On Dec 14, 1:52 pm, Cecil Moore wrote:
Keith Dysart wrote:
Do photons also explain how sound can move
at a 1000 ft/s, while the air molecules barely
move at all?

No, mechanical longitudinal waves are well understood.
It is impossible for them to achieve the speed of light.

Non-sequitor.

No? Not clear then why they are needed for
electrons.

Do you think electrons support mechanical waves?

Simplicity itself. Electrons are charged. Like charges
repel. Move an electron and the next electron will tend
to move away.

The fields of TEM waves consist of photons traveling
at the speed of light.

I've been told that near the antenna, there are just
varying electric and magnetic fields and that some
distance from the antenna the electro-magnetic
wave forms. How does the varying field turn into a
photon? At what point? Where does the simply
varying field end and the photons begin? Or does
the antenna emit photons?

....Keith

"Keith Dysart" wrote in message
...
On Dec 14, 1:52 pm, Cecil Moore wrote:
Keith Dysart wrote:
Do photons also explain how sound can move
at a 1000 ft/s, while the air molecules barely
move at all?

No, mechanical longitudinal waves are well understood.
It is impossible for them to achieve the speed of light.

Non-sequitor.

No? Not clear then why they are needed for
electrons.

Do you think electrons support mechanical waves?

Simplicity itself. Electrons are charged. Like charges
repel. Move an electron and the next electron will tend
to move away.

The fields of TEM waves consist of photons traveling
at the speed of light.

I've been told that near the antenna, there are just
varying electric and magnetic fields and that some
distance from the antenna the electro-magnetic
wave forms. How does the varying field turn into a
photon? At what point? Where does the simply
varying field end and the photons begin? Or does
the antenna emit photons?

...Keith

photons are a non-sequitar... or waves are, take your pick. but never the
twain shall meet... except in some odd quantum mechanics cases where waves
and photons are equally valid. For working with antennas at HF it is best
to forget photons, they will just confuse you. if you get into the inner
workings of lasers or BEC's or other quantum level effects then you might
need to use photons. EM fields and waves in the macro world are all that is
necessary to completely describe the solution to any problem you may
encounter in amateur radio. likewise in transmission lines, forget photons,
use currents and voltages, you will never run into a case where photons are
necessary, or even useful, in transmission line problems.

Dave wrote:
likewise in transmission lines, forget photons,
use currents and voltages, you will never run into a case where photons are
necessary, or even useful, in transmission line problems.

Fields and waves *are* quantized photons. Radiation
from an antenna is a lot easier to understand as
a cloud of photon particles that escape rather than
the EM fields that break away like soap bubbles.
--
73, Cecil http://www.w5dxp.com

Cecil Moore wrote:
Radiation
from an antenna is a lot easier to understand as
a cloud of photon particles that escape rather than
the EM fields that break away like soap bubbles.

Cecil,

Only in your dreams. Antenna photons may be great for your handwaving
explanations. Let's see you do the math. Do you suppose there is a
conspiracy among the many authors of text books to use only the
cumbersome wave formulations? Are photons too easy? Would the textbooks
then be unneeded?

73,
Gene
W4SZ

Keith Dysart wrote:
On Dec 14, 1:52 pm, Cecil Moore wrote:
Do you think electrons support mechanical waves?

Simplicity itself. Electrons are charged. Like charges
repel. Move an electron and the next electron will tend
to move away.

So by your own admission, those are not mechanical waves.
Like charge repulsion is *NOT a mechanical phenomenon*.
Those electrons never touch each other. They are repelled
by the photons they are emitting.

I've been told that near the antenna, there are just
varying electric and magnetic fields and that some
distance from the antenna the electro-magnetic
wave forms. How does the varying field turn into a
photon?

The varying field ***IS*** made up of *PHOTONS*.
All electromagnetic fields consist of photons!
--
73, Cecil http://www.w5dxp.com