On 9/5/2013 10:06 PM, rickman wrote:
On 9/5/2013 9:30 PM, Jerry Stuckle wrote:
On 9/5/2013 7:08 PM, rickman wrote:
On 9/5/2013 1:47 PM, Michael Black wrote:
On Thu, 5 Sep 2013, rickman wrote:


It seems very restrictive that anyone can use a marine VHF radio on
their boat, but if they want to speak with someone on shore that is
not allowed except for special cases like drawbridge operators. I can
understand that marine radios are not for shore to shore
communications, but it only seems natural to use the same radio for
ship to ship and ship to shore comms.

The magic reasoning is that if you're on a boat or ship, then you
are on
the water, and the marine band would then apply. You may need it for
emergency, or talking to other boats. I'm sure you used to have to be
licensed in order to have a Marine band license, so things have
changed.
Indeed, it was only about the late sixties that the VHF Marine band
came
into existence, before that you had to use the 2 to 3MHz Marine band,
with much longer antennas and I think more serious licensing
requirements. The VHF Marine band gave a lot more boaters the use of
radio, and some of that was because in putting the band at higher
frequencies, the range was limited, so more people could make use of
the
allocation. And about that time, the equipment on the HF marine band
got
fancier and more expensive, precisely to make better use of that
allocation.

But, if anyone could get a marine band radio and use it from shore,
what's to keep them from just using it as a general radio band? The
allocation is for marine use, yet if anyone could use a radio for the
band from shore, then they might use it for any purpose.

That's the difference, it's now easy to use the radio from a boat,
where
the band is intended for, and difficult to use from shore since you
need
to justify that you actually will be using it for ship to shore use.

Faulty reasoning. I can use the marine band radio from shore now. The
only thing stopping me is the law. Last year I was told it was ok to
use it from shore if I was communicating with a boat (which makes
perfect sense), now I find that is *not* the case. During our trip I
heard any number of conversations between boats and what appeared to be
their homes. There was no congestion, no interference of the airways,
just ship to shore communications when useful.



You need to look at the law, not listen to some armchair lawyer. We
pointed you to the actual regulations.

And if someone is caught using a marine radio on shore without a
license, it is a $10K fine - and chances are you will NEVER get ANY kind
of FCC license in the future.

There is every need for a boat to have a radio, no need for everyone on
shore to have a radio, so the licensing is restrictive. Likely not as
restrictive as you perceive it, but still there to weed out the people
who might wish to use it for other things.

The utility of a radio, especially in emergency situations, is greatly
diminished if you can't reach people on the shore. My understanding is
that the range of these radios is *very* short if you are close to the
water. There were kayaks less than 4 miles away who I could not raise
on the radio and I was likely the closest point of assistance. If they
had needed to call for help, who exactly would they be able to reach?


You can reach people on shore. For instance, the Coast Guard regularly
monitors the marine emergency channel, as do many other people. Not to
say other ships. There are lots of people they can reach.

And these *legal* stations have relatively high antennas - 4 miles is
nothing to them.

So how far is it to the nearest coast guard station at Lake Anna?


I don't know, and I don't care. It is immaterial.


In the sea kayaking community VHF radio is both regarded as an important
safety device because of the importance of communications and as a joke
because of how often it communicates with no out outside of your paddle
group. I don't think it is unreasonable for shore stations to be able
to monitor VHF and respond in an emergency situation or to prevent one.
In the situation at Lake Anna, if I am not allowed to have a VHF
license for my shore station, then what is the use of having a VHF radio
in a boat?


In a *real emergency*, then rules are out. But you need to learn what
the term emergency means to the FCC. It does NOT mean "there's a storm
brewing". It does, however, mean things like "My boat is sinking and we
need immediate help".

The radio in the boat is not meant to talk to *YOU* - it is to talk to
*anyone* who can help - be it the Coast Guard, a marine, another ship or
whatever.

I think we already covered the fact that neither the Coast Guard or
anyone else is monitoring VHF at Lake Anna. Marine VHF is *not* solely
for commercial uses and it is *not* solely for emergencies. As such it
is much more limited by not allowing communications with shore stations
other than the limited set currently allowed.


I didn't say it was solely for commercial uses or solely for
emergencies. But it is not for talking to your pals in their boats when
you're on the ground.


You keep arguing - but the law is the law. If you don't like it,
petition the FCC to have the law changed. Constantly bitching here is
not going to change anything - and will rapidly turn people off (like it
has me).

I understand what I've been told about the law. I'm saying it seems to
be a bit over strict. You seem to have a problem with the fact that I
have an opinion. If you don't like my posts, why do you reply?

I'm trying to find a legal way to do what I want. I still don't know
that this is not allowed. I do now know that I will have to file for a
license and possibly two. I appreciate the help and I regret that you
consider my posts to be "bitching". I would suggest that you reread
them with a different perspective.


Then petition the FCC for a change in the law.

You have gone beyond constructive; you are just repeating yourself now.
It has become tiresome.


--
==================
Remove the "x" from my email address
Jerry Stuckle
JDS Computer Training Corp.

==================