I have a chance to pick up like 8 used 105 amp Leece Nevilles for $15 a
piece..Is this to low of an output to make it worth grabbing them and
attempting to turn around and sell them?..Thanks

The internet is more than a global pornography network

On 26 Dec 2004 23:13:14 GMT, (Programbo5) wrote in
:

I have a chance to pick up like 8 used 105 amp Leece Nevilles for $15 a
piece..Is this to low of an output to make it worth grabbing them and
attempting to turn around and sell them?..Thanks


Assuming no windings are shorted, you might turn about $10-20 profit
if you blow them out and replace the brushes, bearings and regulators.
If not, scrap copper goes for around $.90/lb.

Programbo5 wrote:
I have a chance to pick up like 8 used 105 amp Leece Nevilles for $15 a
piece..Is this to low of an output to make it worth grabbing them and
attempting to turn around and sell them?..Thanks

The internet is more than a global pornography network
I'd buy 'em, rewrap 'em, put bigger regulators on 'em, and use 'em, but
that's me.

-SSB

Not needed by anyone operating legally.

Not needed by anyone operating legally.

Now you see right away you are thinking something negative..Since this is a
CB newsgroup maybe a lot of OTR truckers read here and might need a big
alternator for thier Freightliner or Peterbuilt



The internet is more than a global pornography network

Hello Programo5:

At 15 dollars each, and used sounds like there are not in premium shape.

It may be possible to have them rewound for a higher current, for
running a 4 or 8 pill amps. My 4 pill 2SC2789 amp will draw 75 to 80
amps with no problem.

A 105 amp alternator may have a higher peak current capability than
just 105 amps. I have never measured it but I would think it would have
say a 10 to 20 percent higher peak intermittent rating. Anybody know
about this or measured it?

Most Installations I have seen with a 8 pill amp have had only a 100 amp
or so Alternator. So when the 8 pill amp wants to draw say double of
what a 4 pill amp will draw something like 150 to 160 amps or more, the
Alternator will put out its maximum output current, but the voltage will
drop, and the battery will start to put out current. And when the amp is
unkeyed the Alternator will try to recharge the battery, at a rapid
rate. Its possible to get behind the curve of the Alternator charging
the Battery, and the battery can over heat and possible be damaged with
high current charging over a long period of time.

A lot of guys use large batteries. I think the large batteries is a bad
call as the Alternator should be able to source all the current, to keep
the voltage as close 14 volts under load to keep the out put power up
there. And if a second Alternator is installed it can be wired to also
charge the vehicles battery or run the electrical system should the
stock Alternator fail.

When the guys volt the amps, running more than 14 volts to increase the
out put power even more, then you must have one or more Alternators that
will have the current capability to maintain the higher voltage. The
Alternators outputs can be connected together as they are diode isolated
internally, so feedback from one alternator into another alternator will
NOT happen.

One of the really neat installations I saw at one of the shoot-outs, was
a Bird Watt meter modified to also be able to indicate the amplifier
input voltage and current. And many guys have a separate volt and amp
meter on the dash to indicate the voltages and currents, pretty neat-o.

Jay in the Mojave

Programbo5 wrote:
I have a chance to pick up like 8 used 105 amp Leece Nevilles for $15 a
piece..Is this to low of an output to make it worth grabbing them and
attempting to turn around and sell them?..Thanks

The internet is more than a global pornography network

On Mon, 27 Dec 2004 06:15:14 -0800, Jay in the Mojave
wrote in :

Hello Programo5:

At 15 dollars each, and used sounds like there are not in premium shape.

It may be possible to have them rewound for a higher current, for
running a 4 or 8 pill amps. My 4 pill 2SC2789 amp will draw 75 to 80
amps with no problem.

A 105 amp alternator may have a higher peak current capability than
just 105 amps. I have never measured it but I would think it would have
say a 10 to 20 percent higher peak intermittent rating. Anybody know
about this or measured it?


The current rating is for a specific RPM which is typically high. The
current drops off to a bare minimum at idle which is why you sometimes
see the idiot light come on while waiting at a stop light.


Most Installations I have seen with a 8 pill amp have had only a 100 amp
or so Alternator. So when the 8 pill amp wants to draw say double of
what a 4 pill amp will draw something like 150 to 160 amps or more, the
Alternator will put out its maximum output current, but the voltage will
drop, and the battery will start to put out current. And when the amp is
unkeyed the Alternator will try to recharge the battery, at a rapid
rate. Its possible to get behind the curve of the Alternator charging
the Battery, and the battery can over heat and possible be damaged with
high current charging over a long period of time.


Starting-type (auto) batteries are designed for fast charging.
However, a deep-cycle battery would be ruined by such cycling.


A lot of guys use large batteries. I think the large batteries is a bad
call as the Alternator should be able to source all the current, to keep
the voltage as close 14 volts under load to keep the out put power up
there.


Lead-acid batteries under charge (engine running) have a thing called
"surface charge" that's higher than the nominal 12.6 battery voltage.
Larger batteries have a larger surface charge, and when under load
they tend to keep up the system voltage better than smaller batteries.


And if a second Alternator is installed it can be wired to also
charge the vehicles battery or run the electrical system should the
stock Alternator fail.


You might have a problem with the regulators. If more than one
alternator is used it's best to run the second from a 'slave'
regulator that's controlled by a 'master' on the first alternator. If
you don't then one alternator will pull the full load until the
voltage drops down to the regulated voltage of the second. The result
is "stepped" regulation and can be quite noisy.


When the guys volt the amps, running more than 14 volts to increase the
out put power even more, then you must have one or more Alternators that
will have the current capability to maintain the higher voltage.


Max current is dictated only by the wire size. Without the regulator,
voltage is limited by the PIV of the rectifiers and the insulation
breakdown voltage. The latter is usually very high (~600 volts) so if
the rectifiers have a reasonably high voltage rating then you can
trash the internal regulator and use an external regulator to get
voltages up to 100 volts or more, depending on how fast you can spin
the rotor. But if all you want is max current at 16 to 18 volts then a
smaller pulley would probably do the trick.


The
Alternators outputs can be connected together as they are diode isolated
internally, so feedback from one alternator into another alternator will
NOT happen.

One of the really neat installations I saw at one of the shoot-outs, was
a Bird Watt meter modified to also be able to indicate the amplifier
input voltage and current. And many guys have a separate volt and amp
meter on the dash to indicate the voltages and currents, pretty neat-o.


......uh, voltmeters and ammeters in the dash aren't exactly new ideas.
Neither are voltmeters and ammeters at the input to the amp -- that's
how input power is measured. The old "5-watt" CB radios were rated by
their input power, and years ago the ham radio limits were also by
input power. Nothing new here except the modification of a Bird to do
the job of a cheap multimeter.

On 27 Dec 2004 13:38:42 GMT, (Programbo5) wrote in
:

Not needed by anyone operating legally.

Now you see right away you are thinking something negative..Since this is a
CB newsgroup maybe a lot of OTR truckers read here and might need a big
alternator for thier Freightliner or Peterbuilt


105 amps would be big for a Dodge Dart, not a Peterbuilt.

While typing out my response to Jay I thought of something you might
want to try: swap out the regulators so they can be used in 28 volt
systems. Twice the power. And there are plenty of 28 volt RF power
transistors available if that's your cup of tea.

From: (Programbo5)
I have a chance to pick up like 8 used 105 amp Leece Nevilles for $15 a
piece..Is this to low of an output to make it worth grabbing them and
attempting to turn around and sell them?..Thanks
=A0=A0=A0=A0The internet is more than a global pornography network
_
Can you refurbish them yourself or do you know someone that can help
you? If you answer yes to either question, grab them. Otherwise, they
could be scrap value only.

Hello Frank:

Hope you had a enjoyable Christmas.

Frank Gilliland wrote:

On Mon, 27 Dec 2004 06:15:14 -0800, Jay in the Mojave
wrote in :


Hello Programo5:

At 15 dollars each, and used sounds like there are not in premium shape.

It may be possible to have them rewound for a higher current, for
running a 4 or 8 pill amps. My 4 pill 2SC2789 amp will draw 75 to 80
amps with no problem.

A 105 amp alternator may have a higher peak current capability than
just 105 amps. I have never measured it but I would think it would have
say a 10 to 20 percent higher peak intermittent rating. Anybody know
about this or measured it?



The current rating is for a specific RPM which is typically high. The
current drops off to a bare minimum at idle which is why you sometimes
see the idiot light come on while waiting at a stop light.

Gee whiz Frank, I have never seen the idiot light come on while idling,
with a alternator. Back in the 60s, the ol man had a Ford F100 Custom
Cab, Red Bucket Seats (OH YEAH!) with a 292 Y block that had the old
generator that would light up the idiot light while at a stop light.

I modified a Bronco, removing the 170 CI six cyclender and installing a
302 V8, during the 70's and did business with Bill Stroup Racing in Long
Beach Ca. Dear ol Dad called them up and asked what could be done to
improve the horse power in his truck as the 292 Y Block wouldn't do
wheel stands and left him in the slow lane way too long. So Dad
installed a Lincoln 430 with the automatic tranny. WOW! what a
difference. We had to replace the 4:11 gears and the read end to a 3/4
ton rear end, and 3:73 gears. The Palomar 150 Tube amp made a high
pitched noise due to the high out put alternator, Biiitcheeeen!


Most Installations I have seen with a 8 pill amp have had only a 100 amp
or so Alternator. So when the 8 pill amp wants to draw say double of
what a 4 pill amp will draw something like 150 to 160 amps or more, the
Alternator will put out its maximum output current, but the voltage will
drop, and the battery will start to put out current. And when the amp is
unkeyed the Alternator will try to recharge the battery, at a rapid
rate. Its possible to get behind the curve of the Alternator charging
the Battery, and the battery can over heat and possible be damaged with
high current charging over a long period of time.



Starting-type (auto) batteries are designed for fast charging.
However, a deep-cycle battery would be ruined by such cycling.

Yeah good call there. I replaced the wimpy 35 amp alternator on my "Put
and Park Mini truck with a 120 amp alternator. And had to modify the
regulator to have a delayed response to charge the battery as the bigger
alternator tried to charge the battery as it the engine was trying to
start. The 4 pill amp amp really got up and barked then.


A lot of guys use large batteries. I think the large batteries is a bad
call as the Alternator should be able to source all the current, to keep
the voltage as close 14 volts under load to keep the out put power up
there.



Lead-acid batteries under charge (engine running) have a thing called
"surface charge" that's higher than the nominal 12.6 battery voltage.
Larger batteries have a larger surface charge, and when under load
they tend to keep up the system voltage better than smaller batteries.

Das right. Wonder what those spec are?


And if a second Alternator is installed it can be wired to also
charge the vehicles battery or run the electrical system should the
stock Alternator fail.



You might have a problem with the regulators. If more than one
alternator is used it's best to run the second from a 'slave'
regulator that's controlled by a 'master' on the first alternator. If
you don't then one alternator will pull the full load until the
voltage drops down to the regulated voltage of the second. The result
is "stepped" regulation and can be quite noisy.

Is this advice from experience? I have seen many alternators tied
together and not noticed any noise. When the load is applied to the
alternators is when they will be putting out the high currents, and
voltage regulators will be monitoring the out put of its alternator.

I know at times the alternator diodes shutting off will cause a noise,
that can be cured by a bypass capacitor on the alternators output terminal.


When the guys volt the amps, running more than 14 volts to increase the
out put power even more, then you must have one or more Alternators that
will have the current capability to maintain the higher voltage.



Max current is dictated only by the wire size. Without the regulator,
voltage is limited by the PIV of the rectifiers and the insulation
breakdown voltage. The latter is usually very high (~600 volts) so if
the rectifiers have a reasonably high voltage rating then you can
trash the internal regulator and use an external regulator to get
voltages up to 100 volts or more, depending on how fast you can spin
the rotor. But if all you want is max current at 16 to 18 volts then a
smaller pulley would probably do the trick.

Yeah thats how I think the AC Sky class of steel amplifiers are powered.
A alternator diodes are removed, and feeds a input of a 3 phase
transformer and it transforms the voltages to a much higher for the
tubes high voltage B+ voltages. And I have seen external diodes wired in
to allow more current capability.

I have seen the after market voltage regulator that allow the alternator
voltages to reach 18 Volts DC. Wonder how long the amps last doing that?


The
Alternators outputs can be connected together as they are diode isolated
internally, so feedback from one alternator into another alternator will
NOT happen.

One of the really neat installations I saw at one of the shoot-outs, was
a Bird Watt meter modified to also be able to indicate the amplifier
input voltage and current. And many guys have a separate volt and amp
meter on the dash to indicate the voltages and currents, pretty neat-o.



.....uh, voltmeters and ammeters in the dash aren't exactly new ideas.
Neither are voltmeters and ammeters at the input to the amp -- that's
how input power is measured. The old "5-watt" CB radios were rated by
their input power, and years ago the ham radio limits were also by
input power. Nothing new here except the modification of a Bird to do
the job of a cheap multimeter.

I am not saying this is a new idea, but a neat capability to have. And
one has to appreciate the work and ingenuity that goes into this type of
installation. Some of the guys have taken surplus Bird meters and added
them to the dash instrument cluster with back lights that look really
trick, that indicate voltage and current. A cluster of the Bird Meters
showing forward and reverse power, voltage and current look great.
Especillay when the mic is keyed and the back lights come on brighter.

I am planing to have my machinist drill in some small holes in my Bird
Watt Meter Model 43, just above the meter, so that a row of small LED's
can be installed that will indicate the Peak Instantness Power (PIP).
Not the RMS value which is the PEP value, but a power measurement taken
from the actual peak of the voltage, which will be a 3 dB increase in
indicated power. And make ya feel that your getting more power out. A
cheap way to make ya feel ya is ah gettin out hehehhehe.

Jay in the Mojave