In article , Mike Coslo
writes:
Len Over 21 wrote:
In article ,
writes:
Len apparently has simply *refused* to even look at the information you
presented.
No way, he surfed 'em and you can bank it but he doesn't have the
gonads to 'fess up and admit he was wrong. As usual.
Nope. WRONG. ERROR.
Didn't need to surf some selected websites NOW.
Looks like W3RV called it right on the money.
Tsk. I'd already known of amateur BALLOONISTS who went
unmanned high-ballooning a decade ago.
"known of"..."a decade ago"
Living in the past.....
So...where was I "wrong?"
See below!
Mike Coslo claimed he could go to "100,000 feet altitude" or
near space" (as he states it) with "latex weather balloons."
I don't recall that claim at all.
I claim he can't do that...with those same "latex weather
balloons." Atmospheric density and pressure won't allow it and
those "latex weather balloons will burst below 50,000 feet.
Hmmmm......
Dave Mullenix of the EOSS group states:
* We use Totex weather balloons. They seem to be the best quality.
* We purchase them from:
*
* Kaymont Consolidated Industries, Inc.
* 21 Sprucetree Lane
* P.O. Box 348
* Huntington Station, NY 11746
* Phone (voice): 516 424-6459
* Phone (fax): 516 549-3076
*
* Balloons are sized by their weight in grams. Kaymont currently
* carries two sizes, 800 and 1200 grams. The 800 gram size will
* lift 3-4 lbs to 100,000 feet. The 1200 gram size will take a full
* six pound payload to 100,000 feet. Prices are about $45.00 each for
* the 1200 gram balloons. Kaymont accepts telephone orders and credit
cards.
End Dave Mullinex of EOSS quote
But - Len wrote:
"I claim he can't do that...with those same "latex weather balloons."
Atmospheric density and pressure won't allow it and those "latex weather
balloons will burst below 50,000 feet."
So somebody is clearly wrong here.
Kaymont has this to say about their Totex balloons:
* This balloon was developed in the 1940's and is made from a natural
*latex compound which is highly elastic and tear resistant. Physical
*properties are retained at extremely low temperatures and the latex
*compound contains additives which contribute to its resistance to
*oxidation and ozone. The robustness of the rubber film allows the fully
*inflated balloon to maintain its spherical shape making it particularly
*suitable for severe weather launches.
End Kaymont Quote
1940's??!!
Latex balloons.
Helium.
100,000 feet with a six pound payload.
I can supply references upon request.
Why the difference between a manufacturer of the latex balloons, and a
documented user group, and your facts?
Looks like Len is simply wrong about those "latex weather balloons".
Now ya done it, Mike. Proved Len to be definitively mistaken about something.
Of course, as W3RV says, he won't admit it.
Does La cucaracha know of Standard Atmosphere? It's in all
the fancy flying texts, been there for decades. Pressure,
density, temperature all there, all quite good enough for estimating
some balloon experiments with their ultimate altitudes versus
total balloon plus payload weights. Doesn't have to be exquisitely
textbook accurate to begin with, just some estimates, what is
colloquially called "ball park figures."
Diversion from the issue.
Did you see any estimates of weight, altitude, or ANY cost figures
presented in here? I didn't. I doubt anyone else saw them.
More diversion.
Nothing beyond "surprisingly inexpensive". I'm not making a financial
report to the group.
Lessee - $50 for the balloon, $200 for the helium (assumming you need 1000 cu
ft), $50 for other goodies, $100 for stuff I'm not aware of yet. That's $400
for the lifting system. Payload package, launch and recovery expenses not
included.
Not pocket change but not a showstopper either.
Apparently the "dreamers" (or, as they self-ephemistically call
themselves, "concept managers") don't consider some estimates
as necessary. Nope, they have a CONCEPT but that is way way
short of ANY sort of estimated numbers of anything.
Ahem. I'm not required to provide financial data to you.
It's a diversion, Mike.
"Concept" is just a hunch, a sort of emotional daydream of an idea,
ephemeral like a gas without those estimates.
Apparently these expert-knowledge balloonists can float on Will
and Idea, because others have done so before? Tsk.
Kaymont 1200 gram latex weather balloon, 100,000 feet using helium, carrying a
six pound payload. Maybe a little higher with hydrogen?
That's not a concept - it's a proven reality.
Are you counting the "tsks", Mike? Maybe Len imagines himself as the ruling
bull elephant, displaying his t[u]sks in a show of dominance.
Seems to me that my original statement about the problems still holds: The
biggest problem may be getting permission to use the airspace. But it looks
like you've got that one under control too.
73 de Jim, N2EY