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#1
February 14th 07, 05:28 AM
posted to rec.radio.shortwave
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t2fd
anyone use a t2fd here? i'm considering replacing my longwire with a
t2fd-- but i can't mount it on a slope-- will i be wasting my time and money? |
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#2
February 14th 07, 09:56 AM
posted to rec.radio.shortwave
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Shortwave Listening (SWL) Antennas from the "T2FD" to the "Windom" to the Inverted "L" Antenna
= = = On Feb 13, 9:28*pm, "tom k in L.A."
= = = wrote: - - anyone use a t2fd here? * - i'm considering replacing my longwire with a t2fd - but i can't mount it on a slope - will i be wasting my time and money? Tom K in LA, Shortwave Listening (SWL) Antennas from the "T2FD" to the "Windom" to the Inverted "L" Antenna http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortw.../message/12277 Remember that the original design critiera for the Terminated Tilted Folded Dipole (T2FD / TTFD) was for both a Transmitting and Receiving Antenna. * Terminated - To make it poor on any one Frequency and average across many Frequencies. * Tilted - To give it variable Wave Length 'Heigth" above the Ground {Surface} and thus more Broad-Banded across many Frequencies. * Folded - Another Broad-Banded aspect over a Single Dipole. * Dipole - Balance and usable on the Harmonics of the lowest design {cut} Frequency. Original designed for its Broad-Banded Transmitting characteristics and the fact that it also worked about as well as a Broad-Banded Receiving Antenna. READ - Why Tilt ? - The Terminated Tilted Folded Dipole (TTFD / T2FD) Antenna http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortw...a/message/9085 http://groups.google.com/group/rec.r...6f135c9a1ff3d4 Part # 2 {Reply} Why Tilt the T2FD Antenna http://groups.google.com/group/rec.r...1a382dcfd0b599 Part # 3 {Reply} Horizontal & Vertical Dipole Antennas http://groups.google.com/group/rec.r...5a29ea49a79aa9 Part # 4 {Reply} T2FD Antennas - What's Out There . . . http://groups.google.com/group/rec.r...1e739d018d90f2 READ - Shortwave Listener's (SWL) Dipole {T2FD} Antenna that is built with common TV type Parts - 300 Ohm Twin Lead etc http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortw...a/message/2955 http://groups.google.com/group/rec.r...7684e390585424 ABOUT - Making a SWL Antenna out of 300 Ohm Twin Lead and TV Coax Cable http://groups.google.com/group/rec.r...54ef37af697129 The-Bottom-Line - If the Shortwave Antenna is not Tilted : Then it is NOT a Terminated TILTED Folded Dipole (TTFD / T2FD) Antenna [.] Need to Go "FLAT" {Horizontal} and can not 'Tilt' your Shortwave Antenna : Then consider the Windom Antenna as a Multi-Band {Broad-Bandedd} -alternative to- the T2FD Antenna. READ - Build A Four (4) Wire Windom Antenna For Shortwave Listening (SWL) http://groups.google.com/group/rec.r...b82b8338fed2a6 READ - Windom -vice- Dipole which is the better SWL Antenna ? ? ? http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortw...nna/message/80 http://groups.google.com/group/rec.r...475be3a848a708 http://groups.google.com/group/rec.r...bd8dbdaed416b2 ABOUT - The original "WINDOM" Antenna and more . . . http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortw...a/message/6582 http://groups.google.com/group/rec.r...83d7aab64996cb http://groups.google.com/group/rec.r...88118b5d7355a9 READ - Multi-Band Shortwave Listener (SWL) Antennas : Windom - Dipole - Random Wire http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortw...a/message/6595 http://groups.google.com/group/rec.r...0383999b8c1f94 QUESTION - What Will . . . My Second Shortwave Listener (SWL) Antenna Be ? ? ? http://groups.google.com/group/rec.r...e30053633904d9 =OR= Why Not Stick With What You Have - And Improve It ! ! ! 1 - First a simple Longwire {Random Wire} Antenna 2 - Modified to an Inverted "L" Antenna 3 - Up-graded to a "Low Noise" Inverted "L" Antenna 4 - Re-Arranged {Re-Positioned} into a Far-End-Fed "Low Noise" Inverted "L" Antenna QUESTION - Is 'it' a Longwire {Random Wire} Antenna -or- Inverted "L" Antenna ? http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortw...a/message/6300 http://groups.google.com/group/rec.r...364956151adbba WHY - The Inverted "L" Antenna ? http://groups.google.com/group/rec.r...b3ddbed819958d READ - The Next Step - The Low Noise Inverted "L" {Random Wire} Antenna http://groups.google.com/group/rec.r...4e78044fafe71e http://groups.google.com/group/rec.r...ff7ab457d5966c WHY - The Far-End-Fed Shortwave Listener's (SWLs) Inverted "L" Antenna http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortw.../message/11698 http://groups.google.com/group/rec.r...cfc6b9cb2447c0 A Second Look : The WellBrook lay-out for a Low Noise Antenna http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortw...a/message/4856 http://groups.google.com/group/rec.r...ecfc2f91fe5c7e http://groups.google.com/group/rec.r...f72ca458581b9c from 't2fd' to 'windom' to inverted 'l' antenna - iane ~ RHF {pomkia} . Shortwave Listener (SWL) Antennas Group = http://tinyurl.com/ogvcf GoTo = http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortwave-SWL-Antenna/ The SWL Antenna Discussion Group = http://tinyurl.com/ogvcf Shortwave Listener (SWL) Antenna HELP = http://tinyurl.com/ogvcf Shortwave Listener (SWL) Antenna NEWS = http://tinyurl.com/ogvcf Shortwave Listener (SWL) Antenna INFO = http://tinyurl.com/ogvcf * * * All Are Welcome : Including ELMERS and 'Want-to-be-Elmers' plus plain old "Mister-Know-It-Alls"; and even those Newbees with "I Know This Is A Really Dumb Question - But _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ " . The Shortwave Listener's Blessing : SWL BLESSING = http://tinyurl.com/s2bjm May You Never Tire of Listening to the Radio and Always have Strong Signals and Noise Free Reception ~ RHF {ibid} http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortw...a/message/9233 . Tous Sont Bienvenus ! - - - Groupe par Radio d'auditeur d'onde courte pour des Antennes de SWL http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortwave-SWL-Antenna/ . Alle Sind Willkommen ! - - - Shortwave Radiozuhörer Gruppe für SWL Antennen http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortwave-SWL-Antenna/ . Tutti Sono Benvenuti ! - - - Gruppo Radiofonico dell'ascoltatore di onda corta per le Antenne di SWL http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortwave-SWL-Antenna/ . Todos São Bem-vindos ! - - - Grupo de Rádio do ouvinte do Shortwave para Antenas de SWL http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortwave-SWL-Antenna/ . Все *адушны ! - - - Группа оператора на приеме коротковолнового диапазона Radio для Aнтенн SWL http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortwave-SWL-Antenna/ . ¡Todos Son Agradables! - - - Grupo de Radio del oyente de la onda corta para las Antenas de SWL http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortwave-SWL-Antenna/ . = = = = Plain Old American-English Translation = = = = All are Welcome - - - To Join the Shortwave Listeners (SWL) Antenna Group on YAHOO ! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortwave-SWL-Antenna/ . | | | / \ ........!....... |
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#3
February 14th 07, 02:00 PM
posted to rec.radio.shortwave
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t2fd
On 13 Feb 2007 21:28:18 -0800, "tom k in L.A."
wrote: anyone use a t2fd here? i'm considering replacing my longwire with a t2fd-- but i can't mount it on a slope-- will i be wasting my time and money? It'll still outperform almost any other wire antenna |
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#4
February 15th 07, 03:57 AM
posted to rec.radio.shortwave
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t2fd
In article .com,
"tom k in L.A." wrote: anyone use a t2fd here? i'm considering replacing my longwire with a t2fd-- but i can't mount it on a slope-- will i be wasting my time and money? It would be a good move. Sloping it is not important. -- Telamon Ventura, California |
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#5
February 16th 07, 02:05 AM
posted to rec.radio.shortwave
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t2fd
On Feb 14, 7:57 pm, Telamon
wrote: In article .com, "tom k in L.A." wrote: anyone use a t2fd here? i'm considering replacing my longwire with a t2fd-- but i can't mount it on a slope-- will i be wasting my time and money? It would be a good move. Sloping it is not important. -- Telamon Ventura, California really? some people feel strongly about the sloping. elaborate telamon-- if i can get 1/2 the reception you do i will be a happy pappy! |
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#6
February 16th 07, 02:30 AM
posted to rec.radio.shortwave
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t2fd
In article .com,
"tom k in L.A." wrote: On Feb 14, 7:57 pm, Telamon wrote: In article .com, "tom k in L.A." wrote: anyone use a t2fd here? i'm considering replacing my longwire with a t2fd-- but i can't mount it on a slope-- will i be wasting my time and money? It would be a good move. Sloping it is not important. really? some people feel strongly about the sloping. elaborate telamon-- if i can get 1/2 the reception you do i will be a happy pappy! This antenna originated as a ship broadband antenna where there are stays that could be used as an antenna if insulated. The stays on a ship slope. Generally for reception higher is better so I would nix the sloping idea. You can build a simple folded dipole antenna out of TV 300 ohm twin lead and use a common 300 to 75 ohm BALUN. The TV/FM BALUN transformers are not all created equal. Some are poor below 15MHz. The BALUN units with more heft indicate a bigger core that will work well down into the AMBCB band. The twin lead will not support itself so you could tie-wrap it to nylon cord or rope. It would be good if the antenna was at least 40 foot long and longer would be better. If this works well for you then go to the trouble of building a larger capture area antenna. -- Telamon Ventura, California |
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#7
February 16th 07, 02:38 AM
posted to rec.radio.shortwave
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t2fd
On Feb 14, 12:28 am, "tom k in L.A." wrote:
anyone use a t2fd here? i'm considering replacing my longwire with a t2fd-- but i can't mount it on a slope-- will i be wasting my time and money? I replaced my EF-SWL with an RF Systems T2FD cropped to 35' and the difference was amazing. Stations which were heard but noisy became enjoyable, and stations which I didn't know were there popped out, not strong but good enough to listen to. Don't worry about the slope. It helps make the antenna more omnidirectional above all but its certainly not required to get good results. |
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#8
February 16th 07, 01:51 PM
posted to rec.radio.shortwave
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t2fd
On 15 Feb 2007 18:05:53 -0800, "tom k in L.A."
wrote: On Feb 14, 7:57 pm, Telamon wrote: In article .com, "tom k in L.A." wrote: anyone use a t2fd here? i'm considering replacing my longwire with a t2fd-- but i can't mount it on a slope-- will i be wasting my time and money? It would be a good move. Sloping it is not important. -- Telamon Ventura, California really? some people feel strongly about the sloping. elaborate telamon-- if i can get 1/2 the reception you do i will be a happy pappy! The closer to 45 degrees the more omnidirectional the antenna. Otherwise just broadside it to the major directions of interest. |
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#9
February 16th 07, 06:38 PM
posted to rec.radio.shortwave
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T2FD Antenna Made From TV Parts
On Feb 15, 6:30 pm, Telamon
wrote: In article .com, "tom k in L.A." wrote: On Feb 14, 7:57 pm, Telamon wrote: In article .com, "tom k in L.A." wrote: anyone use a t2fd here? i'm considering replacing my longwire with a t2fd-- but i can't mount it on a slope-- will i be wasting my time and money? It would be a good move. Sloping it is not important. really? some people feel strongly about the sloping. elaborate telamon-- if i can get 1/2 the reception you do i will be a happy pappy! This antenna originated as a ship broadband antenna where there are stays that could be used as an antenna if insulated. The stays on a ship slope. Generally for reception higher is better so I would nix the sloping idea. You can build a simple folded dipole antenna out of TV 300 ohm twin lead and use a common 300 to 75 ohm BALUN. The TV/FM BALUN transformers are not all created equal. Some are poor below 15MHz. The BALUN units with more heft indicate a bigger core that will work well down into the AMBCB band. The twin lead will not support itself so you could tie-wrap it to nylon cord or rope. It would be good if the antenna was at least 40 foot long and longer would be better. If this works well for you then go to the trouble of building a larger capture area antenna. -- Telamon Ventura, California Telamon, Yes 300 Ohm TV type Twin-Lead will work for a Quik-and-Dirty T2FD. To simply construction - Instead of a single 450 Ohm Resistor in the Center of the upper T2FD Antenna Element with the 4:1 Balun in the Center of the Lower T2FD Antenna Element. Put a 220 Ohm Resistor at each end of the Twin-Lead. And Yes Again - You are right that the better quality 300 Ohm to 75 Ohm TV type Matching Transformers {Baluns} can work down to at least 5 MHz and as you point out these are usually the larger diameter ones which have a bigger Ferrite Cord, which is the key performance difference, besides increasing the number of windings. IIRC - John Doty wrote about using the Binocular Ferrite Cores from TY type Matching Transformers and -re-winding them with more windings to get better performance across the Shortwave (HF) Bands and down into the AM/MW Band. - - - Searching . . . The "Perfect" Feed-in-Line for Wire Shortwave Listening (SWL) Antennas http://www.hard-core-dx.com/nordicdx...eed/coax2.html -by- John Doty ) -Source- Hard-Cord-DX.Com * It Doesn't Take Very Much Wire * The Problem * The Solution * Construction * Mount the Transformer * Drive a Ground Stake * How It Works, In More Detail * If the Impedances of Two . . . * In My Antenna System * Performance -Source- Hard-Cord-DX.Com -by- John Doty ) http://www.hard-core-dx.com/nordicdx...eed/coax2.html TIP - Re-Construction of a TV Parts Matching Transformer {Balun} into a Shortwave Listeners (SWL) Matching Transformer {Balun} http://www.hard-core-dx.com/nordicdx...eed/coax2.html -by- John Doty ) * My Antenna and Feed System are built with Television Antenna System Components and other common hardware. These Parts are inexpensive and easily obtainable in most places. * The Matching Transformer {Balun} is built around a Toroid {Ferrite Core} extracted from a TV 300 Ohm to 75 Ohm "Matching Transformer". If you're a pack rat like me, you have a few in your basement: you typically get one with every TV or VCR (or you can buy one). Pop the plastic case off and snip the wires from the Toroid (it looks either like a tiny donut, or a pair of tiny donuts stuck together). * The Matching Transformer {Balun} Windings should be made with thin Wi I use #32 Magnet Wire. The Primary is 30 Turns while the Secondary is 10 Turns. * For a One-Hole Toroid, count each passage of the Wire down through the Hole as One Turn. For a Two-Holer, each Turn is a passage of the Wire down through the Right Hole and up through the Left. http://www.hard-core-dx.com/nordicdx...eed/coax2.html READ - Install Your Shortwave Listener (SWL) Antenna Properly http://www.hard-core-dx.com/nordicdx...eed/coax2.html The Antenna System is the 'key' to Reception at Shortwave Frequencies. - From: John Doty ) - Date: February 11, 1995 - Original source: Usenet's Rec.Radio.Shortwave CHECK-OUT - The John Doty 'Reading List" at Hard-Core-DX.Com Other Hard-Cord-DX.Com Articles -by- John Doty to Read JPD READING LIST = http://tinyurl.com/3amvw6 One Shortwave Listeners (SWLs) Un-Ending Pursuit of More Signal and Less Noise http://www.google.com/custom?domains...D%3A1%3B&hl=en sometimes i even supprise myself - iane ~ RHF |
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#10
February 17th 07, 03:16 AM
posted to rec.radio.shortwave
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The T2FD Antenna needs the 30 Degree "Slope" {Tilt} for better All-A-Round Shortwave Reception
On Feb 16, 12:54*pm, "RHF" wrote:
= = = Source - Rec-Radio-Shortwave - NewsGroup = = = On Feb 16, 5:51*am, David wrote: - - The closer to 45 degrees the more omnidirectional the antenna. - Otherwise just broadside it to the major directions of interest. - David - That is true. IMHO - The T2FD Antenna needs the 30 Degree "Slope" {Tilt} for better All-A-Round Shortwave Listening (SWL) Receptionhttp://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortwave-SWL-Antenna/message/12285 Sloping does add a Vertical Dimension to the T2FD Antennahttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dimension and at 45 Degrees the Horizontal and Vertical Aspects are Equal and the Signals should be more Omni-Directional {All-A-Round} then -if- the T2FD Antenna is simply Rigged Horizontal [Flat]. *=But= 30 Degrees is what is most often the recommended Sloping Angle for the T2FD Antenna. "Actually, the idea behind the slope is to make it more omnidirectional. *The ideal slope is something like 30 degrees, but there's no hard-and-fast rule on this. Set it up as best you can." -by- Eric F. Richards [R.R.S]http://groups.google.tt/group/rec.radio.shortwave/msg/bb4ab0c2009b662c Then to Quote Myself in a prior Post : "Yes 30 Degrees works well for most Sloping Receiving Antennas. Horizontal (Flat) Wire = 100% Horizontal Dimension Area of Radiation. Vertcal (Upright) Wire = 100% Vertical Dimension Area of Radiation. 45 Degree Sloping Wire = 50% Horizontal and 50% Vertical Dimension Area of Radiation. 30 Degree Sloping Wire = 87% Horizontal Dimension and 50% Vertical Dimension Areas of Radiation. - - - Roughly speaking. The 30 Degree Sloping Wire Antenna Element to some degree can be though of as the same space equalent as an Inverted "L" Antenna which would make up the other Two Sides of a Triangle created by the Sloping Side. * *30 Ft Sloper Antenna would take up the same space as a 15 Ft Vertical by 26 Ft Horizontal Inverted "L" Antenna. Note - This Inverted "L" would be 41 Ft long (+11 Ft) and have 37% more Wire-in-the-Air. * *52 Ft Sloper Antenna would take up the same space as a 26 Ft Vertical by 45 Ft Horizontal Inverted "L" Antenna Note - This Inverted "L" would be 71 Ft long (+19 Ft) and have 37% more Wire-in-the-Air. - - - For some it simply comes down to the fact that the Sloping Wire Antenna may be eaiser to Rig then the Inverted "L" Wire Antenna." -by- RHFhttp://groups.google.tt/group/rec.radio.shortwave/msg/4e016d6d5422adb3 "The T2FD Antenna when Mounted at an Angle of 30 Degrees will provide an Omni-Directional response with Low Noise." T2FD INFO =http://www.wellbrook.uk.com/UMBT2FD.html The Wellbrook Universal Magnetic Balun UMB T2FD is a Receiving Antenna Balun with a 9:1 impedance ratio, and an integral 500 Ohm 5W Thick Film Termination Resistor. This Wellbrook T2FD Balun is specifically designed to simplify the construction of the T2FD Antenna. Diagram of the Typical Erection of the T2FD Antenna T2FD DIAGRAM =http://www.wellbrook.uk.com/UMBT2FD.html READ - More About the T2FD Antenna "T2FD -- The Forgotten Antenna" -by- Guy Atkinshttp://www.hard-core-dx.com/nordicdx/antenna/wire/t2fd.html * *Designing the T2FD Antenna Note # 3. The Sloping Angle for a Non-Directional {Omni} Receiving Antenna Pattern should be on the order of 30 Degress, but 20–40 Degrees is acceptable.http://www.hard-core-dx.com/nordicdx.../t2design.html * *How to Feed a T2FD Antenna Correctlyhttp://www.hard-core-dx.com/nordicdx/antenna/wire/t2fdfeed.html * *The T2FD Antenna a match for any Shortwave Listening (SWL) Antennahttp://www.hard-core-dx.com/nordicdx/antenna/wire/t2fdcomp.html * *The T2FD Antenna an Excellent Shortwave Receiving Antennahttp://www.hard-core-dx.com/nordicdx/antenna/wire/t2fd_1.html HARD-CORE-DX.COM =http://www.hard-core-dx.com ANTENNA SPECIAL=http://www.hard-core-dx.com/nordicdx/antenna/ 3-degrees-of-separation -or- 30-degrees-of-slope considering the numb3rs - iane ~ RHF {pomkia} *. Shortwave Listener (SWL) Antennas Group =http://tinyurl.com/ogvcf GoTo =http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortwave-SWL-Antenna/ The SWL Antenna Discussion Group =http://tinyurl.com/ogvcf Shortwave Listener (SWL) Antenna HELP =http://tinyurl.com/ogvcf Shortwave Listener (SWL) Antenna NEWS =http://tinyurl.com/ogvcf Shortwave Listener (SWL) Antenna INFO =http://tinyurl.com/ogvcf * * * All Are Welcome : Including ELMERS and 'Want-to-be-Elmers' plus plain old "Mister-Know-It-Alls"; and even those Newbees with "I Know This Is A Really Dumb Question - But _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ " *. The Shortwave Listener's Blessing : SWL BLESSING =http://tinyurl.com/s2bjm May You Never Tire of Listening to the Radio and Always have Strong Signals and Noise Free Reception ~ RHF {ibid}http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortw...a/message/9233 *. Tous Sont Bienvenus ! - - - Groupe par Radio d'auditeur d'onde courte pour des Antennes de SWLhttp://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortwave-SWL-Antenna/ *. Alle Sind Willkommen ! - - - Shortwave Radiozuhörer Gruppe für SWL Antennenhttp://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortwave-SWL-Antenna/ *. Tutti Sono Benvenuti ! - - - Gruppo Radiofonico dell'ascoltatore di onda corta per le Antenne di SWLhttp://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortwave-SWL-Antenna/ *. Todos São Bem-vindos ! - - - Grupo de Rádio do ouvinte do Shortwave para Antenas de SWLhttp://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortwave-SWL-Antenna/ *. Все *адушны ! - - - Группа оператора на приеме коротковолнового диапазона Radio для Aнтенн SWLhttp://groups..yahoo.com/group/Shortwave-SWL-Antenna/ *. ¡Todos Son Agradables! - - - Grupo de Radio del oyente de la onda corta para las Antenas de SWLhttp://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortwave-SWL-Antenna/ *. = = = = Plain Old American-English Translation = = = = All are Welcome - - - To Join the Shortwave Listeners (SWL) Antenna Group on YAHOO !http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortwave-SWL-Antenna/ *. *| *| *| / \ .......!....... this is what RF systems wrote me back: RFI is a BIG problem. You must have a antenna receiving the magnetic component of radio signals. Most antennas receive the electric part. It is just that electric part which carries the RFI. All RF-Systems antennas are Magnetic antennas. The best choice is to use a closed (dipol) antenna ( is also the most expensive choise.............) The T-2FD will ouperforme the MK-4 longwire, but if the T-2FD can kill your RFI..................hard to say! The optimal angle to hang the T-2FD is 30 degree for closeby and DX traffic. If you cannot hang it in a 30 degree angle it is no problem. |
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