Just curious how many out there still have active 2m packet radio in
their area? Aside from APRS, I don't think anyone is listening... and
even that seems to be fading here.

I've been rather inactive for the past 7-10 years and it seems packet
has dissapeared in that time! Anyone have any creative ideas?

I honestly can't come up with any use for it that I can't already do
over the internet... My laptop even has built in EVDO on two cell
networks (redundancy!). What more can I ask for?

PS. 3 month old TH-D7A for sale

J

On 2007-04-12, Joey joey29034atyawwhodotcom wrote:
Just curious how many out there still have active 2m packet radio in
their area? Aside from APRS, I don't think anyone is listening... and
even that seems to be fading here.

I am not sure about that (aprs I mean). In Ireland there seems to be alot
of activity. Maybe its only by a small number, but it looks busy.

I've been rather inactive for the past 7-10 years and it seems packet
has dissapeared in that time! Anyone have any creative ideas?

Well the only thing that hasn't been sent is pr0n..that seems a money-spinner
on cell networks.

I honestly can't come up with any use for it that I can't already do
over the internet... My laptop even has built in EVDO on two cell
networks (redundancy!). What more can I ask for?

I remember going to a radio meeting(probably the only meeting i went to!)
, dunno, about 7-8 years ago.
I argued that Internet was good for ham radio, while alot of people (waay more
experienced than I) argued the opposite. It'll kill DX, Packet etc.

I argued the opposite. It'll give people opportunity to find information, access
to other sides of the world, as if they were in their backgarden.

A little bit of both seems to have happened. Is that a bad thing?

PS. 3 month old TH-D7A for sale

How about you and me have a chat http://www.runningwithbulls.com/blog/contact-us/

thanks,
bernard

I wish I could find a use for it, but all good things come to an
almost-end, I guess

I can't say the internet has been bad for amatuer radio... look at
IRLP, echolink, etc. success. It seems everything comes back to voice
traffic.... look at VoIP on the internet, we have a big fast data
network, and guess what? we want to TALK on it (or download p0rn.
lol)

I guess my voice capable HT will never be obsolete! And that's why i
keep it up and running...

J


On 12 Apr 2007 07:22:20 GMT, blue box thief "blue box
wrote:

On 2007-04-12, Joey joey29034atyawwhodotcom wrote:
Just curious how many out there still have active 2m packet radio in
their area? Aside from APRS, I don't think anyone is listening... and
even that seems to be fading here.

I am not sure about that (aprs I mean). In Ireland there seems to be alot
of activity. Maybe its only by a small number, but it looks busy.

I've been rather inactive for the past 7-10 years and it seems packet
has dissapeared in that time! Anyone have any creative ideas?

Well the only thing that hasn't been sent is pr0n..that seems a money-spinner
on cell networks.

I honestly can't come up with any use for it that I can't already do
over the internet... My laptop even has built in EVDO on two cell
networks (redundancy!). What more can I ask for?

I remember going to a radio meeting(probably the only meeting i went to!)
, dunno, about 7-8 years ago.
I argued that Internet was good for ham radio, while alot of people (waay more
experienced than I) argued the opposite. It'll kill DX, Packet etc.

I argued the opposite. It'll give people opportunity to find information, access
to other sides of the world, as if they were in their backgarden.

A little bit of both seems to have happened. Is that a bad thing?

PS. 3 month old TH-D7A for sale

How about you and me have a chat http://www.runningwithbulls.com/blog/contact-us/

thanks,
bernard

On Thu, 12 Apr 2007 08:47:27 -0700, Joey wrote:

I wish I could find a use for it, but all good things come to an
almost-end, I guess


I don't know where you live, but here in the Midland Michigan area
packet and ham radio in general are alive and well.

I can't say the internet has been bad for amatuer radio... look at
IRLP, echolink, etc. success. It seems everything comes back to voice
traffic.... look at VoIP on the internet, we have a big fast data
network, and guess what? we want to TALK on it (or download p0rn.
lol)

There is a lot of digital traffic locally and via a gateway to through
the Internet. We use both voice and digital modes on VHF and UHF.

There is a lot of experimenting and building as well.


I guess my voice capable HT will never be obsolete! And that's why i
keep it up and running...

J


On 12 Apr 2007 07:22:20 GMT, blue box thief "blue box
wrote:

On 2007-04-12, Joey joey29034atyawwhodotcom wrote:
Just curious how many out there still have active 2m packet radio in
their area? Aside from APRS, I don't think anyone is listening... and
even that seems to be fading here.

APRS is also very active in this area.


I am not sure about that (aprs I mean). In Ireland there seems to be alot
of activity. Maybe its only by a small number, but it looks busy.

I've been rather inactive for the past 7-10 years and it seems packet
has dissapeared in that time! Anyone have any creative ideas?

It depends on the area. Some are very active and other's are like a
desert.

I use a TM-D700 in the car, an all band all mode 897D in the shop and
an old Alinco DR610T in here for VHF and UHF. I also use a pair of
VX-7RBs and often run locked cross band.

Well the only thing that hasn't been sent is pr0n..that seems a money-spinner
on cell networks.

I honestly can't come up with any use for it that I can't already do
over the internet... My laptop even has built in EVDO on two cell
networks (redundancy!). What more can I ask for?

Emergencies. If there is a major disaster and the power hasn't failed
yet, the cell towers become overloaded, often by the press and
therefore useless for any thing else. Nor can they remain on
emergency power indefinitely. The same is true for the Internet. No
power, no Internet. Strong storms can also render satellite
communications unusable as can solar storms. Of course those storms
take out GPS as well.

Storm chasing around here makes good use of packet/APRS and voice over
much wider areas then WiFi or WiMax


I remember going to a radio meeting(probably the only meeting i went to!)
, dunno, about 7-8 years ago.
I argued that Internet was good for ham radio, while alot of people (waay more
experienced than I) argued the opposite. It'll kill DX, Packet etc.

I argued the opposite. It'll give people opportunity to find information, access
to other sides of the world, as if they were in their backgarden.

Maybe the group here is just a bit more forward thinking as they
embrace many faces of ham radio as well as the Internet.

A little bit of both seems to have happened. Is that a bad thing?

I see the Internet and Ham Radio as compatible and that, to me, is a
good thing.


PS. 3 month old TH-D7A for sale



How about you and me have a chat http://www.runningwithbulls.com/blog/contact-us/

thanks,
bernard

On Apr 12, 12:22 am, blue box thief "blue box
wrote:
On 2007-04-12, Joey joey29034atyawwhodotcom wrote:

Just curious how many out there still have active 2m packet radio in
their area? Aside from APRS, I don't think anyone is listening... and
even that seems to be fading here.

I am not sure about that (aprs I mean). In Ireland there seems to be alot
of activity. Maybe its only by a small number, but it looks busy.

I've been rather inactive for the past 7-10 years and it seems packet
has dissapeared in that time! Anyone have any creative ideas?

Well the only thing that hasn't been sent is pr0n..that seems a money-spinner
on cell networks.

I honestly can't come up with any use for it that I can't already do
over the internet... My laptop even has built in EVDO on two cell
networks (redundancy!). What more can I ask for?

I remember going to a radio meeting(probably the only meeting i went to!)
, dunno, about 7-8 years ago.
I argued that Internet was good for ham radio, while alot of people (waay more
experienced than I) argued the opposite. It'll kill DX, Packet etc.

I argued the opposite. It'll give people opportunity to find information, access
to other sides of the world, as if they were in their backgarden.

A little bit of both seems to have happened. Is that a bad thing?

PS. 3 month old TH-D7A for sale

How about you and me have a chat http://www.runningwithbulls.com/blog/contact-us/

thanks,
bernard

Actually, no that is not a bad thing for the masses. It is the end of
ham radio for anything other than talking about your guns, cars, or
aliments to other old farts. I am one of those old farts who has no
illusions about the worth of ham radio in this world of modern
reliable instant inexpensive world wide communications.

Packet Radio has been reduce to APRS and a few DX clusters. I got rid
of my packet station in favor of Internet based DX clusters 4 years
ago. APRS is a completely useless waste of radio spectrum. The only
real use of Packet is as a means of accessing and gathering remote
data. However, there is little ham interest in this type of activity
due largely to the fact that most sites that have power from the grid
also have Telco access which means Internet. Most repeaters are idle
now, even during drive time. SoCal used to be jam packed with repeats
on 2 meters and 70 cm during drive time. There are more cell phones
in use at the TRW and other local swap meets than hand helds. During
the evening there is more activity on 2 meter simplex than there is on
the 2 meter repeaters.

The Internet and Cell phones have reduced ham radio to an old guy's
hobby. The Internet provides reliable world wide communications for a
low monthly price eliminating the need for ham radio's traffic
handling system. Even the slowest dial-up Internet access leaves
packet radio in the dust. Chat rooms make random world wide
conversations with people possible by anyone without requiring a test
to prove that you can memorize a bunch of answers to questions without
having to understand anything. Portable Cell sites have eliminated
the need for ham radio emergency communications. Internet connections
in concert with portable cell sites have eliminated the "Health and
Welfare" traffic as well. Both portable cell and associated Internet
access allow anyone to be trained to handle emergency traffic as well
as health and welfare - no license needed. Cell phones have
eliminated any of the freeway accident reporting needs formerly
provided by hams through repeaters at "drive time".

In summary, Ham Radio has joined the model trains, boats, planes and
other old guys hobbies as something to pass time away but which
contributes nothing of value to the advancement of knowledge or
humanity.

There is virtually no interest in ham radio by the current generation
of kids and young adults -- hand held radios and repeaters are archaic
to them (and rightly so) since they walk around with world wide
reliable telco and internet access for pennies a day without having to
prove that they are worthy of some arcane title.

I for one am still useing Packet and run a beacon on 145.07 vhf.
We have a statewide system with the main digiptrs on tops of
Haleakala and Maunakea so coverage is near statewide. They
use APRS, but all the worlwide params are effective as the params
settings etc are standarized all over the world. Different
types of software and different types of TNC's are not a problem.
They may offer addnl cmds in the params, but the essentials
are still standardized!
Joe/KH6JF (Honolulu)



************************************************** ************************
* Ham since 1937 HiSchool Sophomore ex W9ZUU, KP4EX, W4FAG, KH6ARG KH6JF *
* WW2 Vet since Sep 1940 to just After VJ day. US Signal Corps AACS *
************************************************** ************************

On 12 Apr 2007 10:16:15 -0700, "Nobody" wrote:

Actually, no that is not a bad thing for the masses. It is the end of
ham radio for anything other than talking about your guns, cars, or
aliments to other old farts. I am one of those old farts who has no
illusions about the worth of ham radio in this world of modern
reliable instant inexpensive world wide communications.

Packet Radio has been reduce to APRS and a few DX clusters. I got rid
of my packet station in favor of Internet based DX clusters 4 years
ago. APRS is a completely useless waste of radio spectrum. The only
real use of Packet is as a means of accessing and gathering remote
data. However, there is little ham interest in this type of activity
due largely to the fact that most sites that have power from the grid
also have Telco access which means Internet. Most repeaters are idle
now, even during drive time. SoCal used to be jam packed with repeats
on 2 meters and 70 cm during drive time. There are more cell phones
in use at the TRW and other local swap meets than hand helds. During
the evening there is more activity on 2 meter simplex than there is on
the 2 meter repeaters.

The Internet and Cell phones have reduced ham radio to an old guy's
hobby. The Internet provides reliable world wide communications for a
low monthly price eliminating the need for ham radio's traffic
handling system. Even the slowest dial-up Internet access leaves
packet radio in the dust. Chat rooms make random world wide
conversations with people possible by anyone without requiring a test
to prove that you can memorize a bunch of answers to questions without
having to understand anything. Portable Cell sites have eliminated
the need for ham radio emergency communications. Internet connections
in concert with portable cell sites have eliminated the "Health and
Welfare" traffic as well. Both portable cell and associated Internet
access allow anyone to be trained to handle emergency traffic as well
as health and welfare - no license needed. Cell phones have
eliminated any of the freeway accident reporting needs formerly
provided by hams through repeaters at "drive time".

In summary, Ham Radio has joined the model trains, boats, planes and
other old guys hobbies as something to pass time away but which
contributes nothing of value to the advancement of knowledge or
humanity.

There is virtually no interest in ham radio by the current generation
of kids and young adults -- hand held radios and repeaters are archaic
to them (and rightly so) since they walk around with world wide
reliable telco and internet access for pennies a day without having to
prove that they are worthy of some arcane title.

Most of the time when people make statements like the above, they have
spent little time in actual emergency communications. Nor do they
understand why we still need amateur radio in emergency situations.

Emergencies in our part of the country, as well as many other areas,
are usually forest fires. Telephones, cel phones, public service,
television, the internet, etc. rely on telephone lines and mountain
top locations. When there is a major fire, those things are toast. I
have yet to see any portable cell towers available in our county.
Even when the phone lines manage to stay alive, they are soon taken
down with too many calls to and from the area trying to calm
relatives. This has happened time after time in major emergencies.
So you have no telephone, no cellular telephones, no internet and no
communication between public service entities like police and fire.

Our county, the largest in the state, has state-of-the-art public
service communications with links all over the state. But guess what,
every single police department, sheriff's department, Red Cross,
Salvation Army etc. has an amateur radio station permanently installed
in their facilities because they know some day they will need us. Why
do you think the Office of Homeland Security is currently spending
millions of dollars equipping ARES/RACES stations throughout the
country? It's because the government knows that all the expensive
equipment in the world can be taken out with a major emergency.
That's also why amateur radio continues to hold on to a major portion
of the frequency spectrum. It's sure not so a bunch of old farts can
play radio and talk about model trains.

With regard to packet radio. Yes, it has seen better days. Most
ARES/RACES organizations are going to WinLink 2000. But APRS is sure
not obsolete. If you send out several Jeeps on a search and rescue
mission, and want to know their exact location at all times, what else
will give you that information?

No young people entering amateur radio? How do you explain all those
that are testing for their license every month? Last week we had two
11 year-olds, and a 13 year-old all pass their technician licenses.
And their father drove them 100 miles to get to our testing location!
It's true there are more older people in the hobby today than young,
but there is still a steady stream of teen-agers and even college
students coming into the fold. It's a matter of how the local
amateurs present the hobby to them. If you don't work at getting
people interested, then you aren't going to get new hams. It's as
simple as that. We use things like IRLP and balloon flights tracked
with APRS to interest young people. If the only thing you show them
is how to use an HT, they will just show you their cell phone and
smile.

Some day, when ALL communications are via satellite, and nothing on
the ground can be destroyed by flood, fire, earthquake, tornados,
terrorist attacks, etc., then amateur radio will lose its value to the
country for backup emergency communications. Until then, people will
continue to depend upon amateur radio even when they don't realize it.

73, Dick - W6CCD

--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

Dick,
I do not follow your ranting and theorizing of Ham radio nor
useage of Packet, PSK, and other forms of msg handling.
As we all know by now, the WWW is not infalible, nor the
CellPhone industry nor many of your other theories.
After 70 years with AARS/MARS etc I for one am proud to be
a member of Ham radio and all its requirements. And yes
Hams have access to the Space Ship as I understand it.
So accept my dissent to your comments!!!!!
Joe/KH6JF


************************************************** ************************
* Ham since 1937 HiSchool Sophomore ex W9ZUU, KP4EX, W4FAG, KH6ARG KH6JF *
* WW2 Vet since Sep 1940 to just After VJ day. US Signal Corps AACS *
************************************************** ************************

I have no idea what you are referring to in my message. Please list a
couple of the specific points in my message, and what you disagree
with. Nothing I mentioned are theories, nor is it ranting. I can't
believe you even read my message. It would help if you would leave at
least part of the message you are responding to.

Dick - W6CCD

On Fri, 13 Apr 2007 10:12:47 -1000, Joseph Fenn
wrote:

Dick,
I do not follow your ranting and theorizing of Ham radio nor
useage of Packet, PSK, and other forms of msg handling.
As we all know by now, the WWW is not infalible, nor the
CellPhone industry nor many of your other theories.
After 70 years with AARS/MARS etc I for one am proud to be
a member of Ham radio and all its requirements. And yes
Hams have access to the Space Ship as I understand it.
So accept my dissent to your comments!!!!!
Joe/KH6JF


************************************************* *************************
* Ham since 1937 HiSchool Sophomore ex W9ZUU, KP4EX, W4FAG, KH6ARG KH6JF *
* WW2 Vet since Sep 1940 to just After VJ day. US Signal Corps AACS *
************************************************* *************************





--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

On 2007-04-13, Dick wrote:

BIG SNIP

Dick,

I agree with all you have said above!


Some day, when ALL communications are via satellite, and nothing on
the ground can be destroyed by flood, fire, earthquake, tornados,
terrorist attacks, etc., then amateur radio will lose its value to the
country for backup emergency communications. Until then, people will
continue to depend upon amateur radio even when they don't realize it.

When/If all comms is via satellite, then that will give a target/one place
of insecurity in comms.

Amateur radio works, in emergency situations, because if its unorganised
(in the best sense of tha word!) nature.

Much the same way as the Internet was/is intended to operate.


The only way to knock out amateur radio would be some EMF pollution (that
and kill all the old farts).

bernard