"(Scott Unit 69)" wrote:
You are spreading the misconception that your tests are accuarte and the
results are repeatable.

You're posting as Scott now. WTF is wrong with you?

As we all know under Idea conductions a 1/4 wave whip will out do any
loaded antenna.
But in the real world a loaded antenna ( shortened ) mounted in the center
of the roof will work much better in ALL directions than a 1/4 wave whip
mounted on the bumper, or the rear of the mobile. If the long whip was
mounted on the left back side, the best direction will be to the right
front, whereas a center mounted antenna on the roof, even with its somewhat
more loss will work better in all directions, as the mobile would not have
to be turned like a beam. So the point is I prefer
a good trunk mounted, or a center mounted antenna over the 1/4 whip.

Been there done that.

BuckEye wrote:

As we all know under Idea conductions a 1/4 wave whip will out do any
loaded antenna.


Nope, sorry, that just isn't true. If you would have said
that
a full length 1/4 wave antenna will out perform a shortened
1/4
wave antenna, you'd have been right. But if the full length
and
shortened antennas are of different 'electrical' lengths,
then all
bets are off.
I do agree with the rest of your post. A shortened
antenna is
much more -practical- to use and a lot easier to live with...
'Doc

I agree to all of the above except a 1/4 wave is a 1/4 no matter what. A so
called loaded 1/4 is a loaded antenna not called a 1/4 anymore. Once a
antenna has been shortened by any means, shorter than the physical 1/4 wave
antenna ( 1/4 wave including the velocity factor ), top hats, loading coil,
or ant other ways it is not clamed to be called a 1/4 wave anymore.
I did say 1/4 whip on the post, as most everybody should have known it to
be the 108" antenna.



"'Doc" wrote in message ...


BuckEye wrote:

As we all know under Idea conductions a 1/4 wave whip will out do any
loaded antenna.


Nope, sorry, that just isn't true. If you would have said
that
a full length 1/4 wave antenna will out perform a shortened
1/4
wave antenna, you'd have been right. But if the full length
and
shortened antennas are of different 'electrical' lengths,
then all
bets are off.
I do agree with the rest of your post. A shortened
antenna is
much more -practical- to use and a lot easier to live with...
'Doc

On Tue, 28 Oct 2003 23:10:42 GMT, "BuckEye" wrote:

I agree to all of the above except a 1/4 wave is a 1/4 no matter what. A so
called loaded 1/4 is a loaded antenna not called a 1/4 anymore. Once a
antenna has been shortened by any means, shorter than the physical 1/4 wave
antenna ( 1/4 wave including the velocity factor ), top hats, loading coil,
or ant other ways it is not clamed to be called a 1/4 wave anymore.
I did say 1/4 whip on the post, as most everybody should have known it to
be the 108" antenna.


I don't know where Doc is heading for with his statement, but a
shortened antenna ( like the Xterminator) is 1/4 wave "electrically"

Velocity factor isn't a factor when you determine antenna length,
except certain antennas that are made from transmission line.

"Lancer" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 28 Oct 2003 23:10:42 GMT, "BuckEye" wrote:

I agree to all of the above except a 1/4 wave is a 1/4 no matter what. A
so
called loaded 1/4 is a loaded antenna not called a 1/4 anymore. Once a
antenna has been shortened by any means, shorter than the physical 1/4
wave
antenna ( 1/4 wave including the velocity factor ), top hats, loading
coil,
or ant other ways it is not clamed to be called a 1/4 wave anymore.
I did say 1/4 whip on the post, as most everybody should have known it
to
be the 108" antenna.


I don't know where Doc is heading for with his statement, but a
shortened antenna ( like the Xterminator) is 1/4 wave "electrically"

Velocity factor isn't a factor when you determine antenna length,
except certain antennas that are made from transmission line.

Maby you can explain how a antenna is 1/4 so called " electrically 1/4 " if
it is not a 1/4 wave like a 108" whip.
If it has a coil in it it, and shorter than the 1/4 it is a loaded antenna
NOT a electrically 1/4 wave equivelement .
If that was the case then a very loaded antenna that was 12" tall NOT 8'
could also be called a 1/4 wave "electrically"
What makes then a antenna 1/4 wave "electrically", because it matches the
50 coax?


Velocity factor IS importment when cutting a element to the proper
length.
Typically a antenna element can range from .91 to .99 of the true open space
length.

Here is a add from a supplier of the antenna.

SP-1000

HIGH PERFORMANCE TWIN 1/8" SQUARE COPPER WIRE COIL,
FREQUENCY COVERAGE 26-31MHz,
"SWR LESS THAN 1.5:1 1.5MHz SPREAD"
STANDARD 3/8" x 24 THREAD
OVERALL LENGTH 54" ( WHAT not a 1/4 wave only half the length )
Dam that makes it 1/8 wavelength in the physical length.
No where does it say 1/4 wave equivelement. The only thing that could be
called a 1/4 wave antenna is a is a 1/4 wave antenna.
Thats just another marketing tool to cause more confusion in the antenna
world.

On Wed, 29 Oct 2003 02:52:33 GMT, "BuckEye" wrote:


"Lancer" wrote in message
.. .
On Tue, 28 Oct 2003 23:10:42 GMT, "BuckEye" wrote:

I agree to all of the above except a 1/4 wave is a 1/4 no matter what. A
so
called loaded 1/4 is a loaded antenna not called a 1/4 anymore. Once a
antenna has been shortened by any means, shorter than the physical 1/4
wave
antenna ( 1/4 wave including the velocity factor ), top hats, loading
coil,
or ant other ways it is not clamed to be called a 1/4 wave anymore.
I did say 1/4 whip on the post, as most everybody should have known it
to
be the 108" antenna.


I don't know where Doc is heading for with his statement, but a
shortened antenna ( like the Xterminator) is 1/4 wave "electrically"

Velocity factor isn't a factor when you determine antenna length,
except certain antennas that are made from transmission line.

Maby you can explain how a antenna is 1/4 so called " electrically 1/4 " if
it is not a 1/4 wave like a 108" whip.
If it has a coil in it it, and shorter than the 1/4 it is a loaded antenna
NOT a electrically 1/4 wave equivelement .
If that was the case then a very loaded antenna that was 12" tall NOT 8'
could also be called a 1/4 wave "electrically"
What makes then a antenna 1/4 wave "electrically", because it matches the
50 coax?

A coil in a short antenna cancels out the capacitive reactance making
the antenna resistive at the operating frequency. The coil makes it
"electrically" a 1/4 wavelength. More than likely it won't be 50
ohms, usually quite less, unless some kind of matching is used at the
base.



Velocity factor IS importment when cutting a element to the proper
length.
Typically a antenna element can range from .91 to .99 of the true open space
length.


The number (.91 to .99) are correct for the difference between an
antenna in free space and erected near earth. Its not from the
velocity factor of the antenna.
Its because the antenna is close to the earth and other
conductive objects (tree, buildings and power lines) which present
stray capacitance that tunes the antenna lower in frequency than a
free space antenna. Its called "end effect" and is more prevelant
the closer an antenna is other objects.

Lancerm
Who said anything about velocity factor?
'Doc

On Thu, 30 Oct 2003 18:04:14 -0600, 'Doc wrote:



Lancerm
Who said anything about velocity factor?
'Doc



BuckEye did in this post:



Velocity factor IS importment when cutting a element to the proper
length.
Typically a antenna element can range from .91 to .99 of the true open
space
length.