Brian Kelly wrote:
Mike Coslo wrote in message ...
Brian Kelly wrote:
Mike Coslo wrote in message ...
Brian Kelly wrote:
. . . groan! . . . -100ºF is only a small part of it huh?
The atmospheric profile shows some interesting things. In the
Troposphere, the temperature drops pretty steadily until around 10 Km,
then it tends to stay pretty consistent until 20 Km. Above 20 Km, the
temperature actually rises somewhat until around 50 Km, at which point
it drops again until around 85 Km. At this point it becomes the
Thermosphere, in which the temperatures rise dramatically - they can get
from 500 to 1500 degrees C.
Of course, but 85Km out is ~280,000 MSL and the few atmospheric
*particles* and manmade *objects* which exist or pass thru that
altitude can get radiation-heated to pretty high temps. The temps of
the space *between* those particles and objects however is 'way down
the Kelvin scale. Your stated goal is 100,000 MSL which is only 30Km
out where all objects and particles are bloody friggin' cold no matter
what as the density of the atmosphere increases and blocks radiation
heating from the sun and conduction and convective cooling
increasingly prevails vs. radiation heating/cooling. So what's the
point to your geting into what's up at 85Km since a balloon ain't even
gonna come close to bobbing up to 85Km?
If your payload capsule is engineered properly for an ascent to FL 100
and back down Leonard will be OK which is really what matters. Back to
auditing a Heat Transfer 101 class for you Good Buddy.
Yo for chrissake Mike, I just noticed this gem, 1500ºC is 2732ºF, over
a thousand degrees hotter than the melting point of steel!
By the way post facto it finally dawned on me that I screwed that
statement up *big* time. Chase it down, spank me good for the screwup
and get even.
Nahh. People can make mistakes.
. . WTF . . ?!
The atmosphere does indeed heat up in the area known as the Thermosphere
. . . See above . . .
If you don't believe me, here is some info from NASA. They give even
higher values as a maximum.
http://liftoff.msfc.nasa.gov/academy...tmosphere.html
and
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermosphere
gives a nice explanation of the Thermosphere, and there is a bit of info
there as to why Amateurs should be interested in it.
?? I thought we were deep into ballooning ping-pong ball experiments
for the kids and gloming some brownie points for ham radio in the
process. Is it me again or did something got lost around here when I
wasn't looking?
Oh gawd, yes, Brian! This whole thread got started when I mentioned
that I was putting together this operation in response to Hans' telling
us about how Amateur radio is being marginalized. Then it turned into me
trying to tell the group about what we were trying to do amidst a couple
people that don't believe it can be done.
But since you were talking about the effects of the cold, I thought I
might point out just how weird things are "up there".
And it is hot in the neighborhood of the ionosphere.
A good question is "Why doesn't everything that passes through the
thermosphere burn up?" Because they don't. In fact, despite these high
temps, things passing through this region would "feel" cold.
Why should Hams know about the Thermosphere?
Those of us who are big into bouncing our signals around the planet
have been there since WHEN? Those who don't know about it are not my
problem.
I don't know how to water this down so I'll be blunt about it. You
really do need to consider biting the bullet and delegating the
technical aspects of this project to some technoid(s) and stick to
being the head cheerleader. Preferably before somebody gets hurt .
Thanks for the bluntness Brian. I always appreciate it.
I will be likewise blunt. You are completely wrong about the people
doing (or not doing) this. You *don't* understand some *very* basic
things about the atmosphere, things that you should know as a Ham. Given
those facts, I'll take your judgment of my qualifications to do this
thing under advisement.
Be ****ed or hate me, it's how it is.
Cool off and settle down Mike, I'm completely incapable of getting
****ed off much less hating any USENET poster. Particulary in this
off-the-wall ham radio based collection of particularly Odd Units.
Stick yer head up and sombody is gonna snipe ya for jollies and ya
handle it. So leave yer thin skin home and duck when you post here and
welcome to RRAP where pud-yanking is the name of the game.
That's how it is.
I apologize Brian. Call me incompetent any time you like. It was a
mistake to bring this subject up in here, I'll admit that.
I bring my hockey mentality in here most of the time. This was too much
of a crossover into my professional mentality. And it is apparent that
it won't be differentiated.
So I guess it's back to talking about the Morse code test! 8^)