RadioBanter - View Single Post

March 14th 06, 03:22 PM posted to rec.radio.amateur.antenna

wrote:
The pattern has been after Cecil gets measurement results and finds
they disagree with his theory, he rejects the measurements.

Not true, Tom, please stop saying such. I fully accept and embrace
your measurements of standing wave current, already known to possess
unchanging phase. Kraus has a graph of exactly that. Your measurements
are PERFECTLY consistent with standing wave current measurements. What
they are not consistent with is traveling wave current which undergoes
a phase shift through the coil as yet unmeasured by you.

Why don't you stop talking about you and me and discuss the technical
issues?

The most logical thing any person can do when they repeatedly reject
any disagreeing data supplied by multiple people using different
equipment and methods is to come up with a measurement device no one
has or can build.

That's not true either. A lot of hams can measusre the self-resonant
frequency of a coil and know the coil exhibits a 90 degree phase
shift at that self-resonant frequency.

The only recourse for Cecil and Yuri was to dismiss those measurements
and my measurements and demand new measurements.

This is ancient history, Tom. I have learned a lot since then and
would appreciate you dragging yourself back into the present so
we can discuss technical issues, rather than personalities. For
the present discussion, what happened in the past simply doesn't
matter as I don't believe the same thing I believed three years
ago. Things are not as simple as I first thought.

So here we are today, two or three years later, still trying to find a
measurement method that will agree with what Cecil and Yuri proposed,
that a loading coil behaves as a coiled up antenna or transmission line

Three years ago, one could not use constant phase standing wave
current to measure the delay through a coil. Today, one cannot
use constant phase standing wave current to measure the delay
through a coil. Nothing has changed. Standing wave current is
what it is. Making the same measurements three years apart
doesn't prove anything new.

Since no one has them and
that is all Cecil will accept, Cecil can not be proven wrong by a
method Cecil will accept.

Again, a false statement. I am not asking for fiber optic
measurements. All I am asking is that you measure the delay
through your coil using exactly the methods as before, and
report the results for 1 MHz, 2 MHz, 4 MHz, 8 MHz, and 16
MHz, the self-resonant frequency for which the delay is
already known. When you do that, you will probably know
what is wrong with your conclusions. There's nothing wrong
with your experiment if you really want to measure the phase
shift of a standing wave current known to have unchanging
phase. Your measurements are perfectly consistent with the
laws of physics.

Please stop re-hashing the past. This is three years later.
I've learned a lot in those 3 years and have changed my mind
about a lot of things. Please just discuss the technical
details and leave the personalities out of it.

If the only way you and Roy can dispatch me is at a personal
ad hominem level, doesn't that speak volumes about not being
able to dispatch me at a technical level? Are you guys
engineers or just attack dogs?

For instance, compare the ad hominem stuff in your above
posting to the technical content.
--
73, Cecil http://www.qsl.net/w5dxp