On Sat, 06 Mar 2004 19:15:02 +0000, Ken Scharf stood up and said:

As for the rest of your comments, I suppose you have made up your mind
and have burned your license, framed the ashes, and sold your radio gear
to the CB'er next door.

I think you missed the point of his post. It is an editorial on the
state of the hobby and I think it drives home the current attitudes many
(no all, of course) hams have towards the proposed changes the ARRL are
supporting. It's really human nature; many people are resistant to
change for variety of reasons and sometimes it takes a long, hard look
in the mirror to see how silly this resistance is. The point being, if
one insists on "living in the past", then their is no future. This
applies to everything, not just amateur radio.

And I don't think the original poster has burned his license. He's
probably doing more than you or I to save the hobby by shoving the
egocentrism that many hams exhibit right back in their face. And for
the record, I don't think the ARRL went far enough in their
recommendations. I believe their should only be two licenses: a
beginners with VHF/UHF access and limited HF access, and a "general"
license with full privileges and no CW required. Before you (or anybody
else) flame me for this, note that I do know CW. The only reason I
learned it was to get HF privileges. I maybe had 3 or 4 QSOs using CW
but it's not for me. I find other digital modes like PSK31 to be more
fun. But that's just me.

The power companies know all about the Part 15 rules. They will never
attempt to prosecute you or harass you via the FCC or Federal Courts.

You WILL find yourself in a LOCAL court room, before a LOCAL judge, and
a LOCAL District Attorney. You will be prosecuted as a “Public
Nuisance" under the same laws used to protect the public from dogs
running at large, kids who squeel their car tires, and people who leave
piles of garbage laying about.

Wouldn't it be easy to point at the back of one of the part 15 devices and
show the judge where it says the device must not cause any interfearance to
licensed devices and must accept any interferance from the licened devices ?
Then counter sue the power company for interferance and being a public
nuisance to you.

The power companies know all about the Part 15 rules. They will never
attempt to prosecute you or harass you via the FCC or Federal Courts.

You WILL find yourself in a LOCAL court room, before a LOCAL judge, and
a LOCAL District Attorney. You will be prosecuted as a “Public
Nuisance" under the same laws used to protect the public from dogs
running at large, kids who squeel their car tires, and people who leave
piles of garbage laying about.

Wouldn't it be easy to point at the back of one of the part 15 devices and
show the judge where it says the device must not cause any interfearance to
licensed devices and must accept any interferance from the licened devices ?
Then counter sue the power company for interferance and being a public
nuisance to you.

Ralph Mowery wrote:
The power companies know all about the Part 15 rules. They will never
attempt to prosecute you or harass you via the FCC or Federal Courts.

You WILL find yourself in a LOCAL court room, before a LOCAL judge, and
a LOCAL District Attorney. You will be prosecuted as a “Public
Nuisance" under the same laws used to protect the public from dogs
running at large, kids who squeel their car tires, and people who leave
piles of garbage laying about.


Wouldn't it be easy to point at the back of one of the part 15 devices and
show the judge where it says the device must not cause any interfearance to
licensed devices and must accept any interferance from the licened devices ?
Then counter sue the power company for interferance and being a public
nuisance to you.

Catch this senario:

You and your lawyer bring the Part 15 device to the show the LOCAL
(Municiple) Judge. The power company and there lawyers have assembled
200-300 of their customers in the same courtroom ... pop's and mom's,
grandma's,etc. ... all LOCAL voters ... all screaming for your "blood"
because have ****ed up their internet access ... intentionally!

The Judge knows that his decision will likely be reversed on appeal ...
but, ONLY if YOU have the resources to initiate that appeal (It'll start
in the 100 Kilobuck range). The Judge also knows that the folks in the
courtroom will all vote for HIM in the next election ... and the power
company will also make a money contribution to his campaign.

You are living under the mistaken assumption that RIGHT (or "rights")
and WRONG have anything at all to do with this situation. Its not about
laws and regulations. Or, even physics. Its about MONEY. Its about
POLITICS. Its about GRAFT. In short, its not going to be a fair fight.

Bend over!

And BTW ... Just keep telling me how important it is that I vote
Republican in the next election (terrorism, abortion, and all that
idiotic crap). AND how important it is for prospective hams to learn
and love morse code.

Harv, AI9NL

Ralph Mowery wrote:
The power companies know all about the Part 15 rules. They will never
attempt to prosecute you or harass you via the FCC or Federal Courts.

You WILL find yourself in a LOCAL court room, before a LOCAL judge, and
a LOCAL District Attorney. You will be prosecuted as a “Public
Nuisance" under the same laws used to protect the public from dogs
running at large, kids who squeel their car tires, and people who leave
piles of garbage laying about.


Wouldn't it be easy to point at the back of one of the part 15 devices and
show the judge where it says the device must not cause any interfearance to
licensed devices and must accept any interferance from the licened devices ?
Then counter sue the power company for interferance and being a public
nuisance to you.

Catch this senario:

You and your lawyer bring the Part 15 device to the show the LOCAL
(Municiple) Judge. The power company and there lawyers have assembled
200-300 of their customers in the same courtroom ... pop's and mom's,
grandma's,etc. ... all LOCAL voters ... all screaming for your "blood"
because have ****ed up their internet access ... intentionally!

The Judge knows that his decision will likely be reversed on appeal ...
but, ONLY if YOU have the resources to initiate that appeal (It'll start
in the 100 Kilobuck range). The Judge also knows that the folks in the
courtroom will all vote for HIM in the next election ... and the power
company will also make a money contribution to his campaign.

You are living under the mistaken assumption that RIGHT (or "rights")
and WRONG have anything at all to do with this situation. Its not about
laws and regulations. Or, even physics. Its about MONEY. Its about
POLITICS. Its about GRAFT. In short, its not going to be a fair fight.

Bend over!

And BTW ... Just keep telling me how important it is that I vote
Republican in the next election (terrorism, abortion, and all that
idiotic crap). AND how important it is for prospective hams to learn
and love morse code.

Harv, AI9NL

Arnold wrote:
On Sat, 06 Mar 2004 19:15:02 +0000, Ken Scharf stood up and said:

As for the rest of your comments, I suppose you have made up your mind
and have burned your license, framed the ashes, and sold your radio gear
to the CB'er next door.


I think you missed the point of his post. It is an editorial on the
state of the hobby and I think it drives home the current attitudes many
(no all, of course) hams have towards the proposed changes the ARRL are
supporting. It's really human nature; many people are resistant to
change for variety of reasons and sometimes it takes a long, hard look
in the mirror to see how silly this resistance is. The point being, if
one insists on "living in the past", then their is no future. This
applies to everything, not just amateur radio.

And I don't think the original poster has burned his license. He's
probably doing more than you or I to save the hobby by shoving the
egocentrism that many hams exhibit right back in their face. And for
the record, I don't think the ARRL went far enough in their
recommendations. I believe their should only be two licenses: a
beginners with VHF/UHF access and limited HF access, and a "general"
license with full privileges and no CW required. Before you (or anybody
else) flame me for this, note that I do know CW. The only reason I
learned it was to get HF privileges. I maybe had 3 or 4 QSOs using CW
but it's not for me. I find other digital modes like PSK31 to be more
fun. But that's just me.

I would almost agree with you on having 'only' two licenses. I still
like the idea of the 'EXTRA CLASS' license as a means of promoting self
improvment. It only offers a very small increase in privileges, several
small slivers of bandwidth allocated for CW (and perhaps keep the extras
phone slivers as well). But do combine the advanced and general class
band segments and open them to everyone without the need to know CW.
The CW band segments should still remain, but call them 'narrow
bandwidth' segments for use ONLY with modes requiring less than say
500hz bandwidth. This would include things like digital, PSK31, and of
course, CW (which could become a digital computer mode no longer
requiring any gray cells to perform the incoding and decoding!).
Re-evaluate how much of each band should be set aside for these narrow
bandwidth segments, perhaps.

There are many hams that love cw (and would use it even if it was NOT
required) for things like QRP backpacking (these itty bitty rigs are
quite popular, the kits sell like hotcakes). CW IS the ultimate weak
signal mode. I do say this with second hand knowledge though, like you
I havn't used CW much in years, but I wish could improve on that!
I got my Extra when they lowered the CW requirement to 5 wpm and only
the written test stood in my way to get from Advanced to Extra. (The
challenge of the written test was something I could handle, and it gave
me a chance to bone up on theory I hadn't looked at since college.)

In closing on that, I wouldn't push CW on anybody, but I would hate to
see it die out.

Arnold wrote:
On Sat, 06 Mar 2004 19:15:02 +0000, Ken Scharf stood up and said:

As for the rest of your comments, I suppose you have made up your mind
and have burned your license, framed the ashes, and sold your radio gear
to the CB'er next door.


I think you missed the point of his post. It is an editorial on the
state of the hobby and I think it drives home the current attitudes many
(no all, of course) hams have towards the proposed changes the ARRL are
supporting. It's really human nature; many people are resistant to
change for variety of reasons and sometimes it takes a long, hard look
in the mirror to see how silly this resistance is. The point being, if
one insists on "living in the past", then their is no future. This
applies to everything, not just amateur radio.

And I don't think the original poster has burned his license. He's
probably doing more than you or I to save the hobby by shoving the
egocentrism that many hams exhibit right back in their face. And for
the record, I don't think the ARRL went far enough in their
recommendations. I believe their should only be two licenses: a
beginners with VHF/UHF access and limited HF access, and a "general"
license with full privileges and no CW required. Before you (or anybody
else) flame me for this, note that I do know CW. The only reason I
learned it was to get HF privileges. I maybe had 3 or 4 QSOs using CW
but it's not for me. I find other digital modes like PSK31 to be more
fun. But that's just me.

I would almost agree with you on having 'only' two licenses. I still
like the idea of the 'EXTRA CLASS' license as a means of promoting self
improvment. It only offers a very small increase in privileges, several
small slivers of bandwidth allocated for CW (and perhaps keep the extras
phone slivers as well). But do combine the advanced and general class
band segments and open them to everyone without the need to know CW.
The CW band segments should still remain, but call them 'narrow
bandwidth' segments for use ONLY with modes requiring less than say
500hz bandwidth. This would include things like digital, PSK31, and of
course, CW (which could become a digital computer mode no longer
requiring any gray cells to perform the incoding and decoding!).
Re-evaluate how much of each band should be set aside for these narrow
bandwidth segments, perhaps.

There are many hams that love cw (and would use it even if it was NOT
required) for things like QRP backpacking (these itty bitty rigs are
quite popular, the kits sell like hotcakes). CW IS the ultimate weak
signal mode. I do say this with second hand knowledge though, like you
I havn't used CW much in years, but I wish could improve on that!
I got my Extra when they lowered the CW requirement to 5 wpm and only
the written test stood in my way to get from Advanced to Extra. (The
challenge of the written test was something I could handle, and it gave
me a chance to bone up on theory I hadn't looked at since college.)

In closing on that, I wouldn't push CW on anybody, but I would hate to
see it die out.

Harv nelson wrote:
Ralph Mowery wrote:

The power companies know all about the Part 15 rules. They will never
attempt to prosecute you or harass you via the FCC or Federal Courts.

You WILL find yourself in a LOCAL court room, before a LOCAL judge, and
a LOCAL District Attorney. You will be prosecuted as a “Public
Nuisance" under the same laws used to protect the public from dogs
running at large, kids who squeel their car tires, and people who leave
piles of garbage laying about.



Wouldn't it be easy to point at the back of one of the part 15 devices
and
show the judge where it says the device must not cause any
interfearance to
licensed devices and must accept any interferance from the licened
devices ?
Then counter sue the power company for interferance and being a public
nuisance to you.

Catch this senario:

You and your lawyer bring the Part 15 device to the show the LOCAL
(Municiple) Judge. The power company and there lawyers have assembled
200-300 of their customers in the same courtroom ... pop's and mom's,
grandma's,etc. ... all LOCAL voters ... all screaming for your "blood"
because have ****ed up their internet access ... intentionally!

The Judge knows that his decision will likely be reversed on appeal ...
but, ONLY if YOU have the resources to initiate that appeal (It'll start
in the 100 Kilobuck range). The Judge also knows that the folks in the
courtroom will all vote for HIM in the next election ... and the power
company will also make a money contribution to his campaign.

You are living under the mistaken assumption that RIGHT (or "rights")
and WRONG have anything at all to do with this situation. Its not about
laws and regulations. Or, even physics. Its about MONEY. Its about
POLITICS. Its about GRAFT. In short, its not going to be a fair fight.

Bend over!
Perhaps. But it WILL only take ONE FEDERAL judge to turn it around then
no futher LOCAl judge will prevail. And maybe the ARRL will send one of
their lawyers down pro-bono to see that this happens.

And BTW ... Just keep telling me how important it is that I vote
Republican in the next election (terrorism, abortion, and all that
idiotic crap). AND how important it is for prospective hams to learn
and love morse code.

You have made a VERY good case for all of us NOT to vote Republican.
And BTW GWB CAN'T be RE-Elected, since he WASN'T elected in the first
place. He was CROWNED by the best supreme court money could buy.



Harv, AI9NL

Harv nelson wrote:
Ralph Mowery wrote:

The power companies know all about the Part 15 rules. They will never
attempt to prosecute you or harass you via the FCC or Federal Courts.

You WILL find yourself in a LOCAL court room, before a LOCAL judge, and
a LOCAL District Attorney. You will be prosecuted as a “Public
Nuisance" under the same laws used to protect the public from dogs
running at large, kids who squeel their car tires, and people who leave
piles of garbage laying about.



Wouldn't it be easy to point at the back of one of the part 15 devices
and
show the judge where it says the device must not cause any
interfearance to
licensed devices and must accept any interferance from the licened
devices ?
Then counter sue the power company for interferance and being a public
nuisance to you.

Catch this senario:

You and your lawyer bring the Part 15 device to the show the LOCAL
(Municiple) Judge. The power company and there lawyers have assembled
200-300 of their customers in the same courtroom ... pop's and mom's,
grandma's,etc. ... all LOCAL voters ... all screaming for your "blood"
because have ****ed up their internet access ... intentionally!

The Judge knows that his decision will likely be reversed on appeal ...
but, ONLY if YOU have the resources to initiate that appeal (It'll start
in the 100 Kilobuck range). The Judge also knows that the folks in the
courtroom will all vote for HIM in the next election ... and the power
company will also make a money contribution to his campaign.

You are living under the mistaken assumption that RIGHT (or "rights")
and WRONG have anything at all to do with this situation. Its not about
laws and regulations. Or, even physics. Its about MONEY. Its about
POLITICS. Its about GRAFT. In short, its not going to be a fair fight.

Bend over!
Perhaps. But it WILL only take ONE FEDERAL judge to turn it around then
no futher LOCAl judge will prevail. And maybe the ARRL will send one of
their lawyers down pro-bono to see that this happens.

And BTW ... Just keep telling me how important it is that I vote
Republican in the next election (terrorism, abortion, and all that
idiotic crap). AND how important it is for prospective hams to learn
and love morse code.

You have made a VERY good case for all of us NOT to vote Republican.
And BTW GWB CAN'T be RE-Elected, since he WASN'T elected in the first
place. He was CROWNED by the best supreme court money could buy.



Harv, AI9NL

You have made a VERY good case for all of us NOT to vote Republican.
And BTW GWB CAN'T be RE-Elected, since he WASN'T elected in the first
place. He was CROWNED by the best supreme court money could buy.


It does not seem to make any differance which party is in. I usually vote
for someone that has never been . If you ask the 5000 people out of work in
the town I live in whose cotton mill closed who they should have voted for I
bet they would have said Ross Perot but it is too late now. I don't even
know who or what the platform was in the last presidential election but I
voted for the third party, same as the ones before that.
You are right, the judges are not elected.