On 7/3/2015 10:37 AM, Wayne wrote:


"John S" wrote in message ...

On 6/29/2015 10:48 AM, Wayne wrote:
As a lead in, I use a 16 ft vertical on 20-10 meters, mounted on a flat
metal roof. The antenna is fed with about 25 feet of RG-8, and there is
a tuner at the transmit end.

While I'm pretty happy with the antenna, I'd like to simplify the
matching.

Thus, the question: what is the purpose of a 1:4 unun on a 43 foot
vertical? ( I assume the "4" side is on the antenna side.)

I'd expect a better coax to antenna match when the antenna feedpoint is
a high Z (example, at 30 meters), but I'd also expect a worse coax to
antenna match when the feedpoint is a low Z (example, at 10 meters).

Is that the way it works, or is there other magic involved?

I think we strayed off the path to answering your original question.

The short answer is that you are correct and there is no magic
involved. A bit longer answer is:

A 43ft vertical will present a feed impedance of 1010 + J 269.2 ohms
at 30 meters. Using a 1:4 transformer at the feed point will reduce
that to 253 + J 67 ohms. That is a bit closer to your 50 ohm line.

At 10 meters, the antenna will present a 147 + J 133 ohms impedance. A
1:4 transformer will reduce that to 37 + J 33 ohms.

There are several disclaimers I could include, but I think you
understand that the answers cannot be exact with the info presented.

I hope this helps.

Thanks John.
Yes, we have strayed from the original question, but I have found the
discussion stimulating.
Perhaps a new thread should be started to address those subjects.

If I use EZNEC to model the 43 footer over perfect ground with a 3 inch
diameter radiator, I get impedances in the same ball park as you list.

If I change the "alt SWR Z0" to 200 ohms (presumably what the antenna
would see as a feedline, if a 4:1 unun had 50 ohm coax on the other
side), the SWR plot becomes interesting.

The plot has SWRs of about 2.5:1 to 5:1 over most of the range, with SWR
getting below 2.5:1 around 29 MHz.

Is that a valid approach?

I have not done what you have done, but it sounds correct. I'll try to
verify what you have done when time permits.

I really think you know what you are doing. Don't forget that EZNEC can
use transmission lines, transformers, inductors, capacitors, resistors
and other stuff to help in your analysis. Although the true answers come
from the physical implementation, it is very helpful to use EZNEC to
gain insight into the situation. And, I think you know that as well.