy New Year.


So...wait just a minute. Are you saying that anyone who does not serve
his
country in any capacity (you'd have to define in any capacity, by the
way)
is not supposed to live in the United States?

***That isn't what I said, but do you argue that I'm not entitled to my
own opinion?***


Anyone is entitled to their opinion, and I deny no one that. However, in
general, one cannot expect to express things without discourse on them. So,
if you are taking offense that I would seek clarification for what you are
saying, then to add or disagree with it--then you're offense is duly noted.


Because, in the United States

Is Kim going to tell ---me--- about America???

Please allow me to assume the position.


You really do seem rather argumentative. And, in my opinion (may Kim tell
you about Kim, even?) to assume an argumentative (if not rather childish)
position (or, perhaps that is not what you meant by "position") leads me to
believe that this reply-post is an exercise in futility.


we--regardless of *military* service to the country or not--DO avail
ourselves of whatever is available, be that a good education, a good
job, a
good doctor, a good teacher, a good whatever.

Indeed many do.

They take and they take, good whatever.

Good everythig!!!

Do you count yourself among those???


What in the world do you mean, "among those"? I seek good everything and
anything. What do you want me to do? Strive to be a failure?! Your
question is startling.


That the freedoms we enjoy are here, because of the military service
of
others, is greatly appreciated by most--

Huge, huge appreciations. Yellow magnet ribbons and all....


Is your comment somewhat resentful of the ribbons, moreover the sentiment to
support our troops?! Again, your startling.


there are those that are just plain
idiots (and Jim is not one of them).

Why do you say that Jim is not?


Oh, wait. Let me communicate back to you the same way you communicated to
me: are you saying I am not entitled to my opinion? Hey, you opened that
friggin' door, now close it.


As a matteer of fact, I think Jim IS one of the idiots.


Oh, and here, let me demonstrate how much more human I am capable of being
than you: You are entitled to your opinion about Jim--or anyone else. BUT,
I do not share your opinion.


And, to read your comment above
without having paid attention to this thread, seems to say that
anyone who
doesn't meet your standards of service should just roll up and die?

If you like you can read it that way.


Well, I don't "like" to think that anyone would believe like that. There
are those who serve their nation through military means, there are those
that support them in any and every way they can; there are those who remain
here at home and help their families; there are those who go to their jobs
every day to keep the inner-workings (and the reason for living in such a
wonderful country, by the way) moving; there are those who serve their
nation politically; and,

then, there are those who sponge off any opportunity, until it all dries up.
For anyone to have a scholarship in this country, they had to meet
criteria--set forth by the governing body of that scholarship. For anyone
to have availed themselves of any oppportunity to get as top-notch an
education, or as top-notch an opportunity, as they could possibly get is for
them to have participated in their own destiny, rather than letting things
just happen to them. I don't think you're capable of understanding where it
is I would go with this...so I'll not bother.


But that is not what I meant. Meanwhile, Len, who has served is
supposed to roll up and die.

Why is that???

Surely
I am mistaken in my interpretation of your comment, above.

Kim W5TIT

To be -perfectly- clear, I think Jim is a welfare freeloader to avail
hisself to the freedom to go to USA engineering schools, to avail
hisself to a career in engineering, and then to comment on how bad life
in America is without ***ever*** having done a Goddamned thing to risk
even a split fingernail,


You know what? Screw your ever-loving split fingernail theory. You are one
of those who seem (and note I've said "seem") to be of the opinion that only
those who have served in the United States military are entitled to all the
benefits of HAVING BEEN BORN in the USA. You see? That's all it takes for
entitlement he being born in the USA, or becoming a US citizen (although,
and here's a drift to another thread for you--if you can handle it: there
are those who are NOT from this country who come over here with their little
weenie green cards, suck up what they can from the United States, send it
back home, and then go back home themselves...or go on to becoming a US
citizen but are pretty darned slinky folks...in my opinion).


all the while putting down Len Anderson who
has contributed more to America than a single Jim/N2EY fingernail.
Kim, you did ask.

bb


Uh huh. I did ask. And, you came back with this argument initially
that--paraphrasing--were you not entitled to your opinion. You are
entitled. You are entitled to believe that the ground a military person
walks on is sacred and that no one else is "entitled" to the same benefits
from the United States as a person who has served in the military. You are
entitled to believe that we don't all, in some form or other, contribute to
the integrity, continuance, and strength of the United States--some of us by
just damned getting up out of bed every morning and going to some dorky job
where a damned good portion of our income goes to supporting the military,
and the government, and the "other" people (you know...those who are not
worthy)...

So, yeah. I asked. And, I should have known better...

Kim W5TIT

On Thu, 29 Dec 2004, K4YZ wrote:
D. Stussy wrote:
On Wed, 29 Dec 2004, bb wrote:
What about "volunteer" doesn't the FCC understand?

And if they're worried about their gas money, I think they can
claim 31
cents per mile on their federal income tax returns for travel
incurred
while volunteering.

WRONG: Volunteer (charitable) work only gets 14 cents per mile.

You couldn't even get that correct.

Direct jump to "Snide Mode".

Guess you missed the part where he said "...I think"...indicating
that even he wasn't sure and was acknowledging that in advance.

Maybe so, but he wasn't even close. Had he said $0.12/mile, which was an OLD
rate for this, I wouldn't have been as snide.

Kim wrote:
"bb" wrote in message
oups.com...

Kim wrote:
"bb" wrote in message
oups.com...

Mike said: """Everyone is entitled to an opinion, Brian."""

Reeaally???

"""We wouldn't have anywhere near as much fun if we could only
give
opinions on what we have personal experience in! 8^)"""

Then lotsa people on RRAP owe Len Anderson an apology.

I think Len owes many more apologies to other rrappers than he is
owed....

When I see those apologies, I'll stop pointing out that "true
blue"
Jim

Would that be me?

has never served his country in any capacity,

Not in *any* capacity? Obviously that's false.

yet has availed himself
to the finest education and standard of living in a system
where the
freedom to do so were paid for with the blood of other people's
sons.
Happy New Year.

Can't be referring to me. "Finest education and standard of living"?

So...wait just a minute. Are you saying that anyone who does not
serve
his
country in any capacity (you'd have to define in any capacity, by
the
way)is not supposed to live in the United States?

***That isn't what I said, but do you argue that I'm not entitled
to my
own opinion?***

Anyone is entitled to their opinion, and I deny no one that.
However, in
general, one cannot expect to express things without discourse on
them. So,
if you are taking offense that I would seek clarification for what
you are
saying, then to add or disagree with it--then you're offense is duly
noted.

Well said, Kim, but also consider this: An opinion can be based on
facts, or it can be based on falsehoods. It can be developed by sound
reasoning, or by faulty logic.

Also, the term "serve his country in any capacity" has to be defined
clearly. Does it mean only uniformed military service? That would leave
out a lot of people like police, firefighters, EMS.

Because, in the United States

Is Kim going to tell ---me--- about America???

Please allow me to assume the position.

You really do seem rather argumentative. And, in my opinion (may Kim
tell
you about Kim, even?) to assume an argumentative (if not rather
childish)
position (or, perhaps that is not what you meant by "position") leads
me to
believe that this reply-post is an exercise in futility.

Depends on your purpose, Kim. If you expect to convince "William" that
he is mistaken about some things, it's probably futile. OTOH, if you
want to point out his errors, express your own opinion and some facts,
it's not futile at all.

we--regardless of *military* service to the country or not--DO
avail
ourselves of whatever is available, be that a good education, a
good
job, a good doctor, a good teacher, a good whatever.

Indeed many do.

They take and they take, good whatever.

Good everythig!!!

Do you count yourself among those???

What in the world do you mean, "among those"? I seek good everything
and
anything. What do you want me to do? Strive to be a failure?! Your
question is startling.

There's a big difference in simply taking and paying one's way.

That the freedoms we enjoy are here, because of the military
service
of others, is greatly appreciated by most--

Huge, huge appreciations. Yellow magnet ribbons and all....

Is your comment somewhat resentful of the ribbons, moreover the
sentiment to
support our troops?! Again, your startling.

It should also be remembered that while military service is appreciated
and praiseworthy, our country and its freedoms, wealth and way of life
are not due solely to military service or military actions. Although
firefighters are important, they don't build houses - they only protect
them.

there are those that are just plain
idiots (and Jim is not one of them).

If you mean me, you have my thanks, Kim.

Why do you say that Jim is not?

Oh, wait. Let me communicate back to you the same way you
communicated to
me: are you saying I am not entitled to my opinion? Hey, you opened
that
friggin' door, now close it.

As a matteer of fact, I think Jim IS one of the idiots.

Why?

Oh, and here, let me demonstrate how much more human I am capable of
being
than you: You are entitled to your opinion about Jim--or anyone else.
BUT,
I do not share your opinion.

And, to read your comment above
without having paid attention to this thread, seems to say that
anyone who
doesn't meet your standards of service should just roll up and
die?

If you like you can read it that way.

Well, I don't "like" to think that anyone would believe like that.
There
are those who serve their nation through military means, there are
those
that support them in any and every way they can; there are those who
remain
here at home and help their families; there are those who go to their
jobs
every day to keep the inner-workings (and the reason for living in
such a
wonderful country, by the way) moving; there are those who serve
their
nation politically; and,

then, there are those who sponge off any opportunity, until it all
dries up.

Very well said, Kim. I agree 100%.

For anyone to have a scholarship in this country, they had to meet
criteria--set forth by the governing body of that scholarship. For
anyone
to have availed themselves of any oppportunity to get as top-notch an
education, or as top-notch an opportunity, as they could possibly get
is for
them to have participated in their own destiny, rather than letting
things
just happen to them. I don't think you're capable of understanding
where it
is I would go with this...so I'll not bother.

Well, I have some experience with scholarships, so let me add this:

The scholarships I had for undergraduate education were based on
academic achievement alone, as was my admission to the university I
attended. I also had National Direct Student Loans, all of which were
paid back on-time, with interest. I also worked full-time during school
breaks and part-time during the school year (if you can call 35+
hours/wk "part time") in order to pay for things not covered by
scholarship or loan.

Graduate education funding came from two sources: my pocket and my
employer, who would reimburse some of the cost of tuition *after* the
course was successfully completed. Taking one graduate course at a
time, the reimbursement worked out to about 40% of the tuition. Books,
fees and other costs were on me.

But that is not what I meant. Meanwhile, Len, who has served is
supposed to roll up and die.

When has anyone told Len to do that?

It is Len who has told people here to "shut up", said their days are
numbered, etc.

Why is that???

Surely
I am mistaken in my interpretation of your comment, above.

Kim W5TIT

To be -perfectly- clear, I think Jim is a welfare freeloader to
avail
hisself to the freedom to go to USA engineering schools, to avail
hisself to a career in engineering, and then to comment on how bad
life
in America is without ***ever*** having done a Goddamned thing to
risk
even a split fingernail,

Can't be talking about me, then.

You know what? Screw your ever-loving split fingernail theory. You
are one
of those who seem (and note I've said "seem") to be of the opinion
that only
those who have served in the United States military are entitled to
all the
benefits of HAVING BEEN BORN in the USA. You see? That's all it
takes for
entitlement he being born in the USA, or becoming a US citizen
(although,
and here's a drift to another thread for you--if you can handle it:
there
are those who are NOT from this country who come over here with their
little
weenie green cards, suck up what they can from the United States,
send it
back home, and then go back home themselves...or go on to becoming a
US
citizen but are pretty darned slinky folks...in my opinion).

Should only those with military service be allowed to express opinions?
go to engineering school? vote? express opinions?

all the while putting down Len Anderson who
has contributed more to America than a single Jim/N2EY fingernail.

How does anyone know what our relative contributions "to America"
really are?

Is uniformed military service the only thing that counts?

Does it make everything Len writes here somehow OK?

Kim, you did ask.

bb

Uh huh. I did ask. And, you came back with this argument initially
that--paraphrasing--were you not entitled to your opinion. You are
entitled. You are entitled to believe that the ground a military
person
walks on is sacred and that no one else is "entitled" to the same
benefits
from the United States as a person who has served in the military.
You are
entitled to believe that we don't all, in some form or other,
contribute to
the integrity, continuance, and strength of the United States--some
of us by
just damned getting up out of bed every morning and going to some
dorky job
where a damned good portion of our income goes to supporting the
military,
and the government, and the "other" people (you know...those who are
not
worthy)...

It seems a lot of us are "not worthy".

What about police, firefighters, EMS and other people who have no
military service?

Or doctors, nurses, and other health-care people who risk infection
from incurable diseases on the job?

Or plain ol' working people, with no military service, who do dangerous
but essential things to keep the lights on, the water flowing, etc.?
The wires on the poles didn't put themselves up there, and when there's
a problem, the workers don't get to wait for a nice day to fix them.

So, yeah. I asked. And, I should have known better...

Kim W5TIT

I'll sum it up this way: Each and every person makes some sort of
contribution to a community/society, and is also a burden of some sort
too. Some people give more than they take, others take more than they
give. To judge someone, you need to know the sum total of what they
give and take, not just one item.

The person calling others "welfare freeloaders" doesn't know what he's
writing about. His opinion is not based on facts, and was developed
with faulty logic.

Of course he's entitled to any opinion he wants. Just as people are
entitled to believe that the earth is flat and/or less than 7000 years
old. Or that the moon landings were staged. Or any of many other things
that are simply not true.


73 de Jim, N2EY

In article .com, "bb"
writes:

Kim wrote:
"bb" wrote in message
oups.com...

Mike said: """Everyone is entitled to an opinion, Brian."""

Reeaally???

"""We wouldn't have anywhere near as much fun if we could only give
opinions on what we have personal experience in! 8^)"""

Then lotsa people on RRAP owe Len Anderson an apology.

When I see those apologies, I'll stop pointing out that "true blue" Jim
has never served his country in any capacity, yet has availed himself
to the finest education and standard of living in a system where the
freedom to do so were paid for with the blood of other people's sons.
Happy New Year.

So...wait just a minute. Are you saying that anyone who does not serve his
country in any capacity (you'd have to define in any capacity, by the way)
is not supposed to live in the United States?

***That isn't what I said, but do you argue that I'm not entitled to my
own opinion?***

Because, in the United States

Is Kim going to tell ---me--- about America???

Yes, she are and has... :-)

Please allow me to assume the position.

That quaint service phrase may be lost on all the civilians...

we--regardless of *military* service to the country or not--DO avail
ourselves of whatever is available, be that a good education, a good job, a
good doctor, a good teacher, a good whatever.

Indeed many do.

They take and they take, good whatever.

Good everythig!!!

Do you count yourself among those???

That the freedoms we enjoy are here, because of the military service of
others, is greatly appreciated by most--

Huge, huge appreciations. Yellow magnet ribbons and all....

there are those that are just plain
idiots (and Jim is not one of them).

Why do you say that Jim is not?

As a matteer of fact, I think Jim IS one of the idiots.

Nah. Prolly has a good IQ and all that, but along the way he got
mentally sidetracked on things in reality. He gots "turf disease,"
wherein hanging out daily in some group, being portentiously and
pretensiously veddy correct in everything he say makes him a
"guru"...well, at least in his own eyes. Inside, he gots a mean streak
wherever someone don't think super-highly of his opinions...which are
many and varied about nearly everything.

And, to read your comment above
without having paid attention to this thread, seems to say that
anyone who
doesn't meet your standards of service should just roll up and die?

If you like you can read it that way.

But that is not what I meant. Meanwhile, Len, who has served is
supposed to roll up and die.

The correct "supposeds" are "have a stroke" or "have a heart attack."

The first one was wished by a claimed "health professional." Must
have been one of those who took a hypocrite's oath instead of a
Hippocratic one.

Why is that???

Simple reason: In this venue, anyone who doesn't love, honor, and
cherish morse code testing, can just go off and die. :-)

Surely
I am mistaken in my interpretation of your comment, above.

Kim W5TIT

To be -perfectly- clear, I think Jim is a welfare freeloader to avail
hisself to the freedom to go to USA engineering schools, to avail
hisself to a career in engineering, and then to comment on how bad life
in America is without ***ever*** having done a Goddamned thing to risk
even a split fingernail, all the while putting down Len Anderson who
has contributed more to America than a single Jim/N2EY fingernail.
Kim, you did ask.

That may be a bit rough, but it is cutting close.

Folkses who is full o' themselves are most especially Very Important
Peoples that should never ever be harmed, lest such harm hurt their
divine, noble, righteous thoughts within.

Their country owes THEM a living and they need do nothing for it other
than act anal-retentively lawful...and superior to others not as "gifted" as
they be.

You have to understand something of their motivations to see where they
are coming from (mostly the fantasies of their own imaginations). If you
served with the USAF in some distant land, they think that you HAD to
ask the FCC for legal counsel FIRST before operating any radio there...
and then they get ****ed at you for obeying your real orders from the
USAF instead of them. shrug

Those fine superiors in here are all, naturally, morsemen tested at high
rates code cognition before the federal government. They are superior
supermen and anything they say is the Absolute Truth. No one else
can deny that Absolute lest they be buried in a veritable avalanche of
smug superiorness of hate mail. They will LIE, cheat, maybe even
steal, but whatever they do is Terribly Correct, Righteous.
They are the PCTA extras. That should say it all.

Lenof21 wrote:


Those fine superiors in here are all, naturally, morsemen tested
at high
rates code cognition before the federal government. They are
superior
supermen and anything they say is the Absolute Truth. No one else
can deny that Absolute lest they be buried in a veritable
avalanche of
smug superiorness of hate mail. They will LIE, cheat, maybe even
steal, but whatever they do is Terribly Correct, Righteous.
They are the PCTA extras. That should say it all.



Yup, they couldn't interrupt their educations for military service,
they had more important things to do. Then they put down those who did
serve, then who then spent many years in night school to finally get
their education completed.

They talk and talk and talk about their service to their country, but
never say what that service entailed.

Who's that climbing the antenna mount? Why, it's Rev Jim. Hi!
Get ready for another sermon.

In article .com, "bb"
writes:

Hmmm? Doesn't look like an apology.

Anyway, if Jim and Kelly hadn't put forth the idea that they have
served, all this wouldn't be an issue.

Hmmm...they might have had jobs as caterer's assistants
and served meals? :-)