Original W8JI post:
"The only thing that prevents people from shooting themselves
in the foot with the wire below the Beverage is the wire
couples to the lossy media below it so well it becomes very
lossy, and of course that means it doesn't help with
stability or termination."


Yuri, K3BU wrote:
"If anybody cares to discuss the subject, or explain how the conductor
laid on the ground can lose its conductivity, bring it on."

"Lose its conductivity" is likely a mischaracterization.

"Becomes very lossy" or paraphrased "lose its conductivity" to make the point?

Conductivity of a wire at a particular temperature and frequency is a
function of the form, size, and material the wire is made of.


QSL.

Proximity of the earth should not affect conductivity directly.

QSL

Loss from an R-F carrying conductor can come from energy coupled into
the surroundings. Obvious source is the R-F in the conductor. Closer the
conductor comes to the earth, the higher its capacitive coupling, and
the more current flows in the lossy earth, especially in the case of an
unbalanced conductor.

I can see conductor (assuming insulated wire) having its electrical length
affected by the capacitance between wire and earth, but wouldn't current stay
close to same along the length? So, like if we have a coax, which has quite a
capacitive coupling between the center conductor and shield, we would lose
(significant) RF current at the other end?

The fact that a conductor laid on the ground can lose R-F does not mean
it lost conductivity. It means the conductor has induced loss in the
ground upon which it is laid.

(or improved conductivity?)
Isn't it really case of two (resistive) conductors in parallel? Wire and dirt,
with less resistance wire taking over? Why do we use radials if the conductors
become lossy? Why does the Beverage laid on the ground work?
I can see conductor as a (resonant) RF circuit becoming "detuned" and affected
by earth proximity, but saying that it "becomes very lossy" is not very
descriptive. With two wire Beverage I can see the interference between two
"antennas" having same physical length, but different electrical lengths
causing deterioration of pattern (which is observed).

Cecil help? :-)


Best regards, Richard Harrison, KB5WZI


Yuri, K3BU