dimmer switch question...(radio noise)
 

Hello,

I am having my house re-wired and and I am considering putting in
dimmer switches for lights and /or ceiling fans.

I have heard than can cause radio noise.

Any tips about their installation ?
Are some switches better than others ?
If the power is off to a switch, they can not cause noise, can they ?


Ideas ?

Thanks,

me,...........

On Sat, 06 Nov 2004 02:06:17 -0600, Hank wrote:

Any tips about their installation ?


Yes, don't install them.

Hank schrieb:

Hello,

I am having my house re-wired and and I am considering putting in
dimmer switches for lights and /or ceiling fans.

I have heard than can cause radio noise.


That's true.

Any tips about their installation ?
Are some switches better than others ?

Yes!

If the power is off to a switch, they can not cause noise, can they ?


There are different models. Some switch 'really' off. Some don't.


Ideas ?

I have both types -about 10- installed in my appartment home.
As I live in germany I have installed well known german brands wich are
CE-approved. They are not cheap at all -costs about 30 US$ each...-
I have no noise from them at all.

BTW: Many VCR's are well known to create a big noise floor....

Generally speaking, dimmers are bad news throughout the HF spectrum --
when in use. No noise problems noted when they are turned off.

John

Hank wrote:
Hello,

I am having my house re-wired and and I am considering putting in
dimmer switches for lights and /or ceiling fans.

I have heard than can cause radio noise.

Any tips about their installation ?
Are some switches better than others ?
If the power is off to a switch, they can not cause noise, can they ?


Ideas ?

Thanks,

me,...........

From the ARRL at URL:
http://www.arrl.org/tis/info/touchlamp.html

Light-dimmer Interference Reduction

Radio Amateurs who've have been cursed with RFI from solid-state light
dimmers will be interested to know that at least one domestic
manufacturer -Lutron - produces light dimmers that incorporate RFI
suppression techniques. The Lutron NOVA series uses toroidal chokes that
provide a significant level of RFI suppression.

I bought a Lutron model N-600, which will handle up to 600 watts of
incandescent lighting. Temporarily installed in my radio shack, a generic
light dimmer produced an S9+ reading at 230 kHz (an arbitrary noisy
frequency). The N-600 produced a reading of S3, a difference of about 40 dB.
Admittedly, this is not zero, but installing the N-600 some distance away
provided a reduction in RFI that is very gratifying. Indeed, I new hear new
noise sources, heretofore undetectable through the dimmer din.

You're not likely to find these dimmers at your local discount store, and
they are not inexpensive. Check for the availability of these dimmers at a
lighting fixture store and expect to pay about $25 apiece for them.

-- Richard G. Brunner, AA1P, 10 Brookside Dr., Foxboro, MA 02035

Lutron Electronics Co., Inc.
Suter Rd.
Box 205
Coopersburg, PA 18036
215-282-3800

If you come up with a better solution for these problems, please write to
the RFI Desk with the solution. It sounds like it would be a good candidate
for Hints and Kinks!

"73" from ARRL HQ


--
The Anon Keyboard
I doubt, therefore I might be



"Hank" wrote in message
...
Hello,

I am having my house re-wired and and I am considering putting in
dimmer switches for lights and /or ceiling fans.

I have heard than can cause radio noise.

Any tips about their installation ?
Are some switches better than others ?
If the power is off to a switch, they can not cause noise, can they ?


Ideas ?

Thanks,

me,...........

I am having my house re-wired and and I am considering putting in
dimmer switches for lights and /or ceiling fans.

If you are serious about weak signal DX don't install them.

More tips:
Forget about energy efficient fluorescent lighting.
Wait for LED light bulbs to become cheaper.
LED lights are more efficient and last longer then fluorescent bulbs.
No RFI!

Forget about those new 5.8GHz & 2.4GHz cordless phones.
They generate hash from their computer IC chips.

Use high end RG6 coax and connectors for video distribution.
A quality shield is a must to contain TV hash.
The Belden Brilliance HD digital coax comes to mind - swept to 3GHz!

Use a dedicated ground power outlet for your computer.

"Tian_Li" wrote

(good references for quiet equipment, thanks), and:

Use a dedicated ground power outlet for your computer.

Unless you have a 1-radio "station" and no lightning protection of any kind,
this is a very bad choice.

It is also an expensive undertaking, requiring both a dedicated power
circuit *and* independent grounding. It's a favorite gimmick of audiophiles
but with limited results unless you have noise problems that can't be
corrected by repair or replacement of the offending emitters. While the
audiophile can experiment like that to his heart's content, communication
systems should *never* use independent grounds. That means everything in the
shack. All of our grounding *must* be bonded, and that means either fixing
or avoiding the use of noise emitters in the first place. For the computer,
keep interconnecting data cables away from the coax feedlines, and place RF
chokes on all power and data cables at both ends. That handles signal noise.
The computer's casing provides all the shielding that device should ever
need.

Jack

On Sat, 06 Nov 2004 02:06:17 -0600, Hank wrote:

Hello,

I am having my house re-wired and and I am considering putting in
dimmer switches for lights and /or ceiling fans.

I have heard than can cause radio noise.
Certainly do. The act of switching on and off creates high frequency
transients.

Any tips about their installation ?
Are some switches better than others ?
If the power is off to a switch, they can not cause noise, can they ?


Ideas ?

Thanks,

me,...........

Use a dedicated ground power outlet for your computer.

Unless you have a 1-radio "station" and no lightning protection of any
kind,
this is a very bad choice.

The dedicated power outlet for the COMPUTER is wired by the electrician so
that
both ground leads (white and green) are wired directly to the breaker panel.
The power and ground is NOT
looped to other outlets. It is a dedicated power (and ground) outlet for
computer use only.
It is typically an orange colored power outlet.

This was not intended for radio use. It is simply suggested to keep radio
equipment powered
on a separate power circuit from the computer with the computer ground going
directly to the breaker panel ground.
That IS the single point ground for the house power wiring - at the breaker
panel.

"Tian_Li" wrote

Use a dedicated ground power outlet for your computer.

Unless you have a 1-radio "station" and no lightning protection of any
kind,
this is a very bad choice.

The dedicated power outlet for the COMPUTER is wired by the electrician so
that
both ground leads (white and green) are wired directly to the breaker
panel.
The power and ground is NOT
looped to other outlets. It is a dedicated power (and ground) outlet for
computer use only.
It is typically an orange colored power outlet.

This was not intended for radio use. It is simply suggested to keep radio
equipment powered
on a separate power circuit from the computer with the computer ground
going
directly to the breaker panel ground.
That IS the single point ground for the house power wiring - at the
breaker
panel.

Our discussion here is about radio, and that is not a helpful or cost
effective modification to make. Neither does it provide separate power to
the computer as you allege, it is merely a dedicated neutral and ground
connection to the mains. If electrical planning or mods are being done, much
better to provide the radio room with its own branch panel. Having a
computer on the radio circuit is not a problem, having the whole house on
the radio power loop can be.

Your description of single point ground for the home wiring is correct, but
not complete. The radio station has its own single point ground, and all AC
equipment in a radio room must bond to that. Equipment bonding in the radio
room would immediately negate the questionable benefit that a dedicated
computer neutral/ground offered. One grounding electrode conductor from the
station single point ground to the AC mains single point ground is required.
This creates an unavoidable loop, which is why truly separate power to the
radio room is desired, not a useless dedicated ground for a single piece of
equipment. The one noisy dimmer switch I have in my dining room, no longer
affects the radios since providing separate power to them.

Jack