What is the difference between control signals and broadcasts?
 

Since it seems that I am hopelessly confused between control signals
and broadcasts, could some of the more knowledgeable hams give me a
little primer on how K1MAN broadcasts are the same thing as sending a
control signal to a repeater?

"Michael Coslo" wrote

Since it seems that I am hopelessly confused between control signals and
broadcasts, could some of the more knowledgeable hams give me a little primer
on how K1MAN broadcasts are the same thing as sending a control signal to a
repeater?

Both are "one-way" transmissions in the amateur bands.

73, de Hans, K0HB

KØHB wrote:

"Michael Coslo" wrote


Since it seems that I am hopelessly confused between control signals and
broadcasts, could some of the more knowledgeable hams give me a little primer
on how K1MAN broadcasts are the same thing as sending a control signal to a
repeater?


Both are "one-way" transmissions in the amateur bands.

What does the one way transmission to the repeater do? Is it just
something that is done for fun, or "information" or is it something
else? What about a signal to say, turn on a stray elimination filter? Is
that just for sending out a signal, or is that signal made in order to
improve the communications that the repeater handles? Are the signal
tones that I send to activate the autopatch one way transmissions?

We seem to be very close to arguing that the subaudible tones, which
are used to get me into some repeaters in the first place, are one way
transmissions.

Or like the cute post about how if no one answers my CQ, I am making a
broadcast.

Seems like people are doing a bit of stretch on what I am talking about
here. Slippery slopin' it the whole way down. Slippery slope arguments
are so tedious. Kinda like the old dudes at the mall getting upset
because teenage girls are wearing shirts that expose their bellybuttons,
and that means that soon we'll all be forced to worship Satan or
sumpthin'........ yeah I suppose so. ;^)

- Mike KB3EIA -

"Michael Coslo" wrote in message
...


KØHB wrote:

"Michael Coslo" wrote


Since it seems that I am hopelessly confused between control signals and
broadcasts, could some of the more knowledgeable hams give me a little
primer on how K1MAN broadcasts are the same thing as sending a control
signal to a repeater?


Both are "one-way" transmissions in the amateur bands.

What does the one way transmission to the repeater do? Is it just
something that is done for fun, or "information" or is it something else?
What about a signal to say, turn on a stray elimination filter? Is that
just for sending out a signal, or is that signal made in order to improve
the communications that the repeater handles? Are the signal tones that I
send to activate the autopatch one way transmissions?

We seem to be very close to arguing that the subaudible tones, which are
used to get me into some repeaters in the first place, are one way
transmissions.

Or like the cute post about how if no one answers my CQ, I am making a
broadcast.

no, a cq may be a one way transmission, but it is not a broadcast... a
review of the basics is in order i think.

definition in 97.3(a)
(10) Broadcasting. Transmissions intended for reception by the general
public, either direct or relayed.

from operating standards in 97.111

(b) In addition to one-way transmissions specifically authorized elsewhere
in this Part, an amateur station may transmit the following types of one-way
communications:


(1) Brief transmissions necessary to make adjustments to the station;
(2) Brief transmissions necessary to establishing two-way communications
with other stations;

(3) Telecommand;

(4) Transmissions necessary to providing emergency communications;

(5) Transmissions necessary to assisting persons learning, or improving
proficiency in, the international Morse code;

(6) Transmissions necessary to disseminate information bulletins;

(7) Transmissions of telemetry.

so, to totally ban one-way transmissions you would have to stop all these
specifically permitted types of one-way transmissions. it is interesting to
note the definition of broadcasting specifically aims the transmission at
the general public... and the paragraphs that talk about transmitting
information bulletins or code practice do not use the word broadcasting,
they call it transmissions or transmitting.

"Michael Coslo" wrote

Seems like people are doing a bit of stretch on what I am talking about here.

No stretch at all, Mike, when an educated fella says

" I do not believe that one way transmissions should be legal on the amateur
bands.

"Period."

That "period" business doesn't seem to leave any room for exceptions.

"One way' is "one-way". Period.

"Yes Officer, I saw the sign with the arrow, and I was only going one way!"

Beep beep
de Hans, K0HB

KØHB wrote:
"Michael Coslo" wrote


Seems like people are doing a bit of stretch on what I am talking about here.


No stretch at all, Mike, when an educated fella says

" I do not believe that one way transmissions should be legal on the amateur
bands.

"Period."

That "period" business doesn't seem to leave any room for exceptions.

"One way' is "one-way". Period.

"Yes Officer, I saw the sign with the arrow, and I was only going one way!"


Yeah Hans, You are right. I really meant any transmission that does not
elicit a return transmission. This means no control signals, no polling
receivers and transmitters, nothing other than humans talking or beeping
to each other. No sub-audible tones, nothing to make a machine on which
you want to talk to another do something that aids in that talking.
Yeah, that is what I meant. I don't consider those one way transmissions
because they aren't IMO.


Have fun!

- Mike KB3EIA -

Dave wrote:
"Michael Coslo" wrote in message
...


KØHB wrote:


"Michael Coslo" wrote



Since it seems that I am hopelessly confused between control signals and
broadcasts, could some of the more knowledgeable hams give me a little
primer on how K1MAN broadcasts are the same thing as sending a control
signal to a repeater?


Both are "one-way" transmissions in the amateur bands.

What does the one way transmission to the repeater do? Is it just
something that is done for fun, or "information" or is it something else?
What about a signal to say, turn on a stray elimination filter? Is that
just for sending out a signal, or is that signal made in order to improve
the communications that the repeater handles? Are the signal tones that I
send to activate the autopatch one way transmissions?

We seem to be very close to arguing that the subaudible tones, which are
used to get me into some repeaters in the first place, are one way
transmissions.

Or like the cute post about how if no one answers my CQ, I am making a
broadcast.


no, a cq may be a one way transmission, but it is not a broadcast... a
review of the basics is in order i think.

definition in 97.3(a)
(10) Broadcasting. Transmissions intended for reception by the general
public, either direct or relayed.

from operating standards in 97.111

(b) In addition to one-way transmissions specifically authorized elsewhere
in this Part, an amateur station may transmit the following types of one-way
communications:


(1) Brief transmissions necessary to make adjustments to the station;
(2) Brief transmissions necessary to establishing two-way communications
with other stations;

(3) Telecommand;

(4) Transmissions necessary to providing emergency communications;

(5) Transmissions necessary to assisting persons learning, or improving
proficiency in, the international Morse code;

(6) Transmissions necessary to disseminate information bulletins;

(7) Transmissions of telemetry.

so, to totally ban one-way transmissions you would have to stop all these
specifically permitted types of one-way transmissions. it is interesting to
note the definition of broadcasting specifically aims the transmission at
the general public... and the paragraphs that talk about transmitting
information bulletins or code practice do not use the word broadcasting,
they call it transmissions or transmitting.



I'm reformed now, Dave. The more one way broadcasts, the better. I was
so wrong in my opinion before.

- Mike KB3EIA -

"Mike Coslo" wrote in message
...
Dave wrote:
"Michael Coslo" wrote in message
...


KØHB wrote:


"Michael Coslo" wrote



Since it seems that I am hopelessly confused between control signals
and broadcasts, could some of the more knowledgeable hams give me a
little primer on how K1MAN broadcasts are the same thing as sending a
control signal to a repeater?


Both are "one-way" transmissions in the amateur bands.

What does the one way transmission to the repeater do? Is it just
something that is done for fun, or "information" or is it something else?
What about a signal to say, turn on a stray elimination filter? Is that
just for sending out a signal, or is that signal made in order to improve
the communications that the repeater handles? Are the signal tones that I
send to activate the autopatch one way transmissions?

We seem to be very close to arguing that the subaudible tones, which are
used to get me into some repeaters in the first place, are one way
transmissions.

Or like the cute post about how if no one answers my CQ, I am making a
broadcast.


no, a cq may be a one way transmission, but it is not a broadcast... a
review of the basics is in order i think.

definition in 97.3(a)
(10) Broadcasting. Transmissions intended for reception by the general
public, either direct or relayed.

from operating standards in 97.111

(b) In addition to one-way transmissions specifically authorized
elsewhere in this Part, an amateur station may transmit the following
types of one-way communications:


(1) Brief transmissions necessary to make adjustments to the station;
(2) Brief transmissions necessary to establishing two-way
communications with other stations;

(3) Telecommand;

(4) Transmissions necessary to providing emergency communications;

(5) Transmissions necessary to assisting persons learning, or improving
proficiency in, the international Morse code;

(6) Transmissions necessary to disseminate information bulletins;

(7) Transmissions of telemetry.

so, to totally ban one-way transmissions you would have to stop all these
specifically permitted types of one-way transmissions. it is interesting
to note the definition of broadcasting specifically aims the transmission
at the general public... and the paragraphs that talk about transmitting
information bulletins or code practice do not use the word broadcasting,
they call it transmissions or transmitting.



I'm reformed now, Dave. The more one way broadcasts, the better. I was so
wrong in my opinion before.


no, we don't want any 'broadcasts', however, one way 'transmissions' under
the right conditions are perfectly acceptable.