WANTED: Museum seeks B-17G Flying Fortress radio/radar equipment
 

ORIGINAL MESSAGE:

Spokesman wrote:

Then don't complain about what other people are doing!



*********** REPLY SEPARATOR ***********

And the Head Up the Ass award goes to.... Spokesman, who complains
about what other people are doing by telling them not to complain about
what other people are doing.

I'm sure the award went right over his head. Someone explain it to him,
please.

Bill T.

WANTED: Museum seeks B-17G Flying Fortress radio/radar equipment
 

"Bill Turner" wrote in message
...
ORIGINAL MESSAGE:

Spokesman wrote:

Then don't complain about what other people are doing!



*********** REPLY SEPARATOR ***********

And the Head Up the Ass award goes to.... Spokesman, who complains
about what other people are doing by telling them not to complain about
what other people are doing.

I'm sure the award went right over his head. Someone explain it to him,
please.

Who cares..... If I ever get to a point where I am senile enough to get into
a ****ing contest because somebody said not to get ugly, then just shoot me.

-n6ojn

WANTED: Museum seeks B-17G Flying Fortress radio/radar equipment
 

"Bill Turner" wrote in message
...
ORIGINAL MESSAGE:

-=H=- wrote:

We will survive. Let's
just stop all of the arguing and whining. This isn't
the right forum for it.



*********** REPLY SEPARATOR ***********

Very interesting that the post asking to stop the arguing and whining
is the longest post of all, by far. In a nutshell, that's the problem.
Only your thoughts are important, only your desires are valid, what you
want is primary above all.

As long as folks like you own these priceless relics, someday the last
one will be reduced to scrap. What a shame.


The answer is still the same. If you don't want the airplane to fly then
YOU should buy it and put it on static display in your workshop.

If you don't want to buy it then let the people who are willing to
restore it use it as a flying museum.


Bill T.

WANTED: Museum seeks B-17G Flying Fortress radio/radar equipment
 

In rec.radio.amateur.boatanchors Bill Turner wrote:

snip

As long as folks like you own these priceless relics, someday the last
one will be reduced to scrap. What a shame.

Bill T.

No one is keeping YOU from gathering money for acquisition, restoration,
and floor space for a static display.

Or is it just easier for you to **** and moan about the people that are
actually doing something without any personal involvement on your part
other than your ****ing and moaning?

--
Jim Pennino

Remove .spam.sux to reply.

WANTED: Museum seeks B-17G Flying Fortress radio/radar equipment
 

In article ,
Bill Turner wrote:
ORIGINAL MESSAGE:

-=H=- wrote:

We will survive. Let's
just stop all of the arguing and whining. This isn't
the right forum for it.



*********** REPLY SEPARATOR ***********

Very interesting that the post asking to stop the arguing and whining
is the longest post of all, by far. In a nutshell, that's the problem.
Only your thoughts are important, only your desires are valid, what you
want is primary above all.

Yet you think *you* have the right to dictate to the people that own and
pay for those craft what _they_ "should" do with their own property.


As long as folks like you own these priceless relics, someday the last
one will be reduced to scrap. What a shame.

Which will have absolutely *zero* effect on the number of non-flying
"relics" on static display.

Available evidence suggests (*very* strongly, too) that "more or less
*NOBODY*" wants to spend the money to preserve such static non-flying
display aircraft. That *those* aircraft are being 'reduced to scrap'
_today_, for lack of interest. "What a shame", indeed.

Not to put too fine a point on it, how much money have _you_ donated to
the support of _any_ "non-flying B-17 static display" organization?

It's always easier to spend somebody else's money, isn't it?

I suspect the appellation 'hypocrite' applies.

WANTED: Museum seeks B-17G Flying Fortress radio/radar equipment
 

In article ,
Bill Turner wrote:
ORIGINAL MESSAGE:

RST Engineering wrote:

Money talks, bull**** walks.

Jim

*********** REPLY SEPARATOR ***********

Not so pal, just the opposite. Bull****ters talk forever, money steps
up and quietly does the job.

Bill T.

And you, by your own admission are "all talk, and no money", critizing
those who _have_ 'stepped up and are doing the job'.

At least you recognize your own shoe.

WANTED: Museum seeks B-17G Flying Fortress radio/radar equipment
 

Absolutely, I get it.

Not.


You and the two or three posters who agree with you are self-centered
pigs who care nothing about preserving history.

I take it you don't speak face-to-face with others very often?
Your low-brow approach to debate is, if nothing else, good for a chuckle.

Looks like you just enjoy arguing without reason; because you're completely
unarmed,
and going in pointless circles with your posts. Try to make a valid point,
please.

Your temporary
adrenaline rush is much more important, and the risk of splattering a
priceless aircraft means nothing beside your momentary thrills. How sad
that people like you are allowed to own such an aircraft.

LOL... four words: lost ball, high weeds.
What does your above statement even mean???

FYI: Don't EVER research the film industry for any reason.


A hundred or five hundred years from now, if your ilk prevails, people
will be saying "Gosh, I wish someone had kept a B-17G preserved
somewhere. I would have really loved to see the real thing".

Wow...? Not sure what to say to that after reading your cumulative posts.
First, please refer to the "lost ball" statement above, then
try to do some research on vintage aircraft clubs, museums, owners and
current displays.


I hope and pray there are not many like you.

Plane-loads! And no thanks to you, we sit about debating whether or not a
Neanderthal with a superiority complex is a paradox.

Mister, it's painfully obvious that your intent is not to prove a point, nor
offer a reasonable debate; but to simply try and talk others down.
You must have a very hollow existence.

I hope and pray you can find a better way to spend your time.

rb

WANTED: Museum seeks B-17G Flying Fortress radio/radar equipment
 

Airplanes crash, especially ones flown and maintained by well-meaning
but inexperienced pilots and mechanics who are usually short of cash,
spare parts and time, and who, sooner or later, will feel the pressure
to fly it when they really shouldn't in order to keep an airshow
schedule.

Park it.


Bill, have you considered a career in politics?

Exactly where would you suggest we park general aviation?
rb

WANTED: Museum seeks B-17G Flying Fortress radio/radar equipment
 

ORIGINAL MESSAGE:

Woody wrote:

Mister, it's painfully obvious that your intent is not to prove a
point, nor offer a reasonable debate; but to simply try and talk
others down. You must have a very hollow existence.


*********** REPLY SEPARATOR ***********

You completely missed it, Woody. My only concern here is to preserve a
historical artifact which once destroyed, can never be replaced. If the
current owners and future owners keep flying it around, it eventually
will be destroyed. Hopefully at some point the owners will wise up and
say "Enough. Lets park it before it's too late.".

My concern is as simple as that. Please do not read other motives into
my posts.

Bill T.

WANTED: Museum seeks B-17G Flying Fortress radio/radar equipment
 

Woody wrote:


Bill, have you considered a career in politics?

Yes, but I'm not crooked enough to get elected.

Exactly where would you suggest we park general aviation?

General aviation doesn't need parking as far as I can tell.

The B-17G should be parked in the desert, in a hangar, where there is
low humidity and no violent weather. It would last practically forever,
and at five or ten bucks a ticket, would be a source of income also
practically forever. And guess what... no maintenance cost either,
except maybe for a feather duster now and then. :-)

Bill T.

WANTED: Museum seeks B-17G Flying Fortress radio/radar equipment
 

"Bill Turner" wrote in message
...
Woody wrote:


Bill, have you considered a career in politics?

Yes, but I'm not crooked enough to get elected.

Exactly where would you suggest we park general aviation?

General aviation doesn't need parking as far as I can tell.

The B-17G should be parked in the desert, in a hangar, where there is
low humidity and no violent weather. It would last practically forever,
and at five or ten bucks a ticket, would be a source of income also
practically forever. And guess what... no maintenance cost either,
except maybe for a feather duster now and then. :-)

Bill T.

How sad.

WANTED: Museum seeks B-17G Flying Fortress radio/radar equipment
 

Bill, I'm not reading any motives. I'm simply responding to your approach.
It's a bit harsh.

As others have pointed out, there are plenty of clipped wings grounded out
just as you describe.

Also, as others have said: We're getting nowhere fast, this is the wrong
group for that, and 'tis ok to agree to disagree.

However; I will concede a bit and say you can feel good knowing that if this
were the *last* B-17, I'd probably lean your way too. But it isn't the last,
and there's plenty of preserves.

What we have come to is quite simple; to collect or not to collect.... that
is the question.

The answer of course, is equally simple:

All hail the great and powerful.....*owner*.

Personal prefs aren't much for debating.... so I shall bow out.
regards,
Woody



"Bill Turner" wrote in message
...
ORIGINAL MESSAGE:

Woody wrote:

Mister, it's painfully obvious that your intent is not to prove a
point, nor offer a reasonable debate; but to simply try and talk
others down. You must have a very hollow existence.


*********** REPLY SEPARATOR ***********

You completely missed it, Woody. My only concern here is to preserve a
historical artifact which once destroyed, can never be replaced. If the
current owners and future owners keep flying it around, it eventually
will be destroyed. Hopefully at some point the owners will wise up and
say "Enough. Lets park it before it's too late.".

My concern is as simple as that. Please do not read other motives into
my posts.

Bill T.

WANTED: Museum seeks B-17G Flying Fortress radio/radar equipment
 

-=H=- wrote:
----snip----
This IS still the United States of America....
----snip----

No, I'm afraid not, this is bigger and better than the USA :)

WANTED: Museum seeks B-17G Flying Fortress radio/radar equipment
 

Bill Turner wrote:
Woody wrote:

Bill, have you considered a career in politics?

Yes, but I'm not crooked enough to get elected.

Exactly where would you suggest we park general aviation?

General aviation doesn't need parking as far as I can tell.

The B-17G should be parked in the desert, in a hangar, where there is
low humidity and no violent weather. It would last practically forever,
and at five or ten bucks a ticket, would be a source of income also
practically forever. And guess what... no maintenance cost either,
except maybe for a feather duster now and then. :-)


One of the "great moments" of my life was watching a B-17 coming in to
land at the local airport. I didn't know it was coming in,and the noise
and profile when I figured out just what I was seeing was
overwhelming. I'm richer for it, and so are all those who have the
experience. I've seen a lot of historic planes and spacecraft in
museums. They are very nice and all, but to see one actually working is
orders of magnitude better an experience. Museums bear more than a
passing semblance to funeral parlors. Interesting idea to store the B-17
in the desert - that is where the plane graveyards are.

I'm a machine man, and machines are made to be used IMO. I don't care
if it is automobiles, trains, radios, or airplanes.

- 73 de mike KB3EIA -

WANTED: Museum seeks B-17G Flying Fortress radio/radar equipment
 

Hmmm, another 'museum' request. See 'em all the time.

So, who actually owns the aircraft? I mean when it is sold off who will get
the money.

I have been approached by 'museums' for my BC-375, ART13s, 348s etc even my
BC-610.

But in the end it was an individual or his kids who would finncially
benefit in the end.

So where does the financial ownership of material donated utilmately end up?




"=K=5=D=H=" wrote in message
...
WANTED: B-17G Flying Fortress radio equipment

This is a long message... please read it all!

The Vintage Flying Museum of Fort Worth, Texas, home
of B-17G N3701G, "Chuckie", is seeking DONATIONS of
any kind of radio and radar equipment that would have
been used aboard B-17G's built from early-1944 on.

Our airplane is a B-17G-70-VE, serial number 44-8543A.
She was built in January, 1944, by the Vega division
of Lockheed (B-17G's were built by Boeing, Douglas,
and Vega). She was converted to a "pathfinder" model,
which means she had a radar set installed in place of
the ball turret which allowed bombing through overcast.
Very few Forts were converted for this mission, and it
is possible that our Fort saw combat time over Europe.
The combat records of the pathfinder Forts are still
classified, so we may never know for sure.

Right now, the only original radio gear installed in
the airplane is a BC-348-P receiver and shock mount.
We need everything else. Some of the specific items
we seek are the BC-375-E transmitter, tuning units
TU-4B through TU-10B, BC-306 antenna matching unit,
the wooded tuning unit storage rack that mounts to the
rear bulkhead, ceramic feedthrough insulators, power
and control connectors, and cables. We're also looking
for command set transmitters, receivers, racks, cables,
control boxes, spline cables (the LONG ones that will
reach the flight deck ceiling), modulator, and so on.

Obviously, we are looking for NICE equipment that is
in display condition because we display the airplane
both in the Museum and at air shows and fly-ins. We'll
certainly accept donations of "parts units", but the
primary focus is on acquiring gear that looks good
enough to be installed in the airplane. We want to
impress our tour guests at the air shows with a great
looking radio room! Do you have some surplus military
WW2 airborne radios stashed in your garage or attic?
Would you like to see them go to a good home? Please
donate your equipment to VFM and help us restore the
radio compartment in our beloved B-17! Any radios and
accessories that we don't use in the airplane will be
either put on display in the Museum's exhibit hall or
sold off to generate money to help finance the effort
(no matter how much gets donated, we'll still end up
having to buy some stuff to complete the job!).

We are a small museum, and we have very limited funds
available to spend on things that don't actually help
us to keep the airplane flying. We are looking for
DONATIONS of equipment. We are a 501-c-3 tax-exempt
charitable organization, and we will provide a tax
receipt for your donation.

"Chuckie" is one of approximately 15 B-17s worldwide
that are still in flyable condition, and one of about
10 that is flown regularly. Please don't "bash" me
if my numbers are off by a plane or two; the numbers
go up and down as some Forts come out of restoration
and others go down for heavy maintenance or retirement.
She participated in the fabuluous Thunder Over Michigan
air show in 2005 in which EIGHT of the remaining B-17
population were not only present at the show, but flew
together! It was the largest gathering of civilian
B-17s in history, and it may never be repeated.

Please visit the Museum's web site:

http://www.vintageflyingmuseum.org

I have been authorized by the Museum to be the focal
point for this effort. Please address your messages
directly to me.

We're also looking for a complete chin turret if you
happen to have one stashed in your barn! Actually,
we will graciously accept donations of ANY B-17 parts
that you might have lying around. :)

My final request is this: If you have nothing nice to
say about this effort, please say nothing. If you are
not a warbird fan, if you believe our effort is a waste
of time and money, if you think we're "glorifying" war,
if you think operating antique warplanes is dangerous
and should be outlawed, etc, etc... you're entitled to
your opinion, but I respectfully ask that you keep it
to yourself.

Thanks and 73,
Dean Hemphill, K5DH
Vintage Flying Museum member