|
Solar cycle: normal
There have been some suggestions that the sun is not behaving normally
with respect to the sunspot cycle. There was a thread in this group a month ago with the title, "Sunspot cycle more dud than radiation flood." If you're worried about that, you might want to have a look at http://science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2...htm?list174385. |
Solar cycle: normal
On Jul 11, 12:10 pm, K7ITM wrote:
There have been some suggestions that the sun is not behaving normally with respect to the sunspot cycle. There was a thread in this group a month ago with the title, "Sunspot cycle more dud than radiation flood." If you're worried about that, you might want to have a look athttp://science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2008/11jul_solarcycleupdate.htm?li.... When the Earths pole stop traversing the plains of Siberier instead of continueing its present path I will be more comfortable |
Solar cycle: normal
"K7ITM" wrote in message ... There have been some suggestions that the sun is not behaving normally with respect to the sunspot cycle. There was a thread in this group a month ago with the title, "Sunspot cycle more dud than radiation flood." If you're worried about that, you might want to have a look at http://science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2...htm?list174385. Tnx Tom, why are there a number of folks totally occupied with trying to keep the rest of us worried? If it's not the tree huggers and their carbon footprint, it's some other condition that implies the end of life as we know it. Could it be that they are intent on keeping us from noticing the guy behind the curtain? Regards W4ZCB |
Solar cycle: normal
On Fri, 11 Jul 2008, K7ITM wrote:
There have been some suggestions that the sun is not behaving normally with respect to the sunspot cycle. Can the sun really do anything that isnt 'normal' ? It is man-kinds stunted view of what normal should be that is abnormal. The sun is not adhering to our predictions based on previous observations. Bad, bad sun. No cookie for you. -- My mailbox is NOT an advertisement medium. Tehrasha Darkon My address is NOT for sale, lease or rent. Send me spam, lose your account. Get it? TINLC-1372 http://tehrasha.mamehost.com/******* B.A.S.T.A.R.D |
Solar cycle: normal
K7ITM wrote:
There have been some suggestions that the sun is not behaving normally with respect to the sunspot cycle. There was a thread in this group a month ago with the title, "Sunspot cycle more dud than radiation flood." If you're worried about that, you might want to have a look at http://science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2...htm?list174385. I don't believe anyone will do a thing, until: 1) We can no longer breath the air with out pain and all the birds are gone. 2) The coral reefs, and there for the fish, are dead (salmon are already going that way.) 3) Ocean acidification has destroyed all oyster, clams, crabs, shrimp, abalone, lobster, etc... (it is beginning now.) 4) Etc., etc., etc. ... I would like to think different, but nothing has changed ... Rome burns while Nero fiddles ... no, greed, corruption and lack of vision will lead us where it always has ... Regards, JS |
Solar cycle: normal
"John Smith" wrote in message ... K7ITM wrote: There have been some suggestions that the sun is not behaving normally with respect to the sunspot cycle. There was a thread in this group a month ago with the title, "Sunspot cycle more dud than radiation flood." If you're worried about that, you might want to have a look at http://science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2...htm?list174385. I don't believe anyone will do a thing, until: 1) We can no longer breath the air with out pain and all the birds are gone. 2) The coral reefs, and there for the fish, are dead (salmon are already going that way.) 3) Ocean acidification has destroyed all oyster, clams, crabs, shrimp, abalone, lobster, etc... (it is beginning now.) 4) Etc., etc., etc. ... I would like to think different, but nothing has changed ... Rome burns while Nero fiddles ... no, greed, corruption and lack of vision will lead us where it always has ... Regards, JS ---------------- We do not possess an all powerful one world government, John. How else could anything be done? If we continue on our present path, there is a chance that billions of people and other species could die as a consequence. The sad truth is that if there was one world government that was all powerful, the only way it could reduce the strain on the world's ecosystem is to kill billions of people. Gee, that sounds familiar, doesn't it? It is easy to say "do something". But when asked precisely what and by whom, things fall apart in a hurry. Anything that could be done, will affect people, their economies, their futures, their children, etc. Who is going to voluntarily put a gun to their head and eliminate themselves from the true problem being experienced by the Earth? Ed Cregger |
Solar cycle: normal
Ed Cregger wrote:
... ---------------- We do not possess an all powerful one world government, John. How else could anything be done? If we continue on our present path, there is a chance that billions of people and other species could die as a consequence. The sad truth is that if there was one world government that was all powerful, the only way it could reduce the strain on the world's ecosystem is to kill billions of people. Gee, that sounds familiar, doesn't it? It is easy to say "do something". But when asked precisely what and by whom, things fall apart in a hurry. Anything that could be done, will affect people, their economies, their futures, their children, etc. Who is going to voluntarily put a gun to their head and eliminate themselves from the true problem being experienced by the Earth? Ed Cregger Absolutely not ... "They" have simply designed the world wrong. We need our jobs closer to our homes. We need small manufacturing plants close to cities, and of varying products so as supply the most needs of the city as possible. Mass transportation in place of single cars ... etc, etc ... We need to manufacture "things" to last a lifetime or two, and out of metal, wood and glass--instead of cheap plastic poisons to fill our dumps, streams and oceans with ... Etc, etc, etc ... Oh no, it is all easily "fixable", it just won't be done--greed and corruption take a far different path--one which always ends in the end of the particular civilization in question ... look at the cheap plastic "toy" radios we have today--a sharp contrast to the sturdy metal/glass cases of yesteryear ... Those who know NOT their history are doomed to repeat that history ... today they "rewrite history" in the image "they" wish ... Regards, JS |
Solar cycle: normal
"K7ITM" wrote in message ... There have been some suggestions that the sun is not behaving normally with respect to the sunspot cycle. There was a thread in this group a month ago with the title, "Sunspot cycle more dud than radiation flood." If you're worried about that, you might want to have a look at http://science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2...htm?list174385. The sun may have been behaving abnormally and is now be returning to normal! Have a look at http://members.optushome.com.au/vk6y...olarcycles.htm |
Solar cycle: normal
"John Smith" wrote Absolutely not ... "They" have simply designed the world wrong. We need our jobs closer to our homes. We need small manufacturing plants close to cities, and of varying products so as supply the most needs of the city as possible. Mass transportation in place of single cars ... etc, etc ... We need to manufacture "things" to last a lifetime or two, and out of metal, wood and glass--instead of cheap plastic poisons to fill our dumps, streams and oceans with ... Etc, etc, etc ... Oh no, it is all easily "fixable", it just won't be done--greed and corruption take a far different path--one which always ends in the end of the particular civilization in question ... look at the cheap plastic "toy" radios we have today--a sharp contrast to the sturdy metal/glass cases of yesteryear ... Those who know NOT their history are doomed to repeat that history ... today they "rewrite history" in the image "they" wish ... Regards, JS ----------- No offense intended, but the first really scary thing that I learned as an adult was that there is no "they". It is all random. See, I told you that was scary. One man's corruption is another man's politics... Looking back with 20-20 hindsight, it is simple to see how things could have been accomplished in much more efficient manners. Who would have gussed that chemical companies' run-off (ditching) would affect the world so negatively? I lived in a community whose main source of income was the production of various chemicals. Just like the old smoking ads that claimed that smoking was good for you (yes, they did, in fact, exist and were uttered by our government), we blue collar kids were told that chemicals and fumes were good for you. I swear to God. It's true. Seems hard to believe today, but in those days, TV was only on the air for six to seven hours a day and no one, but no one, spread negative news toward industry. Anyway, we have another chance, in fact, multitude chances, to save our civilization. But it will probably spring from technologies and ways of thinking which we cannot even imagine presently. Try to enjoy the good things and times while they are here, for they too are transitory. And just in case you forgot, so are we. Ed Cregger |
Solar cycle: normal
Ed Cregger wrote:
... ----------- No offense intended, but the first really scary thing that I learned as an adult was that there is no "they". It is all random. See, I told you that was scary. ... Well, I differ, the "they" are those in power with the chance to make things better, or make a buck--however, we seem to live in a world where this two things are mutually exclusive! If it were I or you, or we together, who were the ones in "power", we would face great temptations to do the same--sell out our fellow citizens to fatten our wallets. The safeguards, which were once in place, are now gone--money purchasing your congressmen and senators fixed that ... Anyway, we have another chance, in fact, multitude chances, to save our civilization. But it will probably spring from technologies and ways of thinking which we cannot even imagine presently. Try to enjoy the good things and times while they are here, for they too are transitory. And just in case you forgot, so are we. Ed Cregger We are indeed in a time of GREAT transition. The gold in the gold fields is gone. The BIG trees in the forests have all been harvested. In the Sierra Nevada's, "they" have left belts of trees along the highways for aesthetics, but venture a little ways off these highways and you find great areas of clear cut land. In the old days, one single log could fill a logging truck; today, these trucks appear to be carrying loads of pencils! Every acre of ground is now in the hands of private citizens, companies/corps or the gov't. All the farm ground is now in production which is economically feasible to grow crops on; we tax the reserves of cheaply available fertilizer we have left to raise these crops. Every gallon of water in the lakes, rivers and streams is owned by some entity. Without anymore natural resources to exploit--we now face a much different world. While capitalism was wonderful when resources were abundantly plentiful to be raped, it will now be interesting to see how it functions. I see a world with vast numbers of impoverished "have-nothings" and a few members of a ruling class with their knaves and female servents ... but come hell-or-high-water, we shall see this "new world order." The gears which bring it turn now; and, I see none powerful enough to halt them. But then, I digress from antennas ... Regards, JS |
Solar cycle: normal
John Smith wrote:
... But then, I digress from antennas ... Regards, JS I failed to mention oil/energy, but then, you already know about those ... Regards, JS |
Solar cycle: normal
John Smith wrote:
While capitalism was wonderful when resources were abundantly plentiful to be raped, it will now be interesting to see how it functions. ---Eight stages of democracy--- From bondage to spiritual faith; From spiritual faith to great courage; From courage to liberty; From liberty to abundance; From abundance to complacency; From complacency to apathy; From apathy to dependence; (2008?) From dependence back into bondage. -- 73, Cecil http://www.w5dxp.com |
Solar cycle: normal
Ed Cregger wrote:
"John Smith" wrote Absolutely not ... "They" have simply designed the world wrong. We need our jobs closer to our homes. We need small manufacturing plants close to cities, and of varying products so as supply the most needs of the city as possible. Mass transportation in place of single cars ... etc, etc ... We need to manufacture "things" to last a lifetime or two, and out of metal, wood and glass--instead of cheap plastic poisons to fill our dumps, streams and oceans with ... Etc, etc, etc ... Oh no, it is all easily "fixable", it just won't be done--greed and corruption take a far different path--one which always ends in the end of the particular civilization in question ... look at the cheap plastic "toy" radios we have today--a sharp contrast to the sturdy metal/glass cases of yesteryear ... Those who know NOT their history are doomed to repeat that history ... today they "rewrite history" in the image "they" wish ... Regards, JS ----------- No offense intended, but the first really scary thing that I learned as an adult was that there is no "they". It is all random. See, I told you that was scary. One man's corruption is another man's politics... Looking back with 20-20 hindsight, it is simple to see how things could have been accomplished in much more efficient manners. Who would have gussed that chemical companies' run-off (ditching) would affect the world so negatively? Odd, but it was obvious to a lot of people. They were just ignored or ostracized. I lived in a community whose main source of income was the production of various chemicals. In our area, we had a world class trout fishing stream. when I say that, I mean that people from all over the world came here and spent a lot of money to fish, and stay in hotels, eat in restaraunts. We also had a chemical production company that wanted to do a lot of things that some of the populous didn't want them to do. It got to the point of township meetings. Some folks said that the companies practices were going to destroy the local watershed. The company and a lot of people accused them of being anti-business, anti job, anti growth, and worse. The chemical company got it's way. Fast forward to today.... The watershed has been destroyed by two chemicals that leaked from poorly constructed holding areas. The world class trout stream is no more. No more visitors spending all that money - it was millions in the 60's, who knows what it would be now. The chemicals have reached a lake about 30 miles away now, and people aren't supposed to eat fish from either the lake or stream. And the chemical company? They aren't in business any more. They were bought out by a european company who then closed down the competition, took a write off, and left. That isn't all they left. The bill for the cleanup is with us. The end result: Jobs are gone. World class fishing stream gone. A nice lake downstream gone as an added benefit. No one can say they didn't know. They didn't listen. Just like the old smoking ads that claimed that smoking was good for you (yes, they did, in fact, exist and were uttered by our government), And yet, I read a book from the late 1800's that stated that smoking tobacco caused Lung cancer and emphysema, and that chewing it caused oral and stomach cancer. We knew. We just didn't listen. we blue collar kids were told that chemicals and fumes were good for you. I swear to God. It's true. Seems hard to believe today, but in those days, TV was only on the air for six to seven hours a day and no one, but no one, spread negative news toward industry. When I was a kid, of course I didn't pay much attention. But as I grew, I found that the answers were out there somewhere.We just had to look for them. Even as a teenager, I wanted to look for the unfiltered source for knowledge. Anyway, we have another chance, in fact, multitude chances, to save our civilization. But it will probably spring from technologies and ways of thinking which we cannot even imagine presently. I just don't think it will happen. I suspect the last humans' words will be "We just didn't know!" - 73 de Mike N3LI - |
Solar cycle: normal
Michael Coslo wrote:
... When I was a kid, of course I didn't pay much attention. But as I grew, I found that the answers were out there somewhere.We just had to look for them. Even as a teenager, I wanted to look for the unfiltered source for knowledge. Most look at "the news" on tv/radio, I don't think the answers to their questions are there. I don't think the news is responsible to "Joe-Blow_Citizen"; I think "the news" is responsible to "the men with the money." This is highly dangerous to over 99% of the citizens ... "the truth" can be very difficult to find--when it has the potential to threaten those in power ... Anyway, we have another chance, in fact, multitude chances, to save our civilization. But it will probably spring from technologies and ways of thinking which we cannot even imagine presently. I just don't think it will happen. I suspect the last humans' words will be "We just didn't know!" - 73 de Mike N3LI - I agree with you here. Even if "the technologies" provide answers (and, that is NOT on the horizon), our "public servants" (the president, senators, congressmen, military, police, etc.) are bought and owned; this is what has really brought on the problems you have named and those which face us now, and in the foreseeable future. Until we have made "them" responsible to us, with great penalties placed on "them" for prostituting themselves for money, we will remain where we are ... the man behind the curtain is pulling the strings and leavers. Regards, JS |
Solar cycle: normal
Cecil Moore wrote:
John Smith wrote: While capitalism was wonderful when resources were abundantly plentiful to be raped, it will now be interesting to see how it functions. ---Eight stages of democracy--- From bondage to spiritual faith; From spiritual faith to great courage; From courage to liberty; From liberty to abundance; From abundance to complacency; From complacency to apathy; From apathy to dependence; (2008?) From dependence back into bondage. Or, simply, those who do not know their history are doomed to repeat their history ... Regards, JS |
Solar cycle: normal
Cecil Moore wrote:
John Smith wrote: While capitalism was wonderful when resources were abundantly plentiful to be raped, it will now be interesting to see how it functions. ---Eight stages of democracy--- From bondage to spiritual faith; From spiritual faith to great courage; From courage to liberty; From liberty to abundance; From abundance to complacency; From complacency to apathy; From apathy to dependence; (2008?) From dependence back into bondage. I should also have stated, remember that the "Boston Tea Party" was over a penny a pound tax on tea ... Now, count all the hidden taxes we pay .... the forefathers MUST be turning in their graves ... Regards, JS |
Solar cycle: normal
Michael Coslo wrote:
In our area, we had a world class trout fishing stream. when I say that, I mean that people from all over the world came here and spent a lot of money to fish, and stay in hotels, eat in restaraunts. We also had a chemical production company that wanted to do a lot of things that some of the populous didn't want them to do. It got to the point of township meetings. Some folks said that the companies practices were going to destroy the local watershed. The company and a lot of people accused them of being anti-business, anti job, anti growth, and worse. The chemical company got it's way. Fast forward to today.... The watershed has been destroyed by two chemicals that leaked from poorly constructed holding areas. The world class trout stream is no more. No more visitors spending all that money - it was millions in the 60's, who knows what it would be now. The chemicals have reached a lake about 30 miles away now, and people aren't supposed to eat fish from either the lake or stream. And the chemical company? They aren't in business any more. They were bought out by a european company who then closed down the competition, took a write off, and left. That isn't all they left. The bill for the cleanup is with us. The end result: Jobs are gone. World class fishing stream gone. A nice lake downstream gone as an added benefit. No one can say they didn't know. They didn't listen. What a disaster - and a huge tragedy. Clearly the world would be a better place....if it was uninhabited. I guess a better message would have been that holding areas should not be poorly constructed, rather than just shouting the tired old eco-mantra 'corporations are evil' - which nobody listens to. But eco groups aren't exactly the best listeners either. ac6xg |
Solar cycle: normal
"John Smith" wrote in message ... Ed Cregger wrote: ... ----------- No offense intended, but the first really scary thing that I learned as an adult was that there is no "they". It is all random. See, I told you that was scary. ... Well, I differ, the "they" are those in power with the chance to make things better, or make a buck--however, we seem to live in a world where this two things are mutually exclusive! If it were I or you, or we together, who were the ones in "power", we would face great temptations to do the same--sell out our fellow citizens to fatten our wallets. The safeguards, which were once in place, are now gone--money purchasing your congressmen and senators fixed that ... Anyway, we have another chance, in fact, multitude chances, to save our civilization. But it will probably spring from technologies and ways of thinking which we cannot even imagine presently. Try to enjoy the good things and times while they are here, for they too are transitory. And just in case you forgot, so are we. Ed Cregger We are indeed in a time of GREAT transition. The gold in the gold fields is gone. The BIG trees in the forests have all been harvested. In the Sierra Nevada's, "they" have left belts of trees along the highways for aesthetics, but venture a little ways off these highways and you find great areas of clear cut land. In the old days, one single log could fill a logging truck; today, these trucks appear to be carrying loads of pencils! Every acre of ground is now in the hands of private citizens, companies/corps or the gov't. All the farm ground is now in production which is economically feasible to grow crops on; we tax the reserves of cheaply available fertilizer we have left to raise these crops. Every gallon of water in the lakes, rivers and streams is owned by some entity. Without anymore natural resources to exploit--we now face a much different world. While capitalism was wonderful when resources were abundantly plentiful to be raped, it will now be interesting to see how it functions. I see a world with vast numbers of impoverished "have-nothings" and a few members of a ruling class with their knaves and female servents ... but come hell-or-high-water, we shall see this "new world order." The gears which bring it turn now; and, I see none powerful enough to halt them. But then, I digress from antennas ... Regards, JS --------- The more people that want a piece of the pie, the smaller the pieces will be. Our main, number #1 problem is over population for the resources we have remaining and the lifestyle we wish to live. But you know that. Nature culls its creatures occasionally. Will it be by disease/plague? By wars? By things we cannot even imagine? No one knows. Enjoy the party while it is going on. Analyze later. Worrying hurts no one but you and those around you. I have given up worrying about it all. It is now in God's hands. I surrender. Ed, NM2K back to antennas |
Solar cycle: normal
"Jim Kelley" wrote What a disaster - and a huge tragedy. Clearly the world would be a better place....if it was uninhabited. I guess a better message would have been that holding areas should not be poorly constructed, rather than just shouting the tired old eco-mantra 'corporations are evil' - which nobody listens to. But eco groups aren't exactly the best listeners either. ac6xg ---------- And that is the answer in a nutshell. The environmental folks have to make ridiculous statements to the news media to obtain any coverage of their views. The general population sees the wackos on TV and dismisses anything they have to say because, "they aren't like us". But you will never get the general population to think through the unusual clothing, phrasing and behavior of the environmentalists. How can such brilliant folks (the environmentalists on the average) miss such a mundane marketing practice as "do not alienate the customer"? It appears that they could use some help from the very industrial folks they hold in such high disdain. Ed Cregger |
Solar cycle: normal
Jim Kelley wrote in
: Michael Coslo wrote: In our area, we had a world class trout fishing stream. when I say that, I mean that people from all over the world came here and spent a lot of money to fish, and stay in hotels, eat in restaraunts. We also had a chemical production company that wanted to do a lot of things that some of the populous didn't want them to do. It got to the point of township meetings. Some folks said that the companies practices were going to destroy the local watershed. The company and a lot of people accused them of being anti-business, anti job, anti growth, and worse. The chemical company got it's way. Fast forward to today.... The watershed has been destroyed by two chemicals that leaked from poorly constructed holding areas. The world class trout stream is no more. No more visitors spending all that money - it was millions in the 60's, who knows what it would be now. The chemicals have reached a lake about 30 miles away now, and people aren't supposed to eat fish from either the lake or stream. And the chemical company? They aren't in business any more. They were bought out by a european company who then closed down the competition, took a write off, and left. That isn't all they left. The bill for the cleanup is with us. The end result: Jobs are gone. World class fishing stream gone. A nice lake downstream gone as an added benefit. No one can say they didn't know. They didn't listen. What a disaster - and a huge tragedy. Clearly the world would be a better place....if it was uninhabited. I guess a better message would have been that holding areas should not be poorly constructed, rather than just shouting the tired old eco-mantra 'corporations are evil' - which nobody listens to. But eco groups aren't exactly the best listeners either. Jim, I'll give you a universal truth. It is all about money. Nothing else. Either through the chemicals or the world class fishing stream. Take your pick. Have a company that comes in, pays about 20 people a little above minimum wage, and maybe 5 managers a decent wage for a few years. Or a setup that keeps returning money as long as it can be kept up? Know what the problem with well constructed holding areas is? If you try to insist on them, it will cost the company more money, and in an effort to avoid that, you are painted as an eco-nut or a tree hugger. I was perhaps remiss in that the quality of the holding ponds was part of the controversy. You might be glad to know that the design settled upon saved the company a lot of money. Great, huh? Showed the tree huggers a thing or two. Problem was, it leaked like a seive. Roughty equivalent to just pouring th echemicals on the ground, which would have saved the company even more money. Contrast that to millions that would have come in if the fishing stream was protected and maintained. As a person who stood to make money on one of the two endeavors, which would you prefer? One that could make you a whole lot of money over a long long period of time, or the ten year model that puts a lot less money into the community, eventually leaves you footing a very large bill. What we did, we lost money on, not made money. No tree hugging, no Sierra club, no leeeburuls, no "Corporations are evil", nothing but pure bottom line. Money. Why would you be against making as mouch money as possible? I like capitalism myself, how about you? - 73 de Mike N3LI - |
Solar cycle: normal
Ed Cregger wrote:
Ed: You are not just right, you are right on. ... The more people that want a piece of the pie, the smaller the pieces will be. Our main, number #1 problem is over population for the resources we have remaining and the lifestyle we wish to live. But you know that. Yes, strange the last thing our public servants will consider is closing the borders ... well, until you consider the desire for dirt-cheap labor and an impoverished work force which will work for next to nothing ... and you are quite right, I did know that--but then, anyone with the gray matter to blow away a fly would ... :-( Nature culls its creatures occasionally. Will it be by disease/plague? By wars? By things we cannot even imagine? No one knows. Enjoy the party while it is going on. Analyze later. Worrying hurts no one but you and those around you. I have given up worrying about it all. It is now in God's hands. I surrender. Ed, NM2K back to antennas Yes, a disease which favored the control freaks, corrupt public servants and the power-hungry would be useful right about now ... And yes, something new, unique or at least interesting and not seen before would be nice--even with antennas! I am all ears! :-) Warm regards, JS |
Solar cycle: normal
Mike Coslo wrote:
... No tree hugging, no Sierra club, no leeeburuls, no "Corporations are evil", nothing but pure bottom line. Money. Why would you be against making as mouch money as possible? I like capitalism myself, how about you? - 73 de Mike N3LI - Then I suggest you listen to rush linbaugh (sp?) He clearly explains that there is nothing wrong; things are good and only getting better! However, I think he is mainly speaking to those which enjoy the smog polluted airs of Los Angeles and drinking water containing chemicals I have great difficulty pronouncing. Those who think the climbing numbers of sterile males is "natural." Those who like the charts showing climbing numbers of cancer, birth defects, etc. Those who never did like the taste of salmon and can certainly rejoice in its' extinction, etc., etc. You know who I speak of, those who will only empty the trash can when garbage starts hitting the floor and stinking so bad it takes their breath away, and they ponder why the rats have taken on such a sickly look ... Regards, JS |
Solar cycle: normal
On Jul 16, 8:39*pm, Mike Coslo wrote:
Jim, I'll give you a universal truth. It is all about money. Nothing else. Either through the chemicals or the world class fishing stream. Take your pick. Have a company that comes in, pays about 20 people a little above minimum wage, and maybe 5 managers a decent wage for a few years. Or a setup that keeps returning money as long as it can be kept up? Know what the problem with well constructed holding areas is? If you try to insist on them, it will cost the company more money, and in an effort to avoid that, you are painted as an eco-nut or a tree hugger. I was perhaps remiss in that the quality of the holding ponds was part of the controversy. You might be glad to know that the design settled upon saved the company a lot of money. Great, huh? Showed the tree huggers a thing or two. Problem was, it leaked like a seive. Roughty equivalent to just pouring th echemicals on the ground, which would have saved the company even more money. Contrast that to millions that would have come in if the fishing stream was protected and maintained. * * * * As a person who stood to make money on one of the two endeavors, which would you prefer? One that could make you a whole lot of money over a long long period of time, or the ten year model that puts a lot less money into the community, eventually leaves you footing a very large bill. What we did, we lost money on, not made money. No tree hugging, no Sierra club, no leeeburuls, no "Corporations are evil", nothing but pure bottom line. Money. Why would you be against making as mouch money as possible? I like capitalism myself, how about you? * * * * - 73 de Mike N3LI -- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - The primary redeeming quality and prerequisite of any good mantra is that it must fit nicely on a bumper sticker - inescapable logic in four words or less. Print enough of them and it becomes a truism. Never trust anyone over 30, man. ac6xg |
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- Show quoted text - The primary redeeming quality and prerequisite of any good mantra is that it must fit nicely on a bumper sticker - inescapable logic in four words or less. Print enough of them and it becomes a truism. Never trust anyone over 30, man. ac6xg This has drifted an awfully long way off the original topic, and the purpose of the newsagroup. Any chance of you folks proclaiming your non-antenna beliefs somewhere else? W4ZCB over 30. |
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Harold E. Johnson wrote:
... This has drifted an awfully long way off the original topic, and the purpose of the newsagroup. Any chance of you folks proclaiming your non-antenna beliefs somewhere else? W4ZCB over 30. Oh, good! Your post brought this to mind: http://www.goerie.com/apps/pbcs.dll/...687445/-1/NEWS Just thought you might enjoy it ... ;-) Regards, JS |
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On Jul 17, 10:38*am, "Harold E. Johnson" wrote:
This has drifted an awfully long way off the original topic, and the purpose of the newsagroup. Yes, but one could take consolation in the fact that with enough self- righteous indignation and proselytizing, there would eventually be a law against it. ac6xg |
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Jim Kelley wrote:
The primary redeeming quality and prerequisite of any good mantra is that it must fit nicely on a bumper sticker - inescapable logic in four words or less. Print enough of them and it becomes a truism. The problem with soundbites and bumper stickers and tiny mantras is that they appeal to the least common denominator. Ideas and theories in nutshells belong in nutshells. - 73 de Mike N3LI - |
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Harold E. Johnson wrote:
- Show quoted text - The primary redeeming quality and prerequisite of any good mantra is that it must fit nicely on a bumper sticker - inescapable logic in four words or less. Print enough of them and it becomes a truism. Never trust anyone over 30, man. ac6xg This has drifted an awfully long way off the original topic, and the purpose of the newsagroup. Any chance of you folks proclaiming your non-antenna beliefs somewhere else? Probably not a whole lot, Harold. For that matter, there isn't a whole lot in the newsgroup that is on topic,these days. Or if it is, it is just a rehashed argument that has been going on for months now. Bleh. Heck, even the original thread was off topic. So do you want us to go back to the topic of the thread, of just quit posing on the topic. Outlook should be able to allow you to filter us though. Might be a better option for you. - 73 de Mike N3LI - |
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"Michael Coslo" wrote in message ... snip And yet, I read a book from the late 1800's that stated that smoking tobacco caused Lung cancer and emphysema, and that chewing it caused oral and stomach cancer. We knew. We just didn't listen. Sure. Even so, I didn't realize the truth was known _that_ far back. But in the fifties, when I started smoking (briefly, thank goodness) we referred to cigarettes as cancer sticks and coffin nails. Yet, lots of people referred to the first Surgeon General's Report (1964?) as "groundbreaking." Ah ... no! |
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Sal M. Onella wrote:
"Michael Coslo" wrote in message ... snip And yet, I read a book from the late 1800's that stated that smoking tobacco caused Lung cancer and emphysema, and that chewing it caused oral and stomach cancer. We knew. We just didn't listen. Sure. Even so, I didn't realize the truth was known _that_ far back. But in the fifties, when I started smoking (briefly, thank goodness) we referred to cigarettes as cancer sticks and coffin nails. Yet, lots of people referred to the first Surgeon General's Report (1964?) as "groundbreaking." Ah ... no! To be completely fair, they relied on cause and effect, which is to say that they noticed a lot of people who smoked and chewed ended up with these diseases. But deep pockets kept tangling things up until testing came along that not only showed that they caused the diseases, but the pathways, and how, and in a 100 percent unambiguous way. If we were to apply the same rationale and proof to say, falling out of airplanes at 30 thousand feet, the argument would be " Well, can you prove that the person died form the fall, or did they perhaps die of fright on the way down? Can you testify with a certainty that is what happened? As if the exact mechanism being indeterminate means the activity should be promoted, when we all know that whatever the exact cause of death, if you do fall out at that height, it ain't gonna be too happy of an ending. - 73 de Mike N3LI - |
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Michael Coslo wrote:
... To be completely fair, they relied on cause and effect, which is to say that they noticed a lot of people who smoked and chewed ended up with these diseases. But deep pockets kept tangling things up until testing came along that not only showed that they caused the diseases, but the pathways, and how, and in a 100 percent unambiguous way. If we were to apply the same rationale and proof to say, falling out of airplanes at 30 thousand feet, the argument would be " Well, can you prove that the person died form the fall, or did they perhaps die of fright on the way down? Can you testify with a certainty that is what happened? As if the exact mechanism being indeterminate means the activity should be promoted, when we all know that whatever the exact cause of death, if you do fall out at that height, it ain't gonna be too happy of an ending. - 73 de Mike N3LI - You are quite correct, as are the others comments in the same direction(s.) Now, having been "burnt", in the past, by gov't, medicine, big money, power and "the media", can you look around and see these exact same tactics in use today? And, what percentage of the population is so stupid they make no use of past history which recorded these lies and so sadly demonstrated those lies ability to do much damage and death? I will give you this--I feel it is a HIGH percentage! "But you tell me Over and over and over again, my friend Ah, you don’t believe We’re on the eve of destruction." -- Barry McGuire, Eve of Destruction. Regards, JS |
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On Wed, 16 Jul 2008 23:19:56 -0400, "Ed Cregger"
wrote: "John Smith" wrote in message ... Ed Cregger wrote: ... snip --------- The more people that want a piece of the pie, the smaller the pieces will be. Our main, number #1 problem is over population for the resources we have remaining and the lifestyle we wish to live. But you know that. Nature culls its creatures occasionally. Will it be by disease/plague? By wars? By things we cannot even imagine? No one knows. Enjoy the party while it is going on. Analyze later. Worrying hurts no one but you and those around you. I have given up worrying about it all. It is now in God's hands. I surrender. Ed, NM2K back to antennas How about taking a look at a population density map. |
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"JosephKK" wrote in message ... On Wed, 16 Jul 2008 23:19:56 -0400, "Ed Cregger" wrote: "John Smith" wrote in message ... Ed Cregger wrote: ... snip --------- The more people that want a piece of the pie, the smaller the pieces will be. Our main, number #1 problem is over population for the resources we have remaining and the lifestyle we wish to live. But you know that. Nature culls its creatures occasionally. Will it be by disease/plague? By wars? By things we cannot even imagine? No one knows. Enjoy the party while it is going on. Analyze later. Worrying hurts no one but you and those around you. I have given up worrying about it all. It is now in God's hands. I surrender. Ed, NM2K back to antennas How about taking a look at a population density map. --------------- How about giving me a clue? What is your point? Ed Cregger |
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Ed Cregger wrote:
"JosephKK" wrote in message How about taking a look at a population density map. --------------- How about giving me a clue? What is your point? It's probably the old "How can there be too many people when there are so many empty spaces"? Chestnut, used by some to imply that we have alot of room to expand. The answer is simple. If the land is crowded, you can't grow the crops. If the land is in the middle of the Sahara, you can't have many people living on it. Same goes for Death Vally, Antarctica, The Canadian Arctic, jungles and on and on. In our area, Many farmers have sold off prime agricultural land for housing development. After all, "someone else" will grow the food. Problem is, the someone else sold off his land too. When the places that are inhospitible to life are taken out of the picture, it doesn't look quite so happy. - 73 de Mike N3LI - |
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Michael Coslo wrote:
... It's probably the old "How can there be too many people when there are so many empty spaces"? Chestnut, used by some to imply that we have alot of room to expand. The answer is simple. If the land is crowded, you can't grow the crops. If the land is in the middle of the Sahara, you can't have many people living on it. Same goes for Death Vally, Antarctica, The Canadian Arctic, jungles and on and on. In our area, Many farmers have sold off prime agricultural land for housing development. After all, "someone else" will grow the food. Problem is, the someone else sold off his land too. When the places that are inhospitible to life are taken out of the picture, it doesn't look quite so happy. - 73 de Mike N3LI - "Gad Dummit Man"; get off that soap box, QUICK! Next they will be demanding we depart from our "antenna farms" and begin raising vegetables! LOL! Regards, JS |
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John Smith wrote:
Michael Coslo wrote: ... It's probably the old "How can there be too many people when there are so many empty spaces"? Chestnut, used by some to imply that we have alot of room to expand. The answer is simple. If the land is crowded, you can't grow the crops. If the land is in the middle of the Sahara, you can't have many people living on it. Same goes for Death Vally, Antarctica, The Canadian Arctic, jungles and on and on. In our area, Many farmers have sold off prime agricultural land for housing development. After all, "someone else" will grow the food. Problem is, the someone else sold off his land too. When the places that are inhospitible to life are taken out of the picture, it doesn't look quite so happy. - 73 de Mike N3LI - "Gad Dummit Man"; get off that soap box, QUICK! Next they will be demanding we depart from our "antenna farms" and begin raising vegetables! LOL! How about we propose some experiments in which we put up a tower, and grow crops around it, to see if the radio waves promote the crop growth? I'll try the experiment with Barley and hops.... ;^) - 73 d eMike N3LI - |
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"Michael Coslo" wrote in message ... John Smith wrote: Michael Coslo wrote: ... It's probably the old "How can there be too many people when there are so many empty spaces"? Chestnut, used by some to imply that we have alot of room to expand. The answer is simple. If the land is crowded, you can't grow the crops. If the land is in the middle of the Sahara, you can't have many people living on it. Same goes for Death Vally, Antarctica, The Canadian Arctic, jungles and on and on. In our area, Many farmers have sold off prime agricultural land for housing development. After all, "someone else" will grow the food. Problem is, the someone else sold off his land too. When the places that are inhospitible to life are taken out of the picture, it doesn't look quite so happy. - 73 de Mike N3LI - "Gad Dummit Man"; get off that soap box, QUICK! Next they will be demanding we depart from our "antenna farms" and begin raising vegetables! LOL! How about we propose some experiments in which we put up a tower, and grow crops around it, to see if the radio waves promote the crop growth? I'll try the experiment with Barley and hops.... ;^) - 73 d eMike N3LI - ------------- Or how about genetically engineering a tree to actually be an antenna tree? Just for kicks, we could patch in some genes to apple, peach and pear trees too, so it wouldn't be a total ecological loss. Ed, NM2K |
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On Mon, 28 Jul 2008 23:38:31 -0400, "Ed Cregger"
wrote: "JosephKK" wrote in message .. . On Wed, 16 Jul 2008 23:19:56 -0400, "Ed Cregger" wrote: "John Smith" wrote in message ... Ed Cregger wrote: ... snip --------- The more people that want a piece of the pie, the smaller the pieces will be. Our main, number #1 problem is over population for the resources we have remaining and the lifestyle we wish to live. But you know that. Nature culls its creatures occasionally. Will it be by disease/plague? By wars? By things we cannot even imagine? No one knows. Enjoy the party while it is going on. Analyze later. Worrying hurts no one but you and those around you. I have given up worrying about it all. It is now in God's hands. I surrender. Ed, NM2K back to antennas How about taking a look at a population density map. --------------- How about giving me a clue? What is your point? Ed Cregger Without looking any further, it is on the map Ed. |
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"JosephKK" wrote in message ... On Mon, 28 Jul 2008 23:38:31 -0400, "Ed Cregger" wrote: "JosephKK" wrote in message . .. On Wed, 16 Jul 2008 23:19:56 -0400, "Ed Cregger" wrote: "John Smith" wrote in message ... Ed Cregger wrote: ... snip --------- The more people that want a piece of the pie, the smaller the pieces will be. Our main, number #1 problem is over population for the resources we have remaining and the lifestyle we wish to live. But you know that. Nature culls its creatures occasionally. Will it be by disease/plague? By wars? By things we cannot even imagine? No one knows. Enjoy the party while it is going on. Analyze later. Worrying hurts no one but you and those around you. I have given up worrying about it all. It is now in God's hands. I surrender. Ed, NM2K back to antennas How about taking a look at a population density map. --------------- How about giving me a clue? What is your point? Ed Cregger Without looking any further, it is on the map Ed. ---------------- When I left home for the first time in 1966, I was headed for Lackland AFB in San Antonio, TX. It was my first passenger jet experience and was a direct flight from Philadelphia (yeah, I'm that old). I was astounded at all of the open land beneath the plane and as far as I could see. All thoughts of over population left my mind for a few decades. Now a days, I have a little better idea of how much Earth it takes to support just one average American living our current average life styles. It takes a lot of land to support one of us when you factor in all of the things that we consume. Me, I don't want to give up a single damned thing. So, the answer seems obvious to me. We must put a halt to our expanding population until our technology advances more and provides us with some solutions. Is this written in stone? Of course not. Would I restrict anyone else's ability to procreate, based upon my impression? No, not at all. But I think it would be nice if we could at least talk it over on the net and on TV without the religious folks becoming rabid and incensed (sp?). As though that could ever happen...8) Ed Cregger |
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