Does Shortwave still Exist?
 

Does shortwave radio still exist in today's time? Do any countries
still broadcast to the U.S.?

I can get all those countries I listened to in the 1990's on podcasts
now on itunes. I wouldn't mind a new
shortwave to play around with but... I think the fun factor would fade
quickly. It's not old technology, it's really
really really old technology.

I read Passport to World Band Radio closed shop. Sad but, sign of the
times.

Does Shortwave still Exist?
 

On Nov 9, 11:58*pm, "Von Fourche"
wrote:
* * Does shortwave radio still exist in today's time? *Do any countries
still broadcast to the U.S.?

* * I can get all those countries I listened to in the 1990's on podcasts
now on itunes. *I wouldn't mind a new
shortwave to play around with but... * I think the fun factor would fade
quickly. *It's not old technology, it's really
really really old technology.

* I read Passport to World Band Radio closed shop. *Sad but, sign of the
times.

Passport became a victim of several negative trends: poor sales/
circulation of printed periodicals/books everywhere due to IT, poor /
inferior propagation time period , general interest of SW hobby
nowhere near it was just 10 years ago . Plus the current
globaleconomic crisis . Plus loss of interest in manufacture of
good / decent hardware . Most of the current production is a myriad of
extremely low-end portables from PRC . But, we have to remember, that
SW is the only mass medium in the world that cannot be shut down /
controlled 100% by anyone . Other than nature itself !

Does Shortwave still Exist?
 

On Nov 10, 3:29*am, "Geoffrey S. Mendelson"
wrote:

- - Von Fourche wrote:
- - Does shortwave radio still exist in today's time?
- - Do any countries still broadcast to the U.S.?

China [CRI] and Russia [VOR] both still Broadcast
via the Shortwave Radio Bands to the USA in English.

CRI = China Radio International
http://english.cri.cn/
http://www.bclnews.it/a10schedules/china.htm

Does Shortwave still Exist?
 

On Nov 9, 8:58*pm, "Von Fourche"
wrote:
* * Does shortwave radio still exist in today's time? *Do any countries
still broadcast to the U.S.?

Yes and yes, though it's declining, it's not yet obsolete. There still
is no acceptable substitute which can reach populations whose
governments don't allow certain views to be broadcast domestically.

And even when there is, the ionosphere and the laws of physics will
remain. *Some* use will continue to be mad of the ability to bounce
signals off the ionosphere (free of any satellite transponder rental
charges). It's just too convenient to be ignored. It may be a very
different mix of uses than what exists today, but (absent a total
collapse of technological society) I really don't see shortwave being
completely abandoned.

* * I can get all those countries I listened to in the 1990's on podcasts
now on itunes. *I wouldn't mind a new
shortwave to play around with but... * I think the fun factor would fade
quickly. *It's not old technology, it's really
really really old technology.

It's not even 100 years old! How can it be considered "old", yet alone
"really old"? Stone knives and axes, now there's a really really old
technology!

* I read Passport to World Band Radio closed shop. *Sad but, sign of the
times.

One publication going out of business does not mean shortwave has
completely disappeared.

--
David Barts
Portland, OR

Does Shortwave still Exist?
 

On Nov 10, 7:01*am, dave wrote:
Von Fourche wrote:
* * *Does shortwave radio still exist in today's time? *Do any countries
still broadcast to the U.S.?

* * *I can get all those countries I listened to in the 1990's on podcasts
now on itunes. *I wouldn't mind a new
shortwave to play around with but... * I think the fun factor would fade
quickly. *It's not old technology, it's really
really really old technology.

* *I read Passport to World Band Radio closed shop. *Sad but, sign of the
times.

- The true lovers of the technology remain.
- The stamp collectors have moved on.

Dave,

The International News & Info Listeners* have
mostly 'migrated' to the Internet and to Cable
TV and Satellite TV and Satellite Radio.
* This applies to Ex-Pats too wanting current
News and Info from back home.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ex-pat

Just like the many who used to use Amateur[HAM]
Radio and CB Radio : Now simply use a Cellphone.

When "4G" becomes fully implemented nation-wide
in the USA the Desk-Top PC will be 'passe' for
many/most people under the age of 25.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4G

Beyond the basic Cellphone other Stand-A-Lone
4G Devices all Billed by One Provider :
1 - 4G Net-Tablet & Net-Book & Net{Lap}Top
2 - 4G HDTV {Videos} -no-cable-or-dish-
3 - 4G Radio {Audio} -no-sat-radio-
4 - 4G Home Phone {The Second Phone in a
Family Plan for Singles and Families too.}
-no-at&t-land-line-phone-

technology* evolves and people adapt ~ RHF
* technology a driving force of social change

Does Shortwave still Exist?
 

On 11/10/2010 1:22 PM, Steve wrote:
On Nov 9, 11:58 pm, "Von
wrote:
Does shortwave radio still exist in today's time? Do any countries
still broadcast to the U.S.?

I can get all those countries I listened to in the 1990's on podcasts
now on itunes. I wouldn't mind a new
shortwave to play around with but... I think the fun factor would fade
quickly. It's not old technology, it's really
really really old technology.

I read Passport to World Band Radio closed shop. Sad but, sign of the
times.

A lot of people don't use SW radios primarily for listening to AM
broadcast stations. Some people like to hunt beacons, monitor military
frequencies, listen to aeronautical comms, amateur radio operators,
etc. Broadcast listening is only one slice of a large pie.



There's a growing number of amateur operators, experimenters really,
using the AM mode on shortwave, too. You can find them on 3700-3735
kHz, 3860-3890 kHz, 7285-7295 kHz, and a few other spots too.

What's interesting about them is that some are real experimenters
and run transmitters with superb fidelity, some sounding better than
commercial broadcast stations.


With all good wishes,


Kevin, WB4AIO.
--
http://nationalvanguard.org/
http://kevinalfredstrom.com/

Does Shortwave still Exist?
 

On Nov 10, 10:02*am, dave wrote:
wrote:
extremely low-end portables from PRC . But, we have to remember, that
SW is the only mass medium in the world that cannot be shut down /
controlled 100% by anyone . Other than nature itself !

Ever heard of a HARM missile?

HARM is a weapon designed to home in on radio emission, mostly
radars .

Does Shortwave still Exist?
 

Kevin Alfred Strom wrote:


There's a growing number of amateur operators, experimenters really,
using the AM mode on shortwave, too. You can find them on 3700-3735 kHz,
3860-3890 kHz, 7285-7295 kHz, and a few other spots too.

What's interesting about them is that some are real experimenters and
run transmitters with superb fidelity, some sounding better than
commercial broadcast stations.


With all good wishes,


Kevin, WB4AIO.

What's experimental about A3 emission?

Does Shortwave still Exist?
 

On 11/11/2010 10:21 AM, dave wrote:
Kevin Alfred Strom wrote:


There's a growing number of amateur operators, experimenters really,
using the AM mode on shortwave, too. You can find them on
3700-3735 kHz,
3860-3890 kHz, 7285-7295 kHz, and a few other spots too.

What's interesting about them is that some are real experimenters and
run transmitters with superb fidelity, some sounding better than
commercial broadcast stations.


With all good wishes,


Kevin, WB4AIO.

What's experimental about A3 emission?



That's like asking "What's experimental about audio?" The answer is:
an almost infinite number of things.

Some things with which I or my friends have been personally involved
that relate to AM experimentation:

1. Building new kinds of AM/DSB detectors, including ultra-low
distortion detectors, synchronous detectors, stereo (I/Q and U/L)
synchronous detectors, autocorrelation detectors, et cetera.

2. Refining and extending the state of the art in AM transmission,
including Class E and Class D transmitters, pulse-duration
modulation, multiphase pulse duration modulation, I/Q multichannel
modulation, outphasing modulation, use of mathematical transforms
for AM/DSB generation, et cetera.

3. Study of the effectiveness of wider-bandwidth modes with varying
degrees of information redundancy in varying communications
conditions, including AM/DSB versus SSB (the late John Costas,
W2CRR, an amateur AM operator and experimenter, was the pioneer
here, with his "Poisson, Shannon, and the Radio Amateur" in
_Proceedings of the IRE_).

4. Experimentation with audio processing, including multiband AGC,
compressors, distortion-cancelled clipping, audio phase rotators, et
cetera (one of the pioneers in this field, Mike Dorrough, is an
amateur AM operator).

I am sure there are many more examples of AM experimentation than I
am even aware of. It's a mode that seems to attract those with an
experimental bent. Very few AM hams are running stock commercial
gear; usually, at the very least, it is modified for better quality
audio.

Hearing the best of these operators on a receiver with superb audio
-- say, an SP-600 in the 13 kHz bandwidth, with the detector output
fed into a high-fidelity amplifier driving a pair of AR-3ax speakers
-- brings you the true magic of radio in a way that must be heard to
be believed.


With all good wishes,


Kevin.
--
http://nationalvanguard.org/
http://kevinalfredstrom.com/

Does Shortwave still Exist?
 

On Nov 11, 9:56*am, Bob Dobbs wrote:
Kevin Alfred Strom wrote:

What's interesting about them is that some are real experimenters
and run transmitters with superb fidelity, some sounding better than
commercial broadcast stations.

When are HAMs going to start hacking the iBiquity codec
and going HD-IBOC?
Would be more interesting than some of the ego power trips on 80m.

I would think that HAMs would try an adapt
to and use DRM Transmission versus IBOC.

DRM is Direct Digital and more efficient for
one-to-one direct communications.

IBOC is a Hybrid Analog/Digital and is only
valuable as a backwardly compatible System
for Transitioning from Analog to Digital.

~ RHF

Does Shortwave still Exist?
 

Bob Dobbs wrote:
Kevin Alfred Strom wrote:

What's interesting about them is that some are real experimenters
and run transmitters with superb fidelity, some sounding better than
commercial broadcast stations.

When are HAMs going to start hacking the iBiquity codec
and going HD-IBOC?
Would be more interesting than some of the ego power trips on 80m.

We're trying to avoid proprietary code on the ham bands, for obvious
reasons. Amplitude Modulation is a pretty mature technology; they got
into PDM, PWM, etc. way before switch mode power supplies and Class D
audio amps.

Does Shortwave still Exist?
 

On Nov 11, 1:20*pm, RHF wrote:
On Nov 11, 9:56*am, Bob Dobbs wrote:

Kevin Alfred Strom wrote:

What's interesting about them is that some are real experimenters
and run transmitters with superb fidelity, some sounding better than
commercial broadcast stations.

When are HAMs going to start hacking the iBiquity codec
and going HD-IBOC?
Would be more interesting than some of the ego power trips on 80m.

I would think that HAMs would try an adapt
to and use DRM Transmission versus IBOC.

DRM is Direct Digital and more efficient for
one-to-one direct communications.

IBOC is a Hybrid Analog/Digital and is only
valuable as a backwardly compatible System
for Transitioning from Analog to Digital.

~ RHF
*.

Voice communications are vulgar.

Does Shortwave still Exist?
 

On Nov 11, 12:40*pm, Steve wrote:
On Nov 11, 1:20*pm, RHF wrote:



On Nov 11, 9:56*am, Bob Dobbs wrote:

Kevin Alfred Strom wrote:

What's interesting about them is that some are real experimenters
and run transmitters with superb fidelity, some sounding better than
commercial broadcast stations.

When are HAMs going to start hacking the iBiquity codec
and going HD-IBOC?
Would be more interesting than some of the ego power trips on 80m.

I would think that HAMs would try an adapt
to and use DRM Transmission versus IBOC.

DRM is Direct Digital and more efficient for
one-to-one direct communications.

IBOC is a Hybrid Analog/Digital and is only
valuable as a backwardly compatible System
for Transitioning from Analog to Digital.

~ RHF
*.

- Voice communications are vulgar.

Most "Voice Communications" are in the 'vulgar'.

'language' the code-of-sounds transmitted
by the human voice conveying meaning ~ RHF©

Does Shortwave still Exist?
 

On 10-11-11 02:10 PM, RHF wrote:

- Voice communications are vulgar.

Most "Voice Communications" are in the 'vulgar'.


The word is 'vulgate'. It's Latin for 'the common language' or the
language of the masses. Vulgar is a derivation, meaning 'common' or of
the lower classes.




mike

Does Shortwave still Exist?
 

Herbert Visser wrote:

experimental bent. Very few AM hams are running stock commercial gear;
usually, at the very least, it is modified for better quality audio.

Better than Collins tube gear? How?

Hearing the best of these operators on a receiver with superb audio --
say, an SP-600 in the 13 kHz bandwidth, with the detector output fed
into a high-fidelity amplifier driving a pair of AR-3ax speakers --
brings you the true magic of radio in a way that must be heard to be

Sounds to good to be true :-). I think it's time that we're also going
to start these AM-experiments over here in Europe.

Herbert Visser

There's no shortage of them around here, perhaps you could take a few
with you?

Does Shortwave still Exist?
 

On 11/13/2010 10:36 AM, dave wrote:
Herbert Visser wrote:

experimental bent. Very few AM hams are running stock commercial
gear;
usually, at the very least, it is modified for better quality audio.

Better than Collins tube gear? How?



Stock KW-1s and 32Vs have fairly narrow "communications quality"
audio with middling distortion, though not as bad as some other
manufacturers. The experimental AM crowd often strives for audio
far, far beyond that -- trying to achieve HF audio several degrees
better than, say, KHJ's in its golden days. Some are successful.

In short: lower distortion at higher modulation densities; enhanced
frequency response despite the limitations of the medium;
maintaining excellent intelligibility while retaining high perceived
quality; and that indefinable something that makes for appealing,
beautiful sound.


With every good wish,


Kevin, WB4AIO.
--
http://nationalvanguard.org/
http://kevinalfredstrom.com/

Does Shortwave still Exist?
 

Kevin Alfred Strom wrote:
On 11/13/2010 1:45 PM, dave wrote:
Kevin Alfred Strom wrote:
On 11/13/2010 10:36 AM, dave wrote:
Herbert Visser wrote:

experimental bent. Very few AM hams are running stock commercial
gear;
usually, at the very least, it is modified for better quality
audio.

Better than Collins tube gear? How?



Stock KW-1s and 32Vs have fairly narrow "communications quality"
audio
with middling distortion, though not as bad as some other
manufacturers.
The experimental AM crowd often strives for audio far, far beyond
that
-- trying to achieve HF audio several degrees better than, say,
KHJ's in
its golden days. Some are successful.

In short: lower distortion at higher modulation densities; enhanced
frequency response despite the limitations of the medium; maintaining
excellent intelligibility while retaining high perceived quality; and
that indefinable something that makes for appealing, beautiful sound.


With every good wish,


Kevin, WB4AIO.

Odd. Transmitters back then had to pass "Proof of performance" which
required AF response to 10 kilocycles per second be tested annually.
I worked in a dozen AM stations during the McLendon/Ron Jacobs
"Golden Age". Continental and Collins transmitters sounded great out
of the box. Gates was junk (still is). RCA, GE and Western Electric
also built quirky stuff, but Collins and Continental sounded sweet,
with minimal processing. The magic was in the iron in those days;
good transformers built by artisans are fast disappearing.


I agree with your assessment of old Collins broadcast gear -- I thought
you were talking about Collins amateur gear.

The best-sounding AM transmitters, in my experience, have been digitally
modulated or used low-level balanced modulators to generate AM. But most
of the Collins tube gear was sweet, no doubt.



I think the top photo is from Joe Walsh's house in Sherman Oaks.

http://www.radionational.org/broadca..._ham_bands.htm

Does Shortwave still Exist?
 

On 11/13/2010 2:34 PM, dave wrote:
Kevin Alfred Strom wrote:
On 11/13/2010 1:45 PM, dave wrote:
Kevin Alfred Strom wrote:
On 11/13/2010 10:36 AM, dave wrote:
Herbert Visser wrote:

experimental bent. Very few AM hams are running stock commercial
gear;
usually, at the very least, it is modified for better quality
audio.

Better than Collins tube gear? How?



Stock KW-1s and 32Vs have fairly narrow "communications quality"
audio
with middling distortion, though not as bad as some other
manufacturers.
The experimental AM crowd often strives for audio far, far beyond
that
-- trying to achieve HF audio several degrees better than, say,
KHJ's in
its golden days. Some are successful.

In short: lower distortion at higher modulation densities; enhanced
frequency response despite the limitations of the medium;
maintaining
excellent intelligibility while retaining high perceived
quality; and
that indefinable something that makes for appealing, beautiful
sound.


With every good wish,


Kevin, WB4AIO.

Odd. Transmitters back then had to pass "Proof of performance" which
required AF response to 10 kilocycles per second be tested annually.
I worked in a dozen AM stations during the McLendon/Ron Jacobs
"Golden Age". Continental and Collins transmitters sounded great out
of the box. Gates was junk (still is). RCA, GE and Western Electric
also built quirky stuff, but Collins and Continental sounded sweet,
with minimal processing. The magic was in the iron in those days;
good transformers built by artisans are fast disappearing.


I agree with your assessment of old Collins broadcast gear -- I
thought
you were talking about Collins amateur gear.

The best-sounding AM transmitters, in my experience, have been
digitally
modulated or used low-level balanced modulators to generate AM.
But most
of the Collins tube gear was sweet, no doubt.



I think the top photo is from Joe Walsh's house in Sherman Oaks.

http://www.radionational.org/broadca..._ham_bands.htm






Very nice; thank you!

It appears that the lower photos are from KO6NM, Mike Dorrough, the
inventor of multiband audio processing. And the site is run by
N2SAG, a regular Liberty Net participant. What a confluence of
coincidences!


All the best,


Kevin, WB4AIO.
--
http://nationalvanguard.org/
http://kevinalfredstrom.com/

Does Shortwave still Exist?
 

Kevin Alfred Strom wrote:
On 11/13/2010 2:34 PM, dave wrote:
Kevin Alfred Strom wrote:
On 11/13/2010 1:45 PM, dave wrote:
Kevin Alfred Strom wrote:
On 11/13/2010 10:36 AM, dave wrote:
Herbert Visser wrote:

experimental bent. Very few AM hams are running stock commercial
gear;
usually, at the very least, it is modified for better quality
audio.

Better than Collins tube gear? How?



Stock KW-1s and 32Vs have fairly narrow "communications quality"
audio
with middling distortion, though not as bad as some other
manufacturers.
The experimental AM crowd often strives for audio far, far beyond
that
-- trying to achieve HF audio several degrees better than, say,
KHJ's in
its golden days. Some are successful.

In short: lower distortion at higher modulation densities; enhanced
frequency response despite the limitations of the medium;
maintaining
excellent intelligibility while retaining high perceived
quality; and
that indefinable something that makes for appealing, beautiful
sound.


With every good wish,


Kevin, WB4AIO.

Odd. Transmitters back then had to pass "Proof of performance" which
required AF response to 10 kilocycles per second be tested annually.
I worked in a dozen AM stations during the McLendon/Ron Jacobs
"Golden Age". Continental and Collins transmitters sounded great out
of the box. Gates was junk (still is). RCA, GE and Western Electric
also built quirky stuff, but Collins and Continental sounded sweet,
with minimal processing. The magic was in the iron in those days;
good transformers built by artisans are fast disappearing.


I agree with your assessment of old Collins broadcast gear -- I
thought
you were talking about Collins amateur gear.

The best-sounding AM transmitters, in my experience, have been
digitally
modulated or used low-level balanced modulators to generate AM.
But most
of the Collins tube gear was sweet, no doubt.



I think the top photo is from Joe Walsh's house in Sherman Oaks.

http://www.radionational.org/broadca..._ham_bands.htm






Very nice; thank you!

It appears that the lower photos are from KO6NM, Mike Dorrough, the
inventor of multiband audio processing. And the site is run by N2SAG, a
regular Liberty Net participant. What a confluence of coincidences!


All the best,


Kevin, WB4AIO.

If you live in the San Fernando Valley not so odd.

Does Shortwave still Exist?
 

dave wrote:
Kevin Alfred Strom wrote:

Very nice; thank you!

It appears that the lower photos are from KO6NM, Mike Dorrough, the
inventor of multiband audio processing. And the site is run by N2SAG, a
regular Liberty Net participant. What a confluence of coincidences!


All the best,


Kevin, WB4AIO.

If you live in the San Fernando Valley not so odd.

I think you both miss the point, however. SSB can sound BETTER than AM.
It requires more than a 3 KHz channel to do so, but the quality is
comparable to sync detection on DSB AM.

Does Shortwave still Exist?
 

On 11/14/2010 9:49 AM, dave wrote:
dave wrote:
Kevin Alfred Strom wrote:

Very nice; thank you!

It appears that the lower photos are from KO6NM, Mike Dorrough, the
inventor of multiband audio processing. And the site is run by
N2SAG, a
regular Liberty Net participant. What a confluence of coincidences!


All the best,


Kevin, WB4AIO.

If you live in the San Fernando Valley not so odd.

I think you both miss the point, however. SSB can sound BETTER than
AM. It requires more than a 3 KHz channel to do so, but the quality
is comparable to sync detection on DSB AM.



Yes, SSB can, if engineered properly, sound just as good in
frequency response and distortion terms as properly engineered DSB.
But it would require a pilot carrier and pilot-carrier-based AGC to
preserve the dynamic range as well as inherently carrier-based modes
like AM and FM. (This prevents any increase in receiver gain between
words and sentences.) This has been done, but is seldom seen.

There are quite a number of good fidelity amateur SSB stations on
the air these days (sometimes they are called ESSB for "enhanced" or
"extended" SSB) -- a phenomenon of the last few years, really. Not
surprisingly, quite a number of these stations also operate AM.


With my best,



Kevin, WB4AIO.
--
http://nationalvanguard.org/
http://kevinalfredstrom.com/