"Dave Hall" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 13 May 2004 03:43:39 GMT, "Landshark"
wrote:


"Dave Hall" wrote in message
news
On Wed, 12 May 2004 13:52:46 GMT, "Landshark"
wrote:




So what you are saying, in essence, is that people are well aware
of
the rules. If they choose to break them they will do so at their
own
risk.

Yes

Efforts to enforce the rules are a waste of time, since it will
not stem the tide of irresponsible behavior. Is that about right?

No. It is the job of the duly appointed Officer (Sheriff,
constable,
Highway Patrolman, Trooper) to enforce the laws, not me.

Right, but it's the responsibility of every citizen to apply the
social equivalent of peer pressure to those who refuse to "tow the
line". This form of intimidation was widely employed in days long
gone, but has largely been abandoned in this age of indifference.

Dave, peer pressure might work among friends, but complete strangers
couldn't give a rats ass.


You'd be surprised at just how many people's habits are influenced by
the habits of other, complete strangers. Take a look at some of the
ridiculous fashion trends over the years, which have nonetheless
become popular, for the most obvious evidence of this peer influence.


People need to be made aware that "minor laws" are not always as
"minor" as they may think. Many people believed that crimes such as
cable TV theft of service were "minor" because what was being stolen
was not physically tangible. But when the lost revenue for the cable
companies were added to the picture, it's not such a "victimless"
crime.

Speeding, on the surface, does not seem to be a big deal either. But
consider what can happen when there is a traffic mishap. Speed lessens
reaction time, and increases the potential for damage and injury.

Most laws were not created to ruin people's fun. They were created to
protect society as a collective whole.


There would be no reason for me to go chasing after a speeder
and pull along side of him and start to berate him on how
he was speeding. It would just **** him off and maybe create
an even worse situation, road rage.

Maybe so, but if people routinely did this, there would be a lot
less
people speeding, and the cops would have an easier job.

Sorry, I'll disagree. Each to their own opinion

Ok, you have the right to disagree. Since you do not agree with my
idea of active community involvement in awareness of laws, then what
would you suggest that we, as a society, do to stem the rising tide of
indifference to laws?

There's a difference with "community" involvement and State
involvement. While I might say something to someone in my
town, I will not bother with some guy on the highway, that
would never see me again in a million years.


Any cop will tell you not to confront a law breaker, call them and
let them know, that is their job. Throw a ball in front of a speeding
car, make him swerve, possibly crash, injure himself or someone
other, you will be the law breaker, not the speeder.

That would not be a good idea. But leaving a little "note" on the
offender's car every time it happens, including the forwarding of
their license number to the cops, might make someone think a little.

To get a ticket, an officer must see the offence happen,
just telling him that Jimmie was speeding won't do anything.
Maybe if we all lived in Mayberry RFD something might
happen, but not in this day & age.

Maybe that needs to change to some degree. You're right of course, and
that knowledge just enables lawbreakers. Perhaps if people could be
cited without a LEO physically witnessing the offense, the problem
would diminish.

Never happen, due process of the law. We are not deputized
by the local government to enforce the law. Also, same issue
as with enforcing FCC rules by local law, we would have to
go through many hour or training, do you have the time? I
don't raising two kids working 9+ hours a day.


Technology offers yet another solution. GPS technology and OBD-II
emission control systems can be integrated to the point where all
functions of the car can be monitored. If the car travels down a road
over the posted speed limit, it sends a little "On-Star" type message
to a LEO, and a ticket in then issued. This has the added benefit of
enabling the tracking of the car if it were to be stolen. This is
similar to the idea of mounting cameras to take pictures of people
running red lights.
People will scream "Big Brother". But maybe that's what it takes when
you can't trust people to behave on their own.

Already done, dismissed in the courts. A rental car agency
was doing that, issuing speeding tickets to thier customers,
the courts ordered them to stop.

As a parent, I have become very conscious of people speeding through
residential neighborhoods. I would hate to have my kid or an
neighbor's kid fall victim to someone who's ignoring a "nuisance" law.

Good Luck! I've gone to the city and county councils, tried
to get the street closed at one end, to prevent all the people
from speeding down my street to get over to their street
faster, but not a chance. Speed bumps? Yeah right! I
don't want to hear the sound of cars "jumping" the speed
bumps at all hours of the night & day. So the best they
can offer is "selective" enforcement, LOL!! Useless!

Hmm.... I'm not sure how I want to proceed here. On the one hand I can
lambast you for your duplicitous position with regard to "selective"
speeding (It's ok, just don't do it on my street).

Yeah you could, but then this thread will have gone from a
civil thread to an abusive thread. I am a little that way, as for
around town I don't really speed, out in the coutry side, on
the bike, yeah. But again about the worst that can happen there
is tha I kill myself. As for on the freeway, Bronco doesn't go
over 70MPH, so don't speed there. My other cars on the
freeway, I'll admit that I ocassionally go over the speed limit,
but nothing dramatic, most cars are still passing me, so the
cops go by me and catch the guy that's going 20-30 MPH
over the speed limit.

On the other hand,
I might be tempted to say that you give up too easily. Politicians
have to answer to the people, usually those who make the most noise.
Record the problem. Present the issue to the town council, their
decisions are public record. Make it known that if, at some point in
the future, a kid does get killed due to a speeding car, that they can
be held as a party to the crime, due to their negligence, and refusal
to act to mitigate the situation in the face of irrefutable evidence.

That's correct, petitions, 80% of residents, they still didn't care.
Yes, it usually takes a fatality for locals to install stops signs,
speed enforcement etc etc in the state of California.
You usually can not hold a California politician accountably
unless they show gross disregard or criminal activity.

Do we, as American citizens, not have a responsibility to stand up
for
what is right? Do we have a responsibility to instill the need to be
more law abiding?

Yes, but as for "enforcement" of most laws, that is the responsibility
of
the Police, not average Joe on the street.

The police are given the jurisdiction to make arrests and levy fines.
But we all share the responsibility to make it known that we will not
stand by and allow these things to go on. By doing nothing, you are
giving your passive condonation, which further re-enforced the
attitude that breaking the law is "ok".

Here's where we part company Dave....... I AM NOT A
LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICER! I will report it to
the local authorities, hope that they handle it accordingly,
that is the reason I pay taxes.

We're not really parting company. I'm not advocating that you play
cop. But reporting the issue repeatedly WILL get the attention of the
LEO's, and the problem will get some attention. If nobody takes the
responsibility to make those reports, the cops will think that all's
well in happytown.

Dave
"Sandbagger"


Landshark


--
Most true happiness comes
from one's inner life, from the
disposition of the mind and soul.
Admittedly, a good inner life is
hard to achieve, especially in
these trying times. It takes
reflection and contemplation
and self-discipline.

"Landshark" wrote:
"Steveo" wrote in message
...
FlavaFlav wrote:
leland never said he was gonna key your car assflap. liar

More lies.
I won't retire, but I might retread.

Hey dude,
The history Channel had a show on muscle
cars of the 60's and early seventies last night.
Man, was that cool. All the cars with commercials
from that era and designers & engineers giving
commentary.

Landshark

That must have been cool..I watched a show about the Spirit
of America, the jet powered land speed record holder from
the sixties. Fun stuff.

--
I won't retire, but I might retread.

Dave Hall wrote:
On 12 May 2004 12:56:54 -0700, (I Am Not
George) wrote:

Steveo wrote:
(I Am Not George) wrote:
Steveo wrote:
Dave Hall wrote:
Like in the case of illegal CB use, it may seem that the guys
advocating legal operation are grossly outnumbered, but to
ignore
it,
is giving your acceptance of it.

Hypocrite.

Dave Hall wrote:
Granted this turns a 800 watt peak amp into a 200 watt amp
(Doesn't
sound so glamourous), but for my type of operating, this works
the
best.

Watch out Dave, if you disagree with this guy he will have a
tantrum
and drive to you're house and leave notes or take pictures,
rotflmao.

Or send mail to your house........

Dave there it is from the horses mouth, steve is openly harasing and
threatening to harass hams in this NG he is like a child, if he doesnt
get his way he will have a tantrum. He has no regard for laws,
restraining orders, using the us mail for threats, etc. so be advised.

If you are truly not who he thinks you are, then why worry if he sends
mail? It will end up in the wrong place.

There is the problem for geo, it is him.

"You don't know the **** storm you just brought upon yourself and other
users of this forum..." --george busch

--
I won't retire, but I might retread.

NNTP-Posting-Date: =A0=A0 Wed, May 12, 2004, 1:35pm (EDT-1) From: =A0=A0
Dave Hall Group: =A0=A0 rec.radio.cb Subject:
=A0=A0 Peaked and Tuned Date: =A0=A0 Wed, May 12, 2004, 2:35pm
Organization: =A0=A0 home.ptd.net/~n3cvj X-Trace: =A0=A0
sv3-hKhHBR7qn180T5Bu3dyEhmANPbUn5PvEOKrb7INWIBH9cpHchV 8p0Wejccc8rzdf5C88HZ=
Kdr9x6WrI!WlAbAVORPVohISeW6X0kKlZH+WhSYWjkUnA55eUJ 8TaQON6i/c4yK+MxxdSkePGx=
m8wY1xkVYq6R!8fNyTIrBRHg=3D
X-Complaints-To: =A0=A0 X-DMCA-Complaints-To: =A0=A0
X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: =A0=A0 Please be sure to forward a
copy of ALL headers X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: =A0=A0 Otherwise we will be
unable to process your complaint properly X-Postfilter: =A0=A0 1.1 On
Wed, 12 May 2004 11:53:28 -0400, (Twistedhed)
wrote:
From: (Dave=A0Hall)
On Tue, 11 May 2004 13:51:09 -0400,
When have I EVER done that? YOU are the

one who sees fit to paste it in, when it suits

you. I deliberately do not bring my ham status

into this group as a rule, since it is not

relevant. The fact that my call is part of my

email address is incidental, not deliberate.

Dave

"Sandbagger"

http://home.ptd.net/~n3cvj
_
Oh? Someone ELSE made your email for you, making it "incidental"
(definition: "Happening or likely to happen in an UNPLANNED
conjunction")?
_
Sigh. I should have known I'd have to explain

it to you in the same manner that I have to use
when explaining things to my 4 year old.
_
Your 4 year old has been that age for years. Why is that child not
aging, Davie? Ah..never mind.
_
My 4 year old has been a 4 year old since

January. Before that, she was a three year

old.
_
I said never mind, but you have exhibited an uncanny penchant for
invoking your child into this newsgroup on many occasion, but such is to
be expected from fathers who are separated from their child and only
permitted supervised visits. Your pain manifests in the strangest of
places, such as this group, but really, it isn't relevant, except to
illustrate you couldn't even maintain a successful relationship with the
mother of your child, let alone anyone else.
_

*I* made up my email address. But its

inclusion in any headers is not a deliberate act
on my part.
_
No one mentioned headers, Davie, except you. Let's look at what you said
again.
_
No, let's keep what you said in context.
_
LOL..of course you would say NO to looking at what you said, it presents
your idiocy and self-contradictions.
_
You said:
=A0
=A0"Same reason you feel it pertinent to present your hammie call in a
CB ng.
_
Which to anyone with normal comprehensive

skills, would mean that I deliberately sign my

messages with it or otherwise include the fact

within the message body.
_
Which has nothing to do with headers you are s-t-r-e-t-c-h-i-n-g to
invoke, Davie-son, just like I maintained and you refused to
acknowledge.
_
Since you once again ran your fingers before

you had your brain fully engaged, you made

that erroneous accusation, and are now

backpeddling.
_
The back pedal is all yours. To "peddle", is to sell your wares,
Davie-son. but since you again ran your mouth and fingers before you had
your brain engaged, you made that erroneous statement and are now being
force-fed the correction.
_
I am hardly "flaunting" my ham status.
_
No one accused you of doing such. You're way too paranoid.
_
You did, see above.
_
I did no such thing. I claimed you brought your call sign to this group
after you claimed you did not. Anyone with normal cognitive
comprehension skills that do not suffer such massive communication
deficits sees that you most certianly did bring your call here. To wit:
_
The fact that my call is part of my

email address is incidental, not deliberate.
_
Again,,the call is most certainly deliberate and NOT incidental. Sit
down and take a rest, as your are quite dizzy from all that spinning you
attempt.
_
You will not see me signing it in the message

body of any message posted on this group.
_
Never claimed such,,,,merely claimed that you indeed brought your call
to the group, and you did. Now you're angry once again because I
illustrated your goofy lies and you resorted to what you always do when
caught in lies,,,,,insults. You're a lowlife, davie-son.
_
You need to dig some more. The only thing

you're coming up with are dirty hands.
_
No need to dig. One merely needs to watch your posts full of
contradictions and lies.
_
I made no such contradictions. Conversely,

you make many accusations which, when

confronted with them, resort to obfuscation

and spin followed by the inevitable

backpeddle.

Like your lie concerning the Phelps, or the cber in "suburban"
philthadelphia (which you demonstrated you have no clue what constitutes
a "suburbia" of a town or city) that you claimed was convicted, except
no record exists.
Indidentally (hyuk), those "dirty hands" only come from handling you and
dragging you across the coals with your own lies.
_
You are the only one who lies here. And

you're not even dead yet.....
_
Sucks for you and Lelnad,,,,LOL..the both of you scumbag lids harass
cbers for behavior you both engaged,,I merely point such things out and
watch you go to pieces, insult, and cry about off-topics.

_
Dave

"Sandbagger"

http://home.ptd.net/~n3cvj
_
"The fact that my call is part of my
email address is incidental, not deliberate" N3CVJ - Dave "Hypocrite"
Hall

dave the "hypocrite" Hall, N3CVJ ignorantly professed:
Ok, you have the right to disagree. Since you

do not agree with my idea of active community
involvement in awareness of laws, then what

would you suggest that we, as a society, do to
stem the rising tide of indifference to laws?

The Bush administration released just this week domestic crime has
decreased steadily over the last three years. Stop lying to try and
bolster your psychotic analogies related to a cb newsgroup. You're all
washed up here, hypocrite. Stop trying so hard to gain acceptance. You
ruined yourself and your hammie reputation long ago with your lies.

From: (Steveo)
There is the problem for geo, it is him.

_
"You don't know the **** storm you just brought upon yourself and other
users of this forum..." --george busch

_
Damn! Sounds just like KC8LDO's threats of harassment with having N8
flood this group.....

_
"But, it did stop the flooding. That can't be
denied"..in response to KC8LDO's assertion that reporting a porn posting
flooder in rec.radio.cb did no good.








"He could have stop simply because that is what he wanted to do. I'm
sure if you want to test the water he would be happy to resume it just
to prove a point.
73 de,
Leland C. Scott
KC8LDO
ARRL member
NCI member
_

On Thu, 13 May 2004 13:45:36 GMT, "Landshark"
wrote:



Right, but it's the responsibility of every citizen to apply the
social equivalent of peer pressure to those who refuse to "tow the
line". This form of intimidation was widely employed in days long
gone, but has largely been abandoned in this age of indifference.

Dave, peer pressure might work among friends, but complete strangers
couldn't give a rats ass.


You'd be surprised at just how many people's habits are influenced by
the habits of other, complete strangers. Take a look at some of the
ridiculous fashion trends over the years, which have nonetheless
become popular, for the most obvious evidence of this peer influence.


People need to be made aware that "minor laws" are not always as
"minor" as they may think. Many people believed that crimes such as
cable TV theft of service were "minor" because what was being stolen
was not physically tangible. But when the lost revenue for the cable
companies were added to the picture, it's not such a "victimless"
crime.

Speeding, on the surface, does not seem to be a big deal either. But
consider what can happen when there is a traffic mishap. Speed lessens
reaction time, and increases the potential for damage and injury.

Most laws were not created to ruin people's fun. They were created to
protect society as a collective whole.


There would be no reason for me to go chasing after a speeder
and pull along side of him and start to berate him on how
he was speeding. It would just **** him off and maybe create
an even worse situation, road rage.

Maybe so, but if people routinely did this, there would be a lot
less
people speeding, and the cops would have an easier job.

Sorry, I'll disagree. Each to their own opinion

Ok, you have the right to disagree. Since you do not agree with my
idea of active community involvement in awareness of laws, then what
would you suggest that we, as a society, do to stem the rising tide of
indifference to laws?

There's a difference with "community" involvement and State
involvement. While I might say something to someone in my
town, I will not bother with some guy on the highway, that
would never see me again in a million years.

So, can I assume then that you have no alternative answer? Should we
just allow society to regress in much the same manner as operators on
CB radio did?



Any cop will tell you not to confront a law breaker, call them and
let them know, that is their job. Throw a ball in front of a speeding
car, make him swerve, possibly crash, injure himself or someone
other, you will be the law breaker, not the speeder.

That would not be a good idea. But leaving a little "note" on the
offender's car every time it happens, including the forwarding of
their license number to the cops, might make someone think a little.

To get a ticket, an officer must see the offence happen,
just telling him that Jimmie was speeding won't do anything.
Maybe if we all lived in Mayberry RFD something might
happen, but not in this day & age.

Maybe that needs to change to some degree. You're right of course, and
that knowledge just enables lawbreakers. Perhaps if people could be
cited without a LEO physically witnessing the offense, the problem
would diminish.

Never happen, due process of the law. We are not deputized
by the local government to enforce the law. Also, same issue
as with enforcing FCC rules by local law, we would have to
go through many hour or training, do you have the time? I
don't raising two kids working 9+ hours a day.


Technology offers yet another solution. GPS technology and OBD-II
emission control systems can be integrated to the point where all
functions of the car can be monitored. If the car travels down a road
over the posted speed limit, it sends a little "On-Star" type message
to a LEO, and a ticket in then issued. This has the added benefit of
enabling the tracking of the car if it were to be stolen. This is
similar to the idea of mounting cameras to take pictures of people
running red lights.
People will scream "Big Brother". But maybe that's what it takes when
you can't trust people to behave on their own.

Already done, dismissed in the courts. A rental car agency
was doing that, issuing speeding tickets to thier customers,
the courts ordered them to stop.

There's a difference between a rental car agency and a provision in
the law. If the law were changed, it would be allowed. Your testimony
only proves that the technology is viable.


As a parent, I have become very conscious of people speeding through
residential neighborhoods. I would hate to have my kid or an
neighbor's kid fall victim to someone who's ignoring a "nuisance" law.

Good Luck! I've gone to the city and county councils, tried
to get the street closed at one end, to prevent all the people
from speeding down my street to get over to their street
faster, but not a chance. Speed bumps? Yeah right! I
don't want to hear the sound of cars "jumping" the speed
bumps at all hours of the night & day. So the best they
can offer is "selective" enforcement, LOL!! Useless!

Hmm.... I'm not sure how I want to proceed here. On the one hand I can
lambast you for your duplicitous position with regard to "selective"
speeding (It's ok, just don't do it on my street).

Yeah you could, but then this thread will have gone from a
civil thread to an abusive thread.

Not really. I don't lambast people directly, only their ideas.


I am a little that way, as for
around town I don't really speed, out in the coutry side, on
the bike, yeah. But again about the worst that can happen there
is tha I kill myself. As for on the freeway, Bronco doesn't go
over 70MPH, so don't speed there. My other cars on the
freeway, I'll admit that I ocassionally go over the speed limit,
but nothing dramatic, most cars are still passing me, so the
cops go by me and catch the guy that's going 20-30 MPH
over the speed limit.

Same thing here. I never speed in a residential area. I may push it to
60 or 62 MPH on the highway, since they can't cite you in Pa, until
you exceed 5 MPH over the limit.


On the other hand,
I might be tempted to say that you give up too easily. Politicians
have to answer to the people, usually those who make the most noise.
Record the problem. Present the issue to the town council, their
decisions are public record. Make it known that if, at some point in
the future, a kid does get killed due to a speeding car, that they can
be held as a party to the crime, due to their negligence, and refusal
to act to mitigate the situation in the face of irrefutable evidence.

That's correct, petitions, 80% of residents, they still didn't care.
Yes, it usually takes a fatality for locals to install stops signs,
speed enforcement etc etc in the state of California.
You usually can not hold a California politician accountably
unless they show gross disregard or criminal activity.

Those petitions and other actions that you take can be admitted as
evidence. Their lack of response can then be interpreted as "gross
negligence". Most juries would be more inclined to side with the dead
kid's parents than a do-nothing politician.

Maybe if a few cases set precedent, other local politicians will sit
up and take notice.

Dave
"Sandbagger"

On Thu, 13 May 2004 13:45:36 GMT, "Landshark"
wrote:


"Steveo" wrote in message
...
FlavaFlav wrote:
leland never said he was gonna key your car assflap. liar

More lies.
I won't retire, but I might retread.

Hey dude,
The history Channel had a show on muscle
cars of the 60's and early seventies last night.
Man, was that cool. All the cars with commercials
from that era and designers & engineers giving
commentary.

I saw it (or one similar) some time back. It was a great series.
Brings back memories of a time when you could order a car right out of
the factory with choice of engine, whether you wanted dual carbs,
choice of rear, choice of exhaust, etc. And best of all, it could be
had for under $3000.

Dave
"Sandbagger"

Steveo wrote in message ...
Dave Hall wrote:
On 12 May 2004 12:42:14 -0700, (I Am Not
George) wrote:
Watch out Dave, if you disagree with this guy he will have a tantrum
and drive to you're house and leave notes or take pictures, rotflmao.

If he wants to drive all the way to my house, I'll at least have the
courtesy to buy him a beer and ask him why he's so angry.....

While the beer sounds good Dave, please pay no attention
to our resident **** stir. I've done nothing that wasn't asked
for by the two people whom I visited.

you fool they did not ask you to take pictures of there houses and
post them on the internet. Doug or Leland saying "come over any time"
does not give you permission to behave in a harassing manner, make
threats, take photos, etc.

Steveo wrote in message ...
FlavaFlav wrote:
Steveo wrote in
news:20040513080931.545$n7 @newsreader.com:

While the beer sounds good Dave, please pay no attention to our
resident **** stir. I've done nothing that wasn't asked for by
the two
people whom I visited.

Dave pay no attention to our rersident psycho. The peoples houses
he
visits have done nothing to ask for the resident rambo to visit
them.

Heh, dogie has invited me repeatedly..notice the subject header
from this invitation, punk.

Judge: The charge is assault, we have witnesses that saw you in the
act.

Steveo: Your honor the victim asked me to his house

Judge: Oh I see, case dismissed

Steveo: ha ha I knew I could get away with it

Judge: I was being sarcastic you idiot. Bayliff take him to county
jail, 90 days for assault.