On Wed, 26 Jul 2006 07:51:19 -0400, "J. D. B."
wrote:

Al Klein wrote:

Wrong. I want ham radio to stop being what it's been for the last
couple of decades - CB on different frequencies. There are CBers who
are competent communications engineers, but the majority today - CB or
ham band - want to buy a radio and put it on the air.

And what is wrong with that?

What's wrong with ham radio being turned into CB? For one thing, we
already had a couple of citizen's bands - we didn't need a dozen more.

Any license requirement is just an annoyance they get around any way they can -
except by actually studying and learning enough to pass tests.

How does "passing tests" going to eliminate the problem?

For them? It's not. If they can't pass the test they don't get the
privilege. That's just the way life is. If you're not 75 inches
tall, we don't let you be 6'3". These days some people want to be
what they aren't, regardless of reality. Giving ham licenses to
anyone who wants one doesn't make hams of people who know nothing, it
makes the ham license worthless.

Take a close look at a General test from the 50s and one from today.
The difference isn't that the current one dropped old technical
questions and added equivalent questions about modern modes - it's

How does memorizing answers to "technical questions" make you a better ham?

I said it doesn't. I said that learning makes you more knowledgeable.

that the current test has dropped the technical requirement low enough
that it's a joke.

Everyone says that CW is old hat and modern modes

At least we agree on something and nice to see you admit that everyone
is now saying this.

That thing passing over your head was the point.

have replaced it. Okay - let's see a question asking for a PSK
interface schematic, including full isolation. That's just simple
audio and DC stuff.

Yup, it is a simple circuit. It's also readily available in books, the
Internet, etc., so how does memorizing the circuit to pass a test, make
you a better ham?

Understanding how it works makes you more knowledgeable. Evidently
you're one of those who needs things repeated a few times.

Let's have questions on Rayleigh fading and its
effect on maximum usable baud rate at various frequencies, so no one
complains about the FCC not giving us permission to run 9600 bps on
20. Modern stuff.

"Rayleigh Fading" - that comes up in daily discussions on the radio.
Never heard anyone complaining about not being able to run 9600 baud on
HF - who the heck to you hang around with?

You never listened to QSOs on 20? Or questions asked at ham club
meetings? Or in radio fora?

And no more published answers.

Why not? Memorizing answers has people learning just like reading a
book. Learning is learning.

Learning requires understanding. Memorizing isn't understanding. It
was proved over 100 years ago that rote memorization isn't even a
mediocre way of teaching.

Then let's see how many people talk about "modern" and how many yell
"too difficult - there's no reason to know all this stuff".

That's true, many of the things I had to learn for my test in the 1970s
was worthless in my opinion. But it was conceived by people who had the
same outdated opinion as you. Let's get people communicating and not
continue to figure out ways to make it so hard that new people do not
come into the service. Here's the choice for kids today. Learn code and
other crap to get a license to use a ham radio - or - get on the
Internet immediately where everyone is and communicate with them. Guess
what choice is being made Al - it's a no brainer and why our testing
should be a no brainer.

So let them get on radio immediately with no testing. The method has
been available since the 60s.

IT'S CALLED CB! You want HF? Get on 11 meters. You want UHF? Get
on 465. It's all there.

And leave ham radio to hams.

Which is
why, on SWL fora, you'll see people complaining that they listened all
day on 4.2 MHz and only heard noise. Or tried to get some foreign
broadcast station up above 15 MHz all night and couldn't.

So what? They will seek out the answers and learn on their own.

Or, as has happened over the past few decades, they won't. But now
that you said they will ... magic ... they will, eh?

It's the "why doesn't this work, and don't give me any of that
technical BS" syndrome. People don't want to know how things work,

You know that's true and some will seek answers, others won't.

So those who seek answers become hams - those who don't become CBers.
What's with the "everyone is equal even if the only way to achieve it
is to dumb the entire world down" crap?

or
why they don't work, but they're angry that they don't. And don't you
dare tell anyone it's his fault for trying to receive a 440 repeater
80 miles away with a 1/4 wave antenna 5 feet off the ground.

I won't because those discussions never come up in our area. Where the
heck do you live that you have these discussions with so many people?

In the real world.

His
friend, just 3 doors down, copies the repeater S9+ (with a dual 11
element beam 75 feet in the air and LMR600 coax). Now, without any
technical BS or monetary expenditure, what does he have to do to
receive it?

Something tells me he'll figure it out on his own, via another ham, the
Internet, etc. and he'll learn - learning without being forced is a
wonderful thing.

Demanding answers without putting in any effort seems to have
substituted for learning.

It's not that no one ever pulled that stuff 50 years ago -

Yup, that's true, and all those strict technical tests back then did not
prevent this from occuring.

but it was
so far in the minority that it was below the noise level. Today it's
the majority of newcomers.

No proof of that statement Al. Just something in your own mind.

About like everything you've said here.

"I have a right to use the public
airwaves, and I don't want to have to learn anything."

Is this a great country or what?

Yes, if you're in the bottom 10%, it must surely look that way. You
get to be in the top 10% merely because that's the way you want things
to be, and heaven help the rest of us if we don't give you your way.