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FCC took 11 meters from Hams and gave it to CB'ers.
When CW is gone, CB'ers will get the other bands too. SC |
FCC took 11 meters from Hams and gave it to CB'ers.
Slow Code wrote:
When CW is gone, CB'ers will get the other bands too. SC Actually what the FCC did was to take the 11 meter band and create the General Radio Service Class C and Class D. Class C was limited to only a few channels (6) limited to control and paging. Class D was farmed out as 23 channels with only AM modulation and a max. of 5 watts power input to the finals. This was later modified to 40 channels and 4 watts input. The classic CB'er came just prior to the increase to 40 channels. Dave N KBH1602 (very expired) |
FCC took 11 meters from Hams and gave it to CB'ers.
On Wed, 08 Nov 2006 00:34:08 GMT, Slow Code wrote:
When CW is gone, CB'ers will get the other bands too. SC ++++++++ I fail to see the connection between Country and Western music bands and amateur radio. And what makes you think that Country and Western is endangered in the first place? |
FCC took 11 meters from Hams and gave it to CB'ers.
X-rated wrote: On Wed, 08 Nov 2006 00:34:08 GMT, Slow Code wrote: When CW is gone, CB'ers will get the other bands too. SC ++++++++ I fail to see the connection between Country and Western music bands and amateur radio. And what makes you think that Country and Western is endangered in the first place? |
FCC took 11 meters from Hams and gave it to CB'ers.
X-rated wrote: On Wed, 08 Nov 2006 00:34:08 GMT, Slow Code wrote: When CW is gone, CB'ers will get the other bands too. SC ++++++++ I fail to see the connection between Country and Western music bands and amateur radio. And what makes you think that Country and Western Wikipedia Directory Reference Wikipedia continuous wave A continuous wave or continuous waveform (CW) is an electromagnetic wave of constant amplitude and frequency; and in mathematical analysis, of infinite duration. Continuous wave is also the name given to an early method of radio transmission, in which a carrier wave is switched on and off. Information is carried in the rhythm and spacing with which the signal is sent. CW is thus is a form of on-off keying (OOK). In radio transmission, CW waves are also known as "undamped waves", to distinguish this method from damped wave transmission is endangered in the first place? |
FCC took 11 meters from Hams and gave it to CB'ers.
X-rated Vermonter wrote:
On Wed, 08 Nov 2006 00:34:08 GMT, Slow Code wrote: When CW is gone, CB'ers will get the other bands too. SC ++++++++ I fail to see the connection between Country and Western music bands and amateur radio. And what makes you think that Country and Western is endangered in the first place? Country seems to be doing fine, Western might be sparse on the ground but that's the nature of that beast. |
FCC took 11 meters from Hams and gave it to CB'ers.
wrote:
Directory Reference Wikipedia continuous wave A continuous wave or continuous waveform (CW) is an electromagnetic wave of constant amplitude and frequency; and in mathematical analysis, of infinite duration. Thus, a continuous wave is incapable of conveying any information. -- 73, Cecil http://www.w5dxp.com |
FCC took 11 meters from Hams and gave it to CB'ers.
Cecil Moore wrote: wrote: Directory Reference Wikipedia continuous wave A continuous wave or continuous waveform (CW) is an electromagnetic wave of constant amplitude and frequency; and in mathematical analysis, of infinite duration. Thus, a continuous wave is incapable of conveying any information. Um, not quite:-) The very presence of the CW signal conveys SOME information (e.q. the fact that something is out there generating it:-) It's the turning on and off of the wave that conveys most of the USEFUL information:-) Which makes CW communication a DIGITAL mode, by the way. Harry |
FCC took 11 meters from Hams and gave it to CB'ers.
Harry Gross wrote:
Cecil Moore wrote: Thus, a continuous wave is incapable of conveying any information. Um, not quite:-) The very presence of the CW signal conveys SOME information (e.q. the fact that something is out there generating it:-) "Information - an indication of the number of possible choices of messages, expressible as the value of some monotonic function of the number of choices." -- 73, Cecil http://www.w5dxp.com |
FCC took 11 meters from Hams and gave it to CB'ers.
Is this a Chat Room?
"Slow Code" wrote in message k.net... When CW is gone, CB'ers will get the other bands too. SC |
FCC took 11 meters from Hams and gave it to CB'ers.
I think you will find that cw is making a comeback. Now that the cw
requirement has been serverly reduced, more hams are getting into cw and it should be starting to make a comback.... Second... I also think you will find that the fcc, and in my country the IC, are deeply regretting the conversion of 11 meters to 'cb'. Virtually all of our bad radio operating procedures, of all radio services, can all be traced back to the bad operating technique found in the 11 meter cb band.... Larry ve3fxq Slow Code wrote: When CW is gone, CB'ers will get the other bands too. SC |
FCC took 11 meters from Hams and gave it to CB'ers.
In rec.radio.amateur.antenna Cecil Moore wrote:
Harry Gross wrote: Cecil Moore wrote: Thus, a continuous wave is incapable of conveying any information. Um, not quite:-) The very presence of the CW signal conveys SOME information (e.q. the fact that something is out there generating it:-) "Information - an indication of the number of possible choices of messages, expressible as the value of some monotonic function of the number of choices." -- 73, Cecil http://www.w5dxp.com How about a DF to give the bearing to the transmitter? See straws, grasping. -- Jim Pennino Remove .spam.sux to reply. |
FCC took 11 meters from Hams and gave it to CB'ers.
That was 50 years ago! If you listened to the ARRL SS last weekend you
know CW is not dead. Look at Dx Summit spots...CW is by far the majority! And I am mostly SSB! Dave K4JRB |
FCC took 11 meters from Hams and gave it to CB'ers.
Stop posting on multiple newsgroups. Don't you have anything else to do
Dave K4JRB "Slow Code" wrote in message k.net... When CW is gone, CB'ers will get the other bands too. SC |
FCC took 11 meters from Hams and gave it to CB'ers.
This is worse that a chat room, lotsalaughs
"JD" wrote in message . .. Is this a Chat Room? "Slow Code" wrote in message k.net... When CW is gone, CB'ers will get the other bands too. SC |
FCC took 11 meters from Hams and gave it to CB'ers.
David G. Nagel wrote:
Slow Code wrote: When CW is gone, CB'ers will get the other bands too. SC Actually what the FCC did was to take the 11 meter band and create the General Radio Service Class C and Class D. Class C was limited to only a few channels (6) limited to control and paging. Class D was farmed out as 23 channels with only AM modulation and a max. of 5 watts power input to the finals. This was later modified to 40 channels and 4 watts input. Wasn't it 4 watts output? The classic CB'er came just prior to the increase to 40 channels. Dave N KBH1602 (very expired) Some more facts: 11 meters was never a ham band by international treaty. FCC allowed hams to use it on a shared basis with Industrial, Scientific and Medical users after WW2. This was done in part as a sort of compensation for hams' loss of 160 meters to LORAN after WW2. The Citizens' Radio Service was created by FCC in the late 1940s. The original Class A and Class B services were on UHF - right where FRS and GMRS are now. The problem was that, in those days, the UHF radios that performed well were big, heavy, expensive, power hungry and complex. Simple UHF sets that were small, light, inexpensive and simple didn't perform too well. The Citizen's Radio service had so few takers at the end of 10 years that FCC created Class C and Class D, at 27 MHz. Low power channelized sets for 27 MHz could be made small and inexpensive even with the technology of the late 1950s. FCC could take the band away from hams because it wasn't a ham band by treaty anyway. They also argued that the creation of the 15 meter ham band in 1954, and the gradual return of 160 to hams, meant that 11 meters wasn't critical to ham radio. Add to that the fact that 11 meters wasn't the most-popular ham band anyway. Many popular rigs of the time didn't even cover the band. It wasn't harmonically related to the other HF/MF ham bands of the era, and in many areas it was full of noise from ISM users like diathermy machines, vacuum formers, etc. Since many other countries didn't allocate 11 meters to hams, there wasn't as much DX to work on 11. And the 1.7 MHz wide 10 meter band was right next door. Of course hams didn't like losing the band, fearing that it was a harbinger of things to come, but it wasn't. Over the intervening years, we hams got all of 160 back, and three new HF bands at 30, 17 and 12 meters. The cb boom of the '70s came and went, and hams are still here. 73 de Jim, N2EY |
FCC took 11 meters from Hams and gave it to CB'ers.
Dave wrote:
How about a carrier that confirms ALL OK. Absence of carrier = Problem exists. Absence of carrier is the opposite of continuous wave. :-) -- 73, Cecil http://www.w5dxp.com |
FCC took 11 meters from Hams and gave it to CB'ers.
Cecil Moore wrote in
t: Dave wrote: How about a carrier that confirms ALL OK. Absence of carrier = Problem exists. Absence of carrier is the opposite of continuous wave. :-) And switching between the two with various patterns can convey a message. Those with a brain and who aren't lazy can receive it, those that can't should stay on CB. SC |
FCC took 11 meters from Hams and gave it to CB'ers.
X-rated wrote: On Wed, 08 Nov 2006 00:34:08 GMT, Slow Code wrote: When CW is gone, CB'ers will get the other bands too. SC ++++++++ I fail to see the connection between Country and Western music bands and amateur radio. And what makes you think that Country and Western is endangered in the first place? Actually today it is Country and Restroom. |
FCC took 11 meters from Hams and gave it to CB'ers.
|
FCC took 11 meters from Hams and gave it to CB'ers.
"larya" wrote in message
ups.com... Second... I also think you will find that the fcc, and in my country the IC, are deeply regretting the conversion of 11 meters to 'cb'. I hope not. The FCC providing unlicensed spectrum for the masses was one of the smartest thing they ever did! Yes, it leads to all sorts of horrible operating practices, but CB and -- more contemporarily -- FRS/GMRS and WiFi had provided *huge* benefits for people (and many millions of dollars in equipment sales) nationwide. I'd hate to live in a country where there's no such thing as a license-free $20 pair of FRS-type walkie talkies or $20 WiFi cards for high-speed Internet access. Virtually all of our bad radio operating procedures, of all radio services, can all be traced back to the bad operating technique found in the 11 meter cb band.... I'd say they can be traced back to human nature. People were rowdy and "uncouth" in, say, taverns for thousands of years before CB came along. ---Joel |
FCC took 11 meters from Hams and gave it to CB'ers.
Joel Kolstad wrote:
SNIPPED I'd say they can be traced back to human nature. People were rowdy and "uncouth" in, say, taverns for thousands of years before CB came along. ---Joel I'll agree with the uncouth in the taverns part, but, disagree with the context. CB brought the uncouth out of the tavern and onto the air. :-) |
FCC took 11 meters from Hams and gave it to CB'ers.
"Dave" wrote in message
... CB brought the uncouth out of the tavern and onto the air. Drive by the tavern... tune past the CBers? ;-) I suppose amateur radio is supposed to be more a high-class dining establishment than a dinner -- suit, tie, and official FCC-approved membership required --, although these days you wouldn't necessarily know it from listening to the airwaves. |
FCC took 11 meters from Hams and gave it to CB'ers.
Joel Kolstad wrote:
"Dave" wrote in message ... CB brought the uncouth out of the tavern and onto the air. Drive by the tavern... tune past the CBers? ;-) I suppose amateur radio is supposed to be more a high-class dining establishment than a dinner -- suit, tie, and official FCC-approved membership required --, although these days you wouldn't necessarily know it from listening to the airwaves. Hmmm: You mean you can quickly tell the difference from some self-important, self-worshiping, self-impressed, carried-away-with-oneself personality as opposed to one considering himself/herself to being a student-of-the-world? And, your final implication being, "This group of amateurs is full of the former?" You present a most interesting observation! in-a-contemplative-state JS |
FCC took 11 meters from Hams and gave it to CB'ers.
Joel Kolstad wrote:
"Dave" wrote in message ... CB brought the uncouth out of the tavern and onto the air. Drive by the tavern... tune past the CBers? ;-) I suppose amateur radio is supposed to be more a high-class dining establishment than a dinner -- suit, tie, and official FCC-approved membership required --, although these days you wouldn't necessarily know it from listening to the airwaves. I think it depends where you listen... This past weekend, I was active in the November CW Sweepstakes. Made over 400 QSOs in 74 sections (all states except Hawaii). Lots of activity but nothing objectionable at all. 73 de Jim, N2EY |
FCC took 11 meters from Hams and gave it to CB'ers.
Dave wrote:
wrote: SNIPPED Some more facts: 11 meters was never a ham band by international treaty. FCC allowed hams to use it on a shared basis with Industrial, Scientific and Medical users after WW2. This was done in part as a sort of compensation for hams' loss of 160 meters to LORAN after WW2. The Citizens' Radio Service was created by FCC in the late 1940s. The original Class A and Class B services were on UHF - right where FRS and GMRS are now. The problem was that, in those days, the UHF radios that performed well were big, heavy, expensive, power hungry and complex. Simple UHF sets that were small, light, inexpensive and simple didn't perform too well. The Citizen's Radio service had so few takers at the end of 10 years that FCC created Class C and Class D, at 27 MHz. Low power channelized sets for 27 MHz could be made small and inexpensive even with the technology of the late 1950s. FCC could take the band away from hams because it wasn't a ham band by treaty anyway. They also argued that the creation of the 15 meter ham band in 1954, and the gradual return of 160 to hams, meant that 11 meters wasn't critical to ham radio. Add to that the fact that 11 meters wasn't the most-popular ham band anyway. Many popular rigs of the time didn't even cover the band. It wasn't harmonically related to the other HF/MF ham bands of the era, and in many areas it was full of noise from ISM users like diathermy machines, vacuum formers, etc. Since many other countries didn't allocate 11 meters to hams, there wasn't as much DX to work on 11. And the 1.7 MHz wide 10 meter band was right next door. Of course hams didn't like losing the band, fearing that it was a harbinger of things to come, but it wasn't. Over the intervening years, we hams got all of 160 back, and three new HF bands at 30, 17 and 12 meters. The cb boom of the '70s came and went, and hams are still here. 73 de Jim, N2EY As a former user of 11 meters, the Ham Band, this summary pretty much reflects my memory of events. Thanks! BTW, my old Multi-Elmac AH-54 [if I recall] had 11 meters factory installed. It drifted "slighlty" during each transmission. Slightly meaning 50 +/- KHz. I had to use crystal control to stay reasonably close to any frequency! I think one reason for the relative unpopularity of 11 meters with hams was that the band was not harmonically related to other bands, meaning crystals bought for 11 were probably not useful on any other ham band. 73 de Jim, N2EY |
FCC took 11 meters from Hams and gave it to CB'ers.
|
FCC took 11 meters from Hams and gave it to CB'ers.
"Joel Kolstad" wrote in
: "Dave" wrote in message ... CB brought the uncouth out of the tavern and onto the air. Drive by the tavern... tune past the CBers? ;-) I suppose amateur radio is supposed to be more a high-class dining establishment than a dinner -- suit, tie, and official FCC-approved membership required --, Too many amateurs now don't care if ham radio turns into the local scarf & barf. |
FCC took 11 meters from Hams and gave it to CB'ers.
Joel Kolstad wrote:
"larya" wrote in message ups.com... Second... I also think you will find that the fcc, and in my country the IC, are deeply regretting the conversion of 11 meters to 'cb'. I hope not. The FCC providing unlicensed spectrum for the masses was one of the smartest thing they ever did! Yes, it leads to all sorts of horrible operating practices, but CB and -- more contemporarily -- FRS/GMRS and WiFi had provided *huge* benefits for people (and many millions of dollars in equipment sales) nationwide. I'd hate to live in a country where there's no such thing as a license-free $20 pair of FRS-type walkie talkies or $20 WiFi cards for high-speed Internet access. Virtually all of our bad radio operating procedures, of all radio services, can all be traced back to the bad operating technique found in the 11 meter cb band.... I'd say they can be traced back to human nature. People were rowdy and "uncouth" in, say, taverns for thousands of years before CB came along. ---Joel At the time "CB" in the 27mhz region made sense because UHF equipment was too expensive to build for the masses. That's no longer true. The FCC should eliminate the 27 mhz CB service before the start of the next sunspot cycle and force everyone there to move to UHF. One of CB's biggest problems was interference from 'skip' (DX), and it is illegal to work DX stations anyway. |
FCC took 11 meters from Hams and gave it to CB'ers.
"ken scharf" wrote in message
.. . At the time "CB" in the 27mhz region made sense because UHF equipment was too expensive to build for the masses. That's no longer true. The FCC should eliminate the 27 mhz CB service before the start of the next sunspot cycle and force everyone there to move to UHF. I like your reasoning, although realistically they'd have to have a well-publicized program to do so that would most likely have various "deadlines" that would get pushed back a few times before really having any meaning (just as the switch to broadcast HDTV has done!) I'd expect that equpiment manufacturers would -- for a time -- be building dual-band radios. Given how "abused" FRS and GMRS are anyway, perhaps the FCC could just drop the GMRS licensing requirement and pretty much be done with it! One of CB's biggest problems was interference from 'skip' (DX), and it is illegal to work DX stations anyway. Really -- I didn't know that (the part about it being illegal)! Seems a little silly to me... ---Joel |
FCC took 11 meters from Hams and gave it to CB'ers.
wrote:
On Mon, 13 Nov 2006 09:40:54 -0800, "Joel Kolstad" wrote: "ken scharf" wrote in message .. . At the time "CB" in the 27mhz region made sense because UHF equipment was too expensive to build for the masses. That's no longer true. The FCC should eliminate the 27 mhz CB service before the start of the next sunspot cycle and force everyone there to move to UHF. I like your reasoning, although realistically they'd have to have a well-publicized program to do so that would most likely have various "deadlines" that would get pushed back a few times before really having any meaning (just as the switch to broadcast HDTV has done!) I'd expect that equpiment manufacturers would -- for a time -- be building dual-band radios. get that band back for Ham use is simply imposible too many rigs out there Given how "abused" FRS and GMRS are anyway, perhaps the FCC could just drop the GMRS licensing requirement and pretty much be done with it! One of CB's biggest problems was interference from 'skip' (DX), and it is illegal to work DX stations anyway. Really -- I didn't know that (the part about it being illegal)! Seems a little silly to me... indeed it is ilegal to make a contact more than 150 miles away from you a rule I have broeken without trying near the top of the last cycle with a a mag mount on AM was living near springfield IL mentioned the town springfield someone came back refered to roads that don't exist so yes I have broken that rule and was techinal subjec to a serve fine becuase the FCC tried to rewrie the laws of physics it makes it difcult for me to be too critcal of breaking other of the rules when the rules are so hard to take seriously ---Joel http://kb9rqz.blogspot.com/ That arrangement of words comes nearest the most logic, reason and formed thought I believe ever sprang forth from your keyboard. JS |
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