(OT) : The Failure of the US Congress to Protect the USA andUS Citizens from Terrorist Attacks by Islam-O-Facists.
 

RHF wrote:

Any Combatant Found in the Area of Combat : Who is
an Un-Lawful Military Combatant will be Interrogated,
Summarily Judged and Executed within 72 Hours. -eod-
http://writ.news.findlaw.com/dorf/20020123.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unlawfu...tary_combatant


Good thing the English didn't invent the term 'Un-Lawful Military
Combatant' during the US war of independence. There were LOTS of
un-uniformed people shooting at them from behind trees, bushes and houses.

mike

--
Due to the insane amount of spam and garbage, this filter
blocks all postings from Gmail, Google Mail and Google Groups.

http://improve-usenet.org/

(OT) : Stop the Abortion of Liberalcide !
 

Brody wrote:

calling someone gullible is not demonizing for gawd's sake.

Well, we differ on that. 'Gullible' has a connotation of an
unsophisticated and less than smart person. A gullible person is easily
tricked or suckered. They are pawns in the hands of their 'users'.

The term is sometimes used to described someone who, because of their
own experiences, thinks differently than we do. Gullible, in the sense
you used it, means 'wrong'.

Thinking differently doesn't automatically mean thinking incorrectly.

mike


--
Due to the insane amount of spam and garbage, this filter
blocks all postings from Gmail, Google Mail and Google Groups.

http://improve-usenet.org/

(OT) SPECIAL: for Ace and other ditto heads
 

dave wrote:
Brody wrote:

beyond bizzare.. by this logic, every Jap and German POW should have
had a US lawyer and his day in a US court, and presumably release on
bond until his court date


Most of the people at Guantanamo were turned-in for bounty or otherwise
the result of something other than capture on the battlefield

source ?

. If they
are POWs, this ruling doesn't apply. They are to be held under the
Geneva Conventions, which do not allow torture.

There is no Declaration of War in effect right now, unlike the Japs and
the Gerrys.

(OT) SPECIAL: for Ace and other ditto heads
 

m II wrote:

Brody wrote:


Who is denying rights? It's already happened. Washington did it.
Whatever became of innocent until proven guilty?

beyond bizzare.. by this logic, every Jap and German POW should have had
a US lawyer and his day in a US court, and presumably release on bond
until his court date



Those people were not picked up on the street or dragged out of their
beds at three in morning or turned in to the occupiers as a means of
revenge or as a political move by the competition.


An example of how things have been twisted around:

After WWII, Japanese soldiers who had water boarded US prisoners were
branded as having committed war crimes.

Japs and Nazi were convicted of a lot worse than waterboarding.


In Texas, 1983, a Sheriff and
three deputies got 10 years for torturing with the technique.

and deserved it.. whats your point ?

Today,
there must be a kinder, gentler version of this torture, as it's
accepted US practice. Hell, they even changed the definition of
'torture' to cover their illegal as hell backsides.

pfft... you lefties claim playing loud music is torture.


Please, do some research. Find out what monsters have taken over your
country:


Want to know what real torture is ?? Read up on the torture rooms found
in Iraq, and the techniques and tools the terrorists (some held in
Gitmo) used .

US troops are subjected to waterboarding wbile training how to resist
interrogation. Unfortunately there is no way to resist having ones head
sawed off with a dull knife.

http://www.searchmash.com/search/jap...oarding+prison

mike

(OT) : Stop the Abortion of Liberalcide !
 

m II wrote:

Brody wrote:


calling someone gullible is not demonizing for gawd's sake.


Well, we differ on that. 'Gullible' has a connotation of an
unsophisticated and less than smart person.

no... plenty of REALLY smart are gullible.


A gullible person is easily
tricked or suckered. They are pawns in the hands of their 'users'.


which is why i used the word... it applies.

The term is sometimes used to described someone who, because of their
own experiences, thinks differently than we do. Gullible, in the sense
you used it, means 'wrong'.

Thinking differently doesn't automatically mean thinking incorrectly.

Then why the 'studies' to 'prove' conservatives are not as smart as liberals


mike



Seems your are to lazy to read site linked to in the original post, or
the hate messages the article generated

(OT) : Classic Liberal Demonization of the Right Speak - Da BushCrime Family
 

On Jun 14, 7:01*am, dave wrote:
m II wrote:
Telamon wrote:

Look up Napoleanic Law. You might as well learn it, now that it's
replaced the Constitution.
You don't seem to understand the Constitution applies to US citizens not
foreign military combatants.

Some human beings are more equal than others in the eyes of God?

mike

- I'm pretty sure all persons on American soil
- have rights, not just citzens.

Yes Illegal Alien Invaders -have- The Right to be Deported.

-*The Bush Crime Family knew this,

Classic Liberal Demonization of the Right Speak :
da bush crime family,
Da Bush Crime Family.
DA BUSH CRIME FAMILY !

- and claim Gitmo is on foreign soil.
-*The base is actually as American as John McCain's birthplace.

Actually a Good Valid Point.

(OT) : Oh Canada - Open Up Your Doors to Set the WrongfullyImprisoned Free - Give the GITMO Detainees a Home to Plan Their Next Jihad
 

On Jun 14, 5:16*am, John Barnard wrote:
RHF wrote:
On Jun 13, 11:44 pm, Telamon
wrote:
In article 8yJ4k.1364$L03.1142@edtnps92, m II wrote:
Telamon wrote:
Yes torturous, mental in exchange for the physical. The supreme court
has seen fit to torture us all in exchange for the lot that has befallen
jailed foreign terrorists who are not US citizens. Military combatants
who would kill you if they had the chance, would deny you your rights if
they had the chance, and have no standing in our courts should get the
rights we posses? I don't think so.
Who is denying rights? It's already happened. Washington did it.
Whatever became of innocent until proven guilty? When did the US
convert to Napoleanic law? Nowadays, the US assumes guilt and then
denies the right of a trial. That is hell. Wake up.
Look up Napoleanic Law. You might as well learn it, now that it's
replaced the Constitution.

- You don't seem to understand the Constitution applies
- to US citizens not foreign military combatants.
-
- --
- Telamon
- Ventura, California

Telamon - Ditto That !

Point-of-Fact - These 'people' down in Gitmo are
Un-Lawful Military Combatants* : Who are Clearly
Outside the Geneva Convention 1949.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unlawfu...tary_combatant
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geneva_Convention
* They are in-fact Islam-O-Facist Terrorists.
GITMO - Guantanamo Bay Detention Camp
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guantan...detention_camp

The Failure of the US Congress to Protect the USA and
US Citizens from Terrorist Attacks by Islam-O-Facists.

Don't Blame the US Military and the DOD.

Don't Blame the US Justice Department

Don't Blame the US Supreme Court and the Courts

Don't Blame the US President and Administration

Clearly the Blame Belongs to the US Congress*
both Democrats and Republicans alike; and the
US House of representatives and the USSenate alike.
* The US Congress Makes the Laws
* The US Congress Failed to Make Good Laws to deal
effectively with these Un-Lawful Military Combatants
who are Islam-O-Facist Terrorists.
* The US Congress has Failing to Act : This Situation
is the Fault of the US Congress.

as an american citizen and a voter - yes i say that ~ RHF
*.- Hide quoted text -

- Does that include those who had been wrongfully imprisoned?
-
- JB

JB - Give us your Name and Address : We will send all
the ones who 'claim' that they were 'wrongfully imprisoned"
over to stay with you so that you can help them to get
over their "wrongfully imprisonment".

GITMO - Guantanamo Bay Detention Camp
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guantan...detention_camp
Since the beginning of the current war in Afghanistan,
* 775 detainees have been brought to Guantanamo,
* Approximately 420 of which have been released without charge.
* As of May 2008, approximately 270 detainees remain.
* More than a Fifth (1/5) are Cleared for Release but may have
to wait Months or Years because U.S. Officials are finding it
increasingly difficult to persuade Countries to accept them,
* According to Officials and Defense Lawyers.
* Of the Roughly 355 still Incarcerated,
* U.S. Officials said they intend to eventually put 60 to 80 on trial
* and Free the Rest.

OH CANADA - OPEN UP YOUR DOORS TO SET THE
WRONGFULLY IMPRISONED FREE: GIVE THE GITMO
DETAINEES A HOME TO PLAN THEIR NEXT JIHAD .
[ Jihad -aka- Islam-O-Facist Act of Terrorism. ]

Note - The US Pentagon claimed that 36 former Guantanamo
Inmates were "Confirmed or Suspected of having returned to
Terrorism".

oh the silence - no name - no address - just so much
liberal rhetoric from canada~ RHF

(OT) SPECIAL: for Ace and other ditto heads
 

Brody wrote:
dave wrote:
Brody wrote:

beyond bizzare.. by this logic, every Jap and German POW should have
had a US lawyer and his day in a US court, and presumably release on
bond until his court date


Most of the people at Guantanamo were turned-in for bounty or
otherwise the result of something other than capture on the battlefield

source ?

The media and public fascination with who is detained at
Guantanamo and why has been
fueled in large measure by the refusal of the Government, on the grounds
of national security, to
provide much information about the individuals and the charges against
them. The information
available to date has been anecdotal and erratic, drawn largely from
interviews with the few
detainees who have been released or from statements or court filings by
their attorneys in the
pending habeas corpus proceedings that the Government has not declared
“classified.”
This Report is the first effort to provide a more detailed
picture of who the Guantanamo
detainees are, how they ended up there, and the purported bases for
their enemy combatant
designation. The data in this Report is based entirely upon the United
States Government’s own
documents.1 This Report provides a window into the Government’s success
detaining only those
that the President has called “the worst of the worst.”
Among the data revealed by this Report:
1. Fifty-five percent (55%) of the detainees are not
determined to have committed any
hostile acts against the United States or its coalition allies.
Only 8% of the detainees were characterized as al
Qaeda fighters. Of the remaining
2.
detainees, 40% have no definitive connection with al Qaeda at all and
18% are have no definitive
affiliation with either al Qaeda or the Taliban.
The Government has detained numerous persons based on
mere affiliations with a
3.
large number of groups that in fact, are not on the Department of
Homeland Security terrorist
watchlist. Moreover, the nexus between such a detainee and such
organizations varies considerably.
Eight percent are detained because they are deemed “fighters for;” 30%
considered “members of;” a
large majority – 60% -- are detained merely because they are “associated
with” a group or groups the
Government asserts are terrorist organizations. For 2% of the prisoners
their nexus to any terrorist
group is unidentified.
4. Only 5% of the detainees were captured by United
States forces. 86% of the
detainees were arrested by either Pakistan or the Northern Alliance and
turned over to United States
custody.

This 86% of the detainees captured by Pakistan or the Northern Alliance
were handed over to the
United States at a time in which the United States offered large
bounties for capture of suspected
enemies.

* The authors are counsel for two detainees in Guantanamo.

http://law.shu.edu/news/guantanamo_reports.htm

http://law.shu.edu/aaafinal.pdf

(OT) : Canada the New Jihad-land of the "Wrongfully Imprisoned"Islam-O-Facist from GITMO
 

On Jun 14, 5:12*am, John Barnard wrote:
Telamon wrote:
In article 8yJ4k.1364$L03.1142@edtnps92, m II wrote:

Telamon wrote:

Yes torturous, mental in exchange for the physical. The supreme court
has seen fit to torture us all in exchange for the lot that has befallen
jailed foreign terrorists who are not US citizens. Military combatants
who would kill you if they had the chance, would deny you your rights if
they had the chance, and have no standing in our courts should get the
rights we posses? I don't think so.

Who is denying rights? It's already happened. Washington did it.
Whatever became of innocent until proven guilty? When did the US
convert to Napoleanic law? Nowadays, the US assumes guilt and then
denies the right of a trial. That is hell. Wake up.

Look up Napoleanic Law. You might as well learn it, now that it's
replaced the Constitution.

- - You don't seem to understand the Constitution
- - applies to US citizens not foreign military combatants.

- Moron!
-
- And what about those people who have been wrongfully imprisoned?
-
- You deserve to live in a police state!
-
- JB

JB - You deserve to Live in a Canada Occupied by your
'wrongfully imprisoned' Islam-O-Facist friends. ~ RHF

JB - Give us your Name and Address : We will send all
the ones who 'claim' that they were 'wrongfully imprisoned"
over to stay with you so that you can help them to get
over their "wrongfully imprisonment".

GITMO - Guantanamo Bay Detention Camp
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guantan...detention_camp
Since the beginning of the current war in Afghanistan,
* 775 detainees have been brought to Guantanamo,
* Approximately 420 of which have been released without charge.
* As of May 2008, approximately 270 detainees remain.
* More than a Fifth (1/5) are Cleared for Release but may have
to wait Months or Years because U.S. Officials are finding it
increasingly difficult to persuade Countries to accept them,
* According to Officials and Defense Lawyers.
* Of the Roughly 355 still Incarcerated,
* U.S. Officials said they intend to eventually put 60 to 80 on trial
* and Free the Rest.

OH CANADA - OPEN UP YOUR DOORS TO SET THE
WRONGFULLY IMPRISONED FREE: GIVE THE GITMO
DETAINEES A HOME TO PLAN THEIR NEXT JIHAD .
[ Jihad -aka- Islam-O-Facist Act of Terrorism. ]

Note - The US Pentagon claimed that 36 former Guantanamo
Inmates were "Confirmed or Suspected of having returned to
Terrorism".

oh the silence - no name - no address - just so much
liberal rhetoric from canada~ RHF

(OT) SPECIAL: for Ace and other ditto heads
 

On Jun 14, 1:02*am, Brody wrote:
m II wrote:
Telamon wrote:

Yes torturous, mental in exchange for the physical. The supreme court
has seen fit to torture us all in exchange for the lot that has befallen
jailed foreign terrorists who are not US citizens. Military combatants
who would kill you if they had the chance, would deny you your rights if
they had the chance, and have no standing in our courts should get the
rights we posses? I don't think so.

Who is denying rights? It's already happened. Washington did it.
Whatever became of innocent until proven guilty?

- beyond bizzare.. by this logic, every Jap and German POW
- should have had a US lawyer and his day in a US court,
- and presumably release on bond until his court date

BRODY - You Got It - War-by-Lawyer ~ RHF
-ps- and the US Taxpayers Paying the Bill.




When did the US convert
to Napoleanic law?
Nowadays, the US assumes guilt and then denies the right of a trial.
That is hell. Wake up.

Look up Napoleanic Law. You might as well learn it, now that it's
replaced the Constitution.

mike- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

(OT) SPECIAL: for Ace and other ditto heads
 

On Jun 14, 7:05*am, dave wrote:
Brody wrote:
beyond bizzare.. by this logic, every Jap and German POW should have had
a US lawyer and his day in a US court, and presumably release on bond
until his court date

Most of the people at Guantanamo were turned-in for bounty or otherwise
the result of something other than capture on the battlefield. If they
are POWs, this ruling doesn't apply. *They are to be held under the
Geneva Conventions, which do not allow torture.

- There is no Declaration of War in effect right now,

Dave,

Pointing out the US Congress' Failure to Act to
Protect the USA and American Citizens.

~ RHF

unlike the Japs and
the Gerrys.

(OT) SPECIAL: for Ace and other ditto heads
 

Brody wrote:
dave wrote:

Brody wrote:

dave wrote:

Brody wrote:

beyond bizzare.. by this logic, every Jap and German POW should
have had a US lawyer and his day in a US court, and presumably
release on bond until his court date


Most of the people at Guantanamo were turned-in for bounty or
otherwise the result of something other than capture on the battlefield


source ?

The media and public fascination with who is detained at
Guantanamo and why has been
fueled in large measure by the refusal of the Government, on the
grounds of national security, to
provide much information about the individuals and the charges against
them. The information
available to date has been anecdotal and erratic, drawn largely from
interviews with the few
detainees who have been released or from statements or court filings
by their attorneys in the
pending habeas corpus proceedings that the Government has not declared
“classified.”
This Report is the first effort to provide a more detailed
picture of who the Guantanamo
detainees are, how they ended up there, and the purported bases for
their enemy combatant
designation. The data in this Report is based entirely upon the United
States Government’s own
documents.1 This Report provides a window into the Government’s
success detaining only those
that the President has called “the worst of the worst.”
Among the data revealed by this Report:
1. Fifty-five percent (55%) of the detainees are not
determined to have committed any
hostile acts against the United States or its coalition allies.
Only 8% of the detainees were characterized as al
Qaeda fighters. Of the remaining
2.
detainees, 40% have no definitive connection with al Qaeda at all and
18% are have no definitive
affiliation with either al Qaeda or the Taliban.
The Government has detained numerous persons based on
mere affiliations with a
3.
large number of groups that in fact, are not on the Department of
Homeland Security terrorist
watchlist. Moreover, the nexus between such a detainee and such
organizations varies considerably.
Eight percent are detained because they are deemed “fighters for;” 30%
considered “members of;” a
large majority – 60% -- are detained merely because they are
“associated with” a group or groups the
Government asserts are terrorist organizations. For 2% of the
prisoners their nexus to any terrorist
group is unidentified.
4. Only 5% of the detainees were captured by United
States forces. 86% of the
detainees were arrested by either Pakistan or the Northern Alliance
and turned over to United States
custody.

This 86% of the detainees captured by Pakistan or the Northern
Alliance were handed over to the
United States at a time in which the United States offered large
bounties for capture of suspected
enemies.

* The authors are counsel for two detainees in Guantanamo.


Your source is the terrorists lawyers

here is my source

http://www.defenselink.mil/home/features/gitmo/
http://www.defenselink.mil/news/news....aspx?id=14844

You mean the detainees' lawyers. I'll believe them before I'll believe
some DOD flack for the Bush Crime Family.

(OT) SPECIAL: for Ace and other ditto heads
 

dave wrote:
Brody wrote:

dave wrote:

Brody wrote:

dave wrote:

Brody wrote:

beyond bizzare.. by this logic, every Jap and German POW should
have had a US lawyer and his day in a US court, and presumably
release on bond until his court date


Most of the people at Guantanamo were turned-in for bounty or
otherwise the result of something other than capture on the
battlefield



source ?

The media and public fascination with who is detained at
Guantanamo and why has been
fueled in large measure by the refusal of the Government, on the
grounds of national security, to
provide much information about the individuals and the charges
against them. The information
available to date has been anecdotal and erratic, drawn largely from
interviews with the few
detainees who have been released or from statements or court filings
by their attorneys in the
pending habeas corpus proceedings that the Government has not
declared “classified.”
This Report is the first effort to provide a more detailed
picture of who the Guantanamo
detainees are, how they ended up there, and the purported bases for
their enemy combatant
designation. The data in this Report is based entirely upon the
United States Government’s own
documents.1 This Report provides a window into the Government’s
success detaining only those
that the President has called “the worst of the worst.”
Among the data revealed by this Report:
1. Fifty-five percent (55%) of the detainees are not
determined to have committed any
hostile acts against the United States or its coalition allies.
Only 8% of the detainees were characterized as al
Qaeda fighters. Of the remaining
2.
detainees, 40% have no definitive connection with al Qaeda at all and
18% are have no definitive
affiliation with either al Qaeda or the Taliban.
The Government has detained numerous persons based
on mere affiliations with a
3.
large number of groups that in fact, are not on the Department of
Homeland Security terrorist
watchlist. Moreover, the nexus between such a detainee and such
organizations varies considerably.
Eight percent are detained because they are deemed “fighters for;”
30% considered “members of;” a
large majority – 60% -- are detained merely because they are
“associated with” a group or groups the
Government asserts are terrorist organizations. For 2% of the
prisoners their nexus to any terrorist
group is unidentified.
4. Only 5% of the detainees were captured by United
States forces. 86% of the
detainees were arrested by either Pakistan or the Northern Alliance
and turned over to United States
custody.

This 86% of the detainees captured by Pakistan or the Northern
Alliance were handed over to the
United States at a time in which the United States offered large
bounties for capture of suspected
enemies.

* The authors are counsel for two detainees in Guantanamo.



Your source is the terrorists lawyers

here is my source

http://www.defenselink.mil/home/features/gitmo/
http://www.defenselink.mil/news/news....aspx?id=14844

You mean the detainees' lawyers.

no.. I mean the terrorists lawyers..

I'll believe them before I'll believe
some DOD flack for the Bush Crime Family.

Of course you would... and in WWII you and your liberal friends would
take the word of Nazi Germany and Imperial Japan's propagandists before
the word of the Allies.

(OT) SPECIAL: for Ace and other ditto heads
 

Telamon wrote:

Some human beings are more equal than others in the eyes of God?

Of course not. Are you saying God follows or wrote the US Constitution?

It wouldn't have mattered anyway. The Patriot Act overrules God.




mike


--
Due to the insane amount of spam and garbage, this filter
blocks all postings from Gmail, Google Mail and Google Groups.

http://improve-usenet.org/

(OT) SPECIAL: for Ace and other ditto heads
 

Brody wrote:

Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld expressed frustration over this
effort during a June 21 interview on the "Tony Snow Show."

Is he the same guy that said prisoner suicide was actually 'Asymmetrical
warfare' against the US? No, wait..that was war criminal Harris, who,
coincidentally, was only following orders.


mike

--
Due to the insane amount of spam and garbage, this filter
blocks all postings from Gmail, Google Mail and Google Groups.

http://improve-usenet.org/

(OT) : The Failure of the US Congress to Protect the USA andUS Citizens from Terrorist Attacks by Islam-O-Facists.
 

Telamon wrote:

The English at the time executed anyone that gave them a problem on the
spot. The English military were judge, jury, and executioner. They
killed anyone they felt like killing at the time. If they came across
someone's farm house they wanted to stay at and the people didn't move
out fast enough they were shot.


Very much like Iraq? Were there premeditated rapes of fourteen year olds
and the subsequent murder of her family?

History seems to repeat itself.

The US fought the English and now, the Iraqis are fighting you.


mike






--
Due to the insane amount of spam and garbage, this filter
blocks all postings from Gmail, Google Mail and Google Groups.

http://improve-usenet.org/

(OT) : Stop the Abortion of Liberalcide !
 

Brody wrote:

Seems your are to lazy to read site linked to in the original post, or
the hate messages the article generated

Why would I read a site that classifies a group of people as stupid?

The poster quoted:
=======================================
An April 2007 Pew Research Study survey found that viewers of the
conservative Fox News channel had the lowest knowledge of national and
international affairs."
=======================================

This says 'viewers'. That could be anybody. I'm sure both political
wings watch each other's propaganda.

I'd rather watch factual NEWS. Editorial comment belongs in the opinion
section.



mike

--
Due to the insane amount of spam and garbage, this filter
blocks all postings from Gmail, Google Mail and Google Groups.

http://improve-usenet.org/

(OT) : The Failure of the US Congress to Protect the USA and US Citizens from Terrorist Attacks by Islam-O-Facists.
 

In article Mt15k.1435$sg6.1117@edtnps91, m II wrote:

Telamon wrote:

The English at the time executed anyone that gave them a problem on the
spot. The English military were judge, jury, and executioner. They
killed anyone they felt like killing at the time. If they came across
someone's farm house they wanted to stay at and the people didn't move
out fast enough they were shot.


Very much like Iraq? Were there premeditated rapes of fourteen year olds
and the subsequent murder of her family?

You were there to see this?

History seems to repeat itself.

Most days.

The US fought the English and now, the Iraqis are fighting you.

They are not fighting me or the US troops. There are some insurgents
trained and supplied in Iran trying to create mayhem in Iraq though.

--
Telamon
Ventura, California

(OT) : Stop the Abortion of Liberalcide !
 

RHF wrote:

Stop the Abortion of Liberalcide !


I've been meaning to ask....what does the above line mean? I've looked
at it from all angles and still can't figure it out.





mike

--
Due to the insane amount of spam and garbage, this filter
blocks all postings from Gmail, Google Mail and Google Groups.

http://improve-usenet.org/

(OT) SPECIAL: for Ace and other ditto heads
 

Brody wrote:
dave wrote:
Brody wrote:

dave wrote:

Brody wrote:

dave wrote:

Brody wrote:

beyond bizzare.. by this logic, every Jap and German POW should
have had a US lawyer and his day in a US court, and presumably
release on bond until his court date


Most of the people at Guantanamo were turned-in for bounty or
otherwise the result of something other than capture on the
battlefield



source ?

The media and public fascination with who is detained at
Guantanamo and why has been
fueled in large measure by the refusal of the Government, on the
grounds of national security, to
provide much information about the individuals and the charges
against them. The information
available to date has been anecdotal and erratic, drawn largely from
interviews with the few
detainees who have been released or from statements or court filings
by their attorneys in the
pending habeas corpus proceedings that the Government has not
declared “classified.”
This Report is the first effort to provide a more detailed
picture of who the Guantanamo
detainees are, how they ended up there, and the purported bases for
their enemy combatant
designation. The data in this Report is based entirely upon the
United States Government’s own
documents.1 This Report provides a window into the Government’s
success detaining only those
that the President has called “the worst of the worst.”
Among the data revealed by this Report:
1. Fifty-five percent (55%) of the detainees are not
determined to have committed any
hostile acts against the United States or its coalition allies.
Only 8% of the detainees were characterized as al
Qaeda fighters. Of the remaining
2.
detainees, 40% have no definitive connection with al Qaeda at all
and 18% are have no definitive
affiliation with either al Qaeda or the Taliban.
The Government has detained numerous persons based
on mere affiliations with a
3.
large number of groups that in fact, are not on the Department of
Homeland Security terrorist
watchlist. Moreover, the nexus between such a detainee and such
organizations varies considerably.
Eight percent are detained because they are deemed “fighters for;”
30% considered “members of;” a
large majority – 60% -- are detained merely because they are
“associated with” a group or groups the
Government asserts are terrorist organizations. For 2% of the
prisoners their nexus to any terrorist
group is unidentified.
4. Only 5% of the detainees were captured by United
States forces. 86% of the
detainees were arrested by either Pakistan or the Northern Alliance
and turned over to United States
custody.

This 86% of the detainees captured by Pakistan or the Northern
Alliance were handed over to the
United States at a time in which the United States offered large
bounties for capture of suspected
enemies.

* The authors are counsel for two detainees in Guantanamo.



Your source is the terrorists lawyers

here is my source

http://www.defenselink.mil/home/features/gitmo/
http://www.defenselink.mil/news/news....aspx?id=14844

You mean the detainees' lawyers.

no.. I mean the terrorists lawyers..

I'll believe them before I'll believe some DOD flack for the Bush
Crime Family.

Of course you would... and in WWII you and your liberal friends would
take the word of Nazi Germany and Imperial Japan's propagandists before
the word of the Allies.

You really need to get out more. That's a terrible analogy. Again I
remind you, there is no Declaration of War.

The USA is not in any great danger. When the Soviets were within 15
minutes of wasting both coasts we didn't trample the Constitution this
bad. (My "grow a pair" analogy...)

(OT) SPECIAL: for Ace and other ditto heads
 

dave wrote:

Brody wrote:
dave wrote:
Brody wrote:

dave wrote:

Brody wrote:

dave wrote:

Brody wrote:

beyond bizzare.. by this logic, every Jap and German POW should
have had a US lawyer and his day in a US court, and presumably
release on bond until his court date


Most of the people at Guantanamo were turned-in for bounty or
otherwise the result of something other than capture on the
battlefield



source ?

The media and public fascination with who is detained at
Guantanamo and why has been
fueled in large measure by the refusal of the Government, on the
grounds of national security, to
provide much information about the individuals and the charges
against them. The information
available to date has been anecdotal and erratic, drawn largely from
interviews with the few
detainees who have been released or from statements or court filings
by their attorneys in the
pending habeas corpus proceedings that the Government has not
declared “classified.”
This Report is the first effort to provide a more detailed
picture of who the Guantanamo
detainees are, how they ended up there, and the purported bases for
their enemy combatant
designation. The data in this Report is based entirely upon the
United States Government’s own
documents.1 This Report provides a window into the Government’s
success detaining only those
that the President has called “the worst of the worst.”
Among the data revealed by this Report:
1. Fifty-five percent (55%) of the detainees are not
determined to have committed any
hostile acts against the United States or its coalition allies.
Only 8% of the detainees were characterized as al
Qaeda fighters. Of the remaining
2.
detainees, 40% have no definitive connection with al Qaeda at all
and 18% are have no definitive
affiliation with either al Qaeda or the Taliban.
The Government has detained numerous persons based
on mere affiliations with a
3.
large number of groups that in fact, are not on the Department of
Homeland Security terrorist
watchlist. Moreover, the nexus between such a detainee and such
organizations varies considerably.
Eight percent are detained because they are deemed “fighters for;”
30% considered “members of;” a
large majority – 60% -- are detained merely because they are
“associated with” a group or groups the
Government asserts are terrorist organizations. For 2% of the
prisoners their nexus to any terrorist
group is unidentified.
4. Only 5% of the detainees were captured by United
States forces. 86% of the
detainees were arrested by either Pakistan or the Northern Alliance
and turned over to United States
custody.

This 86% of the detainees captured by Pakistan or the Northern
Alliance were handed over to the
United States at a time in which the United States offered large
bounties for capture of suspected
enemies.

* The authors are counsel for two detainees in Guantanamo.



Your source is the terrorists lawyers

here is my source

http://www.defenselink.mil/home/features/gitmo/
http://www.defenselink.mil/news/news....aspx?id=14844

You mean the detainees' lawyers.

no.. I mean the terrorists lawyers..

I'll believe them before I'll believe some DOD flack for the Bush
Crime Family.

Of course you would... and in WWII you and your liberal friends would
take the word of Nazi Germany and Imperial Japan's propagandists before
the word of the Allies.

You really need to get out more. That's a terrible analogy. Again I
remind you, there is no Declaration of War.

The USA is not in any great danger.

Rickets, as long as there are folks out there like you, we are always in great
danger.

dxAce
Michigan
USA

(OT) SPECIAL: for Ace and other ditto heads
 

dxAce wrote:


The USA is not in any great danger.

Rickets, as long as there are folks out there like you, we are always in great
danger.

dxAce
Michigan
USA


So's your old man!

(OT) SPECIAL: for Ace and other ditto heads
 

dave wrote:

dxAce wrote:


The USA is not in any great danger.

Rickets, as long as there are folks out there like you, we are always
in great
danger.

dxAce
Michigan
USA


So's your old man!


That's really hurtful. They've never met.



mike

--
Due to the insane amount of spam and garbage, this filter
blocks all postings from Gmail, Google Mail and Google Groups.

http://improve-usenet.org/

(OT) SPECIAL: for Ace and other ditto heads
 

m II wrote:

dave wrote:

dxAce wrote:


The USA is not in any great danger.

Rickets, as long as there are folks out there like you, we are always
in great
danger.

dxAce
Michigan
USA


So's your old man!

That's really hurtful. They've never met.

Projecting again?

(OT) SPECIAL: for Ace and other ditto heads
 

Dudette, I am not a ditto head.
cuhulin

(OT) : Oh Canada - Open Up Your Doors to Set the WrongfullyImprisoned Free - Give the GITMO Detainees a Home to Plan Their Next Jihad
 

RHF wrote:
On Jun 14, 5:16 am, John Barnard wrote:
RHF wrote:
On Jun 13, 11:44 pm, Telamon
wrote:
In article 8yJ4k.1364$L03.1142@edtnps92, m II wrote:
Telamon wrote:
Yes torturous, mental in exchange for the physical. The supreme court
has seen fit to torture us all in exchange for the lot that has befallen
jailed foreign terrorists who are not US citizens. Military combatants
who would kill you if they had the chance, would deny you your rights if
they had the chance, and have no standing in our courts should get the
rights we posses? I don't think so.
Who is denying rights? It's already happened. Washington did it.
Whatever became of innocent until proven guilty? When did the US
convert to Napoleanic law? Nowadays, the US assumes guilt and then
denies the right of a trial. That is hell. Wake up.
Look up Napoleanic Law. You might as well learn it, now that it's
replaced the Constitution.
- You don't seem to understand the Constitution applies
- to US citizens not foreign military combatants.
-
- --
- Telamon
- Ventura, California
Telamon - Ditto That !
Point-of-Fact - These 'people' down in Gitmo are
Un-Lawful Military Combatants* : Who are Clearly
Outside the Geneva Convention 1949.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unlawfu...tary_combatant
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geneva_Convention
* They are in-fact Islam-O-Facist Terrorists.
GITMO - Guantanamo Bay Detention Camp
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guantan...detention_camp
The Failure of the US Congress to Protect the USA and
US Citizens from Terrorist Attacks by Islam-O-Facists.
Don't Blame the US Military and the DOD.
Don't Blame the US Justice Department
Don't Blame the US Supreme Court and the Courts
Don't Blame the US President and Administration
Clearly the Blame Belongs to the US Congress*
both Democrats and Republicans alike; and the
US House of representatives and the USSenate alike.
* The US Congress Makes the Laws
* The US Congress Failed to Make Good Laws to deal
effectively with these Un-Lawful Military Combatants
who are Islam-O-Facist Terrorists.
* The US Congress has Failing to Act : This Situation
is the Fault of the US Congress.
as an american citizen and a voter - yes i say that ~ RHF
.- Hide quoted text -

- Does that include those who had been wrongfully imprisoned?
-
- JB

JB - Give us your Name and Address : We will send all
the ones who 'claim' that they were 'wrongfully imprisoned"
over to stay with you so that you can help them to get
over their "wrongfully imprisonment".

GITMO - Guantanamo Bay Detention Camp
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guantan...detention_camp
Since the beginning of the current war in Afghanistan,
* 775 detainees have been brought to Guantanamo,
* Approximately 420 of which have been released without charge.
* As of May 2008, approximately 270 detainees remain.
* More than a Fifth (1/5) are Cleared for Release but may have
to wait Months or Years because U.S. Officials are finding it
increasingly difficult to persuade Countries to accept them,
* According to Officials and Defense Lawyers.
* Of the Roughly 355 still Incarcerated,
* U.S. Officials said they intend to eventually put 60 to 80 on trial
* and Free the Rest.

OH CANADA - OPEN UP YOUR DOORS TO SET THE
WRONGFULLY IMPRISONED FREE: GIVE THE GITMO
DETAINEES A HOME TO PLAN THEIR NEXT JIHAD .
[ Jihad -aka- Islam-O-Facist Act of Terrorism. ]

Note - The US Pentagon claimed that 36 former Guantanamo
Inmates were "Confirmed or Suspected of having returned to
Terrorism".

oh the silence - no name - no address - just so much
liberal rhetoric from canada~ RHF
.

Nature abhors a vacuum and your last name is Hoover.

JB

(OT) : Gitmo Prisoners are Un-Lawful Military Combatants[Islam-O-Facist Terrorists]
 

On Jun 14, 5:16*am, John Barnard wrote:
RHF wrote:
On Jun 13, 11:44 pm, Telamon
wrote:
In article 8yJ4k.1364$L03.1142@edtnps92, m II wrote:
Telamon wrote:
Yes torturous, mental in exchange for the physical. The supreme court
has seen fit to torture us all in exchange for the lot that has befallen
jailed foreign terrorists who are not US citizens. Military combatants
who would kill you if they had the chance, would deny you your rights if
they had the chance, and have no standing in our courts should get the
rights we posses? I don't think so.
Who is denying rights? It's already happened. Washington did it.
Whatever became of innocent until proven guilty? When did the US
convert to Napoleanic law? Nowadays, the US assumes guilt and then
denies the right of a trial. That is hell. Wake up.
Look up Napoleanic Law. You might as well learn it, now that it's
replaced the Constitution.

- You don't seem to understand the Constitution applies
- to US citizens not foreign military combatants.
-
- --
- Telamon
- Ventura, California

Telamon - Ditto That !

Point-of-Fact - These 'people' down in Gitmo are
Un-Lawful Military Combatants* : Who are Clearly
Outside the Geneva Convention 1949.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unlawfu...tary_combatant
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geneva_Convention
* They are in-fact Islam-O-Facist Terrorists.

Does that include those who had been wrongfully imprisoned?

JB





GITMO - Guantanamo Bay Detention Camp
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guantan...detention_camp

The Failure of the US Congress to Protect the USA and
US Citizens from Terrorist Attacks by Islam-O-Facists.

Don't Blame the US Military and the DOD.

Don't Blame the US Justice Department

Don't Blame the US Supreme Court and the Courts

Don't Blame the US President and Administration

Clearly the Blame Belongs to the US Congress*
both Democrats and Republicans alike; and the
US House of representatives and the USSenate alike.
* The US Congress Makes the Laws
* The US Congress Failed to Make Good Laws to deal
effectively with these Un-Lawful Military Combatants
who are Islam-O-Facist Terrorists.
* The US Congress has Failing to Act : This Situation
is the Fault of the US Congress.

as an american citizen and a voter - yes i say that ~ RHF
*.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

JB - It's a Package Deal ~ RHF
-aka- The Gift That Just Keeps On Killing

(OT) : Oh Canada - Open Up Your Doors to Set the WrongfullyImprisoned Free - Give the GITMO Detainees a Home to Plan Their Next Jihad
 

On Jun 15, 9:45*am, John Barnard wrote:
RHF wrote:
On Jun 14, 5:16 am, John Barnard wrote:
RHF wrote:
On Jun 13, 11:44 pm, Telamon
wrote:
In article 8yJ4k.1364$L03.1142@edtnps92, m II wrote:
Telamon wrote:
Yes torturous, mental in exchange for the physical. The supreme court
has seen fit to torture us all in exchange for the lot that has befallen
jailed foreign terrorists who are not US citizens. Military combatants
who would kill you if they had the chance, would deny you your rights if
they had the chance, and have no standing in our courts should get the
rights we posses? I don't think so.
Who is denying rights? It's already happened. Washington did it.
Whatever became of innocent until proven guilty? When did the US
convert to Napoleanic law? Nowadays, the US assumes guilt and then
denies the right of a trial. That is hell. Wake up.
Look up Napoleanic Law. You might as well learn it, now that it's
replaced the Constitution.
- You don't seem to understand the Constitution applies
- to US citizens not foreign military combatants.
-
- --
- Telamon
- Ventura, California
Telamon - Ditto That !
Point-of-Fact - These 'people' down in Gitmo are
Un-Lawful Military Combatants* : Who are Clearly
Outside the Geneva Convention 1949.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unlawfu...tary_combatant
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geneva_Convention
* They are in-fact Islam-O-Facist Terrorists.
GITMO - Guantanamo Bay Detention Camp
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guantan...detention_camp
The Failure of the US Congress to Protect the USA and
US Citizens from Terrorist Attacks by Islam-O-Facists.
Don't Blame the US Military and the DOD.
Don't Blame the US Justice Department
Don't Blame the US Supreme Court and the Courts
Don't Blame the US President and Administration
Clearly the Blame Belongs to the US Congress*
both Democrats and Republicans alike; and the
US House of representatives and the USSenate alike.
* The US Congress Makes the Laws
* The US Congress Failed to Make Good Laws to deal
effectively with these Un-Lawful Military Combatants
who are Islam-O-Facist Terrorists.
* The US Congress has Failing to Act : This Situation
is the Fault of the US Congress.
as an american citizen and a voter - yes i say that ~ RHF
*.- Hide quoted text -

- Does that include those who had been wrongfully imprisoned?
-
- JB

JB - Give us your Name and Address : We will send all
the ones who 'claim' that they were 'wrongfully imprisoned"
over to stay with you so that you can help them to get
over their "wrongfully imprisonment".

GITMO - Guantanamo Bay Detention Camp
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guantan...detention_camp
Since the beginning of the current war in Afghanistan,
* 775 detainees have been brought to Guantanamo,
* Approximately 420 of which have been released without charge.
* As of May 2008, approximately 270 detainees remain.
* More than a Fifth (1/5) are Cleared for Release but may have
to wait Months or Years because U.S. Officials are finding it
increasingly difficult to persuade Countries to accept them,
* According to Officials and Defense Lawyers.
* Of the Roughly 355 still Incarcerated,
* U.S. Officials said they intend to eventually put 60 to 80 on trial
* and Free the Rest.

OH CANADA - OPEN UP YOUR DOORS TO SET THE
WRONGFULLY IMPRISONED FREE: GIVE THE GITMO
DETAINEES A HOME TO PLAN THEIR NEXT JIHAD .
[ Jihad -aka- Islam-O-Facist Act of Terrorism. ]

Note - The US Pentagon claimed that 36 former Guantanamo
Inmates were "Confirmed or Suspected of having returned to
Terrorism".

oh the silence - no name - no address - just so much
liberal rhetoric from canada~ RHF
*.

- Nature abhors a vacuum and your last name is Hoover.
-
- JB

JB - Boy Howdy are you oso wrong

D'Oh ! with the Initials R. H. F.
Dah -The last name ain't Hoover.
HOOVER is my middle name ;-}

it sucks to be me ~ RHF

(OT) SPECIAL: for Ace and other ditto heads
 

dave wrote:
Brody wrote:

dave wrote:

Brody wrote:

dave wrote:

Brody wrote:

dave wrote:

Brody wrote:

beyond bizzare.. by this logic, every Jap and German POW should
have had a US lawyer and his day in a US court, and presumably
release on bond until his court date


Most of the people at Guantanamo were turned-in for bounty or
otherwise the result of something other than capture on the
battlefield




source ?

The media and public fascination with who is detained at
Guantanamo and why has been
fueled in large measure by the refusal of the Government, on the
grounds of national security, to
provide much information about the individuals and the charges
against them. The information
available to date has been anecdotal and erratic, drawn largely
from interviews with the few
detainees who have been released or from statements or court
filings by their attorneys in the
pending habeas corpus proceedings that the Government has not
declared “classified.”
This Report is the first effort to provide a more detailed
picture of who the Guantanamo
detainees are, how they ended up there, and the purported bases for
their enemy combatant
designation. The data in this Report is based entirely upon the
United States Government’s own
documents.1 This Report provides a window into the Government’s
success detaining only those
that the President has called “the worst of the worst.”
Among the data revealed by this Report:
1. Fifty-five percent (55%) of the detainees are not
determined to have committed any
hostile acts against the United States or its coalition allies.
Only 8% of the detainees were characterized as al
Qaeda fighters. Of the remaining
2.
detainees, 40% have no definitive connection with al Qaeda at all
and 18% are have no definitive
affiliation with either al Qaeda or the Taliban.
The Government has detained numerous persons based
on mere affiliations with a
3.
large number of groups that in fact, are not on the Department of
Homeland Security terrorist
watchlist. Moreover, the nexus between such a detainee and such
organizations varies considerably.
Eight percent are detained because they are deemed “fighters for;”
30% considered “members of;” a
large majority – 60% -- are detained merely because they are
“associated with” a group or groups the
Government asserts are terrorist organizations. For 2% of the
prisoners their nexus to any terrorist
group is unidentified.
4. Only 5% of the detainees were captured by United
States forces. 86% of the
detainees were arrested by either Pakistan or the Northern Alliance
and turned over to United States
custody.

This 86% of the detainees captured by Pakistan or the Northern
Alliance were handed over to the
United States at a time in which the United States offered large
bounties for capture of suspected
enemies.

* The authors are counsel for two detainees in Guantanamo.




Your source is the terrorists lawyers

here is my source

http://www.defenselink.mil/home/features/gitmo/
http://www.defenselink.mil/news/news....aspx?id=14844

You mean the detainees' lawyers.


no.. I mean the terrorists lawyers..

I'll believe them before I'll believe some DOD flack for the Bush
Crime Family.


Of course you would... and in WWII you and your liberal friends would
take the word of Nazi Germany and Imperial Japan's propagandists
before the word of the Allies.


You really need to get out more. That's a terrible analogy.

Why ? because you declare it so ??
During the period the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact was in effect, US "peace
groups" opposed war with Hitler. Of course that all changed when Hitler
invaded Soviet Russia.

Again I
remind you, there is no Declaration of War.

So ?? The Vietnam war and Korean war were not declared wars... whats
your point...


The USA is not in any great danger.

Thanks to President Bush's actions.

When the Soviets were within 15
minutes of wasting both coasts we didn't trample the Constitution this
bad. (My "grow a pair" analogy...)

The Constitution is not being trampled simply because you and your waco
socialist friends declare it to be so.

(OT) SPECIAL: for Ace and other ditto heads
 

Brody wrote:

The USA is not in any great danger.

Thanks to President Bush's actions.


Place banana in your ear.
Observe that there is no alligators around.
Conclude banana placed in ear keeps alligators away.



mike

--
Due to the insane amount of spam and garbage, this filter
blocks all postings from Gmail, Google Mail and Google Groups.

http://improve-usenet.org/

(OT) SPECIAL: for Ace and other ditto heads
 

m II wrote:

Brody wrote:

The USA is not in any great danger.

Thanks to President Bush's actions.

Place banana in your ear.
Observe that there is no alligators around.
Conclude banana placed in ear keeps alligators away.

Wow, something else you dumbass Canucks do to pass the time.

(OT) : Banana Special for Mike [M II]
 

On Jun 15, 10:02*pm, m II wrote:
Brody wrote:
*The USA is not in any great danger.

Thanks to President Bush's actions.

- Place banana in your ear.
- Observe that there is no alligators around.
- Conclude banana placed in ear keeps alligators away.
-
- mike

Place Banana in your Keyboard.
Observe that there is a Mike [M II] Poston the PC Monitor.
Conclude Mike [M II] is Full of Bananas.

~ RHF

(OT) SPECIAL: for Ace and other ditto heads
 

All US military bases are US soil, just as are all US embassies. As such,
the US Supreme Court and lower Federal courts have jurisdiction over
anyone being detained on any US military base.

There is no presiding US court judge at any US military base in a foreign
country, but all JAG court decisions are appealable and addressable to US
Federal courts, including the Supreme Court.


I always wondered why the US airbases in the UK were called RAF Stations,
not USAF Bases - now I know why.

Thanks for the info.

(OT) SPECIAL: for Ace and other ditto heads
 

In article ,
"Dave Holford" wrote:


All US military bases are US soil, just as are all US embassies. As such,
the US Supreme Court and lower Federal courts have jurisdiction over
anyone being detained on any US military base.

There is no presiding US court judge at any US military base in a foreign
country, but all JAG court decisions are appealable and addressable to US
Federal courts, including the Supreme Court.


I always wondered why the US airbases in the UK were called RAF Stations,
not USAF Bases - now I know why.

Thanks for the info.

That's right. Foreign US military bases are not US soil. Usually they
are some kind of lease agreement where they US has use of the land for
some period of time but the country they are in is not giving up all
rights to the land during the lease. US law does not recognize these
agreements as "US soil" to my knowledge.

--
Telamon
Ventura, California

(OT) SPECIAL: for Ace and other ditto heads
 

"Telamon" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"Dave Holford" wrote:


All US military bases are US soil, just as are all US embassies. As
such,
the US Supreme Court and lower Federal courts have jurisdiction over
anyone being detained on any US military base.

There is no presiding US court judge at any US military base in a
foreign
country, but all JAG court decisions are appealable and addressable to
US
Federal courts, including the Supreme Court.


I always wondered why the US airbases in the UK were called RAF Stations,
not USAF Bases - now I know why.

Thanks for the info.

That's right. Foreign US military bases are not US soil. Usually they
are some kind of lease agreement where they US has use of the land for
some period of time but the country they are in is not giving up all
rights to the land during the lease. US law does not recognize these
agreements as "US soil" to my knowledge.


SOFA agreements (like the one Bush is trying to force on the Iraqi
government ATM), cover this. Anyone that the US holds, the US has
jurisdiction over. If, on the other hand, someone under the SOFA is busted
doing something outside the base (which IS sovereign US territory, just as
an embassy is, regardless of any contractural agreement that cedes the land
to the US during whatever period is negotiated), then they may or may not be
under jurisdiction of the host country.

(OT) SPECIAL: for Ace and other ditto heads
 

"Brenda Ann" wrote in message
...

"Telamon" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"Dave Holford" wrote:


All US military bases are US soil, just as are all US embassies. As
such,
the US Supreme Court and lower Federal courts have jurisdiction over
anyone being detained on any US military base.

There is no presiding US court judge at any US military base in a
foreign
country, but all JAG court decisions are appealable and addressable to
US
Federal courts, including the Supreme Court.


I always wondered why the US airbases in the UK were called RAF
Stations,
not USAF Bases - now I know why.

Thanks for the info.

That's right. Foreign US military bases are not US soil. Usually they
are some kind of lease agreement where they US has use of the land for
some period of time but the country they are in is not giving up all
rights to the land during the lease. US law does not recognize these
agreements as "US soil" to my knowledge.


SOFA agreements (like the one Bush is trying to force on the Iraqi
government ATM), cover this. Anyone that the US holds, the US has
jurisdiction over. If, on the other hand, someone under the SOFA is busted
doing something outside the base (which IS sovereign US territory, just as
an embassy is, regardless of any contractural agreement that cedes the
land to the US during whatever period is negotiated), then they may or may
not be under jurisdiction of the host country.


Not that I want to prolong this discussion, which has nothing whatsoever to
do with shortwave radio and obviously belongs elsewhere; but the only
jurisdictional statements relating to individuals I can find in SOFA
agreements is that the US has jurisdiction over offences by Americans
against Americans, and offences by Americans in the performance of official
duties. All other situations are subject to the jurisdiction of the host
state. It appears to be the activity, not the location which determines who
has jurisdiction. - bearing in mind that these are generalities since all
SOFAs are unique.

(OT) SPECIAL: for Ace and other ditto heads
 

Telamon wrote:
In article ,
"Dave Holford" wrote:

All US military bases are US soil, just as are all US embassies. As such,
the US Supreme Court and lower Federal courts have jurisdiction over
anyone being detained on any US military base.

There is no presiding US court judge at any US military base in a foreign
country, but all JAG court decisions are appealable and addressable to US
Federal courts, including the Supreme Court.

I always wondered why the US airbases in the UK were called RAF Stations,
not USAF Bases - now I know why.

Thanks for the info.

That's right. Foreign US military bases are not US soil. Usually they
are some kind of lease agreement where they US has use of the land for
some period of time but the country they are in is not giving up all
rights to the land during the lease. US law does not recognize these
agreements as "US soil" to my knowledge.

Then John McCain is a furriner.

(OT) SPECIAL: for Ace and other ditto heads
 

On Jun 17, 5:22*am, "Dave Holford" wrote:
"Brenda Ann" wrote in message

...





"Telamon" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"Dave Holford" wrote:

All US military bases are US soil, just as are all US embassies. As
such,
the US Supreme Court and lower Federal courts have jurisdiction over
anyone being detained on any US military base.

There is no presiding US court judge at any US military base in a
foreign
country, but all JAG court decisions are appealable and addressable to
US
Federal courts, including the Supreme Court.

I always wondered why the US airbases in the UK were called RAF
Stations,
not USAF Bases - now I know why.

Thanks for the info.

That's right. Foreign US military bases are not US soil. Usually they
are some kind of lease agreement where they US has use of the land for
some period of time but the country they are in is not giving up all
rights to the land during the lease. US law does not recognize these
agreements as "US soil" to my knowledge.

SOFA agreements (like the one Bush is trying to force on the Iraqi
government ATM), cover this. *Anyone that the US holds, the US has
jurisdiction over. If, on the other hand, someone under the SOFA is busted
doing something outside the base (which IS sovereign US territory, just as
an embassy is, regardless of any contractural agreement that cedes the
land to the US during whatever period is negotiated), then they may or may
not be under jurisdiction of the host country.

Not that I want to prolong this discussion, which has nothing whatsoever to
do with shortwave radio and obviously belongs elsewhere; but the only
jurisdictional statements relating to individuals I can find in SOFA
agreements is that the US has jurisdiction over offences by Americans
against Americans, and offences by Americans in the performance of official
duties. All other situations are subject to the jurisdiction of the host
state. It appears to be the activity, not the location which determines who
has jurisdiction. - bearing in mind that these are generalities since all
SOFAs are unique.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Ergo Third Party Nationals are in Limbo - Oops Gitmo.

(OT) 2008 Election Politics - John 'Smiley" McCain is many things. . .
 

RHF wrote:



dang - sure sounds like a us citizen to me - amigo ~ RHF
.

Then Gitmo is also US soil.

(OT) 2008 Election Politics - John 'Smiley" McCain is many things. . .
 

On Jun 17, 7:39*am, dave wrote:
RHF wrote:

- - dang - sure sounds like a us citizen to me - amigo ~ RHF

- Then Gitmo is also US soil.

D'Oh ! - How many of the Islam-O-Facist Terrorist at Gitmo
are Americans ? {Born in the USofA}

D'Oh ! - How many of the Islam-O-Facist Terrorist at Gitmo
had an American Father ?

D'Oh ! - How many of the Islam-O-Facist Terrorist at Gitmo
had an American Mother ?

D'Oh ! - How many of the Islam-O-Facist Terrorist at Gitmo
were even Born on a US Military Base.

hey - may be the islam-o-terrorist are cubans - listen everyone . . .
anybody hear fidel castro saying - let my people free ~ RHF