On 9/8/2013 9:44 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 08 Sep 2013 07:32:19 -0400, wrote:

On 9/8/2013 9:48 AM, wrote:
On Sun, 08 Sep 2013 00:07:21 -0400, wrote:

On 9/7/2013 7:50 PM, wrote:
On Sat, 07 Sep 2013 19:10:14 -0400, wrote:

Yeah, I read on the FCC site that I am ok as long as I am in US waters
or *not* communicating with a foreign station. Something like that. I
don't expect to have any issues related to this though. It gets pretty
cold up there near Canada and the water is even colder.
You DO realize that most Canadians live south of Duluth? Kitchener
is just north of the northern border of California - Great beaches on
Georgian bay and Lake Erie.. Great warm water canoeing and kayaking on
the Grand River.

The Great Lakes are a well known death trap for the unprepared kayaker.
Check out some of the accident analyses on the cold water safety web
site...

http://www.coldwatersafety.org/

As for Grand River, here is a table of water temps. Seems Grand River,
on the average, is only has a safe temperature for two months out of the
year, July 10 to Sept 10.

The grand on an AVERAGE year is safe as far as temps go from late june
to early October - and the water is generally (relatively) shallow and
slow moving through most of the watershed. This summer has been an
exception - running full almost all summer. THOUSANDS of canoeists
and kayakers all summer in the Kitchener and Cayuga areas in
particular.

The numbers I read *were* average numbers. What do you consider "safe"
water temps?


If I were to be kayaking near Canada it would be more likely East Coast
and that is ocean and even worse. That's all I meant.

BTW, being south of Duluth is no indication that the water is safe...
Check out this case study that happened right here in Virginia...

http://www.coldwatersafety.org/Rule2.html#rule2Case7

If you can't use the above link go to the cold water web site and click
through to Golden Rule 2, case 7. When you read many of these reports
it gets to you after a while.

Many of these accidents could have been prevented if the kayakers had
used a marine band VHF or other radio to contact help. That is one of
the reasons why I want to get a marine radio here.

Did you do any reading of the cold water safety site I mentioned. Most
people don't realize the danger of cold water or just how cold it needs
to be to be dangerous.
The temperatures right now - Sept 1 to 9, 2013 at the bottom of the
shand Dam at Belwood has been a steady 20C. It warms up as it flows
through the Elora Goege down to Brigeport (Kitchener) where it has
gone from 25 down to 20 and back up to 23C over the last 8 days.Down
at Port Maitland where it enters the lake, it has run from 27 to 21C,
and at it's coldest point it has varied between 18 and 15C.

This is colder than normal at this time of year due to heavier rains
and cooler weather. Last year it was likely 3-5C higher

15C is 59F,
23C is 73.4F
25 is 77F

At 60F water is borderline dangerous - but most places where the water
is currently that cold you could stand in the Grand and walk to shore.
Down at Port Maitland it handles great lakes freighters.
We used to swim in the grand and it's tributaries from early June on
untill late September as kids,

Get the book "paddling the Grand". It's about $20.

This has gotten *very* off topic for this group. But I want to point
out that your facts are wrong, dangerously wrong. You pointed me to a
book I would have to buy to read, but I don't need that. I have seen a
lot of *very* good info on the issue of cold water safety and water at
60°F is not *borderline* dangerous, it is just plain dangerous. If you
think that you can fall into water at that temperature regardless of how
deep it is without risk of death, you are mistaken. Go to the web site
I pointed you to and do some reading. *Everything* discussed on the web
site is backed by research and scientific evidence. It is all available.

This website and the National Center for Cold Water Safety was created
because of the many deaths which are largely attributed to the lack of
knowledge about the real hazards of cold water sports.

I won't discuss this further in this newsgroup, but feel free to contact
me directly if you wish or in another venue. Are there sports
newsgroups where this might be more appropriate? I'd be happy to
continue the conversation elsewhere.

--

Rick