On Mar 29, 10:56�pm, "AF6AY" wrote:
From: Dave Heil on Thu, 29 Mar 2007 16:34:59 GMT
AF6AY wrote:
From: on Wed, 28 Mar 2007 16:00:14 -0400

* *Amateur radio was NOT one of my life goals, David. *

Sure it was, Len.You just took over 50 years to
achieve that goal.

It is just
* *a small part of the much larger world of radio where I've lived
* *and worked in for decades. *It just wasn't something I desired
* *or longed for during all that time.

That's simply not true, Len. Your own words
prove that you *did* desire and long for the
status of being a radio amateur. You just
weren't willing to do the work to become one
until a few weeks ago.

* *My participation in a campaign to (successfully) eliminate the
* *morse code test was a POLITICAL exercise in regards to old,
* *antiquated radio regulations for a hobby radio activity.

Your participation consisted of sending a lot
of wordy comments and reply comments to
FCC and posting lots of words here. That's
your right, of course, but all it probably did
was slow down the process.

*That
* *had NOTHING to do with (what you imagine) as lusting after a
* *amateur radio license. *:-)

The smiley tells me it had everything to do with it.

* *Newcomers are generally
* *younger and aren't buying "the old guy's club" stuff like the
* *old guys did when they were young.

Generally younger? *Do you mean generally younger than yourself when you
became a newcomer some weeks ago?

* *I was a newcomer in radio 54 years ago. *:-) *I'm not a "newcomer"
* *in ANY radio, sweetums.

Yes, you are, Len. You're a newcomer to amateur radio. A tyro,
beginner, newbie, novice, wet-behind-the-ears, tenderfoot, newcomer to
Amateur Radio.

Not that there's anything wrong with that.

Amateur radio is not solely about design and theory. *Much of it is
about operating, the thing which an amateur radio license permits you to do.

* *I've OPERATED radios on LF, on HF, on VHF, on UHF, and on
* *microwaves WITHOUT *ANY* LICENSE! *Legally, too. *:-)

Lots of people have, Len. There's cb, baby monitors, cordless and cell
phones, FRS, GMRS....the list goes on and on.

* *I've OPERATED broadcast transmitters, even talked over them,
* *with a COMMERCIAL radio operator license...something that is
* *NOT PERMITTED with an amateur radio license.

So has anyone who calls in to Rush Limbaugh or Howard Stern, Len.

Broadcasting is one-way radio. That says a lot about you, Len. You
like broadcasting but you don't like to listen.

* *I've OPERATED a civil aviation radio, its companion VOR, and
* *ATC Transponder with a COMMERCIAL radio operator license. *The
* *FCC will not allow an amateur radio licensee to do that unless
* *they have a commercial license. *That was AT the controls of
* *the aircraft at the time. *:-)

Appliance operation, all of it. Push the button and talk, release the
button and listen. Maybe you had to select a channel and learn some
jargon.

* *I have NOT "operated" using morse code on any radio...and I
* *don't care to do so now.

Nobody says you have to or even should, Len.

*Isn't that what YOU call "operating
* *a radio?" *:-)

It's one way of operating. It's one of many things I
have done in amateur radio and you have not. It's
one of many things I can do and you cannot.

So what?

* *The practitioners of amateur radio, at least some, will pound
* *on the table, get red in the face, hollering that the ONLY way
* *one can learn "radio" is to become an amateur licensee. *That's
* *totally stupid emotional non-logic.

Yes, it is. Becoming a radio amateur is just one way to learn "radio".
It's a good way but not the only way.

It surely is stupid, emotional non-logic.

* *If you think so, why on earth did you use the "newcomer to radio"
* *remark earlier in this message?

He didn't, Len. You did.

You're a newcomer to amateur radio.

* *Well, at least you agree that some of YOUR OWN remarks in
* *the past were, indeed, "stupid, emotional non-logic."

When did K8MN or I "pound on the table, get red
in the face, hollering that the ONLY way one can learn "radio" is to
become an amateur licensee. " ?


In fact, you're the only fellow I've seen make such a statement.

* *Did your computer screen malfunction. *I was just paraphrasing
* *your own words of the past.

* *Most of those just haven't
* *had any real experience in other radio services and the resent
* *those of us who have done so.

Not true, Len.

You have almost no real experience in amateur
radio, and you resent those of us who do.

I wouldn't advise that you start off making such statements when you
first put your brand new amateur radio license to use in getting on the air.

* *I've already been on the amateur bands, David...and have
* *discussed such subjects with other radio amateurs here. *:-)

The smiley tells me the opposite is true.

* *Those practitioners want to SHUT
* *OUT any mention of other radio services as "not applicable" to
* *amateur radio.

That's not the case either, Leonard. *You've been told that amateur
radio is not like other services when it comes to the use of Morse code.

And many other ways.

* *Tsk, tsk, you've TOLD ME a lot of different ****, David.
* *Complete with the wearing of the Waffen SS costume with
* *monocle in a terrible parody of Colonel Klink. *:-)

It is still heavily used in amateur HF and VHF weak signal work.

* *Then by all means USE it yourself. *Why do you insist on
* *shoving YOUR preferences down others' throats?

Nobody is doing that but you, Len. You tried to shove
your preferences on real estate zoning down other people's throats
some years back. You also tried to shove your preferences on amateur
radio testing *and* age requirements for an amateur licensing down
other people's throats.

Compounding that was your FACTUAL ERROR
* *in assuming you were some kind of "authority" and/or "leader"
* *on who should do what and where.

K8MN is more of an authority on amateur radio
than you are, Len. He has decades of amateur radio experience and
knowledge. You are a newcomer to amateur radio.

Not that there's anything wrong with that.

* *Every time you shout "factual error" you make your own FACTUAL
* *ERROR. *You have NO authority to judge anyone.

If he doesn't have the authority to judge others, Len,
then neither do you.

Jim, N2EY