RadioBanter - View Single Post

John Smith[_7_]

On 10/25/2011 7:59 PM, Alan Baker wrote:
In ,
John wrote:

On 10/25/2011 7:31 PM, Scout wrote:

"Alan wrote in message
...
In ,
. net wrote:

"Alan wrote in message
...
In ,
. net wrote:

"Alan wrote in message
...
In ,
John wrote:

Again, you prove yourself a fool, the high level drivers
make the
video
calls to the devices ... the hardware manufactures simply
have to
translate those into assembly ... the same calls are made,
but
the
firmware of the manufacturer translates those to fit its'
hardware
...
ATI will be much different the NVIDIA ... but windows
makes the
same
calls from its high level driver(s) ... and, windows must
provide
what
the game developers need, the instructions and calls, or it
doesn't
even
get off the ground. Just because a video card slot exists
on a
motherboard DOES NOT mean windows has to support it ...

It is the windows kernal which runs the games ... but hey,
glad
to
be
able to help you dispel your ignorance! :-)

I'm sorry, but when you really don't know what you're talking
about,
you
should just shut up.

Create a video card, write drivers for it according to Windows
published
requirements and it will work...

...Microsoft doesn't have anything to do with it other than
certifying
the drivers after they've been written.

What a dumb asshole ... you'd better make yourself familiar
with
the
windows device driver tools and their specs, moron ...

I am familiar with the process as you obviously are not,
since you
said
that Microsoft writes the drivers for other companies'
hardware when
they most certainly do not.

They most certainly do, or more accurately have ... now the
hardware
simply needs to have those translated ... new hardware can be
constructed which can do a whole LOT of things that WHQL
drivers, are
not aware of and can't use ... not until the windows drivers and
constructed, by microsoft, will those ever be used ...

WHQL is the specification, is the test, is the standard for
windows
drivers ... it is the sole creation and property of microsoft.

Like I say, you attempt to use semantics to prove black is really
white
...

No, John. Black is black and white is white.

Microsoft writes the specs to which the driver's must be written...

...but the hardware manufacturers/vendors write them.

Really?

I've got a lot of drivers on my computer, and when I look at the
data I
find
most are provided by Microsoft.

In fact, the only drivers which aren't from Microsoft are those I
installed
or downloaded from a manufacturer.

Disk Drivers - Drivers by Microsoft
Disk Interface - Drivers by Microsoft
Keyboard - Driver by Microsoft
Mouse - Driver by Microsoft
Monitor - Driver by Microsoft
Ports - Driver by Microsoft
CPU - Driver by Microsoft
System Devices - Drivers by Microsoft
USB - Driver by Microsoft

Video Card - Driver by Nividia
Ethernet - Driver by Intel
Audio - Drivers by RealTec

If the hardware manufacturers/venders write them, then why do they
state
they were provided by Microsoft?

Seems to me if someone else provided the drivers, then they could sue
Microsoft for false representation.

So why haven't they?

Scout: my discussions with John arose specifically about video cards.

So? My default drivers is provided bygasp Microsoft.

For devices with extremely well-defined interfaces. You can have disk
drivers by Microsoft because the drive manufactures work to the ATA
spec, etc.

Yep, just like graphics cards at least to a certain resolution.

Indeed if Microsoft didn't provide a driver for video cards it would be
extremely hard to install the O/S on the computer.

And because for basic drivers, the manufacturers make sure the cards
follow a basic spec.

Be that as it may, the default driver is still done by Microsoft.

"Windows didn't "go ahead" and do that, John. The companies that build
the graphics cards provide the drivers."

Yep, but Microsoft also produces drivers for graphics cards.

Very basic ones, yes.

Quickly: Tell us again who wrote the video card drivers on your
system...

Initially it was Microsoft.

Later it was Nividia

However, without that graphics card driver from Microsoft I would
never have
been able to instead the driver from Nividia.

Nope. Not true. It would have been a good bit more difficult... ...but
not impossible.

But the point of this was that John was touting *Microsoft* for writing
the drivers that make the high-performance video cards work in their
high-performance mode...

...and it just isn't so.

Well, actually, the BIOS and internal sockets in Windows has support for
the higher modes then your driver simply wouldn't work.

In short, you're not going to exceed the limits of what the BIOS and/or
O/S sets for the maximum limit.

Within the limits of the BIOS and O/S you can write drivers that will
work, but only within the limits of what is supported by them.

Scout:

The reason ATI cannot use NVIDIA drives is that the hardware is
different, windows make the same calls from its' driver (basically, some
minor differences are involved), there are windows drivers at work. If
the card is NVIDIA, those software engineers will translate the driver
calls into the proper hardware instructions ... if the card is ATI, the
same is done, only the hardware calls are different.

Windows has much different drivers than MAC, even when operating on the
same chip, the reason for all of this is complex and involves patents,
and differences between the two operating systems and many other factors.

The beginning discussion was on windows drivers, such as versus MAC
drivers ... however, in all fairness, in the industry, there are
actually two levels of utilities termed "drivers", and splits into "high
level drivers" and "low lever drivers." Or, simply, in shop the card
manufacturers will call their software (or firmware) "drivers." And
they are low level drivers, in fact ...

But, and I know it got confusing with everything being tossed into the
bowl to aid in obfuscation ... we WERE speaking of windows drivers ...
windows simply has no interest in the actually calls, commands, and port
addresses of the hardware ... but, make no mistake, the windows drives
are the "data pumps" and "data suckers" ... indeed, to windows, believe
it or not, a video card is much like just another file to be written to,
or read from ... same for unix and linux also, indeed, this model is
much more apparent in those latter systems ...

You have no clue.

Copy my text and post it in an OS forum ...

Regards,
JS