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On Sun, 9 Jan 2005 16:35:20 -0500, "Jack Painter"
wrote: Guys, the last time I checked, this was not rec.car.battery. We're talking about antennas and RF, not DC connections to your car battery. Using grease, even outside the made connection, will eventually penetrate the spaces. Maybe this doesn't matter to the 50-100w user, but it matters to high power connections, the most notable of which is lightning. Here in the UK I'll think you'll find the lightning conductors have greased joints. I always thought it was the origin of the term 'greased lightning'.... (only joking) -- from Aero Spike |
"Spike" wrote in message ... On Sun, 9 Jan 2005 16:35:20 -0500, "Jack Painter" wrote: Guys, the last time I checked, this was not rec.car.battery. We're talking about antennas and RF, not DC connections to your car battery. Using grease, even outside the made connection, will eventually penetrate the spaces. Maybe this doesn't matter to the 50-100w user, but it matters to high power connections, the most notable of which is lightning. Here in the UK I'll think you'll find the lightning conductors have greased joints. I always thought it was the origin of the term 'greased lightning'.... Plus, of course, the issue isn't so much the power as the current when thinking of high resistance connections. The cranking current drawn via a car battery terminal is around 100A. If the grease ingress caused a high resistance connection, the car wouldn't start. In practice, ungreased connections tend to 'go high' due to corrosion. -- Brian Reay www.g8osn.org.uk www.amateurradiotraining.org.uk FP#898 |
"Spike" wrote Here in the UK I'll think you'll find the lightning conductors have greased joints. I always thought it was the origin of the term 'greased lightning'.... (only joking) -- from Aero Spike That is funny. But since this has now become rec.batteries.car (just kidding): The reaction from battery acids, air and dirt are minimized with grease. But mechanics who grease the inside of the cable-clamp and outside of the battery post *before the connection is made* are not helping the electrical connection - they're applying preventative maintenance for idiots - who never clean their battery posts. Conductive paste is much more expensive than grease. Those who know what they are doing use the former. Conductive paste is specified in US Lightning protection (NEC-70/NFPA-780), and grease is not allowed to be used in any mechanical connection there. Back to antennas for a moment, we all know that grease (or conductive pate) does not provide waterproofing of any kind. And most of you will accept that grease is a dialectric, not a conductor. But after making a mechanical joint with conductive paste (ensuring no air enters the joint, and conductivity remains per the connected materials), and proper waterproofing is applied, you have a safe and maintenance-free joint that will last for years. Or it would anyway, if the same codes didn't require you to expose and mechanically tighten every such joint once a year. That's why the expensive exothermic (welding) of all grounding electrode conductor joints becomes a savings in the long run. Unfortunately that is never practical along rooflines up on masts and towers. So those mechanical joints must provide as little impedance as possible, and survival of the equipment depends on this. Because all transmitter antenna radials automatically become a part of the lightning protection system, the materials used should be the best you could afford, not the cheapest you can find. And the connections should likewise be the best possible. The transmission system will be more efficient, and safer. Jack Painter Virginia Beach, Virginia |
On Sun, 9 Jan 2005 22:51:14 +0000, "Ian White, G3SEK" wrote:
wrote: get a mechanised pizza cutter to make the wire slots and place it on the wheel of a wheel barrow Art, you're a genius! SM2CEW's website describes a radial plough which attaches to the back of a tractor, and can lay a full-sized Top Band radial in 2 minutes. I had been lamenting the lack of a Volvo tractor (or the space to lay such long radials) but a blade attached to a wheelbarrow might just do it... or even to the lawn mower. Opens up a whole new perspective on mowing the lawn. Jock. -- "Education is a progressive discovery of our own ignorance." - Will Durant |
On Sun, 9 Jan 2005 22:51:14 +0000, "Ian White, G3SEK"
wrote: wrote: get a mechanised pizza cutter to make the wire slots and place it on the wheel of a wheel barrow Art, you're a genius! SM2CEW's website describes a radial plough which attaches to the back of a tractor, and can lay a full-sized Top Band radial in 2 minutes. I had been lamenting the lack of a Volvo tractor (or the space to lay such long radials) but a blade attached to a wheelbarrow might just do it... or even to the lawn mower. I just checked one of my catalogs from a restaurant supply store (Bridge Kitchenware in New York City), and I notice they sell pizza cutters with wheels as big as 5 inches in diameter. If you used hose clamps to attach the handle of a pizza cutter to the end of a broom handle, I bet that would make a dandy lawn slit cutter for laying radials. Bob k5qwg |
Spike wrote in
: On Sun, 09 Jan 2005 15:52:22 GMT, David Edmonds wrote: Maybe it's the installation and not supplying that is under question - though typically our government bring in a silly law such as this - while they know that there is no right of entry to inspect. The problem arises when you try to sell your house. A prospective purchaser's solicitor will ask for the certificates for any work you admit to having been done post Jan 1. So you don't admit to any! |
"Brian Reay" wrote in
: "Spike" wrote in message ... On Sun, 9 Jan 2005 16:35:20 -0500, "Jack Painter" wrote: Guys, the last time I checked, this was not rec.car.battery. We're talking about antennas and RF, not DC connections to your car battery. Using grease, even outside the made connection, will eventually penetrate the spaces. Maybe this doesn't matter to the 50-100w user, but it matters to high power connections, the most notable of which is lightning. Here in the UK I'll think you'll find the lightning conductors have greased joints. I always thought it was the origin of the term 'greased lightning'.... Plus, of course, the issue isn't so much the power as the current when thinking of high resistance connections. The cranking current drawn via a car battery terminal is around 100A. If the grease ingress caused a high resistance connection, the car wouldn't start. In practice, ungreased connections tend to 'go high' due to corrosion. It's not normally grease, it's vaseline, which is conductive. I don't know how vaseline behaves at RF, though. Maybe not too well? |
Bob
The idea is to not mess up the lawn PLUS controlling the depth of the cut. When the slicer is on the wheel the main weight of the barrow is directly over the slicer thus making it easir to slice the lawn at a controled depth reducing the possibility of jamming at a lower depth. The whole idea is not to mess up the lawn and by taking some flower pots from one end and changing them over at the other end will look like you are working hard in the garden and shaming the neigbors in front of yjeir wifes. Cheers Art I might add I used a tractor system when I did mine which also inserted the wire but you just don't mess with an English lawn or you will lose the impression of perfection and where wifes are known to use treezers for the final touch. Reminds me of a story where a yank admired a particular lawn at some notable tourist site. He asked the ground keeper how he could duplicate it when he got home, Certainly the groundskeeper replied but firt you must start the lawn several centeries ago! "Bob Miller" wrote in message ... On Sun, 9 Jan 2005 22:51:14 +0000, "Ian White, G3SEK" wrote: wrote: get a mechanised pizza cutter to make the wire slots and place it on the wheel of a wheel barrow Art, you're a genius! SM2CEW's website describes a radial plough which attaches to the back of a tractor, and can lay a full-sized Top Band radial in 2 minutes. I had been lamenting the lack of a Volvo tractor (or the space to lay such long radials) but a blade attached to a wheelbarrow might just do it... or even to the lawn mower. I just checked one of my catalogs from a restaurant supply store (Bridge Kitchenware in New York City), and I notice they sell pizza cutters with wheels as big as 5 inches in diameter. If you used hose clamps to attach the handle of a pizza cutter to the end of a broom handle, I bet that would make a dandy lawn slit cutter for laying radials. Bob k5qwg |
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"Alun" wrote in message ... Plus, of course, the issue isn't so much the power as the current when thinking of high resistance connections. The cranking current drawn via a car battery terminal is around 100A. If the grease ingress caused a high resistance connection, the car wouldn't start. In practice, ungreased connections tend to 'go high' due to corrosion. It's not normally grease, it's vaseline, which is conductive. I don't know how vaseline behaves at RF, though. Maybe not too well? If it isn't in the the current path (ie between the mating surfaces) and also not acting as an unwanted path (eg between the earth clap and the antenna), does it matter? OK, you may get some local absortion of RF energy, but how much grease are you going to use? Not enough to absorb much RF and the mass of grease (or vaseline) will be far less than other unquantified RF conductors and absorbers in the vicinity. You need to look at things like this in the context of the problem. -- Brian Reay www.g8osn.org.uk www.amateurradiotraining.org.uk FP#898 |
On 10 Jan 2005 03:40:46 GMT, Alun wrote:
Spike wrote in : On Sun, 09 Jan 2005 15:52:22 GMT, David Edmonds wrote: Maybe it's the installation and not supplying that is under question - though typically our government bring in a silly law such as this - while they know that there is no right of entry to inspect. The problem arises when you try to sell your house. A prospective purchaser's solicitor will ask for the certificates for any work you admit to having been done post Jan 1. So you don't admit to any! You got it in one ;-) That's why people in-the-know are buying up twin-and-earth, and electrical fittings (many of which have a moulding date-code on them) just in case..... -- from Aero Spike |
Jack Painter wrote:
[...] Jack is absolutely right about grease being non-conductive! It only keeps air and moisture out of the areas where the metal is already touching. The same is true of the special conductive greases - the particles of metal provide the conductivity, and the grease only serves to seal around the contact surfaces. Let's drive a stake through this stupid urban myth. Vaseline (pure soft petroleum jelly) is a mixture of hydrocarbons, and is a very close relative of polyethylene, polypropylene, beeswax and other well-known insulators. Still don't believe it? Creak... stomp stomp stomp... medicine cabinet... jar of Vaseline... stomp stomp stomp... multimeter... 20 megohm range... test prods... WELL OF COURSE it's bloody non-conductive!!!!! Two touching greased surfaces still read 20M until you grind them together and force the grease out. And unless you DO force two greased metal surfaces together, they will be almost perfectly insulated from each other! [...] Just one further comment on Jack's posting: Because all transmitter antenna radials automatically become a part of the lightning protection system, the materials used should be the best you could afford, not the cheapest you can find. And the connections should likewise be the best possible. In principle that is correct, but heavy-duty radials are not cost-effective for ham installations, because there are so many of them (even in a small system). Also, heavy-duty radials are not necessary for the main purpose, which is RF grounding for normal operation. For a ham installation, it seems much more realistic to install enough ground rods to qualify as a lightning ground in their own right (as if there weren't any radials at all). Then you can treat the radials as being purely for RF grounding. They will of course contribute to lightning grounding, but you don't have to rely on them for that purpose. We're moving house, so I am just about to tear up the radial system here - and also pull out the 8ft ground rod that goes 5-6ft into groundwater. The next QTH will have much more space, so this discussion comes at just the right time. -- 73 from Ian G3SEK 'In Practice' columnist for RadCom (RSGB) http://www.ifwtech.co.uk/g3sek |
On Sun, 9 Jan 2005 19:55:41 -0500, "Jack Painter"
wrote: The reaction from battery acids, air and dirt are minimized with grease. But mechanics who grease the inside of the cable-clamp and outside of the battery post *before the connection is made* are not helping the electrical connection - they're applying preventative maintenance for idiots - who never clean their battery posts. Conductive paste is much more expensive than grease. Those who know what they are doing use the former. Jack, many thanks for your informative post, it was certainly an interesting read, and deserves a response. I'd like to quote what Brian Reay said in reply to another poster on this topic. He said "If it isn't in the current path (i.e. between the mating surfaces) and also not acting as an unwanted path (eg between the earth clamp and the antenna), does it matter? OK, you may get some local absorption of RF energy, but how much grease are you going to use? Not enough to absorb much RF and the mass of grease (or vaseline) will be far less than other unquantified RF conductors and absorbers in the vicinity. You need to look at things like this in the context of the problem." Now I don't doubt that everyone who has contributed is right in their own way, but look at the wider problems of the Radio Amateur's vertical antenna that demand attention. Only having one element, it has to work against something, which in this case is the ground or earth. To work with some efficiency it has to make good contact with said ground or earth, and I did some calculations elsewhere showing in simple terms how this can vary with the ohmage of the earth path. Hence the advice about radials wires, cost, corrosion, and all the other things. But this antenna has to live outside and cope with wind, rain, snow, ice, hail, frost, dog pee, etc, the whole nine yards, and this has to be taken into account in the design and construction phases. What you wind up with is a compromise, and everyone's choices will likely be different. I doubt that anyone puts up a vertical antenna designed to cope with a lightning strike - and very many antenna designs (such as balanced dipoles) might have either no DC earth path or only a fortuitous one - or even a 1000 ohm resistor as a static leakage path....it just doesn't feature as a major topic. Just to illustrate the point about what is incorporated in antenna designs, we've had some bad weather here in the UK over the last few days. One amateur on here had his wire doublet aerial anchored in a tree, which blew over in the wind. It pulled his aerial along, together with the length of feeder to his radio. Result was everything on the shelf was pulled off onto the floor. So although this amateur had an off-the-shelf design of aerial, he had no snap-line in place that would have broken when the tree went over. I'll bet there wasn't much lightning protection either..... It comes down at the end of the day to the art of the possible. While a storm-proof, lightning-resistant, non-corroding, highly efficient vertical antenna could be designed and constructed, it would cost a fortune, and at the end of the day you'd still have 'only' a vertical antenna - which anyway is not an all-round solution to working other amateur stations. I myself had a vertical antenna for some decades, the earth system of which was constructed along the lines I mentioned elsewhere. It withstood everything thrown at it, including the 'great storm' of 1987 with hurricane-force winds. On those occasions when licensed amateurs used it, there was negligible fall-off in the aerial current over its life-span, which told me that the earth system was not deteriorating. In the end the 'maintenance' of this aerial consisted of an occasional spray of WD40 (shock, horror) - but when finally dismantled, *all* the mating connections were bright and tight....it served me well and I don't think I could have asked for more. -- from Aero Spike |
On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 06:25:05 -0000, "Brian Reay"
wrote: You need to look at things like this in the context of the problem. Brian, I replied to Jack Painter elsewhere (q.v.) in which I quoted your posting as part of my reply. Hope you don't mind. -- from Aero Spike |
In message , Spike
writes but when finally dismantled, *all* the mating connections were bright and tight....it served me well and I don't think I could have asked for more. Remind me, Spike, what precautions you took to ensure all the connections remained pristine. -- 73 Ian, G3NRW |
On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 10:58:43 GMT, news wrote:
In message , Spike writes but when finally dismantled, *all* the mating connections were bright and tight....it served me well and I don't think I could have asked for more. Remind me, Spike, what precautions you took to ensure all the connections remained pristine. The subject of great debate atm.....chassis grease. Some joints were overtaped with Lasso tape. All got WD40'd at some time or another.... -- from Aero Spike |
Mr.Reay shouts a lot.
"news" wrote in message ... Now where do I find the nearest horse doctor |
On 10 Jan 2005 03:52:38 GMT, Alun wrote:
It's not normally grease, it's vaseline, which is conductive. I don't know how vaseline behaves at RF, though. Maybe not too well? What about silicon grease? Jock. -- "The graveyards are full of indispensable men." - Charles de Gaulle (1890-1970) |
"Spike" wrote in message ... On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 06:25:05 -0000, "Brian Reay" wrote: You need to look at things like this in the context of the problem. Brian, I replied to Jack Painter elsewhere (q.v.) in which I quoted your posting as part of my reply. Hope you don't mind. Not at all, I'll send a bill for my normal fee ;-) -- Brian Reay www.g8osn.org.uk www.amateurradiotraining.org.uk FP#898 |
"news" wrote in message ... Following up all these comments, I hadn't expected such a comprehensive and useful set of responses! Commiserations to the guy with "only" half an acre. If only my yard were anything like as big as that. Remember, you have to mow it. (or pay a gardener, of course). Many thanks to everyone. Now where do I find the nearest horse doctor I'm told the down and outs also drink the stuff you are thinking of. I'm sure one will be along before too long ;-) -- Brian Reay www.g8osn.org.uk www.amateurradiotraining.org.uk FP#898 |
I live in a "no antenna" gated community. So I use a vert. (removable) for 20
M. The radials are simply laid on the ground and they are insulated telephone wire. (I had plenty), they are twisted together at the base of the antenna and connected to the braid with an aligator clip. Real high tech here. But I get out all I want.(K.I.S.S.) All this with 100W and an old HW100. Bob WA2EAW (retried in FL.) |
Ian,
Some practical questions: ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 1. What is the "best" type of wire (or braid) to use for the radials? 2. How do I bond the radials together? (I guess my 15-watt soldering iron won't be up to the job ...). 3. What kind of solder and flux should I use? 4. What precautions should I take to minimise the effects of corrosion at the joints? 5. How deep should I bury the radials? Two inches, six inches, 12 inches? 6. Is there anything else I should know? __________________________________________________ _______ Some ideas and answers he www.amgroundsystems.com -- Philip de Cadenet G4ZOW Transmitters 'R' Us http://www.transmittersrus.com |
Whatever wrote:
Why not use a roll of wire netting and bury that. Good question. That method has a good reputation for portable 4-squares, as used by some MegaDXpeditions. Just roll it out, and away you go. But it may not be so good for fixed stations, because once it's down there would be no way back. After the grass has started to grow through it, it will be impossible to rip up again. If the mesh began to rot after a few years, it would be very difficult to start again with conventional radials. Looking further ahead, laying mesh would 'sterilize' the area for any kind of future cultivation, unless the whole top surface was planed off and dumped. So the question is: how long will galvanized netting or mesh last in your particular soil? It is an option I am seriously considering for the new site, but will take local advice about soil conditions. -- 73 from Ian G3SEK 'In Practice' columnist for RadCom (RSGB) http://www.ifwtech.co.uk/g3sek |
Ian White, G3SEK wrote:
Whatever wrote: Why not use a roll of wire netting and bury that. Good question. That method has a good reputation for portable 4-squares, as used by some MegaDXpeditions. Just roll it out, and away you go. But it may not be so good for fixed stations, because once it's down there would be no way back. After the grass has started to grow through it, it will be impossible to rip up again. If the mesh began to rot after a few years, it would be very difficult to start again with conventional radials. Looking further ahead, laying mesh would 'sterilize' the area for any kind of future cultivation, unless the whole top surface was planed off and dumped. So the question is: how long will galvanized netting or mesh last in your particular soil? It is an option I am seriously considering for the new site, but will take local advice about soil conditions. Galvanised conductors are really not as good as copper at RF, conductivity is much lower. Probably not much of a problem for a 50 ohm or more antenna but for an electrically short one, as might well be used on the lower bands, the increase in resistance can be significant. Copper is a better choice if the increased cost is not too significant. Tinned copper is really tin wire at RF so it is not as good as plain copper. The smaller the burial depth the better the ground plane will be, in general. In fact much better results have been obtained with elevated (usually about 6 ft.) radials, but 'the powers that be' usually reject this alternative. Disguise as a pergola or frame for training some type of plant is a possibility. Copper will be almost permanent in most soils, galvanised iron wire may only last a few years, so if you don't plan on repeating the installation the best choice is plain copper, either insulated or not, with tinned copper a moderate second and galvanised iron third by a fair way. Any will be significantly better than mud and stones which are known to be poor conductors at RF. vy 73 Andy, M1EBV |
Ian White, G3SEK wrote:
Whatever wrote: Why not use a roll of wire netting and bury that. Good question. That method has a good reputation for portable 4-squares, as used by some MegaDXpeditions. Just roll it out, and away you go. When I was in high school, my Dad had a very large wire chicken pen. I mounted my 33' downspout vertical on top of it and used the wire mesh for a slightly elevated ground plane. Worked All States with it except Idaho (darn it). -- 73, Cecil http://www.qsl.net/w5dxp ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==---- http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 100,000 Newsgroups ---= East/West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =--- |
Ian, theres's far too much unwarranted fuss about ground radials in ordinary
English gardens and back yards. Just lay a few wires, 6 to 12 in number. beneath a trodden-on, compacted soil surface, with lengths of a few metres, perhaps 5 to 10 metres, and away you go. Don't forget to attach to the incoming main water pipe and the domestic plumbing system if you have one. Also the electricity supply ground. And then stop! Or stop before then and see how well it works. ---- Reg. |
Reg Edwards wrote:
Ian, theres's far too much unwarranted fuss about ground radials in ordinary English gardens and back yards. Just lay a few wires, 6 to 12 in number. beneath a trodden-on, compacted soil surface, with lengths of a few metres, perhaps 5 to 10 metres, and away you go. Sorry, Reg, you have no way to know how many radials someone else needs. The 'right' radial layout for any given person will depend on their available space, their resources, their limitations, their style of operating (casual, DXing or contesting), and above all their antennas - none of which you actually know. For example, in presuming that my next radial installation will be in an "ordinary English garden", you'd actually be wrong on all three counts! To everyone else out the if you want to know how many radials you need, go find out everything you can about radials, from every possible source. There's lots of it out there. With each bit of information you find, judge its probable reliability and its relevance to your particular situation. Then make your own decision. -- 73 from Ian G3SEK 'In Practice' columnist for RadCom (RSGB) http://www.ifwtech.co.uk/g3sek |
On Tue, 11 Jan 2005 18:27:28 +0000, "Ian White, G3SEK"
wrote: The 'right' radial layout for any given person will depend on their available space, their resources, their limitations, their style of operating (casual, DXing or contesting), and above all their antennas - none of which you actually know. For example, in presuming that my next radial installation will be in an "ordinary English garden", you'd actually be wrong on all three counts! Once upon a time....I had an 18AVT trapped vertical, which due to the lack of gardening activities in the winter, I had added a number of insulated wire radials lying on the surface of the grass. I kept adding to these as time went by and wire became available. One night, after a few evenings listening to the DX on 80m, I gathered them all into a small arc pointing at the Caribbean. There must have been 200 or 300 radial wires spread over ~10 degrees. A local Amateur friend using an FT200 tuned up and waited until a KV4 station called, and he was the first station pulled out of the following European pile-up, with a cracking signal report. It's just anecdote, but I believe the 18AVT was working well in the manner I had anticipated. It's my belief that you can't have too much in the way of radials.....but each to his own. -- from Aero Spike |
"Ian White, G3SEK" wrote in message ... Reg Edwards wrote: Iasnip For example, in presuming that my next radial installation will be in an "ordinary English garden", you'd actually be wrong on all three counts! one..........two .......three Are we off to Spain? Art snip -- 73 from Ian G3SEK 'In Practice' columnist for RadCom (RSGB) http://www.ifwtech.co.uk/g3sek |
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"Ian White, G3SEK" wrote in message ... Reg Edwards wrote: Ian, theres's far too much unwarranted fuss about ground radials in ordinary English gardens and back yards. Just lay a few wires, 6 to 12 in number. beneath a trodden-on, compacted soil surface, with lengths of a few metres, perhaps 5 to 10 metres, and away you go. Sorry, Reg, you have no way to know how many radials someone else needs. The 'right' radial layout for any given person will depend on their available space, their resources, their limitations, their style of operating (casual, DXing or contesting), and above all their antennas - none of which you actually know. For example, in presuming that my next radial installation will be in an "ordinary English garden", you'd actually be wrong on all three counts! To everyone else out the if you want to know how many radials you need, go find out everything you can about radials, from every possible source. There's lots of it out there. With each bit of information you find, judge its probable reliability and its relevance to your particular situation. Then make your own decision. ============================= Ian, may I suggest you join forces with the Ph.D student on this newsgroup who wants to develop an explicit formula to "Calculate the Earth resistance in a Multi-layer Ground Structure". Your problems are not unrelated. And come back in 20 years time to report your unsuccessful findings. ;o) ---- Reg |
Reg Edwards wrote:
Ian, may I suggest you join forces with the Ph.D student on this newsgroup who wants to develop an explicit formula to "Calculate the Earth resistance in a Multi-layer Ground Structure". Your problems are not unrelated. That is strictly his problem. For my purposes, there's already plenty of information out there. And come back in 20 years time to report your unsuccessful findings. ;o) I will come back much sooner, and report some successful DXing... though you're still going to say it could have been done with a dozen short radials :-) -- 73 from Ian G3SEK 'In Practice' columnist for RadCom (RSGB) http://www.ifwtech.co.uk/g3sek |
I will come back much sooner, and report some successful DXing... though
you're still going to say it could have been done with a dozen short radials :-) -- 73 from Ian G3SEK ====================== Ian, I wish you a trouble-free shift of abode. There are always stresses involved which are to looked-back upon with varying degrees of satisfaction. I envy you and wish I could embark on the same sort of venture. Don't forget to take with you program RADIALS2 even if you might not have the luxury of a back yard. ---- Reg. |
Reg Edwards wrote:
Ian, I wish you a trouble-free shift of abode. There are always stresses involved which are to looked-back upon with varying degrees of satisfaction. I envy you and wish I could embark on the same sort of venture. Thanks, Reg, that's much appreciated. But it's only lawyers, estate agents, builders, removal men... what's to worry about? Don't forget to take with you program RADIALS2 even if you might not have the luxury of a back yard. It's already on my hard disk. -- 73 from Ian G3SEK 'In Practice' columnist for RadCom (RSGB) http://www.ifwtech.co.uk/g3sek |
Jock. wrote:
: On 10 Jan 2005 03:52:38 GMT, Alun wrote: : : It's not normally grease, it's vaseline, which is conductive. I don't know : how vaseline behaves at RF, though. Maybe not too well? : : What about silicon grease? : ah now Jock.... thats just too technical... next thing you'll be mentioning which ''number'' of grease which will really confuse them! |
ZZZPK wrote:
Jock. wrote: : What about silicon grease? ah now Jock.... thats just too technical... next thing you'll be mentioning which ''number'' of grease which will really confuse them! I hear that KY has introduced a heat producing grease. -- 73, Cecil http://www.qsl.net/w5dxp ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==---- http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 100,000 Newsgroups ---= East/West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =--- |
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