I think that since Morse Code is old, but not completely useless, I feel it
should no longer be made to be learned to gain access to the HF bands.

Do I feel that Amateur Radio be made a free for all? No, it should not. There
should be a test, but not a really hard test, but not a easy one either.

I'll even admit, I'll never get a new Icom 7800, at $10,000.00 - I'll be lucky
to maybe get a used 706 at about 400 or 500 or so.


Lloyd Davies - Time Lord and Talk show host
"On the Domestic Front"
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/domesticfront/

(Lloyd Davies - The Time Lord ) wrote in
:

I think that since Morse Code is old, but not completely useless, I
feel it should no longer be made to be learned to gain access to the HF
bands.

Do I feel that Amateur Radio be made a free for all? No, it should not.
There should be a test, but not a really hard test, but not a easy one
either.

I'll even admit, I'll never get a new Icom 7800, at $10,000.00 - I'll
be lucky to maybe get a used 706 at about 400 or 500 or so.


Lloyd Davies - Time Lord and Talk show host
"On the Domestic Front"
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/domesticfront/


The ITU requirement for a code test was dropped on July 5th, 2003, so
evidently a majority around the world agree with you. I think the FCC will
drop it, but they move at a snail's pace. I didn't think it would survive
for as long as a year after it was no longer needed, but it's only nine
months so far, so I could still be right.

"Alun" wrote in message
...
I didn't think it would survive
for as long as a year after it was no longer needed, but it's only nine
months so far, so I could still be right.

I don't know, Alun. I'd wager that more than a few PCTA's have made their
feelings felt to the FCC and, more importantly, to their local elected
representatives. (Some of whom have a say re. the FCC's bugdet.) Perhaps it
might be more than a year...much more.

73 de Bert
WA2SI

"Bert Craig" wrote in message
.net...
"Alun" wrote in message
...
I didn't think it would survive
for as long as a year after it was no longer needed, but it's only nine
months so far, so I could still be right.

I don't know, Alun. I'd wager that more than a few PCTA's have made their
feelings felt to the FCC and, more importantly, to their local elected
representatives. (Some of whom have a say re. the FCC's bugdet.) Perhaps
it
might be more than a year...much more.

73 de Bert
WA2SI


If the FCC goes along with the ARRL proposal, which it looks like they will.
Then CW will be here for the Extra class for the next generation or so.
After that everyone will be dead and the grandkids will be liked to the
internet at birth with bio implants.

Dan/W4NTI

The ITU requirement for a code test was dropped on July 5th, 2003, so
evidently a majority around the world agree with you. I think the FCC will
drop it, but they move at a snail's pace. I didn't think it would survive
for as long as a year after it was no longer needed, but it's only nine
months so far, so I could still be right.


Likely the FCC brearucracy just hasn't gotten around to it yet. They
have bigger fish to
fry, and will likely get to it when there's nothing better to do.

Robert Casey wrote in
:






The ITU requirement for a code test was dropped on July 5th, 2003, so
evidently a majority around the world agree with you. I think the FCC
will drop it, but they move at a snail's pace. I didn't think it would
survive for as long as a year after it was no longer needed, but it's
only nine months so far, so I could still be right.


Likely the FCC brearucracy just hasn't gotten around to it yet. They
have bigger fish to
fry, and will likely get to it when there's nothing better to do.



Sad but true. You only have to look at their home page to see where we are
in their priorities, i.e. not even on their radar atall.

On 7 May 2004 06:51:21 GMT, Alun wrote:

Likely the FCC brearucracy just hasn't gotten around to it yet. They
have bigger fish to
fry, and will likely get to it when there's nothing better to do.

Sad but true. You only have to look at their home page to see where we are
in their priorities, i.e. not even on their radar atall.

Yes but....

The reality is that the "first hoop" at the Commission is the amateur
radio specialist - currently an individual named Bill Cross, a
licensed amateur, BTW. He's the successor to Johnny Johnston, W3BE.

His specialty is formulation of amateur radio rules and policy. Light
his fire, and see how fast the matter moves through the pipeline.

Sometimes it's better if the issue is "under the radar" so the
politicians who inhabit the Eighth Floor don't get involved with
photo ops and sound bites as they have been with BPL, for instance.

--
73 de K2ASP - Phil Kane

Alun wrote in message .. .
(Lloyd Davies - The Time Lord ) wrote in
:

I think that since Morse Code is old, but not completely useless, I
feel it should no longer be made to be learned to gain access to the HF
bands.

Do I feel that Amateur Radio be made a free for all? No, it should not.
There should be a test, but not a really hard test, but not a easy one
either.

I'll even admit, I'll never get a new Icom 7800, at $10,000.00 - I'll
be lucky to maybe get a used 706 at about 400 or 500 or so.


Lloyd Davies - Time Lord and Talk show host
"On the Domestic Front"
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/domesticfront/


The ITU requirement for a code test was dropped on July 5th, 2003, so
evidently a majority around the world agree with you.

A majority of the world's governments that bothered to attend and vote
on the issue.

And all they did was change the rules so each country can decide for
itself what is required - just like the written test.

Although a suggested standard for written tests was added at the same
WRC, it's really more of a suggestion than anything else. Countries
can have wide-ranging interpretations of what's "needed". For example,
do you think ol' JY1 and his family had to sit for written and code
exams that were equivalent to what US or UK hams had to pass for the
same privileges? Or do you think the US writtens compare with, say,
those in the UK?

If I'm not mistaken, getting a license in some countries *requires*
successful completion of an approved training course. (I know the
"Foundation" license has this requirement). Doesn't matter if someone
is a Ph.D. in EE, they have to attend and pass the ham radio classes
to get the license - even though such courses are not part of any
treaty and not required in many other countries.

Imagine the reaction here in the USA if the code test were dropped
*and* getting a license required attendance at an approved ham radio
training course. Not a "one day wonder" course such as was recently
the subject of an article on the ARRL website ("Is Your License Class
Efficient" or some such title), but rather a multisession course with
quizzes and a final test that were not from a published pool.

Point is, just because it's not in the treaty anymore doesn't mean all
countries will or should drop it.

I think the FCC will
drop it, but they move at a snail's pace.

They're busy with other things. And perhaps they don't see what all
the fuss is about. After all, we're talking about a 5 wpm code test
that can be passed in a number of ways, with all sorts of adaptations
and accomodations (tone, volume, headphones, typewriter, flashing
light, Farnsworth, etc.) Add to this the fact that today there are
training aids undreamed of in the past - most of them free or quite
inexpensive.

I didn't think it would survive
for as long as a year after it was no longer needed, but it's only nine
months so far, so I could still be right.

I think you meant 'no longer required by treaty'. Whether something is
needed as a license requirement is purely a matter of opinion.

It's been ten months and two days since WRC-2003 ended, and given
FCC's method of handling the issue it may well be another ten months
before we even get to the NPRM stage.

Most of all, note that the 2000 restructuring did not result in lots
of new hams, even though the requirements for all classes of license
were lowered and the whole structure simplified.

73 de Jim, N2EY

(N2EY) wrote in
om:

Alun wrote in message
.. .
(Lloyd Davies - The Time Lord ) wrote in
:

I think that since Morse Code is old, but not completely useless, I
feel it should no longer be made to be learned to gain access to the
HF bands.

Do I feel that Amateur Radio be made a free for all? No, it should
not. There should be a test, but not a really hard test, but not a
easy one either.

I'll even admit, I'll never get a new Icom 7800, at $10,000.00 -
I'll be lucky to maybe get a used 706 at about 400 or 500 or so.


Lloyd Davies - Time Lord and Talk show host
"On the Domestic Front"
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/domesticfront/


The ITU requirement for a code test was dropped on July 5th, 2003, so
evidently a majority around the world agree with you.

A majority of the world's governments that bothered to attend and vote
on the issue.

And all they did was change the rules so each country can decide for
itself what is required - just like the written test.

Although a suggested standard for written tests was added at the same
WRC, it's really more of a suggestion than anything else. Countries
can have wide-ranging interpretations of what's "needed". For example,
do you think ol' JY1 and his family had to sit for written and code
exams that were equivalent to what US or UK hams had to pass for the
same privileges? Or do you think the US writtens compare with, say,
those in the UK?

If I'm not mistaken, getting a license in some countries *requires*
successful completion of an approved training course. (I know the
"Foundation" license has this requirement). Doesn't matter if someone
is a Ph.D. in EE, they have to attend and pass the ham radio classes
to get the license - even though such courses are not part of any
treaty and not required in many other countries.

Actually, they only have to do the practical assesments, it's not necessary
to attend the course.


Imagine the reaction here in the USA if the code test were dropped
*and* getting a license required attendance at an approved ham radio
training course. Not a "one day wonder" course such as was recently
the subject of an article on the ARRL website ("Is Your License Class
Efficient" or some such title), but rather a multisession course with
quizzes and a final test that were not from a published pool.

Point is, just because it's not in the treaty anymore doesn't mean all
countries will or should drop it.

I think the FCC will drop it, but they move at a snail's pace.

They're busy with other things. And perhaps they don't see what all
the fuss is about. After all, we're talking about a 5 wpm code test
that can be passed in a number of ways, with all sorts of adaptations
and accomodations (tone, volume, headphones, typewriter, flashing
light, Farnsworth, etc.) Add to this the fact that today there are
training aids undreamed of in the past - most of them free or quite
inexpensive.


I doubt if they even think about any of that

I didn't think it would survive
for as long as a year after it was no longer needed, but it's only
nine months so far, so I could still be right.

I think you meant 'no longer required by treaty'. Whether something is
needed as a license requirement is purely a matter of opinion.


I meant both, since I agree with the FCC that it was only needed because of
the treaty

It's been ten months and two days since WRC-2003 ended, and given
FCC's method of handling the issue it may well be another ten months
before we even get to the NPRM stage.


That may be, although I still think it will be earlier than that. How do we
stand with the pool, BTW?

Most of all, note that the 2000 restructuring did not result in lots
of new hams, even though the requirements for all classes of license
were lowered and the whole structure simplified.

73 de Jim, N2EY


I think abolishing the code test will remove a block in the system, but
won't have much effect unless we actively do something to recruit new hams.
I don't really see much of that happening right now.

73 de Alun, N3KIP

Alun wrote:

(N2EY) wrote in
om:


Alun wrote in message
...

(Lloyd Davies - The Time Lord ) wrote in
:


I think that since Morse Code is old, but not completely useless, I
feel it should no longer be made to be learned to gain access to the
HF bands.

Do I feel that Amateur Radio be made a free for all? No, it should
not. There should be a test, but not a really hard test, but not a
easy one either.

I'll even admit, I'll never get a new Icom 7800, at $10,000.00 -
I'll be lucky to maybe get a used 706 at about 400 or 500 or so.


Lloyd Davies - Time Lord and Talk show host
"On the Domestic Front"
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/domesticfront/


The ITU requirement for a code test was dropped on July 5th, 2003, so
evidently a majority around the world agree with you.

A majority of the world's governments that bothered to attend and vote
on the issue.

And all they did was change the rules so each country can decide for
itself what is required - just like the written test.

Although a suggested standard for written tests was added at the same
WRC, it's really more of a suggestion than anything else. Countries
can have wide-ranging interpretations of what's "needed". For example,
do you think ol' JY1 and his family had to sit for written and code
exams that were equivalent to what US or UK hams had to pass for the
same privileges? Or do you think the US writtens compare with, say,
those in the UK?

If I'm not mistaken, getting a license in some countries *requires*
successful completion of an approved training course. (I know the
"Foundation" license has this requirement). Doesn't matter if someone
is a Ph.D. in EE, they have to attend and pass the ham radio classes
to get the license - even though such courses are not part of any
treaty and not required in many other countries.


Actually, they only have to do the practical assesments, it's not necessary
to attend the course.


Imagine the reaction here in the USA if the code test were dropped
*and* getting a license required attendance at an approved ham radio
training course. Not a "one day wonder" course such as was recently
the subject of an article on the ARRL website ("Is Your License Class
Efficient" or some such title), but rather a multisession course with
quizzes and a final test that were not from a published pool.

Point is, just because it's not in the treaty anymore doesn't mean all
countries will or should drop it.


I think the FCC will drop it, but they move at a snail's pace.

They're busy with other things. And perhaps they don't see what all
the fuss is about. After all, we're talking about a 5 wpm code test
that can be passed in a number of ways, with all sorts of adaptations
and accomodations (tone, volume, headphones, typewriter, flashing
light, Farnsworth, etc.) Add to this the fact that today there are
training aids undreamed of in the past - most of them free or quite
inexpensive.



I doubt if they even think about any of that


I didn't think it would survive
for as long as a year after it was no longer needed, but it's only
nine months so far, so I could still be right.

I think you meant 'no longer required by treaty'. Whether something is
needed as a license requirement is purely a matter of opinion.



I meant both, since I agree with the FCC that it was only needed because of
the treaty


It's been ten months and two days since WRC-2003 ended, and given
FCC's method of handling the issue it may well be another ten months
before we even get to the NPRM stage.



That may be, although I still think it will be earlier than that. How do we
stand with the pool, BTW?


Most of all, note that the 2000 restructuring did not result in lots
of new hams, even though the requirements for all classes of license
were lowered and the whole structure simplified.

73 de Jim, N2EY



I think abolishing the code test will remove a block in the system, but
won't have much effect unless we actively do something to recruit new hams.
I don't really see much of that happening right now.

I guess the question is "What are YOU doing to recruit more hams",
Alun? The torch is being passed, and it is being passed to those that
"won" the code/no code debate.

I'm pretty new as a Ham, I try to recruit whenever possible, and will
welcome new hams regardless of their education. Some people might feel
otherwise at this point, having the wind knocked out of their sails, so
to speak.

You guys won. You have the ball now. Using the NCI's polled membership
as an example, you now want to make all Technicians Generals, and
advanced, Extra's. A drastic reduction in entrance requirements seems to
be the rationale du jour for the brave new Amateur Radio Service.

Really it's your ball and your game now. Godspeed!

- Mike KB3EIA -