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Pepper and Salt! (Condiments of the season) :-)
A very merry and satisfying Christmas and a happy new year
to all my readership. And, on the basis that I'm finally getting around to learning Cymraeg (Welsh), ... .... Nadolig LLawen! |
Pepper and Salt! (Condiments of the season) :-)
Gareth's Downstairs Computer
wrote: A very merry and satisfying Christmas and a happy new year to all my readership. And, on the basis that I'm finally getting around to learning Cymraeg (Welsh), ... ... Nadolig LLawen! How do you say "Not guilty" in Welsh, G? You might want to practice that one, just in case. -- STC / M0TEY / http://twitter.com/ukradioamateur |
Pepper and Salt! (Condiments of the season) :-)
Stephen Thomas Cole wrote:
Gareth's Downstairs Computer wrote: A very merry and satisfying Christmas and a happy new year to all my readership. And, on the basis that I'm finally getting around to learning Cymraeg (Welsh), ... ... Nadolig LLawen! How do you say "Not guilty" in Welsh, G? You might want to practice that one, just in case. yn ddieuog |
Pepper and Salt! (Condiments of the season) :-)
On 12/21/2017 3:24 PM, Richard Stearn wrote:
Stephen Thomas Cole wrote: Gareth's Downstairs Computer wrote: A very merry and satisfying Christmas and a happy new year to all my readership. And, on the basis that I'm finally getting around to learning Cymraeg (Welsh), ... ... Nadolig LLawen! How do you say "Not guilty" in Welsh, G? You might want to practice that one, just in case. yn ddieuog You'll need to do better than that... I don't have my Enigma machine handy!!! ;-) -- numerist at aquaporin4 dot com |
Pepper and Salt! (Condiments of the season) :-)
On 2017-12-22, Charles Richmond wrote:
On 12/21/2017 3:24 PM, Richard Stearn wrote: Stephen Thomas Cole wrote: Gareth's Downstairs Computer wrote: A very merry and satisfying Christmas and a happy new year to all my readership. And, on the basis that I'm finally getting around to learning Cymraeg (Welsh), ... ... Nadolig LLawen! How do you say "Not guilty" in Welsh, G? You might want to practice that one, just in case. yn ddieuog You'll need to do better than that... I don't have my Enigma machine handy!!! ;-) A few years ago, I stoppped for a couple of days at a farmhouse near Carmarten(sp) . Nice people, most Welsh people are. I asked the housewife how she did in Welsh. "I miss some nuances, of course, I am from North Wales, only been living here for fifty years." -- greymaus.ireland.ie Just_Another_Grumpy_Old_Man |
Pepper and Salt! (Condiments of the season) :-)
On Fri, 22 Dec 2017 09:25:11 +0000, Brian Reay wrote:
[snip] As a child, I had relatives who lived within 6 or 7 miles of us and their dialect was quite different. Relatives of a similar age who lived closer didn't show the same differences. At times it really was a bit of an issue. I had a high school teacher who said that her Italian husband's home village had a similar thing: the dialect of the people across the river was quite different. Sincerely, Gene Wirchenko |
Pepper and Salt! (Condiments of the season) :-)
On 12/22/2017 2:24 PM, Gene Wirchenko wrote:
On Fri, 22 Dec 2017 09:25:11 +0000, Brian Reay wrote: [snip] As a child, I had relatives who lived within 6 or 7 miles of us and their dialect was quite different. Relatives of a similar age who lived closer didn't show the same differences. At times it really was a bit of an issue. I had a high school teacher who said that her Italian husband's home village had a similar thing: the dialect of the people across the river was quite different. Back in the bad old days, two houses on different sides of the same freeway... a phone call from one house to the other... was a long-distant toll call !!! That is sort of analogous to speaking dialects !!! :-) -- numerist at aquaporin4 dot com |
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On 2017-12-22, Charles Richmond wrote:
On 12/22/2017 2:24 PM, Gene Wirchenko wrote: On Fri, 22 Dec 2017 09:25:11 +0000, Brian Reay wrote: [snip] As a child, I had relatives who lived within 6 or 7 miles of us and their dialect was quite different. Relatives of a similar age who lived closer didn't show the same differences. At times it really was a bit of an issue. I had a high school teacher who said that her Italian husband's home village had a similar thing: the dialect of the people across the river was quite different. Back in the bad old days, two houses on different sides of the same freeway... a phone call from one house to the other... was a long-distant toll call !!! That is sort of analogous to speaking dialects !!! :-) I heard about a hotel in California that straddled area code boundaries - it was long distance to call from one end of the building to the other. The town of Lloydminster sits right on the Alberta/Saskatchewan border. There's some interesting billing there. -- /~\ lid (Charlie Gibbs) \ / I'm really at ac.dekanfrus if you read it the right way. X Top-posted messages will probably be ignored. See RFC1855. / \ HTML will DEFINITELY be ignored. Join the ASCII ribbon campaign! |
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On 23/12/17 00:39, Charlie Gibbs wrote:
On 2017-12-22, Charles Richmond wrote: On 12/22/2017 2:24 PM, Gene Wirchenko wrote: On Fri, 22 Dec 2017 09:25:11 +0000, Brian Reay wrote: [snip] As a child, I had relatives who lived within 6 or 7 miles of us and their dialect was quite different. Relatives of a similar age who lived closer didn't show the same differences. At times it really was a bit of an issue. I had a high school teacher who said that her Italian husband's home village had a similar thing: the dialect of the people across the river was quite different. Back in the bad old days, two houses on different sides of the same freeway... a phone call from one house to the other... was a long-distant toll call !!! That is sort of analogous to speaking dialects !!! :-) I heard about a hotel in California that straddled area code boundaries - it was long distance to call from one end of the building to the other. The town of Lloydminster sits right on the Alberta/Saskatchewan border. There's some interesting billing there. I know someone that could walk from one side of their house to the other and their mobile coverage would go from Vodafone Holland to Vodafone Belgium. |
Pepper and Salt! (Condiments of the season) :-)
On 12/22/2017 7:39 PM, Charlie Gibbs wrote:
On 2017-12-22, Charles Richmond wrote: On 12/22/2017 2:24 PM, Gene Wirchenko wrote: On Fri, 22 Dec 2017 09:25:11 +0000, Brian Reay wrote: [snip] As a child, I had relatives who lived within 6 or 7 miles of us and their dialect was quite different. Relatives of a similar age who lived closer didn't show the same differences. At times it really was a bit of an issue. I had a high school teacher who said that her Italian husband's home village had a similar thing: the dialect of the people across the river was quite different. Back in the bad old days, two houses on different sides of the same freeway... a phone call from one house to the other... was a long-distant toll call !!! That is sort of analogous to speaking dialects !!! :-) I heard about a hotel in California that straddled area code boundaries - it was long distance to call from one end of the building to the other. I haven't heard that, but it's almost assuredly an urban legend. The phone company is not going to create two separate accounts and run lines from two different offices to the same building. The town of Lloydminster sits right on the Alberta/Saskatchewan border. There's some interesting billing there. Is there? Phone companies don't always follow political boundaries (neither does the U.S. Postal Service). -- ================== Remove the "x" from my email address Jerry, AI0K ================== |
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Jerry Stuckle wrote on 12/22/2017 8:18 PM:
On 12/22/2017 7:39 PM, Charlie Gibbs wrote: On 2017-12-22, Charles Richmond wrote: On 12/22/2017 2:24 PM, Gene Wirchenko wrote: On Fri, 22 Dec 2017 09:25:11 +0000, Brian Reay wrote: [snip] As a child, I had relatives who lived within 6 or 7 miles of us and their dialect was quite different. Relatives of a similar age who lived closer didn't show the same differences. At times it really was a bit of an issue. I had a high school teacher who said that her Italian husband's home village had a similar thing: the dialect of the people across the river was quite different. Back in the bad old days, two houses on different sides of the same freeway... a phone call from one house to the other... was a long-distant toll call !!! That is sort of analogous to speaking dialects !!! :-) I heard about a hotel in California that straddled area code boundaries - it was long distance to call from one end of the building to the other. I haven't heard that, but it's almost assuredly an urban legend. The phone company is not going to create two separate accounts and run lines from two different offices to the same building. The town of Lloydminster sits right on the Alberta/Saskatchewan border. There's some interesting billing there. Is there? Phone companies don't always follow political boundaries (neither does the U.S. Postal Service). I met a kid in college who had a hard time at the state university. He lived in the state, but the post office gave them a delivery address from a post office in a different state. I think it was finally resolved, but they had to bring the deed and other documents. I would think a state drivers license with his mailing address would be enough proof of the state he lived in. The DMV isn't going to give you a license if you are out of state. -- Rick C Viewed the eclipse at Wintercrest Farms, on the centerline of totality since 1998 |
Pepper and Salt! (Condiments of the season) :-)
On 12/22/2017 9:33 PM, rickman wrote:
Jerry Stuckle wrote on 12/22/2017 8:18 PM: On 12/22/2017 7:39 PM, Charlie Gibbs wrote: On 2017-12-22, Charles Richmond wrote: On 12/22/2017 2:24 PM, Gene Wirchenko wrote: On Fri, 22 Dec 2017 09:25:11 +0000, Brian Reay wrote: [snip] As a child, I had relatives who lived within 6 or 7 miles of us and their dialect was quite different.Â* Relatives of a similar age who lived closer didn't show the same differences. At times it really was a bit of an issue. Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* I had a high school teacher who said that her Italian husband's home village had a similar thing: the dialect of the people across the river was quite different. Back in the bad old days, two houses on different sides of the same freeway... a phone call from one house to the other... was a long-distant toll call !!!Â* That is sort of analogous to speaking dialects !!!Â* :-) I heard about a hotel in California that straddled area code boundaries - it was long distance to call from one end of the building to the other. I haven't heard that, but it's almost assuredly an urban legend.Â* The phone company is not going to create two separate accounts and run lines from two different offices to the same building. The town of Lloydminster sits right on the Alberta/Saskatchewan border.Â* There's some interesting billing there. Is there?Â* Phone companies don't always follow political boundaries (neither does the U.S. Postal Service). I met a kid in college who had a hard time at the state university.Â* He lived in the state, but the post office gave them a delivery address from a post office in a different state.Â* I think it was finally resolved, but they had to bring the deed and other documents.Â* I would think a state drivers license with his mailing address would be enough proof of the state he lived in.Â* The DMV isn't going to give you a license if you are out of state. Yes, I can definitely believe that. Even here my mailing address is a city "which" doesn't exist (most of the county, including my "city", is unincorporated). And many people around here have mailing addresses in an incorporated city while living in an unincorporated part of the county, or vice versa. What we don't have is people in Maryland with Virginia addresses or vice versa, but that's to be understood. There's a river separating the two :) (same with DC and Virginia). But I don't know of anyone in DC with Maryland mailing addresses or vice versa. I wouldn't doubt it happens, though. But if his mailing address is in another state, how did he get the driver's license? What did he have to do to prove his residency? -- ================== Remove the "x" from my email address Jerry, AI0K ================== |
Pepper and Salt! (Condiments of the season) :-)
On 12/22/2017 8:33 PM, rickman wrote:
Jerry Stuckle wrote on 12/22/2017 8:18 PM: On 12/22/2017 7:39 PM, Charlie Gibbs wrote: On 2017-12-22, Charles Richmond wrote: On 12/22/2017 2:24 PM, Gene Wirchenko wrote: On Fri, 22 Dec 2017 09:25:11 +0000, Brian Reay wrote: [snip] As a child, I had relatives who lived within 6 or 7 miles of us and their dialect was quite different.Â* Relatives of a similar age who lived closer didn't show the same differences. At times it really was a bit of an issue. Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* I had a high school teacher who said that her Italian husband's home village had a similar thing: the dialect of the people across the river was quite different. Back in the bad old days, two houses on different sides of the same freeway... a phone call from one house to the other... was a long-distant toll call !!!Â* That is sort of analogous to speaking dialects !!!Â* :-) I heard about a hotel in California that straddled area code boundaries - it was long distance to call from one end of the building to the other. I haven't heard that, but it's almost assuredly an urban legend.Â* The phone company is not going to create two separate accounts and run lines from two different offices to the same building. The town of Lloydminster sits right on the Alberta/Saskatchewan border.Â* There's some interesting billing there. Is there?Â* Phone companies don't always follow political boundaries (neither does the U.S. Postal Service). I met a kid in college who had a hard time at the state university.Â* He lived in the state, but the post office gave them a delivery address from a post office in a different state.Â* I think it was finally resolved, but they had to bring the deed and other documents.Â* I would think a state drivers license with his mailing address would be enough proof of the state he lived in.Â* The DMV isn't going to give you a license if you are out of state. There is a house built right on what is now the current Vermont/Quebec border. You can buy it, live there, and stay out of jail... *iff* you have dual citizenship: https://tinyurl.com/y78zye3k -- numerist at aquaporin4 dot com |
Pepper and Salt! (Condiments of the season) :-)
Jerry Stuckle wrote on 12/22/2017 10:24 PM:
On 12/22/2017 9:33 PM, rickman wrote: Jerry Stuckle wrote on 12/22/2017 8:18 PM: On 12/22/2017 7:39 PM, Charlie Gibbs wrote: On 2017-12-22, Charles Richmond wrote: On 12/22/2017 2:24 PM, Gene Wirchenko wrote: On Fri, 22 Dec 2017 09:25:11 +0000, Brian Reay wrote: [snip] As a child, I had relatives who lived within 6 or 7 miles of us and their dialect was quite different. Relatives of a similar age who lived closer didn't show the same differences. At times it really was a bit of an issue. I had a high school teacher who said that her Italian husband's home village had a similar thing: the dialect of the people across the river was quite different. Back in the bad old days, two houses on different sides of the same freeway... a phone call from one house to the other... was a long-distant toll call !!! That is sort of analogous to speaking dialects !!! :-) I heard about a hotel in California that straddled area code boundaries - it was long distance to call from one end of the building to the other. I haven't heard that, but it's almost assuredly an urban legend. The phone company is not going to create two separate accounts and run lines from two different offices to the same building. The town of Lloydminster sits right on the Alberta/Saskatchewan border. There's some interesting billing there. Is there? Phone companies don't always follow political boundaries (neither does the U.S. Postal Service). I met a kid in college who had a hard time at the state university. He lived in the state, but the post office gave them a delivery address from a post office in a different state. I think it was finally resolved, but they had to bring the deed and other documents. I would think a state drivers license with his mailing address would be enough proof of the state he lived in. The DMV isn't going to give you a license if you are out of state. Yes, I can definitely believe that. Even here my mailing address is a city "which" doesn't exist (most of the county, including my "city", is unincorporated). And many people around here have mailing addresses in an incorporated city while living in an unincorporated part of the county, or vice versa. What we don't have is people in Maryland with Virginia addresses or vice versa, but that's to be understood. There's a river separating the two :) (same with DC and Virginia). But I don't know of anyone in DC with Maryland mailing addresses or vice versa. I wouldn't doubt it happens, though. But if his mailing address is in another state, how did he get the driver's license? What did he have to do to prove his residency? It was MD and Delaware. I don't know how he got the license. Likely they knew he was in MD because the state knows exactly who needs to pay taxes ect. The University wasn't tapped into any of that so they had their own rules! You'll have to ask the kid, this was over 40 years ago when I was an undergraduate and U of Md was a very big and bizarre place for me. -- Rick C Viewed the eclipse at Wintercrest Farms, on the centerline of totality since 1998 |
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Charles Richmond wrote on 12/22/2017 10:26 PM:
On 12/22/2017 8:33 PM, rickman wrote: Jerry Stuckle wrote on 12/22/2017 8:18 PM: On 12/22/2017 7:39 PM, Charlie Gibbs wrote: On 2017-12-22, Charles Richmond wrote: On 12/22/2017 2:24 PM, Gene Wirchenko wrote: On Fri, 22 Dec 2017 09:25:11 +0000, Brian Reay wrote: [snip] As a child, I had relatives who lived within 6 or 7 miles of us and their dialect was quite different. Relatives of a similar age who lived closer didn't show the same differences. At times it really was a bit of an issue. I had a high school teacher who said that her Italian husband's home village had a similar thing: the dialect of the people across the river was quite different. Back in the bad old days, two houses on different sides of the same freeway... a phone call from one house to the other... was a long-distant toll call !!! That is sort of analogous to speaking dialects !!! :-) I heard about a hotel in California that straddled area code boundaries - it was long distance to call from one end of the building to the other. I haven't heard that, but it's almost assuredly an urban legend. The phone company is not going to create two separate accounts and run lines from two different offices to the same building. The town of Lloydminster sits right on the Alberta/Saskatchewan border. There's some interesting billing there. Is there? Phone companies don't always follow political boundaries (neither does the U.S. Postal Service). I met a kid in college who had a hard time at the state university. He lived in the state, but the post office gave them a delivery address from a post office in a different state. I think it was finally resolved, but they had to bring the deed and other documents. I would think a state drivers license with his mailing address would be enough proof of the state he lived in. The DMV isn't going to give you a license if you are out of state. There is a house built right on what is now the current Vermont/Quebec border. You can buy it, live there, and stay out of jail... *iff* you have dual citizenship: https://tinyurl.com/y78zye3k I heard about a guy who had property on the VA/WV boarder. The exact line between the states had never been defined exactly until the 60's I believe. When the drew the line by his house it put the house in WV! WV demanded he pay back taxes for all the years he owned it! Worse, VA said they wouldn't refund any taxes because their law says once the tax has been paid for some amount of time, you can't dispute it!!! I seem to recall he got politicians involved and they got a reasonable settlement worked out. Talk about getting screwed! Of course, this may all be urban legend. I heard this many years ago. -- Rick C Viewed the eclipse at Wintercrest Farms, on the centerline of totality since 1998 |
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On Sat, 23 Dec 2017 00:39:32 +0000, Charlie Gibbs wrote:
I heard about a hotel in California that straddled area code boundaries - it was long distance to call from one end of the building to the other. The town of Lloydminster sits right on the Alberta/Saskatchewan border. There's some interesting billing there. This town has had that kind of problem since 1843... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baarle-Hertog -- Using UNIX since v6 (1975)... Use the BIG mirror service in the UK: http://www.mirrorservice.org |
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On Fri, 22 Dec 2017 15:39:08 -0600, Charles Richmond
wrote: [snip] Back in the bad old days, two houses on different sides of the same freeway... a phone call from one house to the other... was a long-distant toll call !!! That is sort of analogous to speaking dialects !!! :-) I always thought that that nonsense could have been solved by using a better zone system. A call to the same zone or only one zone away would be local; the others would be long distance. Set the zones to allow for cities and geography. Would this have been workable? Sincerely, Gene Wirchenko |
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On 23/12/17 13:08, Gene Wirchenko wrote:
On Fri, 22 Dec 2017 15:39:08 -0600, Charles Richmond wrote: [snip] Back in the bad old days, two houses on different sides of the same freeway... a phone call from one house to the other... was a long-distant toll call !!! That is sort of analogous to speaking dialects !!! :-) I always thought that that nonsense could have been solved by using a better zone system. A call to the same zone or only one zone away would be local; the others would be long distance. Set the zones to allow for cities and geography. Would this have been workable? Sincerely, Gene Wirchenko I don't often use 'snail mail' in Europe (we are still in Europe) but, as I recall, for some time it has been possible to send a letter within the EU for the same cost as a local one. As I recall, when this was introduced, the rationale was that the bulk of the infra structure was in place in each country and if, for example, I paid more to post to Germany (I'm in the UK) the UK didn't 'hand over' any of the extra I paid to any Post Office 'on route'- in the end it all just 'balanced out'. Logically, the same must apply for telephone calls. Obviously a 'long distance call' uses resources but, in the round, things balance out. There will be exceptions- areas which have low numbers of travellers etc. but, for most cases, surely the logic applies. A mobile call in the UK costs the same if the two 'ends' are 50m apart or 300miles. Why not the same for landline calls? |
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David Billington wrote:
On 23/12/17 00:39, Charlie Gibbs wrote: On 2017-12-22, Charles Richmond wrote: On 12/22/2017 2:24 PM, Gene Wirchenko wrote: On Fri, 22 Dec 2017 09:25:11 +0000, Brian Reay wrote: [snip] As a child, I had relatives who lived within 6 or 7 miles of us and their dialect was quite different. Relatives of a similar age who lived closer didn't show the same differences. At times it really was a bit of an issue. I had a high school teacher who said that her Italian husband's home village had a similar thing: the dialect of the people across the river was quite different. Back in the bad old days, two houses on different sides of the same freeway... a phone call from one house to the other... was a long-distant toll call !!! That is sort of analogous to speaking dialects !!! :-) I heard about a hotel in California that straddled area code boundaries - it was long distance to call from one end of the building to the other. The town of Lloydminster sits right on the Alberta/Saskatchewan border. There's some interesting billing there. I know someone that could walk from one side of their house to the other and their mobile coverage would go from Vodafone Holland to Vodafone Belgium. There's a town on Vermont/Quebec where the library sits on the border and has has an entrance in each country. -- Pete |
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Gene Wirchenko wrote:
On Fri, 22 Dec 2017 15:39:08 -0600, Charles Richmond wrote: [snip] Back in the bad old days, two houses on different sides of the same freeway... a phone call from one house to the other... was a long-distant toll call !!! That is sort of analogous to speaking dialects !!! :-) I always thought that that nonsense could have been solved by using a better zone system. A call to the same zone or only one zone away would be local; the others would be long distance. Set the zones to allow for cities and geography. Would this have been workable? Do many people still pay long-distance charges? For many years we've had plans with "free" nationwide calling. For a while when kids were in school out of state we had a WATS line so they could fall us free. I cancelled it later because I was getting too many calls from Puerto Rico where the callers couldn' speak English. -- Pete |
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On 23/12/2017 14:47, Peter Flass wrote:
Gene Wirchenko wrote: On Fri, 22 Dec 2017 15:39:08 -0600, Charles Richmond wrote: [snip] Back in the bad old days, two houses on different sides of the same freeway... a phone call from one house to the other... was a long-distant toll call !!! That is sort of analogous to speaking dialects !!! :-) I always thought that that nonsense could have been solved by using a better zone system. A call to the same zone or only one zone away would be local; the others would be long distance. Set the zones to allow for cities and geography. Would this have been workable? Do many people still pay long-distance charges? For many years we've had plans with "free" nationwide calling. For a while when kids were in school out of state we had a WATS line so they could fall us free. I cancelled it later because I was getting too many calls from Puerto Rico where the callers couldn' speak English. In the UK there are various deals which include calls on landlines and mobiles but there are local and long distance changes if you don't make use of them, at least on landlines. The deals don't (generally) cover international calls. 'Roaming' is now included on mobiles, at least in the EU, although many companies off packages which include other countries. The exact rules etc vary from company to company. |
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Gene Wirchenko wrote on 12/23/2017 8:08 AM:
On Fri, 22 Dec 2017 15:39:08 -0600, Charles Richmond wrote: [snip] Back in the bad old days, two houses on different sides of the same freeway... a phone call from one house to the other... was a long-distant toll call !!! That is sort of analogous to speaking dialects !!! :-) I always thought that that nonsense could have been solved by using a better zone system. A call to the same zone or only one zone away would be local; the others would be long distance. Set the zones to allow for cities and geography. Would this have been workable? The phone company has no incentive to make this work better for users. Their profits are regulated and they have no competition. I have a place in a very rural area and when I first bought it computers used dial up. I got very lucky and there was a local exchange that was not quite as local as the others so I could reach a provider. Otherwise it would have been a non-long distance toll call. For many others on the other side of the lake it was a toll call. It's still that way some 30 years later. TPC has no incentive to increase the non-toll region even though it costs them nothing in equipment which was upgraded decades ago. They just have to change their billing. -- Rick C Viewed the eclipse at Wintercrest Farms, on the centerline of totality since 1998 |
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wrote in message ... On 2017-12-22, Charles Richmond wrote: On 12/21/2017 3:24 PM, Richard Stearn wrote: Stephen Thomas Cole wrote: Gareth's Downstairs Computer wrote: A very merry and satisfying Christmas and a happy new year to all my readership. And, on the basis that I'm finally getting around to learning Cymraeg (Welsh), ... ... Nadolig LLawen! How do you say "Not guilty" in Welsh, G? You might want to practice that one, just in case. yn ddieuog You'll need to do better than that... I don't have my Enigma machine handy!!! ;-) A few years ago, I stoppped for a couple of days at a farmhouse near Carmarten(sp) . Nice people, most Welsh people are. I asked the housewife how she did in Welsh. "I miss some nuances, of course, I am from North Wales, only been living here for fifty years." In '84 we were on a train to new york from Stamford and the conductor pinned our accent as Paisley area...turned out he used to conduct on the bus between paisley and johnstone before he emigrated .... |
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|
Pepper and Salt! (Condiments of the season) :-)
|
Pepper and Salt! (Condiments of the season) :-)
Ralph Mowery wrote on 12/23/2017 3:06 PM:
In article , says... Gene Wirchenko wrote on 12/23/2017 8:08 AM: On Fri, 22 Dec 2017 15:39:08 -0600, Charles Richmond wrote: [snip] The phone company has no incentive to make this work better for users. Their profits are regulated and they have no competition. I have a place in a very rural area and when I first bought it computers used dial up. I got very lucky and there was a local exchange that was not quite as local as the others so I could reach a provider. Otherwise it would have been a non-long distance toll call. For many others on the other side of the lake it was a toll call. It's still that way some 30 years later. TPC has no incentive to increase the non-toll region even though it costs them nothing in equipment which was upgraded decades ago. They just have to change their billing. The phone company better get some incentive. They are probably loosing lots due to the cell phones and now to the internet phones. Neither of them seem to charge extra for what is usually a long distance call. The phone bill was about $ 20 but taxes and LD connect and other fees made it around $ 40 per month. If you add caller ID and a few other things , it will cost even more. Most of that is 'free' with the $ 30 internet phone I am now using. You seem to fail to understand how "the phone company" operates. They have capital investment. A regulatory board allows them a certain profit based on that capital investment. If they make too little profit they can request rate changes of the regulatory board. TPC doesn't lose money. -- Rick C Viewed the eclipse at Wintercrest Farms, on the centerline of totality since 1998 |
Pepper and Salt! (Condiments of the season) :-)
Ralph Mowery wrote:
In article , says... On Fri, 22 Dec 2017 15:39:08 -0600, Charles Richmond wrote: [snip] Back in the bad old days, two houses on different sides of the same freeway... a phone call from one house to the other... was a long-distant toll call !!! That is sort of analogous to speaking dialects !!! :-) I always thought that that nonsense could have been solved by using a better zone system. A call to the same zone or only one zone away would be local; the others would be long distance. Set the zones to allow for cities and geography. In the 1980's I knew 2 brothers that lived next to each other. The houses were seperated by a small field maybe 100 yards wide. They were long distance from each other by the phone companies. Each one had a different phone company. Where I am at now I can not get ATT as its service starts about 1/4 of a mile or less from me. I am on another phone company, or was before I switched over to the internet phone. That was a very good thing for me. I get free long distance, but best of all they block most robot calls. The phone rings once and quits. The number is on the caller ID box and if it really is something I want, I can dial them back. Also it is easy to go on the internet and tell the phone company I want to block a number. I don't do it, but a friend does, you can have the home phone number send it to your cell phone after a few rings. Our electric is like this. Most of our development is National Grid and our street and one other are NYSEG. Some times this is good, but sometimes we're out and the other streets aren't. -- Pete |
Pepper and Salt! (Condiments of the season) :-)
On Sat, 23 Dec 2017 15:06:37 -0500, Ralph Mowery
wrote: In article , says... Gene Wirchenko wrote on 12/23/2017 8:08 AM: On Fri, 22 Dec 2017 15:39:08 -0600, Charles Richmond wrote: [snip] The phone company has no incentive to make this work better for users. Their profits are regulated and they have no competition. I have a place in a very rural area and when I first bought it computers used dial up. I got very lucky and there was a local exchange that was not quite as local as the others so I could reach a provider. Otherwise it would have been a non-long distance toll call. For many others on the other side of the lake it was a toll call. It's still that way some 30 years later. TPC has no incentive to increase the non-toll region even though it costs them nothing in equipment which was upgraded decades ago. They just have to change their billing. The phone company better get some incentive. They are probably loosing lots due to the cell phones and now to the internet phones. Neither of them seem to charge extra for what is usually a long distance call. The phone bill was about $ 20 but taxes and LD connect and other fees made it around $ 40 per month. If you add caller ID and a few other things , it will cost even more. Most of that is 'free' with the $ 30 internet phone I am now using. The "phone company" is usually also the ISP in the modern world. I don't think they really care that much about land-line calls anymore. |
Pepper and Salt! (Condiments of the season) :-)
On 12/23/2017 2:06 PM, rickman wrote:
Gene Wirchenko wrote on 12/23/2017 8:08 AM: On Fri, 22 Dec 2017 15:39:08 -0600, Charles Richmond wrote: [snip] Back in the bad old days, two houses on different sides of the same freeway... a phone call from one house to the other... was a long-distant toll call !!!Â* That is sort of analogous to speaking dialects !!!Â* :-) Â*Â*Â*Â* I always thought that that nonsense could have been solved by using a better zone system.Â* A call to the same zone or only one zone away would be local; the others would be long distance.Â* Set the zones to allow for cities and geography. Â*Â*Â*Â* Would this have been workable? The phone company has no incentive to make this work better for users. Their profits are regulated and they have no competition.Â* I have a place in a very rural area and when I first bought it computers used dial up.Â* I got very lucky and there was a local exchange that was not quite as local as the others so I could reach a provider.Â* Otherwise it would have been a non-long distance toll call.Â* For many others on the other side of the lake it was a toll call.Â* It's still that way some 30 years later.Â* TPC has no incentive to increase the non-toll region even though it costs them nothing in equipment which was upgraded decades ago.Â* They just have to change their billing. You still pay for long distance? We've had unlimited (domestic) long distance on our land lines for years. And that was long before Verizon had competition. Now they've changed us to fiber - no more POTS line; rather it's VOIP. Works fine (better than the old copper) but the battery dies after about 5-8 hours of power outage, depending on how much we use it. -- ================== Remove the "x" from my email address Jerry Stuckle ================== |
Pepper and Salt! (Condiments of the season) :-)
On 12/23/2017 3:01 PM, Ralph Mowery wrote:
In article , says... On Fri, 22 Dec 2017 15:39:08 -0600, Charles Richmond wrote: [snip] Back in the bad old days, two houses on different sides of the same freeway... a phone call from one house to the other... was a long-distant toll call !!! That is sort of analogous to speaking dialects !!! :-) I always thought that that nonsense could have been solved by using a better zone system. A call to the same zone or only one zone away would be local; the others would be long distance. Set the zones to allow for cities and geography. In the 1980's I knew 2 brothers that lived next to each other. The houses were seperated by a small field maybe 100 yards wide. They were long distance from each other by the phone companies. Each one had a different phone company. Where I am at now I can not get ATT as its service starts about 1/4 of a mile or less from me. I am on another phone company, or was before I switched over to the internet phone. That was a very good thing for me. I get free long distance, but best of all they block most robot calls. The phone rings once and quits. The number is on the caller ID box and if it really is something I want, I can dial them back. Also it is easy to go on the internet and tell the phone company I want to block a number. I don't do it, but a friend does, you can have the home phone number send it to your cell phone after a few rings. Do you mind if I ask which VOIP company you're using (reply by email if you wish). I'm considering switching both my home and business numbers to another company. Verizon has gone VOIP but they're expensive (and have fewer features). -- ================== Remove the "x" from my email address Jerry Stuckle ================== |
Pepper and Salt! (Condiments of the season) :-)
Jerry Stuckle wrote on 12/23/2017 9:10 PM:
On 12/23/2017 2:06 PM, rickman wrote: Gene Wirchenko wrote on 12/23/2017 8:08 AM: On Fri, 22 Dec 2017 15:39:08 -0600, Charles Richmond wrote: [snip] Back in the bad old days, two houses on different sides of the same freeway... a phone call from one house to the other... was a long-distant toll call !!! That is sort of analogous to speaking dialects !!! :-) I always thought that that nonsense could have been solved by using a better zone system. A call to the same zone or only one zone away would be local; the others would be long distance. Set the zones to allow for cities and geography. Would this have been workable? The phone company has no incentive to make this work better for users. Their profits are regulated and they have no competition. I have a place in a very rural area and when I first bought it computers used dial up. I got very lucky and there was a local exchange that was not quite as local as the others so I could reach a provider. Otherwise it would have been a non-long distance toll call. For many others on the other side of the lake it was a toll call. It's still that way some 30 years later. TPC has no incentive to increase the non-toll region even though it costs them nothing in equipment which was upgraded decades ago. They just have to change their billing. You still pay for long distance? We've had unlimited (domestic) long distance on our land lines for years. And that was long before Verizon had competition. Now they've changed us to fiber - no more POTS line; rather it's VOIP. Works fine (better than the old copper) but the battery dies after about 5-8 hours of power outage, depending on how much we use it. If you have "unlimited" long distance, you are paying for it. I have a land line still but have no long distance. I pay $15 a month which is basically to keep the business number until I decide to do something with it like VOIP. I was looking at Google Voice the other day but I digress... You are most likely paying some $30 or $40 a month to get your "unlimited" long distance. A service that comes with my cell where voice calls are unmetered. Funny, it was the over charging for long distance that prompted competition in the market and led to the breakup of Bell Telephone. Now long distance is so cheap they practically give it away. -- Rick C Viewed the eclipse at Wintercrest Farms, on the centerline of totality since 1998 |
Pepper and Salt! (Condiments of the season) :-)
In article ,
says... Do you mind if I ask which VOIP company you're using (reply by email if you wish). I'm considering switching both my home and business numbers to another company. Verizon has gone VOIP but they're expensive (and have fewer features). The company is/was Time Warner Cable that was bought or merged with Spectrum. I only had the internet before the merge and it was about $ 60 and the land line phone with another company was about $ 40 or $ 45 or just the basic service. No caller ID and 10 cents a minuit for long distance. By bundling the internet and phone I am paying about $ 69 per month for both services and that includes a surcharge for the wifi modem and probably because I wanted to keep Earthlink as the ISP instead of going with them which I think is Roadrunner. https://www.spectrum.com/home-phone.html They advertise $ 29.99 each for some cable TV, phone , and internet if you bundle them together. There is no contract or anyting. Not sure how long they will hold that price as it has only been a few months. Did not want the TV as using Direct TV and the wife wanted to keep it. Only drawback I can think of now is if the cable line goes out I have to use a cell phone to call them. |
Pepper and Salt! (Condiments of the season) :-)
On 12/23/2017 10:25 PM, rickman wrote:
Jerry Stuckle wrote on 12/23/2017 9:10 PM: On 12/23/2017 2:06 PM, rickman wrote: Gene Wirchenko wrote on 12/23/2017 8:08 AM: On Fri, 22 Dec 2017 15:39:08 -0600, Charles Richmond wrote: [snip] Back in the bad old days, two houses on different sides of the same freeway... a phone call from one house to the other... was a long-distant toll call !!!Â* That is sort of analogous to speaking dialects !!!Â* :-) Â*Â*Â*Â* I always thought that that nonsense could have been solved by using a better zone system.Â* A call to the same zone or only one zone away would be local; the others would be long distance.Â* Set the zones to allow for cities and geography. Â*Â*Â*Â* Would this have been workable? The phone company has no incentive to make this work better for users. Their profits are regulated and they have no competition.Â* I have a place in a very rural area and when I first bought it computers used dial up.Â* I got very lucky and there was a local exchange that was not quite as local as the others so I could reach a provider.Â* Otherwise it would have been a non-long distance toll call.Â* For many others on the other side of the lake it was a toll call.Â* It's still that way some 30 years later.Â* TPC has no incentive to increase the non-toll region even though it costs them nothing in equipment which was upgraded decades ago.Â* They just have to change their billing. You still pay for long distance?Â* We've had unlimited (domestic) long distance on our land lines for years.Â* And that was long before Verizon had competition. Now they've changed us to fiber - no more POTS line; rather it's VOIP. Works fine (better than the old copper) but the battery dies after about 5-8 hours of power outage, depending on how much we use it. If you have "unlimited" long distance, you are paying for it.Â* I have a land line still but have no long distance.Â* I pay $15 a month which is basically to keep the business number until I decide to do something with it like VOIP.Â* I was looking at Google Voice the other day but I digress...Â* You are most likely paying some $30 or $40 a month to get your "unlimited" long distance.Â* A service that comes with my cell where voice calls are unmetered. Funny, it was the over charging for long distance that prompted competition in the market and led to the breakup of Bell Telephone.Â* Now long distance is so cheap they practically give it away. Not significantly. It's running less than $60 for two lines. But that is actually less then when we had POTS lines and were paying for long distance. But I think it's still too expensive. My business lines are still POTS and much more expensive (as you would expect) - but they also don't have unlimited long distance. But Verizon is going to force me to go VOIP on those lines, soon, also. The difference is the copper in our neighborhood is over 50 years old and having a lot of problems. Rather than replace the cable, Verizon installed fiber and now they run everything - phone, tv and internet - over the one fiber instead of twisted pairs and multiple coaxes. Plus we have more TV channels available than we had with coax. -- ================== Remove the "x" from my email address Jerry, AI0K ================== |
Pepper and Salt! (Condiments of the season) :-)
On 12/23/2017 10:41 PM, Ralph Mowery wrote:
In article , says... Do you mind if I ask which VOIP company you're using (reply by email if you wish). I'm considering switching both my home and business numbers to another company. Verizon has gone VOIP but they're expensive (and have fewer features). The company is/was Time Warner Cable that was bought or merged with Spectrum. I only had the internet before the merge and it was about $ 60 and the land line phone with another company was about $ 40 or $ 45 or just the basic service. No caller ID and 10 cents a minuit for long distance. By bundling the internet and phone I am paying about $ 69 per month for both services and that includes a surcharge for the wifi modem and probably because I wanted to keep Earthlink as the ISP instead of going with them which I think is Roadrunner. https://www.spectrum.com/home-phone.html They advertise $ 29.99 each for some cable TV, phone , and internet if you bundle them together. There is no contract or anyting. Not sure how long they will hold that price as it has only been a few months. Did not want the TV as using Direct TV and the wife wanted to keep it. Only drawback I can think of now is if the cable line goes out I have to use a cell phone to call them. Ah, OK. I thought you had gone with one of the VOIP companies. We don't have Spectrum here; there are some places on the other side of the river in Virginia with them, but all we have available are Verizon and XFinity. I think Verizon is the lesser of the two evils :) -- ================== Remove the "x" from my email address Jerry, AI0K ================== |
phone prices, was Pepper and Salt! (Condiments of the season) :-)
In article , rickman wrote:
You seem to fail to understand how "the phone company" operates. They have capital investment. A regulatory board allows them a certain profit based on that capital investment. If they make too little profit they can request rate changes of the regulatory board. TPC doesn't lose money. That was called rate of return regulation. In the US, only little rural telcos still do that. Big phone companies have negotiated price caps instead, which give them a new incentive to invest as little as possible in the regulated network. For the most part, mobile phone rates aren't regulated at all. -- Regards, John Levine, , Primary Perpetrator of "The Internet for Dummies", Please consider the environment before reading this e-mail. https://jl.ly |
phone prices, was Pepper and Salt! (Condiments of the season) :-)
John Levine wrote on 12/23/2017 11:15 PM:
In article , rickman wrote: You seem to fail to understand how "the phone company" operates. They have capital investment. A regulatory board allows them a certain profit based on that capital investment. If they make too little profit they can request rate changes of the regulatory board. TPC doesn't lose money. That was called rate of return regulation. In the US, only little rural telcos still do that. Big phone companies have negotiated price caps instead, which give them a new incentive to invest as little as possible in the regulated network. For the most part, mobile phone rates aren't regulated at all. You are confused. The cell phone companies are in a different business. Verizon may own a public telephone company, but most of the US has public phone companies owned by someone else. The phone companies providing landline phone service are still regulated entities regardless of who owns what. -- Rick C Viewed the eclipse at Wintercrest Farms, on the centerline of totality since 1998 |
Pepper and Salt! (Condiments of the season) :-)
On Sat, 23 Dec 2017 23:10:44 -0500, Jerry Stuckle
wrote: On 12/23/2017 10:41 PM, Ralph Mowery wrote: In article , says... Do you mind if I ask which VOIP company you're using (reply by email if you wish). I'm considering switching both my home and business numbers to another company. Verizon has gone VOIP but they're expensive (and have fewer features). The company is/was Time Warner Cable that was bought or merged with Spectrum. I only had the internet before the merge and it was about $ 60 and the land line phone with another company was about $ 40 or $ 45 or just the basic service. No caller ID and 10 cents a minuit for long distance. By bundling the internet and phone I am paying about $ 69 per month for both services and that includes a surcharge for the wifi modem and probably because I wanted to keep Earthlink as the ISP instead of going with them which I think is Roadrunner. https://www.spectrum.com/home-phone.html They advertise $ 29.99 each for some cable TV, phone , and internet if you bundle them together. There is no contract or anyting. Not sure how long they will hold that price as it has only been a few months. Did not want the TV as using Direct TV and the wife wanted to keep it. Only drawback I can think of now is if the cable line goes out I have to use a cell phone to call them. Ah, OK. I thought you had gone with one of the VOIP companies. We don't have Spectrum here; there are some places on the other side of the river in Virginia with them, but all we have available are Verizon and XFinity. I think Verizon is the lesser of the two evils :) You know nothing compels you to get your phone from your internet provider. Microsoft provides unlimited worldwide service for $14.99/month, plus $25 every three if you want a number that people can call. Google has something similar. |
phone prices, was Pepper and Salt! (Condiments of the season) :-)
That was called rate of return regulation. In the US, only little
rural telcos still do that. Big phone companies have negotiated price caps instead, which give them a new incentive to invest as little as possible in the regulated network. For the most part, mobile phone rates aren't regulated at all. You are confused. The cell phone companies are in a different business. Verizon may own a public telephone company, but most of the US has public phone companies owned by someone else. The phone companies providing landline phone service are still regulated entities regardless of who owns what. Yes, they're regulated, but most of them are under price caps, not rate of return. So long as they don't exceed the price caps, the regulators don't care what their capital investment or profit is. -- Regards, John Levine, , Primary Perpetrator of "The Internet for Dummies", Please consider the environment before reading this e-mail. https://jl.ly |
Pepper and Salt! (Condiments of the season) :-)
On Sat, 23 Dec 2017 23:49:05 -0500
J. Clarke wrote: You know nothing compels you to get your phone from your internet provider. Microsoft provides unlimited worldwide service for $14.99/month, plus $25 every three if you want a number that people can call. Google has something similar. That is an expensive option unless you make a *lot* of calls, there are providers where you pay for all calls but the rate to most places is under a cent per minute. -- Steve O'Hara-Smith | Directable Mirror Arrays C:\WIN | A better way to focus the sun The computer obeys and wins. | licences available see You lose and Bill collects. | http://www.sohara.org/ |
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