RadioBanter - View Single Post

November 27th 05, 09:03 PM posted to rec.radio.amateur.policy

wrote:
From: on Nov 26, 8:02 pm

wrote:
From: Dave Heil on Mon 21 Nov 2005 09:41
wrote:
From: Dave Heil on Nov 20, 9:25 am

Amateur radio might be operating weak signal UHF SSB with a multi-mode,
multi-band rig. It might be operating 2m FM through a local repeater.
It might be ragchewing on 40m CW. One constant is that you aren't involved.
I don't do any RF transmission in amateur bands, with the
exception of those bands which are shared with other radio
services.
That's a very good thing!

Why? Are you morsemen so elitist you can't get along with others?

Where's my obligation to get along with you? You seemingly don't feel
any need to get along with me.

Yet I am able to communicate worldwide without
an amateur radio license or using morse code!

But not by direct radio contact.

Most absolutely INCORRECT, Jim-Jim.

Naw, he's CORRECT, Len-Len.

DIRECT from a maritime transceiver as a civilian.

You really need to work on sentence structure.

You can communicate worldwide from a maritime transceiver, Len?

DIRECT from a
government radio transmitter.

That's just a clause, Santa. Do you know where you can lay your mitts
on a government transmitter?

DIRECT as in laying on of hands,
moving controls, operating, all that stuff.

I get the feeling that your knowledge of radio operating might be a
little light. Are you of the opinion that operating a radio falls under
"all that stuff"?

And 24/7
without worrying about the ionospheric conditions! :-)

Telephone and internet. We can all do that, Len.

Then why do you fuss with morse and standards that are over
70 years old?

Do you remember that amateur radio is done for the love of radio? The
internet isn't amateur radio. A cellular telephone isn't amateur radio.
If you'd like to spend your days on the internet, that's fine. If your
thing is spending money to telephone folks via cellular phone, then have
at it.

Why do you live in the past?

Tsk, I don't.

You sure talk about it a lot, though.

You were born before 1951? YOU talked much of it in previous post.

YOU have talked much about Reggie Fessenden and his carbon-mike-in-
the-antenna "AM voice transmission" of 1906 and (allegedly) 1900.
Are you 105 years old?!?

You've written about Fessenden a number of times. Aren't you nearly
thirty-five years shy of 105?

Jimmy Noserve loves the past, always
bringing up little factoids of amateur radio history
that happened before his time.

Gee, Len, you're always bringing up little factoids of
history that happened before *your* time.

When did MY "time" begin, Jimmy? My "first radio job" in HF comms
began in 1953. I was there then, did it, came back. Never used
any morse code then on three dozen transmitters, never had to.

....and because you never had to (in your time), no one should be using
morse code in this enlightened day and age?

Are you the only one allowed to do that?

Tsk, you are getting disturbed. Calm down, just keep on bringing
up all those tidbits of "radio history" as you need to. Be mindful
of some critics, though. Not all of those are me. :-)

You've brought up numerous bits of radio history, Len. Some of them
were even correct.

"Radio" is a subset of electrical engineering.

Incorrect. It is a part of electronics, a technology discipline.

"Electronics" is a subset of electrical engineering.

INCORRECT.

Electronics is one TECHNOLOGY DISCIPLINE of physics.

Didn't Dexter teach you the correct way to look at
physics...like everyone else does?

Radio and electronics have some things in common, but they are not
identical, and one is not a subset of the other.

Amateur radio definitions seldom jibe with the rest of the
world of electronics...and radio. :-)

They seem to track pretty well, Len. You, on the other hand, haven't
done very well in here with definitions.

Do you consider U.S. amateur radio to be a HOBBY?

And much more.

And, of course, YOU do so much more... :-)

Jim does much more in amateur radio than you do. I do much more in
amateur radio than you do. The guy who received his amateur radio
license last week does so much more in amateur radio than you do.

Have you defeated any enemies of Homeland Security with your
amateur morsemanship?

Has an opportunity arisen, Len?

Have you saved any lives in the Gulf States with your amateur
morsemanship?

Many radio amateurs did so. Jim is quite some distance from the scenes
of the recent hurricanes.

NPRM 05-143 is singularly about the telegraphy test. [that's
what this "english teacher" of the thread title was commenting
on] That NPRM has NOTHING to do with radiotelephony, radiodata,
teletypewriter over radio, slow or fast-scan television,
facsimile over radio. The amateur radio license tests have
NO test elements for physically OPERATING any radio, are not
required to have radio equipment AT a license exam site.

So? Why is that significant?

Why do you consider yourself so "significant?" :-)

That wasn't a good answer, Len. Can you attach any significance to what
you've offered? Is it supposed to have meaning for us?

The sole manual test for anything at any amateur license exam
is about telegraphy, telegraphy as used on amateur radio (there
is NO landline telegraphy tested), more technically,
radiotelegraphy. As it is NOW, that is.

And that's a good thing.

It is a "good thing" only to those that took that test and
passed it, thus fulfilling the "proper jump through hoops"
of "tradition." :-)

That sounds like sour grapes on your part, Leonard. Those of us who
took and passed such an exam demonstrated that we'd reached a certain
level of competence in what is a useful skill in amateur radio.

The written test elements are prepared, both questions and
multiple-choice question answers, by the VEC QPC.

And approved by the FCC

Who else? :-)

YOU are NOT in the FCC.

I didn't see any statement by Jim that he's the FCC.

Am I saying that many radio amateurs don't know squat about
radio theory? ABSOLUTELY.

Your opinion only. And as you have demonstrated, you are not
exactly unbiased in your opinions.

Yes, MY OPINION! :-) Do you think someone else is writing
all this? :-)

It would seem to be that you've not bothered to substantiate your
opinion with fact. How many is many? How many radio amateurs have you
encountered who are deficient. What percentage of all licensed radio
amateurs do they represent?

Many radio amateurs know much more about radio theory than
you, Len.

Why is that a factor in AMATEUR radio?

I'd think it'd be something to crow about. I think many folks would be
pleased to know more about radio theory than a PROFESSIONAL.

The "National Association for Amateur Radio" (nee' ARRL) is
the "club." Even so, their membership is only one of every
five U.S. amateur radio licensees. Why aren't there more?

Some disagree with League policies
Some think membership costs too much.
Some are inactive
Some don't understand why a national organization is needed.

You have taken a Poll to confirm this? :-)

You can take it upon yourself to conduct one, Len. If you weren't
prepared to accept Jim's answers, why'd you pose the question?

Jimmy boy, YOU are a League BELIEVER. You are so far into
bias on that that all you generate are square waves.

Well, Lennie boy, what is it that you believe in? Do you believe that
the ARRL is an evil organization? You've leveled charges of dishonesty
toward the League, but you never substantiated them.

btw, No-Code International's membership is less than 1% of US amateurs
even though there are no dues and NCI membership never expires.

Highly irrelevant. NCI is NOT a "national association for amateur
radio."

No, it isn't. Can you name any such organization except for the ARRL?

It exists for ONE purpose: Elimination of the code test
from amateur radio license examinations worldwide. That's it.

There seems to have been at least one exception to that stated purpose
already.

You have no activity in amateur radio and except for one outburst almost
six years ago, there's no indication you'll ever get an amateur license.

"Outburst?!?" BWAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I prefer to call it an episode of braggadocio. It has come back to
haunt you repeatedly.

Why, oh WHY must I show "an indication of interest?!?"

One reason could be that you'd be seen as something other than a
sidewalk superintendent in amateur radio. If you have no interest, as
you've alternately claimed, you are irrelevant to amateur radio and you
become a kook who haunts an amateur radio newsgroup.

Who the fork are you to presume *I* MUST demonstrate to YOU
some kind of committment and dedication?!?!?

"Commitment", Len. Nobody forces you to show commitment or dedication.
You needn't obtain or even attempt to obtain an amateur radio license.
If you don't, you won't appear to be very credible. Your extensive
rants will be marginalized. You'll be in the same boat as a certain
English teacher.

If your ego is THAT big, then you should go over to Coslo's BBS
since you will "reach the threashold of space" long before his
big balloon will...

Are you telling him to leave, Len?

So you and the English teacher have the same level of involvement.

Nope. I am as involved as can be with my wife. None other.

....and you wife isn't amateur radio. ZIC/ZID.

As a bachelor I had an "involvement" with an English teacher,
a very nice one, in fact.

Sure, Leonard, and you're getting an "Extra right out of the box".

Try to think about marriage for YOU, Jimmy. It would make you
less of a one-track Believer.

When it was said that you have the same level of involvement as the
English teacher, you said, "I am as involved as can be with my wife.
None other". Here you seem to indicate that marriage makes one "less of
a one-track Believer". You can't even agree with you.

You're not a licensee and and except for one outburst almost
six years ago, there's no indication you'll ever get an amateur
license.

Oh, oh, there goes that control-freak EGO again, Jimmy.

Nobody is controlling you, including yourself. You shot off your mouth
when you made your boast six years ago. You haven't lived up to that
billing.

Work on that. It's bad socially.

If you think that's bad socially, you should be in the shoes of one who
shoots off his yap, saying he's going to do something, but who doesn't
follow through.

Perhaps the FCC chuckles over your comments, Len.

Irrelevant. Chances are they will take my comments seriously.

I don't think you should make that assumption, Len.

Doesn't matter, the PUBLIC has spoken to the FCC 3,794 times
through WT Docket 05-235.

It matters. How many times were you "the public" in regard to 05-235?
Of the members of the PUBLIC who spoke, how many (excluding you) didn't
share your view?

Tsk, tsk, you DO! See little gems of an accusatory nature
such as I should have obtained an amateur radio license
before accepting professional radio employment!
Who wrote that?

Dave Heil. Why aren't you paying ATTENTION to the flow? :-(

You've made another factual error, Leonard. You seem to be the person
who needs to pay ATTENTION.

See, this is what I mean when I say that you make frequent factual
errors. I invite you to tune your Icom receiver to the low ends of the
bands 160-10m this coming weekend.

Why? I have no personal interest in morse code and no interest
in amateur radio contesting. Invitation denied.

Afraid you'll be proven wrong?

Tsk, there you go again with nasty attitude. An evangelical
Believer,
wet proselyte for a battery of morse gods, an acidic base.

I offered a simple experiment. You declined. You shrunk from the
challenge.

Jimmy boy, I'm quite aware of the EM spectrum and who occupies what
"bands."

Well, Lennie boy, you'll find those radio amateur morse signals at the
low end of the bands marked "160, 80, 40, 20, 15 and 10 meters" this
weekend. They're there all the time but you'll find them in profusion
this weekend.

Have been for a very long time...ever since getting my
"first job in radio." I know spectrum occupany OUTSIDE of the ham
bands on HF, on MF, on VHF, on UHF, and on up to 2.4 GHz. WHAT are
YOU going to tell ME?

It'd be tough to reach you. You spend too much time with your
transmitter on and not enough time using the receiver.

That contests are "popular?" I could find
that out by seeing the boosterism for that in print in CQ or QST.

Was the intent to prove that contests are popular or was it to show that
morse code is alive and well in amateur radio?

Is contesting "operation" your main interest in amateur radio?
Are you more interested in awards, trophies, pretty certificates
than radio for radio's sake? It sure sounds like it since you
love getting praise, even from friends and neighbors. :-)

What would any of that be to you, Len? You aren't in amateur radio and
you wouldn't even turn on your receiver to find if the morse code is
alive and well.

This Thursday and Friday I was involved in Thanksgiving in the
literal sense. Good friends got together, didn't talk at all
about amateur radio or morse code. Sunday is another nice
get-together with good people, and I don't expect any of the
talk will be about amateur radio or morse code or contests or
the beeping state of the radio art. No "contests" of any real
kind. Sunnuvagun!

I went to an apple festival this fall. No one there talked about
amateur radio or morse code. Is that supposed to prove that morse code
is dead? I didn't hear a single person there discussing NASA, Darwin or
jazz either.

Have fun in your amateur beeping contests. Those sound very,
Very, VERY important to you. Enjoy.

Thanks for your good wishes. Those things are far more important to me
than obtaining an amateur radio license seems to be for you. Your
participation is not required.

Dave K8MN