"Airy R. Bean" wrote in message
...
This will become an increasing problem in Yerp when the
WEE Waste directive takes hold - no company will be able to
dispose of old electronic eqpt other than through a licensed
waste operator, who must in his turn be able to show that he
has passed it on to similarly licensed people.

Scrap electronics will become a thing of the past for the enthusiast.


This from a summary of the WEE:

"The Waste Electrical and Electronic Equipment Directive (WEEE) aims to
minimise the impacts of electrical and electronic equipment on the
environment during their life times and when they become waste. It applies
to a huge spectrum of products. It encourages and sets criteria for the
collection, treatment, recycling and recovery of waste electrical and
electronic equipment. It makes producers responsible for financing most of
these activities (producer responsibility). Private householders are to be
able to return WEEE without charge."

Sounds like they are concerned with the same mess we have here with
computers and cells phones ending up in the dump.

Other WEEE info indicated that they are mainly concerned with dangerous
chemicles in batteries, etc. It does sound like the inspection process
would drive up the price of everything.

If they are trying to minimize the buildup of electronic waste as disposal
sites they would probably encourge surplus dealers to take what they could
sell. There is a limit to how much the dealers could pay for it. MH



"David" wrote in message
...
Alas, Houston has become a wasteland for electronics scrounging from
what
I've been able to tell.

On Tue, 31 Aug 2004 04:59:12 -0500, "truegridtz"
wrote:

Sounds like they are concerned with the same mess we have here with
computers and cells phones ending up in the dump.

Other WEEE info indicated that they are mainly concerned with dangerous
chemicles in batteries, etc. It does sound like the inspection process
would drive up the price of everything.

If this would force the manufacturers, particularly Chinese ones, to
pay more up front to cover the environmental impact of their
products, then it is a good thing, even if it means consumers will pay
more as well.

For too long, importers of this cheap crap have been permitted to
operate with scant concern about where their products will ultimately
end up. They have been able to price their wares artificially low
because the true cost of manufacturing and ownership is not borne by
them. Why should they care? They don't have to pay the costs of
disposal!

About four to six times a year, I go to our local dump to deposit
refuse that is the result of seasonal cleaning. Every time I am there,
I see an enormous dumpster that is just FILLED FILLED FILLED to over
the top with late-model electronic junk of every description. It makes
me sick.......These items are totally useless albatrosses. No one can
repair them, cannabilization for useful parts is almost impossible,
and disposal in an environmentally acceptable manner is quite
expensive.

IMHO, These items should be put on a giant barge and sent back to the
country of origin with the caveat that a trade embargo will be imposed
against any country that refuses to take them back. Maybe when China,
Mexico, and other cheap-labor countries experience first hand what a
colossal pain it is to deal with the ass end of their product's
mercilessly short life cycles, maybe they won't dump quite so much of
this junk on our shores.

-Scott



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"Scott W. Harvey" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 31 Aug 2004 04:59:12 -0500, "truegridtz"
wrote:

Sounds like they are concerned with the same mess we have here with
computers and cells phones ending up in the dump.

Other WEEE info indicated that they are mainly concerned with dangerous
chemicles in batteries, etc. It does sound like the inspection process
would drive up the price of everything.

If this would force the manufacturers, particularly Chinese ones, to
pay more up front to cover the environmental impact of their
products, then it is a good thing, even if it means consumers will pay
more as well.

For too long, importers of this cheap crap have been permitted to
operate with scant concern about where their products will ultimately
end up. They have been able to price their wares artificially low
because the true cost of manufacturing and ownership is not borne by
them. Why should they care? They don't have to pay the costs of
disposal!

About four to six times a year, I go to our local dump to deposit
refuse that is the result of seasonal cleaning. Every time I am there,
I see an enormous dumpster that is just FILLED FILLED FILLED to over
the top with late-model electronic junk of every description. It makes
me sick.......These items are totally useless albatrosses. No one can
repair them, cannabilization for useful parts is almost impossible,
and disposal in an environmentally acceptable manner is quite
expensive.

IMHO, These items should be put on a giant barge and sent back to the
country of origin with the caveat that a trade embargo will be imposed
against any country that refuses to take them back. Maybe when China,
Mexico, and other cheap-labor countries experience first hand what a
colossal pain it is to deal with the ass end of their product's
mercilessly short life cycles, maybe they won't dump quite so much of
this junk on our shores.


I doubt that the Chinese are really worried about what we want. Communists
are not known for having much of a conscience.

I recall seeing a TV documentary months ago about the recycling of old
computers. They bust them all up and sort the plastic, etc. Seems they
were breaking even or even making a profit. The problem is getting them
before people throw them in the dump. This was a huge operation with
conveyors belts and big piles of dead or near dead computers. I think they
had something like what the tree trimmers haul behind their trucks. Grinds
them up into little recyclable chunks....sort of like spam. Grunt labor
stands there all day by the conveyor belt with Tylenol and rubber gloves.
At least they can claim they are in the computer industry. The last word in
computer technology. MH

-Scott



DO NOT REPLY TO THIS MESSAGE AT THE EMAIL ADDRESS ABOVE!
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unusable)

Need a schematic? check out the Schematic Bank at:
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Just a test to ck my name change.

In rec.antiques.radio+phono truegridtz wrote:
I doubt that the Chinese are really worried about what we want. Communists
are not known for having much of a conscience.

I think lack of conscience is not a communist problem per se. This
having been said, I know that at least some European communist
countries, tried to make their design and manufacturing as solid as
possible. Because in their philosophy there was no such thing as
unemployment, and there often was a shortage of supplies, there was no
reason not to put a good amount of engineering into their stuff. I can
confirm 2 East-German black and white TV sets running since 1988 without
needing repairs (and many more of those sets in continuous use in the
Prague metro, if they were not drowned 2 years ago). Some radio
collectors can confirm as well that East German and Czech radio's seem
rather well built (alltough I have not seen too many of those, but what
I have seen was nice).

---
Met vriendelijke groet,

Maarten Bakker.

On Wed, 1 Sep 2004 09:33:30 UTC, wrote:

I think lack of conscience is not a communist problem per se. This
having been said, I know that at least some European communist
countries, tried to make their design and manufacturing as solid as
possible. Because in their philosophy there was no such thing as
unemployment, and there often was a shortage of supplies, there was no
reason not to put a good amount of engineering into their stuff. I can
confirm 2 East-German black and white TV sets running since 1988 without
needing repairs (and many more of those sets in continuous use in the
Prague metro, if they were not drowned 2 years ago). Some radio
collectors can confirm as well that East German and Czech radio's seem
rather well built (alltough I have not seen too many of those, but what
I have seen was nice).

What next? Will we be pining away for East German and Soviet era
products like the Trabant, Lada, ZIL?

It's one thing to restore and operate an HT-32B/SX-115 but East
German consumer electronics?

The solution to the trash and recycling problem is a bit more
attention to repair and disposal on the design and manufacturing
side, and a recycling deposit.

If the stuff were easier to fix and upgrade, it wouldn't be pitched
out so quickly.

Can't do much about cell phones, portable CD players, and other
smallish items but the big stuff should be fixable or recycleable.

If new consumer electronics were tagged with a barcoded serial
number and a $1, $5, or $10 deposit levied on each item. The
recycling industry could pay people to bring the stuff back.

de ah6gi/4 - No chance of my 75S-1, SB-303, or SX-100 ever
going to the landfill.

The solution to the trash and recycling problem is a bit more
attention to repair and disposal on the design and manufacturing
side, and a recycling deposit.
============
In the Netherlands and probably other EU countries all electrical goods are
subjected to a 'disposal fee' related to the purchase price and
size/hardware content ,which is to be paid upon purchase.

For a hair dryer the fee is low , for a TV set or laundry machine the fee is
much higher. Old /defective goods can be returned to the shop the goods were
purchased ,or to the relevant municipal waste depot.

Good system where money is paid up front to pay for eventual disposal/
recycling.

One of the early 'top' recycling countries in Europe is Switzerland.

Frank GM0CSZ / KN6WH

On Thu, 02 Sep 2004 20:40:04 GMT, "Highland Ham"
wrote:

The solution to the trash and recycling problem is a bit more
attention to repair and disposal on the design and manufacturing
side, and a recycling deposit.
============
In the Netherlands and probably other EU countries all electrical goods are
subjected to a 'disposal fee' related to the purchase price and
size/hardware content ,which is to be paid upon purchase.

For a hair dryer the fee is low , for a TV set or laundry machine the fee is
much higher. Old /defective goods can be returned to the shop the goods were
purchased ,or to the relevant municipal waste depot.

Good system where money is paid up front to pay for eventual disposal/
recycling.


And the electronics shops are supposed to return a certain amount of
rubbish for the consumer electronics they sell. If they can't provide
this they must pay a fee. Some shops collected the old PC's to give to
schools in Poland, but had to give up this practice because it reduced
their rubbish to be collected

On the other hand they might be pleased to solve your problem to get
rid of your rubbish

73
Jan-Martin
LA8AK

---
J. M. Noeding, LA8AK, N-4623 Kristiansand
http://home.online.no/~la8ak/c.htm

Scott W. Harvey wrote:
IMHO, These items should be put on a giant barge and sent back to the
country of origin with the caveat that a trade embargo will be imposed
against any country that refuses to take them back. Maybe when China,
Mexico, and other cheap-labor countries experience first hand what a
colossal pain it is to deal with the ass end of their product's
mercilessly short life cycles, maybe they won't dump quite so much of
this junk on our shores.

Funny you should mention that, That's where a LOT of our surplus
(i.e. garbage) computers end up. They've got a growing problem in
China now about the recycling centers causing massive ecological
damage to the towns that they recycle in. From burning plastic
insulation off to salvage copper, and the chemical sludge from
stripping gold and silver plating.

Jeff


--
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." Benjamin Franklin
"A life lived in fear is a life half lived."
Tara Morice as Fran, from the movie "Strictly Ballroom"
http://www.grendel.com

"Jeffrey D Angus" wrote in message
...


Scott W. Harvey wrote:
IMHO, These items should be put on a giant barge and sent back to the
country of origin with the caveat that a trade embargo will be imposed
against any country that refuses to take them back. Maybe when China,
Mexico, and other cheap-labor countries experience first hand what a
colossal pain it is to deal with the ass end of their product's
mercilessly short life cycles, maybe they won't dump quite so much of
this junk on our shores.

Funny you should mention that, That's where a LOT of our surplus
(i.e. garbage) computers end up. They've got a growing problem in
China now about the recycling centers causing massive ecological
damage to the towns that they recycle in. From burning plastic
insulation off to salvage copper, and the chemical sludge from
stripping gold and silver plating.

Jeff

One of the main reasons that we never seem to get sufficient control of our
pollution problem is the lack of pollution control in developing nations.
We must compete and pollution control is expensive.

Sacrificing human health for corporate profits is the global format. MH

--
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." Benjamin Franklin
"A life lived in fear is a life half lived."
Tara Morice as Fran, from the movie "Strictly Ballroom"
http://www.grendel.com