"Wayne" wrote in message
...

There has previously on the newsgroup been a claim that shortness makes
inefficiency.
To that I say that if for example, 100 watts is fed to a resonant HF
dipole, and 100 watts is fed to a 1 foot long dipole, both radiate 100
watts.
Different patterns, but the power radiated is the same, if you manage to
successfully get the power to the antenna.

The ratio of radiation resistance to ohmic resistance will give the lie to
your claim.

"gareth G4SDW GQRP #3339" wrote in message
...

"Wayne" wrote in message
...

There has previously on the newsgroup been a claim that shortness makes
inefficiency.
To that I say that if for example, 100 watts is fed to a resonant HF
dipole, and 100 watts is fed to a 1 foot long dipole, both radiate 100
watts.
Different patterns, but the power radiated is the same, if you manage to
successfully get the power to the antenna.

The ratio of radiation resistance to ohmic resistance will give the lie to
your claim.

In my claim, equal power arrives at the long or short antenna AFTER the
ohmic resistances have already occurred.

Doesn't matter if you need 2000 watts to deliver 100 watts to the short
antenna.

My understanding is that you claim the short antenna is inefficient only
because it is short.

"Wayne" wrote:
"gareth G4SDW GQRP #3339" wrote in message ...

"Wayne" wrote in message
...

There has previously on the newsgroup been a claim that shortness makes inefficiency.
To that I say that if for example, 100 watts is fed to a resonant HF
dipole, and 100 watts is fed to a 1 foot long dipole, both radiate 100 watts.
Different patterns, but the power radiated is the same, if you manage
to successfully get the power to the antenna.

The ratio of radiation resistance to ohmic resistance will give the lie to your claim.

In my claim, equal power arrives at the long or short antenna AFTER the
ohmic resistances have already occurred.

Doesn't matter if you need 2000 watts to deliver 100 watts to the short antenna.

My understanding is that you claim the short antenna is inefficient only
because it is short.

Wayne, you're wasting your breath. You'll never get Gareth to see sense on
this. He's been banging this drum for years now.


--
STC // M0TEY // twitter.com/ukradioamateur

"Wayne" wrote in message
...
"gareth G4SDW GQRP #3339" wrote in message
...
"Wayne" wrote in message
...
There has previously on the newsgroup been a claim that shortness makes
inefficiency.
To that I say that if for example, 100 watts is fed to a resonant HF
dipole, and 100 watts is fed to a 1 foot long dipole, both radiate 100
watts.
Different patterns, but the power radiated is the same, if you manage to
successfully get the power to the antenna.

The ratio of radiation resistance to ohmic resistance will give the lie to
your claim.

In my claim, equal power arrives at the long or short antenna AFTER the
ohmic resistances have already occurred.

I don't know what you mean by that. The Ohmic resistances to which I
referred
were those of the antenna rod itself.

On 2/29/2016 1:42 PM, gareth G4SDW GQRP #3339 wrote:
"Wayne" wrote in message
...
"gareth G4SDW GQRP #3339" wrote in message
...
"Wayne" wrote in message
...
There has previously on the newsgroup been a claim that shortness makes
inefficiency.
To that I say that if for example, 100 watts is fed to a resonant HF
dipole, and 100 watts is fed to a 1 foot long dipole, both radiate 100
watts.
Different patterns, but the power radiated is the same, if you manage to
successfully get the power to the antenna.

The ratio of radiation resistance to ohmic resistance will give the lie to
your claim.

In my claim, equal power arrives at the long or short antenna AFTER the
ohmic resistances have already occurred.

I don't know what you mean by that. The Ohmic resistances to which I
referred
were those of the antenna rod itself.

All practical antenna have ohmic resistance. None are perfectly
efficient. You can design any antenna to have any efficiency you wish
by using suitable materials even if you have to use superconductors.

--

Rick

"rickman" wrote in message ...

On 2/29/2016 1:42 PM, gareth G4SDW GQRP #3339 wrote:
"Wayne" wrote in message
...
"gareth G4SDW GQRP #3339" wrote in message
...
"Wayne" wrote in message
...
There has previously on the newsgroup been a claim that shortness makes
inefficiency.
To that I say that if for example, 100 watts is fed to a resonant HF
dipole, and 100 watts is fed to a 1 foot long dipole, both radiate 100
watts.
Different patterns, but the power radiated is the same, if you manage
to
successfully get the power to the antenna.

The ratio of radiation resistance to ohmic resistance will give the lie
to
your claim.

In my claim, equal power arrives at the long or short antenna AFTER the
ohmic resistances have already occurred.

I don't know what you mean by that. The Ohmic resistances to which I
referred
were those of the antenna rod itself.

# All practical antenna have ohmic resistance. None are perfectly
# efficient. You can design any antenna to have any efficiency you wish
# by using suitable materials even if you have to use superconductors.

I gave up. If we are talking about theoretical antennas, they are lossless.

In rec.radio.amateur.antenna Wayne wrote:


"rickman" wrote in message ...

On 2/29/2016 1:42 PM, gareth G4SDW GQRP #3339 wrote:
"Wayne" wrote in message
...
"gareth G4SDW GQRP #3339" wrote in message
...
"Wayne" wrote in message
...
There has previously on the newsgroup been a claim that shortness makes
inefficiency.
To that I say that if for example, 100 watts is fed to a resonant HF
dipole, and 100 watts is fed to a 1 foot long dipole, both radiate 100
watts.
Different patterns, but the power radiated is the same, if you manage
to
successfully get the power to the antenna.

The ratio of radiation resistance to ohmic resistance will give the lie
to
your claim.

In my claim, equal power arrives at the long or short antenna AFTER the
ohmic resistances have already occurred.

I don't know what you mean by that. The Ohmic resistances to which I
referred
were those of the antenna rod itself.

# All practical antenna have ohmic resistance. None are perfectly
# efficient. You can design any antenna to have any efficiency you wish
# by using suitable materials even if you have to use superconductors.

I gave up. If we are talking about theoretical antennas, they are lossless.

Theoretical antennas have whatever loss you assign to them.


--
Jim Pennino

wrote in message ...

In rec.radio.amateur.antenna Wayne wrote:


"rickman" wrote in message ...

On 2/29/2016 1:42 PM, gareth G4SDW GQRP #3339 wrote:
"Wayne" wrote in message
...
"gareth G4SDW GQRP #3339" wrote in message
...
"Wayne" wrote in message
...
There has previously on the newsgroup been a claim that shortness
makes
inefficiency.
To that I say that if for example, 100 watts is fed to a resonant HF
dipole, and 100 watts is fed to a 1 foot long dipole, both radiate 100
watts.
Different patterns, but the power radiated is the same, if you manage
to
successfully get the power to the antenna.

The ratio of radiation resistance to ohmic resistance will give the lie
to
your claim.

In my claim, equal power arrives at the long or short antenna AFTER the
ohmic resistances have already occurred.

I don't know what you mean by that. The Ohmic resistances to which I
referred
were those of the antenna rod itself.

# All practical antenna have ohmic resistance. None are perfectly
# efficient. You can design any antenna to have any efficiency you wish
# by using suitable materials even if you have to use superconductors.

I gave up. If we are talking about theoretical antennas, they are
lossless.

# Theoretical antennas have whatever loss you assign to them.

And lossless is a good way to get down to basics.

In rec.radio.amateur.antenna gareth G4SDW GQRP #3339 wrote:
"Wayne" wrote in message
...

There has previously on the newsgroup been a claim that shortness makes
inefficiency.
To that I say that if for example, 100 watts is fed to a resonant HF
dipole, and 100 watts is fed to a 1 foot long dipole, both radiate 100
watts.
Different patterns, but the power radiated is the same, if you manage to
successfully get the power to the antenna.

The ratio of radiation resistance to ohmic resistance will give the lie to
your claim.

I make all my short antennas out of superconductors so they do not have
ohmic resistance.

--
Jim Pennino