King Pineapple wrote:

Clueless Brit "Alan J Giddings" wrote in message
m...
THe Beeb is a first class institution which puts to shame any of the
ABC/CBS/NBC/FOX news coverage.

No, it USED to be that. Until about 10 years ago. And I've been listening to
them DAILY since 1966, so I know what I'm talking about.

I'd have to agree with that assessment, I've been listening to them for about
the same length of time and they have indeed gone 'downhill' in the last 10
years or so.

Steve
Holland, MI
Drake R7, R8 and R8B

In article ,
donutbandit wrote:

(Bob) wrote in :

to see who "wf3h" is, go to "qrz.com"


It's fairly obvious from his posts on this NG. He's a non thinking Nazi far
rightist who marches to Rush Limbaugh and calls others ignorant and
uninformed when they prove things he doesn't want to hear.

I am not a radical leftist, as accused. I am a clear thinking person who is
not blinded by nationalism or politicism and can clearly see what went on.

wf3h, you'd have made a wonderful SS officer. Your blindness is stupendous.
I imagine you use your ham license to transmit ignorance all over the
amateur bands, as well.

With every post you make you give the TROLL what he desires most. Notice
that the thread now revolves around him and not the topic of the thread.
Do us all a favor and put him in the kill file. He will have to go
somewhere else to get his attention fix.

--
Telamon
Ventura, California

On Sat, 31 Jan 2004 09:29:53 -0500, "W G (Geoff) White"
wrote:


Reference: http://www.state.gov/secretary/rm/2001/933.htm

and since he gave a presentation before the UN shortly before the
invasion detailing suspected WMD programs, we can safely assume you
took his quote out of context

No, the reference cited provides the ENTIRE context, so I
suppose "we" should assume you didn't even read it--
probably because you're not really interested in the facts,
are you?

and we can safely assume you've never SEEN collin powell's
presentation and don't even know he gave one.

Regarding Powell's later presentation-- as you say-- "detailing
suspected WMD programs," let's be clear about the facts:
no such weapons have been found and Powell's earlier
statement is the more correct assessment.

thus proving the radical idea to the far left that hindsight is 20/20.
if you had proof that powell was wrong, why didn't YOU present it at
the time? why didn't the french? the germans? the UN itself?

answer: because everyone's intelligence stated that the WMD's existed.
that's what hussein's scientists told HIM because they were stealing
the money he was spending on WMD's.

oh. the far left believed that hussein was a man of honor and always
kept his word. you guys actually believed that fascist because the
alternative was to accept bush's view.

and, again, you're revisionists...liars to be blunt. the issue was not
WMD's. it was whether hussein was complying with UN resolution 1441.

you lefties are always trying to use hindsight to predict the future.
that's why the left is dead in western society.


To save you having to read the whole thing, the entire paragraph
quoted from is below-- but I bet you still don't read it!

I imagine you'll just post another ad hominem attack-- because
that's easier for you, heh!

Secretary Powell:

again, you ignore the fact...as the left does when it re-writes
history...that powell gave a presentation to the UN detailing the
status of intelligence at the time.

thanks, however, for trying to use POST liberation info to judge what
people knew PRIOR to the liberation.


try again, geoff. the BBC is a loser. and so, of course, are you.

---------------------------
to see who "wf3h" is, go to "qrz.com"
and enter 'wf3h' in the field

On Sat, 31 Jan 2004 21:42:09 GMT, Telamon
wrote:

In article ,
donutbandit wrote:

(Bob) wrote in :

to see who "wf3h" is, go to "qrz.com"


It's fairly obvious from his posts on this NG. He's a non thinking Nazi far
rightist who marches to Rush Limbaugh and calls others ignorant and
uninformed when they prove things he doesn't want to hear.

I am not a radical leftist, as accused. I am a clear thinking person who is
not blinded by nationalism or politicism and can clearly see what went on.

wf3h, you'd have made a wonderful SS officer. Your blindness is stupendous.
I imagine you use your ham license to transmit ignorance all over the
amateur bands, as well.

With every post you make you give the TROLL what he desires most. Notice
that the thread now revolves around him and not the topic of the thread.
Do us all a favor and put him in the kill file. He will have to go
somewhere else to get his attention fix.

--

in lieu of an argument, just run and hide, eh?

typical leftie.
---------------------------
to see who "wf3h" is, go to "qrz.com"
and enter 'wf3h' in the field

MJP,

My replies as inserted in to the prior Message.

= = = "M. J. Powell"
= = = wrote in message ...
In message , RHF
writes
MJP,

"The BBC *never* served the British Government.
Lord Reith arranged that in the 1920's. Fortunately."

To Re-State My Point: "The BBC No Longer Serves the British People
or the British Government."

Do you retract your Point about the BBC serving the British Government?

NO - First 'the British People' followed by (therefore it follows)
'the British Government'.
..
..

The current BBC Management and Staff are an Elitist Class who 'think'
that they "Exist" to Serve a Higher Truth and 'The World'. The BBC
is Culturally Isolated from the Rest of the common people of the UK.

1. If you mean the beer and chips brigade then I hope so.


YES - The average everyday British Citizen. (The 'common' Man.)
..
..
2. Judging by the dumbed-down crap on all channels you are wrong.

HELLO - We Are Talking About the BBC's News and Information Content [.]
[ Not the entire programming content of the BBC. ]
..
..

They suffer for the misguided Idea that they are "The PRESS" the
Exhaled and Anointed Few: The Sayers of Truth and Understanding.
* 'The PRESS' has No More Rights then any other Citizen of their
Country of Nationality.

They do, actually.

NO - In Fact a Guaranteed Constitutional Right is 'Freedom' of
"The PRESS [.] All other 'legal constructions' that are Claimed to
be "Derivatives" of that basic right have No actual basis in law.

A Member of "The PRESS" simply has the Rights that are Guaranteed
Every Citizen.

Being a Member of "The PRESS" Does NOT Make One A SUPER-Citizen [.]
..
..

* 'The PRESS' does Not Wear a UN Blue Hat.
* 'The PRESS does Not Have Diplomatic Status or Immunity.
* Being a Member of 'The PRESS' does not Make You Bullet Proof
in a War Zone or Time of Civil Disorder.
* 'The PRESS' Is Not A Class Above All Others: They are simply
common ordinary citizens doing a JOB [.]

Who said that they were ?

It is NOT what is said - It Is How "The PRESS" Acts [.]
..
..
[ What Makes a Nation Great is the Life It Affords every common
ordinary CITIZEN:

Is it?

YES - IT IS [.]
..
..
Not The Prestige That Is Afforded 'The PRESS'. ]

What 'prestige'? Ever popularity poll for many years has placed the
'Press' at the bottom, next to politicians.

The PRESTIGE that "The PRESS" tries to Confer on It's-Self [.]
..
..
The BBC was 'created' to Serve the 'interests' of People of the UK

'Inform, Entertain, Educate?

HELLO - We Are Talking About the BBC's News and Information Content [.]
[ Not the entire programming content of the BBC. ]
..
..
and as such in doing so indirectly serves the government of the UK.

Only in fields like education.

News and Information that is Accurate, Honest, Balanced and Fair
creates an Informed Electorate and a Better Citizen; and Results
in Better Governance.

..
..

The BBC does not 'exist' in a vacuum as an Entity Un-to-Its-Self.

Who said it did?

It is demonstrated daily in the Recent 'slant' that the BBC Presents in
the News and Information that it provides to the British People that is
Openly Hostile to the British Government. It Is How the BBC 'reacts'
to "Outside" Criticism.
..
..
The BBC is FAILING at Being "The BBC" and needs to Return to 'First
Principles' of providing Accurate, Honest, Balanced and Fair News
and Information to the British People that is NOT Obviously Biased
and Hostile to the British Government and the common interests of
the British People.

The 'Press' as a whole are the only defence we have against our own
government.

NO - An Informed Electorate is the Best Defense against Bad Government.
"The PRESS's role is to provide: Accurate, Honest, Balanced and Fair
News and Information to Keep the Average Citizen Imformed.
The BBC is Failing in this Role because it is Openly 'slanting' the
BBC's News and Information with a decided Anti-British Government
Message [.]
..
..
ssi... ~ RHF
= = = So Say I... My Opinions Stated As Facts.

But opinions are not facts.

HELLO "Reality Check"
For Most People (Read the Average Citizen):
* Our FEELINGS Are Facts [.]
* Our OPINIONS Are A "Statement" of Our Feelings [.]
* Our Opinions Are FACTS [.] (Our Personal Reality)
Therefo So Say I... My Opinions Stated As Facts.
..
The Age Old Question of Politicians is . . .
So Tell Me "What Is John Q Public Saying ?"
Translation: Public Opinion -IS- Political Fact [.]
..
..
You're not British are you?

Mike

HEY - You Got That Right ! )
..
Proud To Say: I Am An American ~ RHF
..
..

In message , RHF
writes
MJP,

My replies as inserted in to the prior Message.

= = = "M. J. Powell"
= = = wrote in message ...
In message , RHF
writes
MJP,

"The BBC *never* served the British Government.
Lord Reith arranged that in the 1920's. Fortunately."

To Re-State My Point: "The BBC No Longer Serves the British People
or the British Government."

Do you retract your Point about the BBC serving the British Government?

NO - First 'the British People' followed by (therefore it follows)
'the British Government'.

If the BBC serves the British people it does not follow that it
automatically serves the British government.
.
.

The current BBC Management and Staff are an Elitist Class who 'think'
that they "Exist" to Serve a Higher Truth and 'The World'. The BBC
is Culturally Isolated from the Rest of the common people of the UK.

1. If you mean the beer and chips brigade then I hope so.


YES - The average everyday British Citizen. (The 'common' Man.)

Then good on the BBC. There is no reason that the morons should have it
all their own way.
.
.
2. Judging by the dumbed-down crap on all channels you are wrong.

HELLO - We Are Talking About the BBC's News and Information Content [.]
[ Not the entire programming content of the BBC. ]

OK

They suffer for the misguided Idea that they are "The PRESS" the
Exhaled and Anointed Few: The Sayers of Truth and Understanding.
* 'The PRESS' has No More Rights then any other Citizen of their
Country of Nationality.

They do, actually.

NO - In Fact a Guaranteed Constitutional Right is 'Freedom' of
"The PRESS [.] All other 'legal constructions' that are Claimed to
be "Derivatives" of that basic right have No actual basis in law.

To remind you of what you said above 'we are talking of BBC News and
Information content.' In this country we 'qualified privilege' for the
press when reporting certain stories.


A Member of "The PRESS" simply has the Rights that are Guaranteed
Every Citizen.

Not here. Make up your mind which country you are referring to.

Being a Member of "The PRESS" Does NOT Make One A SUPER-Citizen [.]

Who claimed so?
.
.

* 'The PRESS' does Not Wear a UN Blue Hat.
* 'The PRESS does Not Have Diplomatic Status or Immunity.
* Being a Member of 'The PRESS' does not Make You Bullet Proof
in a War Zone or Time of Civil Disorder.
* 'The PRESS' Is Not A Class Above All Others: They are simply
common ordinary citizens doing a JOB [.]

Who said that they were ?

It is NOT what is said - It Is How "The PRESS" Acts [.]

The press wears a UN blue hat?
The press claims Diplomatic Status and Immunity?
The press claims to be bullet-proof?
Right.
.
.
[ What Makes a Nation Great is the Life It Affords every common
ordinary CITIZEN:

Is it?

YES - IT IS [.]
.
.
Not The Prestige That Is Afforded 'The PRESS'. ]

What 'prestige'? Ever popularity poll for many years has placed the
'Press' at the bottom, next to politicians.

The PRESTIGE that "The PRESS" tries to Confer on It's-Self [.]

How do you claim prestige?
.
.
The BBC was 'created' to Serve the 'interests' of People of the UK

'Inform, Entertain, Educate?

HELLO - We Are Talking About the BBC's News and Information Content [.]
[ Not the entire programming content of the BBC. ]
.
.
and as such in doing so indirectly serves the government of the UK.

Only in fields like education.

News and Information that is Accurate, Honest, Balanced and Fair
creates an Informed Electorate and a Better Citizen; and Results
in Better Governance.

Hehehe!

The BBC does not 'exist' in a vacuum as an Entity Un-to-Its-Self.

Who said it did?

It is demonstrated daily in the Recent 'slant' that the BBC Presents in
the News and Information that it provides to the British People that is
Openly Hostile to the British Government. It Is How the BBC 'reacts'
to "Outside" Criticism.

It is the duty of the BBC and press to point out to the public the
cock-ups of the government, of whichever party. And there have been
plenty from this government. Foot-and-mouth disease, immigrants, the
NHS, the railways, the fishing industry...etc.
.
.
The BBC is FAILING at Being "The BBC" and needs to Return to 'First
Principles' of providing Accurate, Honest, Balanced and Fair News
and Information to the British People that is NOT Obviously Biased
and Hostile to the British Government and the common interests of
the British People.

To point out negatives is not being hostile.

The 'Press' as a whole are the only defence we have against our own
government.

NO - An Informed Electorate is the Best Defense against Bad Government.
"The PRESS's role is to provide: Accurate, Honest, Balanced and Fair
News and Information to Keep the Average Citizen Imformed.

The BBC is informing the electorate.
The press usually doesn't have enough information to be 'Accurate'
particularly when most of the info comes from the government itself.

The BBC is Failing in this Role because it is Openly 'slanting' the
BBC's News and Information with a decided Anti-British Government
Message [.]

"Dog bites man is not news. Man bites dog is news".

You're not British are you?

HEY - You Got That Right ! )

I wonder how I guessed.

.
Proud To Say: I Am An American ~ RHF

Well, OK. Not everyone can be British.

Mike
--
M.J.Powell

On Sun, 01 Feb 2004 18:18:55 -0500, "W G (Geoff) White"
wrote:


the fact you seem reluctant to admit, as a revisionist leftie, is that
the BBC itself both admitted it was wrong AND apologized. gilligan
lied. that's why he resigned. the executives covered for his lie.

That's the second time you've tried to put *your* words
in *my* mouth.

Check the posts in this newgroup. You'll see I have not said
anything about the BBC's statements, pro or con.

then check out of the thread. that was the topic. if you want to
address something off topic, find another thread. the topic was the
integrity of the BBC and its leftist agitating for the fascist regime
in baghdad.


and that's the end of the story. unless you can show me where
the BBC is lying when it said it lied, you got a problem.

As Ronald Reagan said, "there you go again!"

By the way, the personal attack-- "you got a problem" is not
an argument-- even if the rest of what you said was true,
which it was not.

really? the BBC didn't apologize? golly. then I guess someone has
hijacked bush house, because I personally heard the BBC issue an
apology to blair for its lies.

if you can find any managers remaining at the BBC who HAVEN'T resigned
because of its lies, by all means, tell us what the story was.

unless, of course, the far left hasn't revised that version of history
yet.

---------------------------
to see who "wf3h" is, go to "qrz.com"
and enter 'wf3h' in the field

On Mon, 02 Feb 2004 04:35:08 GMT, (Bob) wrote:

Check the posts in this newgroup. You'll see I have not said
anything about the BBC's statements, pro or con.

then check out of the thread. that was the topic. if you want to
address something off topic, find another thread.

Bob, if you think you're the topic cop here
then you probably need to grow up.

Geoff

"M. J. Powell" wrote in message ...
In message , RHF
writes
MJP,

My replies as inserted in to the prior Message.

= = = "M. J. Powell"
= = = wrote in message ...
In message , RHF
writes
MJP,

"The BBC *never* served the British Government.
Lord Reith arranged that in the 1920's. Fortunately."

To Re-State My Point: "The BBC No Longer Serves the British People
or the British Government."

Do you retract your Point about the BBC serving the British Government?

NO - First 'the British People' followed by (therefore it follows)
'the British Government'.

If the BBC serves the British people it does not follow that it
automatically serves the British government.

1. The British People 're-create' the British Government with each
new "Election".

2. The British Government 'created' the BBC to "Serve" the British People.

3. You Draw Your Own Conclusion -&- I Will Draw My Own Conclusion.
..
..
.
.

The current BBC Management and Staff are an Elitist Class who 'think'
that they "Exist" to Serve a Higher Truth and 'The World'. The BBC
is Culturally Isolated from the Rest of the common people of the UK.

1. If you mean the beer and chips brigade then I hope so.


YES - The average everyday British Citizen. (The 'common' Man.)

Then good on the BBC. There is no reason that the morons should have it
all their own way.

So... You 'label' the average everyday British Citizen "A MORON"
(The 'common' Man.)
..
..
.
.
2. Judging by the dumbed-down crap on all channels you are wrong.

HELLO - We Are Talking About the BBC's News and Information Content [.]
[ Not the entire programming content of the BBC. ]

OK

They suffer for the misguided Idea that they are "The PRESS" the
Exhaled and Anointed Few: The Sayers of Truth and Understanding.
* 'The PRESS' has No More Rights then any other Citizen of their
Country of Nationality.

They do, actually.

NO - In Fact a Guaranteed Constitutional Right is 'Freedom' of
"The PRESS [.] All other 'legal constructions' that are Claimed to
be "Derivatives" of that basic right have No actual basis in law.

To remind you of what you said above 'we are talking of BBC News and
Information content.' In this country we 'qualified privilege' for the
press when reporting certain stories.


A Member of "The PRESS" simply has the Rights that are Guaranteed
Every Citizen.

Not here. Make up your mind which country you are referring to.

In Your Mind.
..
..

Being a Member of "The PRESS" Does NOT Make One A SUPER-Citizen [.]

Who claimed so?

"The PRESS" by their Elitist Actions and Arrogant Nature !
..
..
.
.

* 'The PRESS' does Not Wear a UN Blue Hat.
* 'The PRESS does Not Have Diplomatic Status or Immunity.
* Being a Member of 'The PRESS' does not Make You Bullet Proof
in a War Zone or Time of Civil Disorder.
* 'The PRESS' Is Not A Class Above All Others: They are simply
common ordinary citizens doing a JOB [.]

Who said that they were ?

It is NOT what is said - It Is How "The PRESS" Acts [.]

The press wears a UN blue hat?
The press claims Diplomatic Status and Immunity?
The press claims to be bullet-proof?
Right.

"The PRESS" by their Elitist Actions and Arrogant Nature !
..
..
.
.
[ What Makes a Nation Great is the Life It Affords every common
ordinary CITIZEN:

Is it?

YES - IT IS [.]
.
.
Not The Prestige That Is Afforded 'The PRESS'. ]

What 'prestige'? Ever popularity poll for many years has placed the
'Press' at the bottom, next to politicians.

The PRESTIGE that "The PRESS" tries to Confer on It's-Self [.]

How do you claim prestige?

"The PRESS" by their Elitist Actions and Arrogant Nature !
..
..
.
.
The BBC was 'created' to Serve the 'interests' of People of the UK

'Inform, Entertain, Educate?

HELLO - We Are Talking About the BBC's News and Information Content [.]
[ Not the entire programming content of the BBC. ]
.
.
and as such in doing so indirectly serves the government of the UK.

Only in fields like education.

News and Information that is Accurate, Honest, Balanced and Fair
creates an Informed Electorate and a Better Citizen; and Results
in Better Governance.

Hehehe!

The BBC does not 'exist' in a vacuum as an Entity Un-to-Its-Self.

Who said it did?

It is demonstrated daily in the Recent 'slant' that the BBC Presents in
the News and Information that it provides to the British People that is
Openly Hostile to the British Government. It Is How the BBC 'reacts'
to "Outside" Criticism.

It is the duty of the BBC and press to point out to the public the
cock-ups of the government, of whichever party. And there have been
plenty from this government. Foot-and-mouth disease, immigrants, the
NHS, the railways, the fishing industry...etc.

YES - But, the BBC has taken on a decidely "Slanted" and Biased
Distortion of News and Information with respect to the current
British Government.

The BBC needs to return to providing News and Information that
is Accurate, Honest, Balanced and Fair to the British People;
and once again create an Well Informed British Electorate.

IT IS AN INFORMED ELECTORATE THAT WILL HOLD THE BRITISH GOVENMENT ACCOUNTABLE.
..
..

.
.
The BBC is FAILING at Being "The BBC" and needs to Return to 'First
Principles' of providing Accurate, Honest, Balanced and Fair News
and Information to the British People that is NOT Obviously Biased
and Hostile to the British Government and the common interests of
the British People.

To point out negatives is not being hostile.

The BBC has taken on a decidely "Slanted" and Biased Distortion
of the News and Information with respect to the current British
Government is NOT simply pointing-ot-negatives - IT IS BEING NEGATIVE.
..
..

The 'Press' as a whole are the only defence we have against our own
government.

NO - An Informed Electorate is the Best Defense against Bad Government.
"The PRESS's role is to provide: Accurate, Honest, Balanced and Fair
News and Information to Keep the Average Citizen Imformed.

The BBC is informing the electorate.
The press usually doesn't have enough information to be 'Accurate'
particularly when most of the info comes from the government itself.

The BBC is Failing in this Role because it is Openly 'slanting' the
BBC's News and Information with a decided Anti-British Government
Message [.]

"Dog bites man is not news. Man bites dog is news".

YES - The HeadLine may indeed read "Man Bites Dog"
But, Accurate, Honest, Balanced and Fair "Reporting" of the
News and Information would also Report on the Facts concerning
the Number of People Bitten by Dogs Each Day and Ways to Prevent
People form Getting Bit by a Dog.
..
..

You're not British are you?

HEY - You Got That Right ! )

I wonder how I guessed.

.
Proud To Say: I Am An American ~ RHF

Well, OK. Not everyone can be British.

YES - I Thank God Almighty -that- I Am An American ~ RHF
..
..

Mike

..

On Mon, 02 Feb 2004 08:51:14 -0500, "W G (Geoff) White"
wrote:

On Mon, 02 Feb 2004 04:35:08 GMT, (Bob) wrote:

Check the posts in this newgroup. You'll see I have not said
anything about the BBC's statements, pro or con.

then check out of the thread. that was the topic. if you want to
address something off topic, find another thread.

Bob, if you think you're the topic cop here
then you probably need to grow up.

Geoff



IOW you can't address the issue, you refuse to accept the fact the BBC
said they lied, and then apologized. you are having a nuclear meltdown
over the fact gilligan committed professional suicide, and the
revisionist left can't come to grips with it.

thanks. i already knew that, geoff.

---------------------------
to see who "wf3h" is, go to "qrz.com"
and enter 'wf3h' in the field