Here in northern California, repeater spacings in the 2-meter band
seem to be about evenly divided between 15 kHz and 20 kHz, depending on
which portion of the band one is taking about. The local repeater
coordination council (NARCC) mandates the use of narrow-selectivity RF
and IF stages, and peak transmit deviations not to exceed 4 kHz.

The new Kendecom repeaters my group is in the process of putting on
the air, have an IF response which falls off of a cliff at 7.5 khz...
in fact these rigs are very prone to pop or squelch if somebody's
radio is tuned up too hot and is over-deviating past this point.


That's nice that your group can put the Kendecom repeaters on the air. In
some areas there is not that much money for the whole system let alone just
for the repeater.

Here in northern California, repeater spacings in the 2-meter band
seem to be about evenly divided between 15 kHz and 20 kHz, depending on
which portion of the band one is taking about. The local repeater
coordination council (NARCC) mandates the use of narrow-selectivity RF
and IF stages, and peak transmit deviations not to exceed 4 kHz.

The new Kendecom repeaters my group is in the process of putting on
the air, have an IF response which falls off of a cliff at 7.5 khz...
in fact these rigs are very prone to pop or squelch if somebody's
radio is tuned up too hot and is over-deviating past this point.


That's nice that your group can put the Kendecom repeaters on the air. In
some areas there is not that much money for the whole system let alone just
for the repeater.

"Ralph Mowery" wrote in message
k.net...
Chances are there is nothing wrong with either system. Operating 15 kcs
is
really too close for repeaters. Many of them are converted comercial rigs
and the selectivity is not that good in many cases as they were designed
for
30 KC spacings.

When the repeater keys up and you are 15 kc away from it , will it break
the
squelch of your rig ?


No. As a matter of fact, I tried to hear several VERY close
repeaters when +/- 15kc of their outputs. I heard none of them.

You're telling me a repeater is *supposed* to be *less*
selective than a Kenwood TM-271A?

P.S. Happy Thanksgiving.

73's es gd trky de Ken KG0WX

"Ralph Mowery" wrote in message
k.net...
Chances are there is nothing wrong with either system. Operating 15 kcs
is
really too close for repeaters. Many of them are converted comercial rigs
and the selectivity is not that good in many cases as they were designed
for
30 KC spacings.

When the repeater keys up and you are 15 kc away from it , will it break
the
squelch of your rig ?


No. As a matter of fact, I tried to hear several VERY close
repeaters when +/- 15kc of their outputs. I heard none of them.

You're telling me a repeater is *supposed* to be *less*
selective than a Kenwood TM-271A?

P.S. Happy Thanksgiving.

73's es gd trky de Ken KG0WX

In article t,
Ralph Mowery wrote:

Chances are there is nothing wrong with either system. Operating 15 kcs is
really too close for repeaters. Many of them are converted comercial rigs
and the selectivity is not that good in many cases as they were designed for
30 KC spacings.

Here in northern California, repeater spacings in the 2-meter band
seem to be about evenly divided between 15 kHz and 20 kHz, depending on
which portion of the band one is taking about. The local repeater
coordination council (NARCC) mandates the use of narrow-selectivity RF
and IF stages, and peak transmit deviations not to exceed 4 kHz.

The new Kendecom repeaters my group is in the process of putting on
the air, have an IF response which falls off of a cliff at 7.5 khz...
in fact these rigs are very prone to pop or squelch if somebody's
radio is tuned up too hot and is over-deviating past this point.

It'd be nice to be able to count on 30 kHz repeater spacing, but in
many areas of the country the 2-meter repeater subbands are just too
crowded to permit this.

--
Dave Platt AE6EO
Hosting the Jade Warrior home page: http://www.radagast.org/jade-warrior
I do _not_ wish to receive unsolicited commercial email, and I will
boycott any company which has the gall to send me such ads!

In article t,
Ralph Mowery wrote:

Chances are there is nothing wrong with either system. Operating 15 kcs is
really too close for repeaters. Many of them are converted comercial rigs
and the selectivity is not that good in many cases as they were designed for
30 KC spacings.

Here in northern California, repeater spacings in the 2-meter band
seem to be about evenly divided between 15 kHz and 20 kHz, depending on
which portion of the band one is taking about. The local repeater
coordination council (NARCC) mandates the use of narrow-selectivity RF
and IF stages, and peak transmit deviations not to exceed 4 kHz.

The new Kendecom repeaters my group is in the process of putting on
the air, have an IF response which falls off of a cliff at 7.5 khz...
in fact these rigs are very prone to pop or squelch if somebody's
radio is tuned up too hot and is over-deviating past this point.

It'd be nice to be able to count on 30 kHz repeater spacing, but in
many areas of the country the 2-meter repeater subbands are just too
crowded to permit this.

--
Dave Platt AE6EO
Hosting the Jade Warrior home page: http://www.radagast.org/jade-warrior
I do _not_ wish to receive unsolicited commercial email, and I will
boycott any company which has the gall to send me such ads!

I have already mentioned in another post that your problem may be
unresolvable as normal phenomenon. In fact in the Greater Los
Angeles basin are there are numerous repeaters on every frequency
(CTCSS tone protection required) and it is considered "Liddy" to DX
repeaters as it ties up local co-channel or adjacent channel
repeaters. It should be noted that our co-ordination body inverts
the input/output pair for adjacent 15 kHz repeaters for that reason.

Your best bet might be to use a 22 element or longer beam with
greatly reduced power. I routinely keep the TS2000 set to 5 watts
(lowest) rather than 100 watts and use a beam because I have some
elevation.

For your peace of mind, I am a certified technician (NABR, GROL,
PCIA) with many years experience with Motorola, Kenwood, Icom, Yaesu,
BK, Midland and numerous proprietary systems. I can perform
diagnostic testing and corrective adjustments or repairs of all key
performance parameters, including before and after documented
measurements for the mere sum of $50, ship to my address with prepaid
return. Please ship in sturdy box, wrapping unit with microphone in
order to provide a minimum of 3" of bubble or Styrofoam packing (no
shredded or crumpled paper, it will settle in shipment). If there
are serious malfunctions that would be beyond that flat rate, there
would be no charge at all pending your approval. Payal is preferred
because it works and provides card services that are safer than your
local stores.

I personally perform and guarantee the work myself and that my time
is not subsidized by crime, your taxes, or any conspiracy to subvert
the US economy.

J. Bradshaw
35011 Avenue E, #81
Yucaipa, CA 92399
(909) 797 2708

"Ken Bessler" wrote in message
news:rYHod.1792$3I.1128@okepread01...
I live about 15 miles from the N0KTA 146.715
repeater. I like to talk to the 146.700 repeater in
Pratt, KS (about 95 miles).

Problem is that when I transmit on 146.100 for
the Pratt machine, I inadvertantly also key up the
146.715 machine.

At first I suspected my transmitter was off freq so
I tested 3 other repeaters - 145.370 at 1/2 mile
away, 146.895 at 1 mile away and 146.850 at
3 miles away. On all three tests, I could key up
those machines as long as I was +/- LESS than 15
khz from the correct input freq. On all 3 when I
went to the next channel (15 khz spacing) up or
down, I could not key up the machine.

I also did a simplex test with an OP about 1/2 mile
away. I tx'ed DTMF #5 for 30 seconds while he
moved above and below my freq. He reported
he lost my signal as soon as he got more than 10 khz
from me. He also reported that the signal levels at
10 khz were equal between + and - .

All these tests were done with a known good antenna
& new CQ-102 coax. Rig is a 1 year old Kenwood
TM-271A. All tests were done at an indicated 68 w
which is about normal for hi power from this rig.

I'll refrain from using the Pratt repeater until this is
fixed.

My question is this - have I done enough to assume
that the problem is not on my end? Sending in my
rig for service monitor testing would be difficult & a
genuine pain in the neck.

Ken KG0WX

"Ken Bessler" wrote in message
news:rYHod.1792$3I.1128@okepread01...
I live about 15 miles from the N0KTA 146.715
repeater. I like to talk to the 146.700 repeater in
Pratt, KS (about 95 miles).

Problem is that when I transmit on 146.100 for
the Pratt machine, I inadvertantly also key up the
146.715 machine.

At first I suspected my transmitter was off freq so
I tested 3 other repeaters - 145.370 at 1/2 mile
away, 146.895 at 1 mile away and 146.850 at
3 miles away. On all three tests, I could key up
those machines as long as I was +/- LESS than 15
khz from the correct input freq. On all 3 when I
went to the next channel (15 khz spacing) up or
down, I could not key up the machine.

I also did a simplex test with an OP about 1/2 mile
away. I tx'ed DTMF #5 for 30 seconds while he
moved above and below my freq. He reported
he lost my signal as soon as he got more than 10 khz
from me. He also reported that the signal levels at
10 khz were equal between + and - .

All these tests were done with a known good antenna
& new CQ-102 coax. Rig is a 1 year old Kenwood
TM-271A. All tests were done at an indicated 68 w
which is about normal for hi power from this rig.

I'll refrain from using the Pratt repeater until this is
fixed.

My question is this - have I done enough to assume
that the problem is not on my end? Sending in my
rig for service monitor testing would be difficult & a
genuine pain in the neck.

Ken KG0WX

Since you've tested with *very* close repeaters and not interfered with
them, it isn't your set. It's more likely inadequate filtering at the
146.715 repeater which is keying up on your adjacent channel signal. To
prove this try another set at your location; also try your set (and another,
pref.) at various locations around the area to confirm this. You could also
try with low power from your (and another?) set.

To *really* confirm that you aren't putting out spurii you need to get hold
of a spectrum analyser; a VHF radio test set would do this, but I'm a little
far to help. :-) Doubtless there's someone a little closer with the
correct gear to help out if it becomes a requirement, but I don't think it
is.

Cheers.

Ken
VK3KCT / ZL1WKT

Ken Bessler wrote:

All these tests were done with a known good antenna
& new CQ-102 coax. Rig is a 1 year old Kenwood
TM-271A. All tests were done at an indicated 68 w
which is about normal for hi power from this rig.

I'll refrain from using the Pratt repeater until this is
fixed.

My question is this - have I done enough to assume
that the problem is not on my end? Sending in my
rig for service monitor testing would be difficult & a
genuine pain in the neck.

Ken KG0WX


The only way to determine your rigs frequency would be to put it on a
service monitor or at the least, a frequency counter.

I have 3 service monitors and would be glad to check your rig free of
charge if you pay postage both ways.

My test equipment is calibrated to an HP GPS frequency standard so I can
give you a pretty accurate measurement.

73
Andy
WD4KDN



--
"I didn't attend the funeral, but I sent a nice letter saying that I
approved of it."
�- Mark Twain

"Ken Bessler" wrote in message
news:rYHod.1792$3I.1128@okepread01...
I live about 15 miles from the N0KTA 146.715
repeater. I like to talk to the 146.700 repeater in
Pratt, KS (about 95 miles).

Problem is that when I transmit on 146.100 for
the Pratt machine, I inadvertantly also key up the
146.715 machine.

At first I suspected my transmitter was off freq so
I tested 3 other repeaters - 145.370 at 1/2 mile
away, 146.895 at 1 mile away and 146.850 at
3 miles away. On all three tests, I could key up
those machines as long as I was +/- LESS than 15
khz from the correct input freq. On all 3 when I
went to the next channel (15 khz spacing) up or
down, I could not key up the machine.

I also did a simplex test with an OP about 1/2 mile
away. I tx'ed DTMF #5 for 30 seconds while he
moved above and below my freq. He reported
he lost my signal as soon as he got more than 10 khz
from me. He also reported that the signal levels at
10 khz were equal between + and - .

All these tests were done with a known good antenna
& new CQ-102 coax. Rig is a 1 year old Kenwood
TM-271A. All tests were done at an indicated 68 w
which is about normal for hi power from this rig.

I'll refrain from using the Pratt repeater until this is
fixed.

My question is this - have I done enough to assume
that the problem is not on my end? Sending in my
rig for service monitor testing would be difficult & a
genuine pain in the neck.

Ken KG0WX

Since you've tested with *very* close repeaters and not interfered with
them, it isn't your set. It's more likely inadequate filtering at the
146.715 repeater which is keying up on your adjacent channel signal. To
prove this try another set at your location; also try your set (and another,
pref.) at various locations around the area to confirm this. You could also
try with low power from your (and another?) set.

To *really* confirm that you aren't putting out spurii you need to get hold
of a spectrum analyser; a VHF radio test set would do this, but I'm a little
far to help. :-) Doubtless there's someone a little closer with the
correct gear to help out if it becomes a requirement, but I don't think it
is.

Cheers.

Ken
VK3KCT / ZL1WKT